Help, PRD's

[Con_G]

Hello all,
First post so be nice.
Having just passed my PPL theory test, I am studying up on my KDR issues. One of them is PRD's, or more specifically, restricted areas. My Dyson Holland GFPT text book says that flight through a restricted area is not permissible when active, which until now is what I thought. However my Bob Tait text book says that restricted areas may be flown through with a clearance.
Can someone shed some light on this subject please.

Con

[fujii]

AIP ENR 1.4 - 11

[mcgrath50]

The difference is one of legality and practicality (and also location and reason for the restriction).

Legally you are allowed to fly through restricted areas. Grab an ERSA (or look it up online) and have a look at the classifications of them in the PRD section, it gives you a good breakdown of the likelihood of you getting a clearance.

So the answer to the question that is fairly common in CASA exams is that you can with a clearance. This is what Bob Tait is telling you.

In the real world it depends on the location, basically what it is being used for and your operational need. I've never seen people get cleared through the Puckapunyal restricted area but then it's small, easy to avoid and they conduct live firing through it. I plan around it for sake of ease. East Sale on the other hand you usually can plan through. One must remember that clearances can be denied to anyone, except in an emergency. That means if you are planning on flying through a restricted area, you should have a plan B if you get knocked back.

What DH is getting at I'd imagine is that when it's active it is not permissible without a clearance.

[Nautilus Blue]

Deleted - wrong :uhoh:

[wishiwasupthere]

Prohibited areas are never allowed to be flown through, but I was always taught there aren't any in Australia.

There's 1. Pine Gap.

[fujii]

Quote. Restricted areas are now classified as category 1, 2 or 3. Roughly one is you won't ever get a clearance so don't plan through it, .......


RA 1 you may plan through. RA3 not permitted. See AIP. Get it right and don't confuse readers.

[Con_G]

Thank you for your responses. I have looked at the relevant section of the AIP and it is pretty clear now.

Just for the record (breif version):
RA1: Pilots may flight plan through and expect clearance.
RA2: Pilots may not flight plan through and clearance is not assured.
RA3: No chance, don't even bother asking.

[MakeItHappenCaptain]

Faaarrrk.....:rolleyes:

[MakeItHappenCaptain]

Restricted could be opened up for transit if they (the controlling authority) so desired.

The prohibited area (as already pointed out) is Pine Gap near Alice. It technically is not Australian airspace. It belongs to the yanks, so good luck getting a clearance over one of their secure defence commincations facilities. Once the roads went in there, all of the actual facility construction was carried out by American defence contractors. Aussies not permitted. I would expect to be shot at (or down) if I infringed that airspace.:uhoh:

Make a bit more sense?

[alphacentauri]

Pretty sure as of the next charting cycle the P area at Pine Gap is being downgraded to a R area. Story goes there was a bushfire nearby and was threatening the facility. Clearance to the water bombers couldn't not be obtained as no clearance possible for a prohibited area. Apparently it put the wind up the yanks enough to change to a R area.

RIP P299


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[Hugh Jarse]

Are you saying no Aussies permitted into the facility?

[MakeItHappenCaptain]

Not without clearance from US DoD from what I understand. Similar to an embassy, ie. not Australian soil. Maybe a good place for a land rights claim?:}

You about to say you've flown through there?

[Hugh Jarse]

I was going to say I flew over Pine Gap a few weeks ago on the way to Bali. I remember commenting to my colleague at the time that I have a close friend (Aussie) who has worked there for over 15 years in the field of electronics.

His clearance was obtained through ASIS. Interestingly enough, around 1/2 the work force are Aussies and Brits. :)

[Lasiorhinus]

It only goes up to FL180, so above that, of course you can fly over it.

[MakeItHappenCaptain]

Bet I got closer than you on my last run back from Bali.:E
Over, through and near. All have different meanings.

Reminds me of a notam when the USS Kittyhawk last visited Brisbane.
"Any aircraft approaching closer than 2nm/2500' will be treated as hostile."
Caloundra local decided to go for a buzz on that particular morning and asked over the radio, "D'ya reckon they'd mind if I did a flyby?":rolleyes:

The story about no Aussies was during the construction of the facility. A mate's father worked on the initial construction and said once the foundations, tunnels, etc were ready to go in, it was all locals out and specialty US comstruction personnel only.
Understandable.

[hadagutful]

Con_G, slight correction to your summary - RA2 must not plan through UNLESS ON A ROUTE SPECIFIED IN ERSA GEN FPR or under agreement with the Department of Defence......but clearance not assured. (ERSA PRD page 1).
So there would be examples where you can plan through RA2 areas but you would have to check the relevent section of ERSA.

[Con_G]

I know what you are saying, I just wanted to keep my post short which is why I abbreviated.