C17 Lands at wrong (3600 foot!) runway

[Spudh]

Interesting situation here:

Air Force cargo plane lands at Davis Islands airport | TBO.com (http://www2.tbo.com/news/news/2012/jul/20/6/huge-air-force-cargo-plane-lands-at-davis-islands--ar-437276/)

Can't believe how quickly he brought it to a stop!

Craziest thing I've ever seen. C-17 lands at wrong airport. Not an airbase. #Tampa #MacDill #Screwedpilots (http://yfrog.com/mk7ekz)

[Willard Whyte]

What on earth was the nav doi... ah! 2-person flight deck. That figures.

[Rhino power]

Good demo of short field capability though! ;)

-RP

[500N]

"Good demo of short field capability though! "


That's what I was thinking.

I bet a few of the pilot's muscles tightened when he realized
how short the runway actually was !

[Milo Minderbinder]

Wanted: 95 feet of runway for military cargo plane parked on Davis Islands - Tampa Bay Times (http://www.tampabay.com/news/publicsafety/article1241349.ece)
""This is the second time this has happened," said spectator Gary Garrett, 71, who has a real estate office on Davis Islands.
"The last time, it was a 727 in the 80s," he recalled, "and they took that plane apart to get it out of here."

Photos here
Giant military cargo plane lands at small Tampa airport (http://www.myfoxtampabay.com/story/19075531/2012/07/20/giant-military-cargo-plane-lands-at-small-airport)

[SASless]

OH....to have a copy of the CVR tape......that would make for some interesting listening.....particularly after they got it stopped and the magnitude of what they had just done to their careers sunk in!:E

[500N]

You could come up with some great captions for the third photo in this set
(the Air force person talking to the civvy scratching his head or on the phone !)

Giant military cargo plane lands at small Tampa airport (http://www.myfoxtampabay.com/story/19075531/2012/07/20/giant-military-cargo-plane-lands-at-small-airport)

[wokkamate]

Sorry but the phrase 'f*cking idiots' springs to mind......how? :ugh:

[Bob Viking]

So I presume no navigator equipped aircraft has ever landed at the wrong airfield?!
BV;)

[Two's in]

Classic marginal weather - 9999 and 1CU at 5,000 sucked them right in...

[Like This - Do That]

From the airnav website, in KTPF's 'Additional Comments' section:

BE ALERT: MACDILL AFB LCTD 4 MILES SW

:}

Now, about that pavement concession .....

[Buster Hyman]

They should be grateful that it wasn't an Antonov!

[FATTER GATOR]

Now departed again! Follow the link in the first post to see an impressive short field PABTO take-off! I bet V1 came up really quickly and rotate seemed like an eternity!

There are some axminster-shuffles and interviews without coffee going on at McGuire.

[lomapaseo]

OH....to have a copy of the CVR tape......that would make for some interesting listening.....particularly after they got it stopped and the magnitude of what they had just done to their careers sunk in!

They probably spent just enough time discussing it while parked on the runway with recorders running to overwrite the good stuff :E

I gotta give them credit though for the lessons learned and I bet they wont do it again if given the chance

[Mike Gallafent]

A few decades ago, there were several occasions when inadvertent landings occurred at RAF Changi instead at Paya Lebar, the old civil airport in Singapore. Red faces not caused by tropic sun.

Surprised that no photos seen of the rubber on the runway...

[JimNtexas]

The reports are saying there were 19 crewmembers! :ooh:

I thought the C-17 only needed two pilots and a loadmaster.

I wonder if fatigue at the end of a long flight caused a non-sterile cockpit environment.

I hope the pilots, especially the AC, have powerful sponsors.

[KKoran]

I wonder what approach they flying. The ILS and TACAN approaches to Rwy 22 contain the note:

WARNING: Use extreme caution PETER O. KNIGHT arpt 4 NM NE of MACDILL AFB

[500N]

I saw written somewhere in one of the articles that the C17 weighed
some huge amount (400,000 lbs ?) yet the airport runway was
only rated for a number way way less than this (20,000 lbs ?).
Hopefully not the media getting the numbers wrong.

