sky dive from 120,000 feet

[Pilot.Lyons]

Hi all just thought id share this with you

Talk about big dangleberries!

Sky News - Skydiver Prepares To Jump From Edge Of Space http://news.sky.com/story/995122/skydiver-prepares-to-jump-from-edge-of-space

[NDW]

The very best of luck to him.

[Crash one]

Wasn't that done years ago? Can't remember his name.

[treadigraph]

Wasn't that done years ago?

Joe Kittinger in the late 1950s/early 1960s. As far as I know he's still flying Floridian joyriders in a Waco or New Standard or something of a similar vintage to him!

[gordonquinn]

Crash, Joe Kittinger holds the record for highest freefall, for his jump in 1960 from 102,800 feet.

BBC News - Skydiver Felix Baumgartner set to break sound barrier (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-19860249)

This dude Felix Baumgartner is looking to break the record, by jumping from "more than 120,000 feet".

[Ianp83]

Joe kittinger is also on baumgartens team. He's going to be the voice in his ear throughout!

[fisbangwollop]

I had to laugh when I listened to it on the Radio Scotland News this morning....The news report said "He was going to freefall at Mach1 then deploy his chute and float to the earth"........at the end of the report the presenter said " lets all hope the float to the earth bit goes OK" ..:)

[toptobottom]

Apparently, it's being broadcast live on the Top Gear site (http://www.topgear.com/uk/car-news/red-bull-stratos-jump-freefall-supersonic-2012-10-09)(among many others, no doubt)

[Dg800]

Crash, Joe Kittinger holds the record for highest freefall, for his jump in 1960 from 102,800 feet.No, he doesn't. Firstly because he did not freefall at all as a drogue chute deployed automatically as soon as he jumped, otherwise he would have started spinning so violently that he would have lost consciousness pretty quickly (no air to "grab" on to at that altitude). Secondly because his was never meant to be a record-breaking attempt, but was instead meant as a scientific mission to test the feasibility of a high-altitude bailout system for astronauts during re-entry. Because of that no paperwork was done to have this recognized as any record, certainly not as a freefall record (see above).

A Russian pilot (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugene_Andreev) held the previous record, Baumgartner's previous jump is currently being processed (http://www.fai.org/fai-record-file/?recordId=16591) by the FAI.

Ciao,

Dg800

[gordonquinn]

No, he doesn't. Firstly because he did not freefall

You got me, that is right actually, I think what I have misread is that he has the record for the highest skydive, however your point on no paperwork as it was a test, rather than a record breaking attempt kinda throws that out too.

Oh well :) back to work, I think my boss has realised that pprune is not a windows server forum ...dang, incoming internet filter.

[Dg800]

You got me, that is right actually, I think what I have misread is that he has the record for the highest skydive, however your point on no paperwork as it was a test, rather than a record breaking attempt kinda throws that out too.It's in the definition of skydive (or rather, parachute jump in official FAI language) that it has to start in freefall and end in a (preferably soft :ok:) landing under a parachute canopy. If that weren't the case then the actual record would be held by the crew of Apollo 10 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_10) as they were the first to fall all the way from the moon, albeit without a single second of freefall. :E

I have no idea however how Baumgartner actually manages to maintain stability without a drogue.

Ciao,

Dg800

[The Fenland Flyer]

Been postponed due to the winds getting up again while they were having radio problems. They can't reuse the balloon but they have a back up.

[thing]

If that weren't the case then the actual record would be held by the crew of Apollo 10 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_10) as they were the first to fall all the way from the moon, albeit without a single second of freefall. http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/evil.gif

I may be getting the parachuting definition of free fall mixed up here but surely Apollo 10 was in free fall after it's last main engine burn to put it on it's Earth trajectory, IE from Moon orbit?

[Pilot.Lyons]

It said they cant go if winds are above 2 mph.... Now wonder its been 5 years in the planning!

[tractorpuller]

Firstly because he did not freefall at all as a drogue chute deployed
automatically as soon as he jumped, otherwise he would have started spinning so
violently that he would have lost consciousness pretty quickly (no air to "grab"
on to at that altitude).


So what did the drogue chute "grab on to" then?

[Pace]

Surely a drop of a few feet before the drogue chute extended above him would be the free fall bit ?
Unless he jumped with the line already extended and the drogue chute already inflated ;)
Unless the free fall bit is defined ie must free fall 1000 feet before any chute is extended 1 foot would do!

