RYR overcrewed with Fo's?

[Ronand]

Hi, I've been flying for RYR for almost 2 years now, and this summer it appears that I'm getting less and less hrs, compared to last summer it's quite a substantial pay cut, being a brookfield contractor and only getting paid per block hr. Do any other RYR FO's experience similar hr reduction or is it just my badluck?

[zerotohero]

Can't say myself as I am floating but my hours floating about about 10 a month last than last year and I don't hear of many F/O's saying there flying there nuts off, I know a few in small bases that are doing very little hours

I recon you could be right, but it's Ryanair, who knows?

[Lord Spandex Masher]

Ronand, you are beginning to see the folly in working for Ryanair.

Did anyone tell you that you were guaranteed a minimum number of hours when you joined?

You made your bed and now you have to lie in it, or clear off somewhere else that may offer you a worthwhile contract.

[skyflyer737]

Lord Spandex - the guy came on here asking if anyone else is experiencing reduced hours. A simple question. Why do you feel the need to reply with a harsh comment about making his bed, lying in it or clearing off? Totally unnecessary.

[VJW]

So far this year

Apr 85
May 103
Jun 85

Same for everyone in my base!

[karam]

Summer is busy, winters generally not. Depends on your base but you average around 750-850 a year as an FO. Therefore plan in advance and out some money aside for the quiet months. Unlike other airlines, Ryanair or BRK treats its pilots like bus drivers and you only get paid when you work. Not a proper contract or job if you ask me...but there you go. Regard it as Europe's biggest flight school and you'll be fine....regard it as a career...you may be disappointed. Yes, RYR is over crowded with FO's and that won't change. It costs the company nothing to bring in FO's.

[Al Murdoch]

Threads like this on PPRUNE are massively attractive to Trolls - they can't help themselves.

[Dan the weegie]

Can't disagree but equally this is the best way that the information about low hours and low pay being on offer and RYR for FOs who fork out for their rating.

Perhaps the more people that know about this the more FOs will think twice before signing on.

[Lord Spandex Masher]

Lord Spandex - the guy came on here asking if anyone else is experiencing reduced hours. A simple question. Why do you feel the need to reply with a harsh comment about making his bed, lying in it or clearing off? Totally unnecessary.

There is nothing harsh in using a common expression in response to somebody complaining about something they've brought on themselves. Man up wet pants.

The OP asked if it was his bad luck. It wasn't. It was his decision to "work" for Ryanair.

I'll ask again if you have a contract that states you will fly so many hours per year/month?

[fireflybob]

Apparently on the Storm "contract" the FOs are guaranteed a certain minimum number of hours a month.

[Lord Spandex Masher]

Thanks Bob, so the Brookfield guys haven't?

Well guess where all the work is going to go then.

[flying apple]

they have some hour per month guaranteed but they get paid les per hour
so it's not that the storm contracts are better then brookfields

[skyflyer737]

The OP just asked a question and he's had answer from VJW and I'll give him another answer. The FOs at my base are also hovering around the 90-100 hour mark for May, June & July.

Lord Spandex - for many (myself included five years ago) Ryanair was one of only a few options and financially it has worked out far better than if I'd gone anywhere else. I knew the risks with no guaranteed hours - we all do. But we don't need to be lectured about it on here. If the OP asked "Do you think coming here was a good idea? Please discuss" we would welcome your views but why do you come on here telling people to man up or clear off? It's just unnecessarily condescending.

End of rant. In answer to the OP - yes it looks like you're a little unlucky. I had quiet summer months when I was an FO too but over the whole year is what counts. Expect somewhere between 700 and 800.

[EdnaClouds]

Ronand - yes slightly, about 5/10 hrs down on average compared to last year.

Lord Spandex - thanks for your input towards RYR/BRK/Storm as ever.

New storm contract for FO's: less pay, but guaranteed 30hrs pay a month regardless.

[plain-plane]

Think about it this way... it is fairly cheap for FR to over-crew their aircrafts considering 72% of pilots are "pay as you go" contractors.
FR quite well knows that 99,9% of these contractors feel absolutely no loyalty to to MOL the almighty... So yep to the best of their ability FR try to have a few extra F/O's available... this caters for the increased summer production and for when now and again a driver goes "awol" without giving notice.
The extra number of F/O's also increase the captain candidate pool, which will help FR drive down the T&C even more.... all this with the only real and modest cost being the sim sessions for these extra pilots...