With such a huge difference, how come no damage was done to the runway ?

Reason for asking is I once saw what happens when a C130 sinks through
the asphalt / tarmac on landing at an airstrip rated for Hercs but that had obviously not been checked in a while. Not sure what happened on take off
as never went back as it was in the middle of no where (Woomera Rocket Range).

Thanks.

[Willard Whyte]

So I presume no navigator equipped aircraft has ever landed at the wrong airfield?!Not one with me navigating.

[Fareastdriver]

McDill is on the South East corner of a peninsular and Peter O Knight is on the south east corner of peninsular. The GPS says you are on the centre line so it is easy to make the mistake.

A C17 bringing a bomb disposal team landed at Henderson field in the Solomon Islands. The parked the nose against the end of the ramp and shut down.
"Can we have a tug to push the aircraft back, please?"
"What tug?"

Washington would not allow them to pushback using reverse thrust so they had to wait three days until another C17 brought a tug all the way from Hawaii.

Whilst it was there it was the largest man made structure in the Solomons.

[Abbeville]

Good advert for the C17 I would have thought

:}

[Chugalug2]

MG:
A few decades ago, there were several occasions when inadvertent landings occurred at RAF Changi instead at Paya Lebar, the old civil airport in Singapore. Red faces not caused by tropic sun.
Ah memories, "Downwind to roll" "Proceed to finals you are number one...correction, now number two". Sure enough BOAC VC10, having called visual and cleared to land by PL, hoves into view on finals for 20 Changi (same R/W direction as PL). It pours on the coals but not before it has briefly touched down. Result, as you say, red faces and a landing fee from the MOD!

[NutLoose]

Several moons ago a Civi Tristar i think it was diverted into EGNX and the pax had to wait on board for a few hours while a set of Airstairs were driven over from Birmingham that could reach the door :p

[Brian 48nav]

Yes, one of our 48Sqn Hercs landed at a disused strip in Oz; they were inbound to Woomera and landed at a place slightly further north, Evett's Field IIRC.

The captain,who was quite an arrogant sort of chap (RIP), took ages to live it down.

As there was b8gger all between Darwin and Adelaide, apart from the GAFA (great australian f*ck all),not a complete surprise.

It wasn't me I hasn't to add ,and as the nav is also no longer with us, I will refrain from naming him. The co might still be around,can't remember who it was!

[Union Jack]

Surprised that no photos seen of the rubber on the runway....

...... complete with brown skidmarks?:eek:

Jack

[Milo Minderbinder]

Takeoff

Video take a few minutes to load

Raw Video: Air Force cargo plane takes off | TBO.com (http://www2.tbo.com/news/2012/jul/20/raw-video-air-force-cargo-plane-takes-o-39036-vi-28712/)

[racedo]

Ryanair landing at Ballykelly
Easyjet pretty close to landing at Military Field in Sicily
plus numerous other ones

No sure what issue is really as its a great landing as plane is usable again.....

[Fareastdriver]

Lufthansa seemed to be the main culprits at Changi. They had to pay landing charges but their takeoffs were free.
Another Lufthansa landing site was Langford Lodge near Aldergrove.

[Chugalug2]

Northolt was another military runway parallel to a nearby major civil airport visited by wayward airliners. The gasometer on the approach was then painted with the letters NO which says it all, however it's interpreted:-
Boeing 707-321, N725PA, Pan American World Airways (PA / PAA) (http://www.abpic.co.uk/photo/1001607)

[TT2]

Does anyone here remember when an old piston Guppy turned up at ABZ to carry a Chinook across to the US? We stood up near the compass bay, jaws agape. It didn't rotate per se - they lifted the gear and trundled along in ground effect. Some miles away and turning left it was still less height than Kirkhill which is 900ft. Cast iron clapper valves those guys.

[NutLoose]

Gary Numan, remember him... On his round the world flight many years ago spent his first fuel stop locked in the Guardroom at RAF Odiham, instead of having a quick stop at Lasham where he should have been, didn't bode well for the rest of the trip.