I also do not think something has to be classified as a record attempt to be classified as a record only that the event is prove able and accepted as such

Pace

[Dg800]

So what did the drogue chute "grab on to" then?Don't know if you were being sarcastic or not, but here goes. At that height there is of course a residual atmosphere, the drag chute created enough drag (nomen omen) to stabilize Kittinger because:

- it had a much larger area than its cargo and a regular shape (conical), making it inherently stable
- because of the geometry of the whole thing, with Kittinger "hanging" from the chute creating even more stability, much like a ship with its ballast at the bottom of the hull

Add to that the fact that the full pressure suit that was in use at the time was as stiff as a board, making it impossible for Kittinger to move his arms and legs in order to stop any incipient spin, like a normal skydiver has to do all the time or he will start spinning soon enough.

Baumgartner's suit doesn't look like a full pressure setup to me, maybe he has enough mobility to control his attitude. The video material currently being released only shows him stepping out of the capsule, we don't know what the first few seconds of freefall look like.

Ciao,

Dg800

[Dg800]

I may be getting the parachuting definition of free fall mixed up here but surely Apollo 10 was in free fall after it's last main engine burn to put it on it's Earth trajectory, IE from Moon orbit?

The capsule was indeed free-falling, the record is however for human parachutists and not for airdropped cargo. := Too meet the defining criteria for parachute jump the parachutist has to actually step out of the vehicle (and let go of it! :E) and then land under his own canopy. :ok:

Ciao,

Dg800

[Dg800]

I also do not think something has to be classified as a record attempt to be classified as a record only that the event is prove able and accepted as such
Not as far as FAI is concerned. There are several pre-requisites (http://www.fai.org/how-to-set-a-record) you have to meet and each discipline has its own ruleset you have to comply with strictly. In general, if you don't submit a request to have your record recognized, it won't be, regardless of actual performance.

Ciao,

Dg800

[Pilot.Lyons]

You gotta love forums :)

[tractorpuller]

Quote:




So what did the
drogue chute "grab on to" then?
Don't know if you were being sarcastic or not, but here goes.



No, I was actually asking, so thanks for the reply :)

From the videos I've seen of Kittingers jump, the area of his drag chute didn't look much bigger than him, so I didn't think it would help much in beginning of his jump.
Thanks for clarifying.

Rgds

[Dg800]

No, I was actually asking, so thanks for the reply http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/smile.gif

From the videos I've seen of Kittingers jump, the area of his drag chute didn't look much bigger than him, so I didn't think it would help much in beginning of his jump.
Thanks for clarifying.

You're welcome. :ok:
Modern tandem parachute systems actually use a similar system in order to prevent the tandem master/passenger pair from tumbling out of control, and also to reduce terminal speed so as to minimize parachute deployment shock. The drogue then acts as pilot chute to deploy the main canopy, I don't know if Kittinger's setup worked in a similar fashion or whether the drogue was eventually ditched.

Ciao,

Dg800

[Dg800]

Congratulations are in order to Mr. Baumgartner for actually pulling it off (and living to tell the tale:ok:).

From the accounts available it looks like he did not have any drogue deployed as it would have made the "frefall" part in "highest parachute jump" record void, but he did have one ready to be deployed any time were he to become too unstable to safely continue the jump. He did come close to deploying it as he eventually started tumbling head over heels, but managed to become stable again and continued the freefall until the planned deployment altitude.

[Fostex]

This onboard video shows him entering a rather nasty spin and then managing to recover.

LiveLeak.com - Headcam footage of Felix Baumgartner's jump.

[MichaelJP59]

Looked pretty unpleasant - he also ended up pulling his chute earlier than planned and not breaking the free fall time record, perhaps he wasn't feeling too good after all the tumbling.

That camera's a bit deceptive though - a few commentators were going on about how he was so high the curvature of the earth was clear. Fair enough but the "fish-eye" camera makes it look as though he was higher than the space station:)

[mikehallam]

[The commentators did mention the lens effect]

mikehallam

[Tableview]

Question : Did he freefall at +Mach 1? I am asking this as the speed of sound increases with altitude, but I don't know to what extent, nor at what absolute speed (as opposed to Mach) he fell.

[Morris542]

I am asking this as the speed of sound increases with altitude


Er no. Speed of sound decreases as the temperature decreases. Speed of Sound at different altitudes (km/h, mph, knots) (http://www.fighter-planes.com/jetmach1.htm)

According to my ATPL books:

Local speed of sound = 38.94 √Temperature

[Avitor]

Is he bonkers?

[Mark1234]

Probably..

This was interesting wrt length of freefall: Red Bull Stratos: Why Didn't Felix Free Fall for 5 Minutes? | Wired Science | Wired.com (http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2012/10/red-bull-stratos-why-didnt-felix-break-the-free-fall-time-record/)