[SD.]

It's not that FR over over crewed with FO's. FR are under crewed with skippers and have cut schedules, flights and grounded aircraft.

Look around the network and you'll see aircraft on the ground, parked up for the night at 6pm.

The busiest summer in Europe for years and MOL can't fly all of his fleet. Sad but true.

[falconeasydriver]

The busiest summer in Europe for years and MOL can't fly all of his fleet. Sad but true.
Its because they are all relocating to US here at EK and other pastures new.
Even had a ex RYR TRE the other day as an observer :E

[McBruce]

Its a base by base situation I think. Some bases aren't flying some are.... Its my fourth summer in RYR and going by my previous summers, then this one is the worst. Still to do the full 5 days and doing roughly 50 hours per month. Its the same for all FO's in my base.

[Lord Spandex Masher]

Lord Spandex - for many (myself included five years ago) Ryanair was one of only a few options and financially it has worked out far better than if I'd gone anywhere else. I knew the risks with no guaranteed hours - we all do. But we don't need to be lectured about it on here. If the OP asked "Do you think coming here was a good idea? Please discuss" we would welcome your views but why do you come on here telling people to man up or clear off? It's just unnecessarily condescending.

It wasn't a case of manning up or clearing off. My man up comment was aimed specifically at you for being oh so easily offended by a common saying. I'm sure the OP can defend himself though and doesn't need any help from you.

As far as clearing off goes then that is simply one of the options available to you should you not be happy with your lot, after all you have got a decent type rating and there are jobs out there with actual contracts.

If you don't like comments from non Ryanair "employees" then don't post on an open public forum because when you do I am as entitled as anybody else to have my say.

Anyway, what do you really expect from Ryanair when there are cheaper pilots willing to fly?! You don't really need to be posting that particular question here do you? The answer is obvious but as some people seem unable to grasp that then I will offer them my opinion.

Edna, you're very welcome.

[Al Murdoch]

You're insufferable.

[Lord Spandex Masher]

You're off thread.

[antonov09]

There is a thread in the Rumours section about a Flybe Dash descending towards terrain. Maybe an opinion would be more useful there.

Hmmm on second thoughts.

[Lord Spandex Masher]

Well there was me thinking we always descend towards terrain.

It's just something you have to do when you land.

You're off thread as well unless there is a link so tenuous that I can't see it.

[antonov09]

I never knew that.

Thanks.:yuk:

[Lord Spandex Masher]

Anything else you need help with send a PM as you're way off subject.

[antonov09]

Ronand finished off his original post saying "Do any other RYR FO's experience similar hr reduction or is it just my badluck?"

You have never been on subject.

Neither have I. But I never claimed to be.

No help needed from you. I have a funny feeling I was flying planes when you were still in a high chair.

Cheers anyway.

[Lord Spandex Masher]

I asked a question about his contract. That's about as on topic as you can get.

You will, of course, realise that you can still learn from those less experienced than yourself. Not that you can say for certain if I am or not.

Please, continue with your fallacies.

By the way, your hard on for Flybe is a bit concerning.

[Lord Spandex Masher]

Nice ad hominem, I guess you're just a lot more humble than me.

My question would only be rhetorical if I already knew the answer, however, I didn't, did I? See what I did there?!

[antonov09]

Absolute lies. You did know the answer. Yes I did see what you did.

You lied.

[Lord Spandex Masher]

You can, of course, prove that I have knowledge of the OP's contract and had no need to ask my question then?!

Just saying that I lied doesn't mean I did.

[pilot3103]

Time for bed rather than bickering...

[WallyWumpus]

Ronand,

You have the sympathies of many, both in and out of RYR, and you will also generate the best of the trolls and ignorants by starting a thread like this on PPrune.

LSM is an exception to the above, as although often harsh, she is generally fair.

It would be prudent to take this conversation to REPA, where you will be able to guarantee an audience of only fellow RYR pilots, and where the exchange of information is less polluted and less aggressive. If you are not yet a member I suggest you sign up and take a look around.

There are no minimum hours for us in RYR, and everyone who flies for the company knew this before they joined and still chose to walk the road to their door. To see at as imperfect is understandable. To complain outright about it is a little silly.

[Callsign Kilo]

There are no minimum hours for us in RYR, and everyone who flies for the company knew this before they joined and still chose to walk the road to their door. To see at as imperfect is understandable. To complain outright about it is a little silly.

Absolutely. Ryanair will continually change the demographics to suit themselves, you are an afterthought. 300+ cadets a year will continue to be processed through East Midlands and CAE Amsterdam and the company is no longer growing. Today, I am told, the worst place to be in Ryanair is within the 500 - 2000 hours on type experience bracket. You are absolutely no use to them whatsoever. Unless you are a fresh out of the wrapper cadet which costs them next to nothing, a SFO with >2500hrs voicing a willingness to upgrade, a current skipper or a potential DEC then welcome to wilderness alley. Life isn't fair, but who told you otherwise? Was it Brookfield with their 800 hrs a year/4 years to command/life in the sunshine on a 5/4 bullsh1t?

[skyflyer737]

I'm sure Callsign Kilo has a point and his suggestions may be valid at several bases, but at my base all FOs are working hard no matter how many hours they've got, all are hovering around 800hrs in the last 12 months. There are of course no guarantees this will continue though.

[Ronand]

I did 700 hrs last year, and since may I've been flying an average of about 60hrs a month apparently a lot less than other FO's. From what I'm hearing. To be honest this makes me feel quite sick, that I'm earning a lot less than other FO's who are doing the same job, in the same company. I guess its time to start looking arround at other Operators...

[Callsign Kilo]

I did 700 hrs last year, and since may I've been flying an average of about 60hrs a month apparently a lot less than other FO's. From what I'm hearing. To be honest this makes me feel quite sick, that I'm earning a lot less than other FO's who are doing the same job, in the same company. I guess its time to start looking arround at other Operators...

I can't believe you posted this :ugh:

Why do you think this is happening?
Do you think you will receive any sympathy?
Will expressing this sort of sentiment to perspective employers land you another job?

If you couldn't foresee something like this happening in Ryanair, then you shouldn't have joined. I mean know offence Ronand, but come on. Really.

[Lord Spandex Masher]

I guess its time to start looking arround at other Operators...

Isn't that exactly what I suggested on page one?!

[Ronand]

I don't need sympathy, pilots are like sharks everyone for himself so I don't expect any sympathy from anyone....
Even though my moral is kinda low at the moment, I still don't regret that I joined, otherwise I would almost 100% sure be still sitting on my ass unepmloyed, and now I got options for better jobs....:ok:

[ford cortina]

Ever thought of joining Repa?

I am afraid to say I agree with Callsign Kilo and LSM completely.

You join Ryanair, you get what ever they dish out. If you are not prepared o stand up to it, either by yourself or as a group, that's your look out.

I see you have been with Ryanair, for just over a year, maybe you should have took that biz jet job.

[Robert G Mugabe]

Today, I am told, the worst place to be in Ryanair is within the 500 - 2000 hours on type experience bracket. You are absolutely no use to them whatsoever. Unless you are a fresh out of the wrapper cadet which costs them next to nothing, a SFO with >2500hrs voicing a willingness to upgrade, a current skipper or a potential DEC then welcome to wilderness alley. Life isn't fair, but who told you otherwise? Was it Brookfield with their 800 hrs a year/4 years to command/life in the sunshine on a 5/4 bullsh1t?

How true now just substitute Ryanair with easyJet in the above quote and you have the same state of affairs. Its no shock that these two companies are the better placed financially in Europe.

The orange machine is already offering unpaid leave over winter. So what hope do the cadets and flexicrew have. See you next summer if you are retained.

[i_like_tea]

At least easyJet has a route to a perm. contract, some of which are very nice indeed and nothing like the above.

I'm in the orange land and very happy, glad i'm not still flexi crew but it IS what they signed up for and if people really don't know what to expect then they should do a bit more reading!

Yes, it's not nice, but people are aware of the facts before the join up, i certainly was.

[Depone]

IMHO hours at FR are so variable, Ronand, that you're unlikely to have a clear idea of annual hours until the start of 2013. But even amongst pilots at the same base you may find yourself 100 hours up or down on the average.