[SLFguy]

"Whilst it was there it was the largest man made structure in the Solomons."


I'll take you to at least 50 bigger :hmm:



hint: not all of them are afloat still

[SASless]

Alitalia DC-8's have been known to try a landing at Cacina Costa (Agusta Helicopters) instead of Milan Malpensa just across a small ridge to the south. One may have succeeded as I recall.

One is perhaps 4,000 feet long with some factory buildings on one side....the other is a huge airport with an 11,000 foot runway.....and lots and lots of big airliners sat all over the place.

[Fareastdriver]

hint: not all of them are afloat still

They will all be rusting away at the bottom of (aptley named) Ironbottom Sound.

[isaneng]

Hmm, a certain ex-Lyneham Staish announcing that the next person to land at the strong airfield would be 'E' cat'd. How we laughed shortly afterwards.....

[glad rag]

Well, I've been in the back of a RAF herc that very nearly did the same at Rome, so I guess it's not only possible but happens a lot more than we mortals realise.

Sincerely hope that the short ferry wasn't the pilots last C-17 flight.

[fallmonk]

News report says it was a different crew who took the plane back to Mac Dill,
hope first crew dont get in to much trouble.
What makes it worse i suppose is the fact we live in a digital age where every thing is basicly on the web before they even switched the engines off!!!!!!!!

[Easy Street]

That 707 landing at Northolt was in the era when they carried navigators for the transatlantic trips. And I know of at least 2 occasions on which Tornados have landed at the wrong airfield despite (or perhaps because of) the best efforts of the nav!

[friendlypelican 2]

Back in the late '60s, RAF Sharjah and Dubai had parallel runways (12/30?) and generally used the same r/w direction with a change to 30 when the sea-breeze 'kicked-in. In the summer, the vis was never very good at low-level and each airfield could only offer VOR/NDB apps. As it happened, one day Sharjah had changed to 30 and we are coming off the VOR at about 300 feet happily looking beyond our threshold towards the far end of the R/W when out of the haze appears a PIA Trident who believed he was coming off the VOR for 12 at Dubai and happily heading for the threshold! A genuine 'brown-trouser' moment!
Some 4 years later, I am in ops at RAF Changi when the roar of thrust reversers shake me out of a light slumber. Oh dear, it was an SAS DC8 on R/W 02 who had made the error of thinking it was Paya Lebar.

[4mastacker]

Here's another report covering the aircraft's departure.

Cause of surprise landing at Davis Islands airport unclear | TBO.com (http://www2.tbo.com/news/news/2012/jul/20/18/huge-air-force-cargo-plane-lands-at-davis-islands--ar-437276/)

Listen to the commentary at about 02.08. :ugh:

[MightyGem]

The duty bod at 16 Flt AAC at their tiny strip in Dhekelia was most surprised one afternoon in 1980, to here the roar of engines as a Romanian Tarom Airways Antonav landed there instead of Larnaca. It became the star of the Flight open day the following weekend. It departed with a very large dayglo 16 Flt AAC logo on the tail, after all the seats and most of the fuel had been removed and the perimeter fence and a few trees had been levelled.

[500N]

It has been said that CENTCOM Commander Marine Gen Mattis
was on board this C-17.

Not good if confirmed as true.

[BEagle]

While it was a clearly a mistake to land at the wrong aerodrome, the crew certainly reacted well when they realised how short the runway was and executed a safe maximum effort landing.....

Let's hope that, since there was no damage to anything except pride, the safety board just get the crew to write up their experience so that others can learn from it - and that no career-damaging 'disciplinary' action is taken.

[Navy_Adversary]

Hopefully the guys won't be joining the "Flying rubber dogsh*t out of HKG" airline.:O

[Duncan D'Sorderlee]

Whilst I concur with BEagle that the crew appeared to have executed a safe landing, I can't help thinking that they should have 'gone around' - unless they really thought thta they were at McDill.

Duncs:ok:

[VinRouge]

Hopefully the guys won't be joining the "Flying rubber dogsh*t out of HKG" airline.

Your joking arent you? That seems to be the aspiration of most mil transport pilots these days!

[BarnOwl]

When I lived in Melbourne in 1985 a Garuda 747 landed at Essendon (YMEN) R26, 3,600ft, instead of Melbourne (YMML) R27, 7500ft, which was 5 miles away. There was a massive strip-out before it could take off again!

Garuda Airlines (http://www.awriterwhocanwrite.com/htm/garuda.htm)

The Age - Google News Archive Search (http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1300&dat=19860905&id=7OoxAAAAIBAJ&sjid=-pIDAAAAIBAJ&pg=3707,2189275)

[Heathrow Harry]

let us not forget the B-52 that once gave a full display at an almost empty Farnborough - except it was actually Blackbushe......................

[Catwalk Dweller]

US procedure for an Aerodrome controller, from FAAH 7110.65:

"When an arriving aircraft reports at a position where he/she should be seen but has not been visually observed, advise the aircraft as a part of the landing
clearance that it is not in sight and restate the landing runway."

PHRASEOLOGY−
NOT IN SIGHT, RUNWAY (number) CLEARED TO
LAND.

Although the aircrew may have some explaining to do, I've no doubt that there are some ATC types doing a bit of explaining as well - if they'd been properly surveilling their airspace, this incident could have been prevented.

[BEagle]

HH, no, that was a silly rumour.

The B-52 was holding clear under ATC direction, then was given an impossibly tight vector for its flypast, which the crew were unable to accept.

Whereas an F-3 most certainly did carry out a display at the wrong village fête....

[BOAC]

the crew certainly reacted well when they realised how short the runway was and executed a safe maximum effort landing - I fail to see how they can even remotely be considered as 'doing well'!

1) CAVOK, We look up from our copy of 'Peanuts/ (insert other comic as applicable) on short finals, expecting to see, what 11000ft of tarmac? They see several 100% less. As Duncan says, to do 'well' would be to go round and think about things.

2) Now, we don't notice and land anyway - 2 options arise

a) Shout 'Holy Shiite', stand on the brakes, pull max reverse and close your eyes.
b) Shout 'Holy Shiite', then "WTF, let's just roll off the end, who gives a Shiite?"

They were LUCKY - not 'doing well' - that it stopped, and yes, I would firmly believe significant disciplinary action is called for (plus an eyesight check?).

[BOAC]

Head up display

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v293/boacphotos/Managers.jpg

[con-pilot]

In all fairness to the pilots, their view of the runway may have been 'obstructed' by those pesky dual HUD's, which have little use other than to provide enhanced situational awareness.

Actually I think that may had a lot to do with it. They really didn't look out of the windshield (passed the HUD display) until after they touched down, then it was first 'Oh ****e', followed by 'what the hell did we do' after they got it stopped.

At least they were not dumb enough to attempt a go around after touching down.

I still think some one is in a lot of trouble, no tea and biscuits type of trouble. :p

But, it was an impressive landing in any case.

[Milo Minderbinder]

Blame it on the the Cuban Meacons

[gayford]

Many years ago I was a young ATCO at HMS Fulmar (Now RAF Lossiemouth). It was during the Summer Leave period and the RAF controllers remained on duty to provide Approach Control for Kinloss and Moray Radar services, as Lossie airfield was closed except for the SAR helos. I had just released a CAF Argus to Kinloss Tower for a visual join and went on to the balcony to have a break as there was no other traffic expected and it was a hot summer day.
Some few minutes later I was alerted to the sound of aircraft noise only to see the Argus touching down on Lossie's main runway.
The aircraft did a quick backtrack and was soon airborne for Kinloss. The next day we were the surprised recipients of a barrel of beer!!

[zondaracer]

There were four pilots assigned to this mission. The rest of the 19 crew was partly as a result of the DV onboard. This probably won't wend too well for the pilots, possibly a FEB.

[StopStart]

Good to see some finger pointing at those pesky new fangled heads up display thingumajigs. The rot set in with that Spinning Jenny I tell you.... :hmm:

These guys f**cked up cosmically. Runway 33% the size of the one they were expecting, covered in Cessnas. Nav kit & magenta/white line telling them they had 7 miles to the threshold. CAVOK weather too.

Had they briefed the approach they might have read the warning on every plate for rwy 22:

http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h64/judgesaw/macdill.jpg

Unfamiliar airfield in relatively busy airspace - vectored ILS? Or is that too uncool? There may well have been 4 pilots on the flight (there could well have been 400 for all that it matters) but ultimately this is a two man flightdeck aircraft and should be capable of being operated as such. What was the PM/PNF doing?

[VinRouge]

ctually I think that may had a lot to do with it. They really didn't look out of the windshield (passed the HUD display) until after they touched down, then it was first 'Oh ****e', followed by 'what the hell did we do' after they got it stopped.



If it were a more modern hud, they would have had a runway outline over the actual runway that would have made it nigh on impossible to land on the wrong runway.

Much prefer to fly with INS/GPS istead of a nav and a HUD any day.... 3000 hours glass cockpit and not a single whiff of Pi$$....

[BOAC]

I find this 'HUD fixation' quite unbelievable and TOTALLY inexcusable. What if there had been a Cessna at the touchdown. What if the runway was closed/disused/cratered? Don't folk look 'out' any more?

[VinRouge]

You know you can actually see through it don't you?

[StopStart]

HUD fixation? What are you gibbering about? As VR wisely queried - it is actually see through and focussed to infinity. Having 10 years+ experience on big HUD equipped aircraft I now fly EFIS 737. I find this new 'Instrument fixation' quite unbelievable and TOTALLY inexcusable. What if there is a Cessna at the touchdown. What if the runway is closed/disused/cratered? Don't folk look 'out' any more? :rolleyes:

This has nothing to do with HUDs or 2 man flightdecks and everything to do with slack procedures, poor CRM and general f*ckmongery.

PS. I would advise against travelling on Mr Stephenson's new horseless steam engine, The Rocket. I believe a human would suffocate and die at speeds in excess of 10mph. :hmm:

[Brian 48nav]

Not surprising really - you can only smell the stench of the contents of your nappy:O

[BEagle]

Nosing round the A400M FatLass at F'boro last week, I had a very interesting peep at the low light imagery which can be projected onto the HUD. A bit like the FLIR imagery available as an option on some expensive cars, but much better!

Brilliant aircraft, the FatLass - the RAF crews will love it!

This has nothing to do with HUDs or 2 man flightdecks and everything to do with slack procedures, poor CRM and general f*ckmongery.

I do hope that the formal occurence report uses precisely those apt words, Stoppers!

[6foottanker]

I think some of the UK readers would be shocked by the limited hours and general lack of experience and worldly flying knowledge of some of the current generation of US pilots, especially aircraft commanders and even instructors, with 90% of their hours in the desert and very few sorties outside the 'States.
An event such as this is not surprising and will not be the last one.:(

[VinRouge]

6ft,

To be fair, if the USAF actually kept people in for longer than 2 tours or longer, akin to the UK's Professional Aviator Spine, they wouldnt have the problems they do. Instead, they push their guys reaching an acceptable level of skillsets over to mundane staff tours, 12-18 month irrelevant Out Of Areas and push a culture that unless you get promoted, you are seen as an abject failure.... Fortunately, you have the reserve, would be much better to have reservists embedded into USAF units than having a separate reserve, to "Share the Gen".

Unfortunately, some RAF Sqns are going down the same route. The airlines would find it rather strange to spend over 2 million USD to train someone, to then not bother getting any decent return on them.

[SASless]

I have landed at the wrong airfield before. I was cleared "Chinook on final....cleared to land!"....but was on Lai Khe Tower frequency and landed at Dau Tieng. I tweaked to the situation when I realized where we were parked at the Refuel Point was not next to the runway and was not in the middle of a Rubber Plantation.

In my defense....I would argue as we had arrived Army IFR....in those days and locale meant looking down through the chin bubble following a road. Add in it was from atop a broken undercast cloud layer as the morning fog was breaking up....that allowed us to see portions of the road (think dirt track) at times but never all of it.....and that we had missed a "Y" in the road which sent us off down the wrong track....and I don't feel too bad about it.

Now in a C-17, with a HUD, GPS/INS/Doppler Nav, full digital display, a fully functioning ILS system with Approach control Radar looking at me.....and a destination that has a huge....really huge Runway to look for.....with all sorts of approach lighting, lead in lighting....bright white runway markings.....well....perhaps there is a difference between these guys mistake and mine. If they had the ILS for McDill tuned in....and all the data was being displayed on the HUD and Instrument Displays.....what happened? If one pilot had the ILS tuned ups and displayed...and the other guy was doing a GPS Tactical approach of some kind...even a visual approach....they should have caught the error long before it became a problem.

Very sloppy work....and worthy of a small rebuke at some point I am sure.

[sarboy w****r]

Well, I've watched the Red Arrows do a flypast with smoke over what they thought was Wattisham on a Sunday afternoon in about 2002 or '03. They were only about 3 miles out.

[Fareastdriver]

There was one famous continental airline that made an approach and landing at the wrong airfield in Germany. The cabin staff didn't tell the cockpit even though they knew because the passengers had told them. The passengers knew because the seat back map diplays were showing that they were going to the wrong place.

[BEagle]

It was 1995; the Northwest Airlines DC-10 landed at Brussels instead of Frankfurt.......:confused:

[Easy Street]

#70:
Quote:
Fortunately, you have the reserve...
I may have missed it, but has it been determined this was NOT a Reserve crew?I think his point was that the Reserve crews are the experienced ones and hence less likely to make screw-ups like this.

#68:
Unfortunately, most RAF Sqns are going down the same route.My correction in bold!

[VinRouge]

One thing it not be about is "just the pilots". Be it organisational
Issues, very few situations lie this are caused by "just the pilots".

[glad rag]

I think some of the UK readers would be shocked by the limited hours and general lack of experience and worldly flying knowledge of some of the current generation of US pilots, especially aircraft commanders and even instructors, with 90% of their hours in the desert and very few sorties outside the 'States.
An event such as this is not surprising and will not be the last one.

Yep, learned the hard way at eilson when the reservists forgot to turn on the DC busses on start up and then finished with a max stop landing only to set the U/C alight. Amazing how you suddenly fixate on the words in your ears "the aircraft is on fire sir"and how fast you can get out that wee door in a hurry on a kc-135........

[Hueymeister]

Apparently he had a VVIP on board......:\

[zondaracer]

Apparently he had a VVIP on board......

A 4-star CENTCOM commander type VVIP with a General Patton type personality. :sad:

I'm sure it would have been an uncomfortable situation for the crew to let their key passenger know where they landed.

[con-pilot]

Ah yes, but what if it was not an accident they landed there? :E

Tom Clancy anyone? :p

[chopper2004]

Wonder if there were any incidents for Wyton and Alconbury in the days when the air side of Alconbury was active, as both runways practically run in tandem.

I remember as a cadet visiting Wyton circa, 1991, there was a USAF controller or two in Wytons hub.

[RedhillPhil]

Didn't RAF and RN types used to get befuddled with Ford and Tangmere in the fifties? I was at Gatwick one evening when a B.I.A. aircraft landed on the taxiway instead of the runway. I'm fairly sure that something was put or almost was put down at Wellesbourne instead of Gaydon in the late fifties/early sixties.

[con-pilot]

I've only seen the technique of filing to one place and landing at another used by one organization.

I ain't sayin' nuttin'. :\

[Duncan D'Sorderlee]

I'm betting the VVIP said 'I bet you can't land this thing on that tiddly bit of tarmac down there, Sonny!

Duncs
:

[Compass Call]

I don't know if this is a myth or fact.
I was told that a member of the Omani Royal Family was en route London to Oman on a charter flight and the pilot landed at Amman. Seems he mis-heard the destination:eek: