VISION THREAD (other than colour vision) 2

[SAS-A321]

When getting your eyes fixed with LASIK, can the AME see it on your eyes?

Do you have to provide some kind of proof that your vision was within the limits (JAR Class 1) before the operation or can he measure it on the eyes?

[RMarvin86]

I'm also interested in knowing this answer. I searched old posts and I found that there are two ways of finding it at the medical examination.

My question is. If they don't notice it during the first visit is there any possibility that they will find it during renuwal?

If I don't declare surgery and they find it at the first visit, then what happens?

Is there anyone out there who did cheat in some way?

Any information is more than welcome :ok:

[mau mau]

Ok guys.......

On the basis of my experience.
in UK (Gatwick) I did not saw any computer to do Corneal mapping and they did not any special examination at my cornea.
So I assume if you don't tell them nothing they are not able to find the laser intervention.
But Lasik and other laser corrections are allowed, if you are inside limits before the intervention so why don't tell them?
Since laser is allowed, is better to admit about the intervention because before practice the visit, you have to sign a paper with your story and there is explicity a question :"Do you had any lasers/lasik intervention at your eyes"?
If you declare NO, you do a false declaration....I don't know what happen.:uhoh:
And even if you pass your initial and in the future will emerge you did laser, should be a BIG BIG problem. Much better tell them as first thing.
I did my laser (RPK) 8 year ago, and no problem at all: 1 class no restrictions.
When you do laser, clearly before the laser intervention, the doctor write your clinic state, included pre-operative myopia and astigmatism: AME will want a copy of this paper. Thats all.

[RMarvin86]

Of course there should be no problem to admit laser/lasik if you fall within limits. Problems come when you're out of those limit before eye surgery.

Can somebody tell me if CAA UK is stricly applying the JAA limits or do they evaluate each situation? I know about the astigmatism limit pre-operation is 2.0 dioptres for first visit. What if I do lasik with 2.25 or 2.50 and have slight miopia (less thank 3 dioptres), any chance to pass? Anyone did have experience like this? I don't want to cheat but I'll do my best to get class 1. Do I have more chance if I already hold an italian class 1 and going to UK after surgery for first time visit? I cannot either do renuwal in italy because don't hold CPL yet and I'm looking forward to do surgery and fly over to the UK.
Any information about this topic will be of help. Thanks!

[mau mau]

NO WAY in Italy.
In Italy is not permitted to do laser, so if you did laser and have 0,05 astigmatism and 0,05 myopia, you will be out anyway. Due that i went in UK. ITALY does not apply JAR FCL-3 even if is a JAA nation.

UK apply strictly the limits for initial!!!!
If you are outside limits I suggest:

1 - Ask to AME: if they said you can do it even outside limits and you will be alright if the visit will be ok....you are ready to fly!! :ok:

2 - If they said " NO, even with laser you will not be able to gain 1 class"...well, I suggest to go in USA, get 1 class (you will get it in USA, don't worry) and do CPL FAA. Then come back in UK and go to gatwick: they, on the basis of CPL/1 class ICAO (FAA), will apply to you the renewal limit (no limits for astigmatism and -8 for myopia) even if is a initial.

3 - Don't tell them nothing! And Hopefully does not happen anything in the future.

[RMarvin86]

Thank you mau mau, I never considered option n. 2, and it seems to be the best solution. Do you have a link to FAA medical requirements?
So, if I got it right if I get an FAA CPL with of course an FAA class 1 after the training I can apply for a JAA-UK class 1 and they will apply the renuwal restriction even if I did never show up at gatwick before? After that convirt FAA into JAA and be able to fly in Italy-Europe? Sounds cool.

Then come back in UK and go to gatwick: they, on the basis of CPL/1 class ICAO (FAA), will apply to you the renewal limit (no limits for astigmatism and -8 for myopia) even if is a initial.


Are sure that renuwal limits are -8 for myopia and no limits for astigmatism? I though it was 3.0 for astigmatism and 5.0 for myopia or did they change it recently?

[RMarvin86]

I found this:

eCFR ? Code of Federal Regulations (http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=ecfr&sid=3b84537dcd2a04f43e3e9f7b4b66b0ac&rgn=div8&view=text&node=14:2.0.1.1.5.2.1.2&idno=14)

Seems to be the official eye requirment to obtain an FAA class 1 medical certificate. It seems strange but I can't find any myopia/astigmatism restriction !! Is that true? Would be great.
I want to be sure about this and about the fact that converting to JAA they do not apply any specific restriction for astigmatism. :confused:

Thanks for help.

[mau mau]

But why do you want to work in Italy??! This is a **** place to fly and the airlines as well.
Anyway regarding FAA requirements, you will find everything you need on website.
Regarding limits in UK look at follow:

http://www.caa.co.uk/default.aspx?catid=49&pagetype=90&pageid=531

other usefull info are here:

http://www.caa.co.uk/default.aspx?catid=49&pagetype=90&pageid=534

"JAR Class 1
The initial refractive error (correction) limit is +5/-6 dioptres. There is no myopic limit for revalidation/renewal. The astigmatism (distortion) and anisometropia (difference between the eyes) initial limits are 2 dioptres, but there are no limits for revalidation/renewal.
NOTE: contact lenses must be worn if the anisometropia exceeds 3 dioptres."


PS: If you hold a FAA CPL, it's not their roule to apply renewal limit....BUT....
They are more free to examine you carefully and apply at their own discretion the limits of renewal. And 90% they will try to meet your need.
Without cpl FAA (icao) instead, they shall scrupulously keep the limits for initial.

[itsmejames]

After a successful LASik surgery many of my colleagues kept on asking me about “is LAsik painful?” and I always told them that its not, a bite of an ant is more painful than LASik. Anyway, I want to share to everyone here who are planning to have the same procedure but skeptical about the pain, I will tell you that its NOT painful, because you will receive anesthetic eye drops prior to your LASIK treatment which should prevent from feeling any discomfort, though some people do experience a slight sensation of pressure on their eyes during the procedure. Once you return home after LASIK, it is normal for some patients to experience mild discomfort, watery eyes, light sensitivity or blurry vision. These symptoms are usually temporary and treatable with over the counter medication, such as Tylenol. Hope it helps you folks.

[planecrazy.eu]

Not sure why you wouldnt want to declare you have had lasik/ek surgery.

When i was going through the motions, i asked the CAA and they said its acceptable, however they extra check a few things like glare.

I am pretty sure if your honest or not, it wont change the outcome.

But i may well be wrong....

I recon there are better ways to cheat the test than that...

[niknak]

Don't forget that if you've previously held any CAA medical certificate and you were required to wear corrective lenses/spectacles, the AME may ask a few searching questions if you turn up for a renewal/reissue and are able to see unaided.

Until recently, it used to be the case that the CAA required you to undertake a period of time away from flying/controlling to ensure that satisfactory stability of the eyes.

Best to come clean and admit it.

[Raptor_]

Yes they will see it!

When I did my initial Class 1 they took a picture of my eyes, measuring the thickness of the cornea etc. The first thing the lady asked me when she looked at the screen was; how long is it since you had laser surgery performed?

I think the required wait before you can apply for a Class 1 medical after you had LASIK done is minimum 6 months. They are however not interested in what your vision was pre-LASIK, only what your vision is uncorrected (and corrected if needed) at the time you do your medical.

Be honest with your AME, playing tricks and covering up things will only come back to you the bad way.

[Money 4 Jam]

I think the required wait before you can apply for a Class 1 medical after you had LASIK done is minimum 6 months.I believe this information to be wrong, stabilized vision is a requirement. I had a 1st class certificate about six weeks post surgery.

[Raptor_]

I think the required wait before you can apply for a Class 1 medical after you had LASIK done is minimum 6 months.I believe this information to be wrong, stabilized vision is a requirement. I had a 1st class certificate about six weeks post surgery.It is actually 3 months for LASIK and 6 months for PRK.
JAR Class 1 visual standards as applied by the UK CAA:
http://www.caa.co.uk/default.aspx?catid=49&pagetype=90&pageid=2189 - See under "Refactive Surgery"

I belive there are, or might be, some small variations from country to country regarding the different limits and wait-times etc.

What I said in my previous post about the pre-op vision is not entirely correct. Your vision pre-op, at least for the UK, should be no worse than +5/-6, but if you're just outside you can discuss your case with the CAA Medical Department.

[downunderscouser]

Hi peoples,

I have been training for a CPL in Australia and on my initial medical class 1 and 2 I was granted a conditional class 1 and 2 with restrictions due to inferior eyesight in my left eye due to amblyopia.

I passed vision in both eyes, and in my left eye, however i only managed 6/12 instead of 6/9 in my right eye.

The restrictions are:

Valid for Australian airspace only
No rotary wing flying
No mustering or low level agricultural flying.

I am most concerned of course about the first restriction as this pretty much sounds like it blows away any chance of flying for an airline internationally.

I believe that these restrictions are placed because I pass the medical requirements for Australian airspace, but ICAO's vision standards are higher therefore the medical is not valid outside of australia.

Is this the case for me or is it still possible to fly internationally?

Are there any ways around this?

[RavenII]

I had a similar problem.

For the FAA you can do a medical flight test, if u pass this, you get an unrestricted medical.

I passed it and they gave me a state of demonstrated ability, if i rock up fo a new medical, i just show this soda, and they give me my new medical (ClassI) without trouble. (And i'm flying rotorwing, not fixedwing)

For the JAA it is a different story, that really depends on the situation....

[downunderscouser]

Thanks for that reply - it definately gives me some hope :)

I gather that means travelling to the USA to do that medical flight test?

Anyone got any suggestions about JAA? what about CAA?

[ivierre]

Sorry to hear that....

I am sorry but i am abit confused. How is amblyopia different from other visions problems like short sighted, long sighted or astigmatism?

Is the 6/9 requirement the requirement without corrective lenses? Could corrective lenses or lasik surgery help with the problem of amblyopia?

[ariel]

ivierre

Amblyopia is a condition where the affected eye cannot be corrected by prescription lenses, or otherwise.

I think (and I obviously will stand to be corrected by those who know for sure), that in undiagnosed, (and therefore, uncorrected) amblyopia in childhood, the neural pathways from the eye to the brain do not develop properly, so good vision is never attained in that eye.

If discovered in early childhood, methods such as surgery or eye patching are used to 'force' the brain to accept vision from the defective eye, thus preventing the deterioration in the neural pathways.

[ivierre]

Thank you very much and I am sorry to hear that. But do not give up!

Actually, say, how do someone find out if they have Amblyopia or not? except being checked by the specialist? :confused:

[Mickey Kaye]

Amblyopia exercises have been shown to be effective in Px over the age of 8 years of age (which is at the point that the visual system development becomes hard wired) however they are usually transient improvements. Basically when you stop the exercises the vision returns to is pre-exercise level. However the exercises don’t work with everyone. If you are trying to get from 6/12 to 6/9 which is not a huge improvement I would think the appropriate eye exercises would be worth trying – you just might have to do them every year for a month or so before each medical.

[davsto]

Dear all,

I'm looking for some pilots who can share experiences regarding the initial JAR medical examination for monocular pilots.
As I have a waiver issued by the FAA (SODA) for a class III medical, I've been flying for around four years now (200+ TT). Therefore, I would like to see how I can apply for JAR medical somewhere in Europe as well. JAR doesn't seem to be as relaxed about this matter as the FAA, but I would still like to give it a try.
British CAA seems to be more open to this than some other authorities.

If there is someone here with useful vision in one eye and flying with a JAR medical, I would appreciate a (personal) message.

[22/04]

When JAR regulations were introduced I think it was very difficult for monocular pilots to meet medical standards. Things may have eased a little since. Some JAR states (the UK was one) have continued to allow pilots to fly within their areas of juridisdiction if they already held a licence, issuing a Class Two with licence limitations - my licence is only valid in the UK unless I obtain written permssion from other states. Other states may not have fully aligned to JAR- I belive France still licences private pilots in accordance with ICAO class two, which may allow monocular vision under certain circumstances with restrictions. In the UK we currently have a national licence which is regulated by driver standards and allows monocular flying.

Best thing to do is to contact the JAR Authority where you wish to fly (e.g. DGAC in France the CAA in the UK, LBA in Germany)


All this will change in the period 2012-2015 when EASA takes over Flight Crew Licensing in Europe. It may then be possible to meet the standard for a LAPL (Light Aeroplane Pilots Licence) with monocular vision subject ot a flight test, and if ICAO Class Two standards are adopted, for a Private Pilts Licence but the machine is still turining on this.

Alternatively find an N-reg aeroplane to fly- there are loads here in the UK though the rules for flying these may also change under EASA

[davsto]

EASA is also my big hope. Nevertheless, it might be worth giving it a try under JAR. Maybe flight experience helps to convince one of the national authorities in Europe.

I'm currently flying N-regs here. That works out pretty well for me. But as you said, this opportunity might also not be there anymore once EASA rules are in effect. That's what I'm basically concerned about. Otherwise, I would simply stick to my FAA certificate.

German is LBA is pretty hopeless. They are strict about everything, and to my knowledge they won't even consider special issuance in a case like mine.
I wonder how national licenses like the N-PPL in UK will be transformed into EASA licenses. That will be particularly interesting in case of e.g. monocular pilots. Maybe the rest of EASA could benefit from that.

More comments and opinions are welcome (you can also PM me).

[paulryan1990]

hi
i am also monocular and trying to get a jar or caa medical. i was talking to the caa today and they have asked me to get the following form filled out and post it to them for special consideration:
Glasses - any preferences? [Archive] - PPRuNe Forums (http://www.pprune.org/archive/index.php/t-316397.html)

i would like to hear your story of how you obtained your faa medical and ppl and how your getting on obtaining a jar medical.

[sto]

- Got my initial FAA 3rd class medical in 2006, carrying restriction: "only for student pilot purposes". Got it from Oklahoma as my AME had to defer the decision due to no useful vision, left eye (< 20 /200). I could solo with this medical, but had to take a MFT (medical flight test) before doing the check ride. Passed both, received a SODA and unrestricted 3rd class medical and, of course, the PPL ASEL certificate

- Having accumulated roughly 250 TT, wanted to apply to initial JAR class 2. Forget about German CAA (the LBA), they won't even consider. Sent an eye examination report to UK CAA, got approval to go ahead with the rest of the initial examination. That was done with an UK AME. Had to do a MFT again and received a class 2 medical with an AGL restriction: "valid only with approved eye protection". Apparently that means that if I'm flying in any zero / neg G condition or open cockpit, that protection has to be worn. Still have to do some research on this.

---

FAA is the way to go for the very initial medical with monocular vision. Most other CAAs are more restrictive than the FAA. But: Once you have some decent PIC solo time other authorities will more likely consider you. Flight experience really is the door opener in this case. And it's easiest to start off with a FAA medical for this purpose.

Will try to get a (restricted) JAR class 1 medical after some more years of flying, and possibly also a FAA class 2 / 1.

PM me if you have questions. And don't be discouraged by people telling you that you cannot fly. You can.

[paulryan1990]

i meant to update this thread as to my position also:

i am monocular , left eye 20/200 right eye 20/20

i obtained a class 1 FAA with the need for a MFT to get a SODA

i also managed to get a class 2 uk CAA JAR medical with the need to do a MFT.

i will back up the last posters comments. don't give up, fight your corner and you will succeed.
any one has any questions drop me a pm.

[Bad medicine]

Dear All,

Same as for the colour vision thread, I've started a new vision thread as the sites owners have told us that the large threads (more than 1000 posts) put too big a load on the servers and slow the site down. The old thread will remain for reference.

Cheers,

BM

[Jerry Lee]

Roger that. I will re-post my last message but I hope it is not a problem at all.

Is it true that the UK CAA will not be issuing EASA medicals until 17th September, 2012?
I heard they will issue JAR licence till 16th September, 2012 because 1st July, 2012 date turned out to not be achievable.
Can anybody confirm it?

[Dr Jekyll]

Perhaps I misunderstand your post but 6/6 even with correction is fine, and -1.00 correction is also well within limits.

[ayebmi]

Hi guys,

Can anybody tell me when the Spanish CAA is implementing the new EASA Part-MED regulations?

Thanks.:rolleyes:

[tcw3]

Is there someone out there who has actually interviewed/worked for any >Japanese< and other Asian carriers that can assist me with a vision improvement type laser eye surgery question? Please know I have already read all that I can locate on this website. (I have read a few posts that leaned towards saying that this procedure is not permitted in Japan) I then took the extra step of writing two of the broker agencies that have been around for a long time. An established person at Wasinc said this procedure is prohibited by the Japanese Gov’t. But to confuse the issue further a senior Asia person at Rishworth wrote me that an applicant can succeed when applying to a Japanese carrier but reminded me of the necessary steps, ie that one must disclose this on the front end, bring one’s existing home country aviation Medical Certificate and bring the before and after eye measurements from the Dr who performed the surgery. So, from the employment offices that should know, I have received two answers that contradict one another.
In a nutshell,
1 can a pilot successfully obtain a Japanese Gov’t airline pilot’s Level medical if they are healthy in all areas but have previously had successful Laser eye surgery (to improve their vision)? I know radial keratonamy won’t pass, but if they do permit it does the Japanese Gov’t distinguish with a thumbs up/down between PRK and Lasik?
2 If the Japanese Gov’t permits it, does it end up being a de facto item of not getting hired cause no actual Airline in Japan will offer employment to a pilot who has had this?
3 And while we are on this topic, might you happen to know if Laser eye surgery for vision improvement is permitted in
Korea
Singapore
Malaysia
China
Indonesia

Do any of these countries distinguish between PRK and Lasik?

I appreciate whatever info you can pass along. I don’t mind filling out all the various applications but I would like to avoid spending the time barking up the wrong tree if this is a No Go item in certain countries. I imagine your answer will help out a good number of pilots out on this website. Thanks.

[RedBullGaveMeWings]

I heard the time to re-instate a Class 1 medical certificate and a Class 2 medical certificate after a LASIK eye surgery is not 3 months anymore but only 20 days according to new EASA rules. Can anybody confirm that?:eek:
I thought it was still 3 months from date of surgery if LASIK and 6 months from date of surgery if PRK.

I'd really appreciate an answer:}

[An0maly]

Hi All ,

I'd like to apply for a C1 Med and believe that I meet the criteria with the exception of that I exceed the Esophoria limit , which would probably mean an Unfit assessment by AME and referral to Consultant Opthamologist .

I've seen my Orthoptist at Moorefields and showed her the C1 Med requirements , she said that I'm about 12 Eso but that it is well compensated for and have very good Fusional reserves. I also did the Stereoscopic test and could see the 3D images , which means I do retain Binocular vision . She increased my prescription from ( +2.25 L / 2 R ) to ( +3 ) on both as it might help with the Esophoria . I'm supposed to go back in a few days to be checked again and get a report written up to take with me to Gatwick.

She reckons that I could get a pass based on the Compensation and Fusional reserves but IF that wasn't good enough then I could have surgery ( Strabismus correction ?? ) to sort out the imbalance .

Anyone have experience with Esophoria on C1 recently ? I've found a few posts circa 2007 / 2010 and they weren't even referred for further evaluation , 2007 person even said that AME didn't bother measuring fusional reserve.

With regards to the surgery , I remember reading a few posts saying that it was only for cosmetic purposes in adults . According to my Orthoptist and a couple of articles on the web it can improve the eye muscle imbalance , rather confused now :confused:

[WS-G]

tcw3: WRT Singapore, the answer is "yes", even for military pilot selection. Yes, that's right: current standard for selection by the Republic of Singapore Air Force is a refraction within +/-5.00 spherical dioptres and correctable to 6/6 or better in each eye separately, distant and near, no more than 2.00 cylinder dioptres of astigmatism. You must be a citizen or permanent resident of Singapore.


From their own official website:

Republic of Singapore Air Force - Careers - Vocations (http://www.mindef.gov.sg/rsaf/careers/careers/vocations.html)

[tcw3]

WS-G, thanks for the input and web link. tcw3

[Al321]

So I've been reading the new EASA medical guidelines:

http://easa.europa.eu/agency-measures/docs/agency-decisions/2011/2011-015-R/AMC%20and%20GM%20on%20the%20medical%20certification%20of%20p ilots%20and%20medical%20fitness%20of%20cabin%20crew.pdf

On page 24 it states:


(d) Refractive error
(1) At initial examination an applicant may be assessed as fit with:
(i) hypermetropia not exceeding +5.0 dioptres;
(ii) myopia not exceeding –6.0 dioptres;
(iii) astigmatism not exceeding 2.0 dioptres;
(iv) anisometropia not exceeding 2.0 dioptres
provided that optimal correction has been considered and no significant pathology is demonstrated.

(2) Initial applicants who do not meet the requirements in (1)(ii), (iii) and (iv) above should be referred to the licensing authority. A fit assessment may be considered following review by an ophthalmologist.


So does this mean that someone who exceeds these limits (for example, having myopia of -8.0) will be granted a Class 1 medical if they are checked by an opthalmologist and given the all-clear? Earlier on the page it states:


Where specialist ophthalmological examinations are required for any significant reason, this should be imposed as a limitation on the medical certificate.


What do they mean by this? What kind of limitation? :confused:

[Lizz]

I thought I'd pop a post on here regarding my eye sight. I'm looking to hopefully do NPPL which I shouldn't have a problem with, I drive after all. (My general health is good)
My question lies in the other licences which I'm afraid the names of escape me right now, not fully clued up just yet! But basically, I don't want to have to rule out (as long as everything goes well) going commerical and flying for an airline.

I don't really understand my contact lens prescription but my right eye is 6/6-3 and my left is 6/60 and I know that's terrible!!! :(
I've tried looking at the CAA website but couldn't really make 100% sense of it. I've debated looking into getting my eyes sorted, fear and a lack of money have stood in my way and knowing now I can more than likely get the NPPL I'm ok to put it on the back burner although have considered going for a free consultation to see what's said.

My optician said they probably wouldn't do anything with the left because it's bad and because my brain uses my right for seeing and the left for preriferal vision only through years (22 or so) of only having 1 good eye. And he also said they'd probably be funny about doing anything with the right as it wouldn't leave me with a good eye.
However when I put my prescription into the laser eye surgury companies website it says something can be done.

Really, anyone who is/has been in a similar boat, any advice?
Thank you in advance, I really appreciate people giving me all this advice when I know so little :ok:

[covad83]

Hi Lizz,

I've been in a similar boat to you and taken the plunge (I'll stop with the sea based metaphors immediately).

I had 6/60 in both eyes which isn't too bad. I had Lasik surgery four years ago and my right eye deteriorated so I had it done again a couple of months ago. The surgery really isn't that bad but granted, it is quite expensive.

I had a Class 1 medical which is now suspnded for three months until my right eye has recovered but fingers crossed I should get it again. I intend to become a commercial pilot so laser surgery really shouldn't stop you.

There are pre-op limits to what you can be corrected from so double check them and talk to your optician if you exceed that in your worse eye as that will stop the commercial pilot option immediately (sorry, I know that might be frustrating but there is nothing you can do about it so I'm not going to lie).

Happy to answer any questions if you have any.

[Lizz]

Cheers for the sea based reply!
I've come to accept that maybe, just maybe it's a dream I'll have to let go of. Still right now I'm trying to find the money for a private licence, so I'm thinking a while ahead.

As I said I put the prescription into optimax I think it was and it said something could be done either lasek, lasik or a lens into my eye, whatever that one's called although that sounds horrific but that's just me being squimish! :eek:

Saying this I watched air crash investigation on Monday and that captain only had 1 eye and managed to land a plane without engines! So maybe, just maybe there's hope yet!
I have just looked at optical express as well and they too say something can be done. It might just be worth me popping in for one of these free consultations to see what they say, can get an answer either way then!

[RAY - Musician Pilot]

Hello All,

I know that the class 1 medical in JAA/CASA/FAA or even HKCAD also accept do the 20/20 test with correction lens. (Only short sight and Astigmatism, no other eye problem)

However, I just want to know that what is the limit of short sight and Astigmatism?

Also, did the JAA/CASA/FAA accept pilot did the Corneal Refractive Technology /Orthokeratology (Non-surgery) or Implantable Contact Lens (ICL) or lasik, laser??
Accept or Not? If yes, how long around the period that the pilot need to rest after taking the above treatment?

Thank you for answering my question.

[dobbin1]

EASA Medical Standards are here:-

https://easa.europa.eu/agency-measures/docs/agency-decisions/2011/2011-015-R/AMC%20and%20GM%20on%20the%20medical%20certification%20of%20p ilots%20and%20medical%20fitness%20of%20cabin%20crew.pdf

Class 1 eyesight standards are on page 24

[Kengineer-130]

How soon will Gatwick start testing to the new standards?

[Smiless]

After a year of putting my dreams of being a pilot aside and simply concentrating on my degree in Aerospace Engineering due to my eye-sight-not-fit-enough worries, I still cannot stop craving to become a pilot. I am now halfway through my degree, and I am also in position to be able to afford lessons.

But first off, I know this question comes up time after time, but I honestly do not understand a lot of the eye sight requirements, so I thought it would be best to just post my prescription:

Right
Sphere: -0.75
Cylinder: -3.50
Axis: 180
Distance acuity: 6/7.5
Near acuity: N5

Left
Sphere: -2.25
Cylinder: -3.25
Axis: 180
Distance acuity: 6/7.5
Near acuity: N5

Back vertex distance: 9mm

Could anyone be kind enough to tell me if my eyes would be ok to pass the Class 1 Medical test?

Also, would you advise on laser eye surgery? I am prepared to undergo the laser surgery if it is of benefit to a career as a pilot.

If all is well, then I am prepared to try and get my Class 1 test done as soon as possible, and start my training.

I know a lot of people would bring up the question regarding whether I understand what it is like to be a pilot etc. And to answer this beforehand, I understand the "stresses" and the lifestyle pilots undergo and have, as I have a family friend who is a recently retired captain which used to work for Cathay Pacific, and he has mentioned quite a lot regarding the lifestyle of pilots etc. Either way, I really do want to get into a career as a pilot, as it simply has been a dream of mine since a very young age. It's just that my eye-sight has always held me back... :(

[Phororhacos]

The easy answer is that your prescription as you have written it is outside published limits.

Nevertheless I think it would be worth having an up to date eye test and asking your optician to fill out the CAA eye examination form, http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/49/Ophthalmology%20Form%20MED162.pdf then submitting the lot to the CAA at Gatwick and asking in writing a) whether you have a chance of Class 1 certification as you stand, and b) if not, would refractive surgery(with all the risks involved) give you a chance.

you can look at
Guidance following eye surgery | Medical | Personal Licences and Training (http://www.caa.co.uk/default.aspx?catid=2499&pagetype=90&pageid=13878)

and http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/1859/FinalspeccalcV6.6.xlsx

but for the sake of an eye test and a letter, I would still write to them.

FWIW It looks like you would be ok for a PPL medical but that is not the question you asked.

[An0maly]

If that is your best corrected acuity then I'm afraid you don't get an EASA class 1 or 2 medical as both require 6/6 binocular vision , you can however get a LAPL which is the EASA equivalent of the NPPL .

I myself am in the same boat having recently been to see the good people at Gatwick and passed all the Class 1 tests except for the basic eye chart where I scored ( 6/6 -1 ) which means I always miss 1 letter on the 6/6 line as I can't clearly differentiate between O & C , P an F , etc ) on the standard eye chart however I can see 6/5 on the HTOV chart . I was told that even though functionally there is nothing wrong with my eye sight , I fall on the wrong side of 6/6 and thats what the rule says . Also as the Snellen chart is standard , my HTOV results are meaningless , the CAA handbook of Ophthalmology says no mistakes on the standard 6/6 .

My problem can not be corrected by lenses as it is caused by Amblyopia which is a Brain-Eye dysfunction and not refractory in nature . I suggest you go see an Optheometrist to find out why your best corrected is 6/7.5 and if Laser will help or not . Otherwise , you could look in to getting an FAA PPL with a class 3 medical to get around LAPL restrictions , however with EASA rules coming down hard on foreign non commercial licenses and aircraft then it might be a bit pointless . FAA also allows you to get a license with a SODA ( medical flexibility ) , but not sure if you can get Class 1 or 2 with that and even if you could then you'd have to get a job on N-Reg .

Best of luck and hope you can be corrected to 6/6 , I myself am rather miffed at how close I am and the lack of application of common sense ...

[Phororhacos]

From what it says on the CAA website VA of 6/7.5 is ok for class 2, even if his binocular vision is not better than the 6/7.5 corrected stated for each eye.

Visual System GM | Medical | Personal Licences and Training (http://www.caa.co.uk/default.aspx?catid=2499&pagetype=90&pageid=13885#VisAc)

(2) in the case of class 2 medical certificates, 6/12 (0,5) or better in each eye separately and visual acuity with both eyes shall be 6/9 (0,7) or better.

[An0maly]

That's good to know , although is not what the AME at Gatwick told me about 2 months ago . I specifically asked that if I'm not eligible for a C1 if I could get a C2 , he said no as even that requires 6/6 binocular . Maybe its something that changed recently , if I'd known that at the time I wouldn't have cancelled all my PPL arrangements ( time off work , travel , training deposit ,.. ) .

[Smiless]

Thank you both Phororhacos (http://www.pprune.org/members/105097-phororhacos) and An0maly (http://www.pprune.org/members/387759-an0maly).
I will be getting my eyes checked over once more and then write a letter to the CAA regarding my eye-sight and whether I have any chances at all to pass the Class 1 medical (with or without refractive eye surgery).

I know the chances are slim, but it's worth a try. It's just so upsetting that everyone in my family has perfect vision, but me, the only one that has interests in flying, has the bad eye-sight. :(

I'll update once I've got a response from the CAA and I'll just hope for the best for now.

Thanks again. :ok:

[An0maly]

Be sure to ask the doctor if you can be corrected to 6/6 and if not then why , so you can include that in your letter to the CAA . Saves you going back and forth with them asking for additional reports .

Wish you all the best :ok:

[Smiless]

I went to see an optometrist for another eye test as well as a laser consultation. After the eye test, the optometrist said I in fact COULD see 20/20, and my glasses are too strong for my left eye, which he said wasn't good... :eek:

I am also suitable for Lasik eye surgery. I just hope that I still have a chance with the class 1 medical with my pre-op prescription. Nevertheless, I will be sending a letter/email to the CAA asking for advice regarding this issue.

I'll update when I receive a reply, and hopefully it's a good one. :)

[schfandrew]

Hi all sorry if this has already been covered

I underwent surgery as a child to correct my left lazy eye. However the problem is still here years down the line but only mild.

Does having amblyopia automatically prevent you from gaining a class 1 medical or are there limits on how severe the condition can be

Is it possible to obtain a class 2 much easier?

It would be fantastic to hear from anyone who also has this problem or knows of somebody who has.


Thank you.

[GuilhasXXI]

Hello everybody, lately my vision starts to get blurry with night fall. Not sure if I´m spending too much time in front of the computer or if my vision is getting worse. Should I stay away from either computer and television for a few days?
Thanks in advance

[Loose rivets]

I'm a pilot not a doctor.


Age? That's important.


When you say nightfall, do you mean you are actually in reduced lighting?


Have you been checked for cataracts or even just had a standard vision test?


If you splash your eyes with fresh water, do you get an instant improvement?

Is there any redness on the whites of the eyes?


Is there any sign of crusty matter around your eyes in the mornings?

[GuilhasXXI]

I´m 19 years old, and yes, usually in reduced lighting. I´ve done my Class 1 Medical exam, I´m an ATPL student, and strangely yes, I normally get some crust in the eyes i the morning..

[Loose rivets]

Get it checked out, but just a start.

Your eyesight might well be on the focus-limits for the study work young pilots have to do. Check your best focus distance on the page or monitor and check it against your usual working distance. Many hours spent on limits is very tiring.

Wearing specs was something I had to do when young, but then I didn't need them for years.

Take great care with cleanliness, especially hair and around the eyes. A residual infection should be treated right away, but anyway, resist the temptation to repeatedly rub your eyes when tired etc. Tears contain a fantastic antibiotic, but help them along by taking care.

[p1fel]

Posteriar Vitreous Detachement, PVD an eyesight condition which I understand is age related. It's quite possible pilots of a certain vintage with this eyesight condition, may not be completely aware they have it.

If one senses flickering at the edge of the eye during the day and flashing lights in the dark, it could be one of two things, an optical migrane or the onset of PVD and requires investigation.

Gell is likely to be coming away from the retina, the gell breaks away and floats around. It is possible tear's or hole's can occur to the retina and in extreme circumstances a Retina Detachement, with potential eyesight loss.

If this occurs it can be recoverable, provided you go immediately to an eye hospital. If an eye hospital is not available nearby, then a major hospital with an opthalmic specialist department. Even passing by an optician pop in and they will refer you there and then and call an ambulance.

I recently got PVD and the symptons are, of having an annoying fuzzy veil or lace curtain of patchy gell moving across your vision. Somewhat worse than 'floaters' which most people have at some stage anyway. The gell floates across the back of the lense making vision temporarily look fuzzy, until you blink and try and move the gell away and re focus.

I've always been of the belief age 60 is a pretty good age to hang up the headset, in fact I did it at 58 and glad I did. But to have reached today almost 61 with last eye test -0.0 Dps Left eye + 0.5 Dps Right and +2.25 for reading in both, being able to read one up from the bottom line of the eye test chart to probably still pass a class one but for PVD, would be of concern to me.

I understand most can learn to live with it and ignore its presence.

After having an in depth eye test at my optician, with drops to dilate the pupil to allow the optician to have a very good look into the eye and after having photographs taken of the retina I'm glad to say I have extremely healthy Retina's.

I could be wrong, but I think an AME might not pick up this condition unless one said something, then it could be curtains (excuse the pun) to the rest of your flying career I would suspect.

As I am retired I feel I am able to say the above. If it helps any one actively still flying, it's worth being aware of the condition.

p.s. I am not a medic if some of the above is inaccurate, this is my personal experience and opinion and should not be acted upon.

[Loose rivets]

Unlikely, but not impossible at 19 years old.


There is, or was, an eye surgeon in Colchester, who got a PVD in a car accident in his youth. 'The brain learns to look around it.' He did eye surgery with it like that for decades.

I however, wanted my big blob out of the way.


I've written a lot about PVD.

The operation, a vitrectomy, is not too bad, but there is a strong likelihood of a nuclear cataract forming within a few months. That really confuses the visual grey matter cos the brain tries to multi-lense around the obstructions. Very confusing. This of course requires the lens to be changed.

I would be interested to know if there's a procedure that avoids this unpleasant side effect. One American surgeon recons he lets the new fluid in, in a different place/way and stops the cataract reaction. Never heard any more about it.

[B77L]

Concerning eyesight, always eyesight :ugh:

I was looking for BA requirements for myopia/astigmatism and their policy about eye surgery, given that I have "To be able to obtain and hold a JAA Class 1 medical and meet British Airways medical criteria".

Does anyone know something about that? Any info would be really appreciated.

[fmgc]

I am an airline pilot in the UK flying G registered aircraft.

I am thinking about having laser eye surgery, LASIK to be more precise. The CAA have told me that is fine but I have to have 3 months off flying after the procedure and then have an exam with their own ophthalmologist.

I would be interested to know if anybody else has had this procedure and what their experiences were especially with regards to the CAA.

[Fugazi1000]

Hi,

I am not a pilot and have no experience of the CAA, however I have had LASIK surgery in both eyes. For me it was a good move and I am pleased I had it done although it does mean my dusk/night vision is quite impaired as all lights tend to 'star'. I was warned about lights showing a 'halo' effect, but what I now live with is more pronounced than I ever expected. It might be worth asking your consultant about these effects. I had the wave-front (NASA based) guided laser technology that was the newest available about 8 years ago. Assuming CAA are happy, and consultant provides the right answers for you - then all the best if you go ahead.

[bucket_and_spade]

I'm a UK pilot too and wear contacts.

I personally wouldn't want to risk my livelihood by having laser treatment. I know the risks are small but also that the results can vary between people for many reasons - risk/reward ratio too high for me as any problems or an unsatisfactory result could mean loss of medical and a career change!

Is there a particular reason you want to bin glasses/contacts for laser?

I'd just be a little wary as I assume this is also your livelihood.

Just my thoughts!

[aviate1138]

How many Laser Eye Surgeons have had the procedure done to themselves? Most of the ones I see have regular glasses!

[fmgc]

Ok,

Thanks for your responses so far.

More after info from any pilots that HAVE had it done. The risks associated with it I can and have weighed up for myself.

[hampshireandy]

Never ever have eye surgery unless it is 100% guaranteed no ill effects! I know people who have spent thousands on surgery but as their vision was really poor they still need glasses!! Also several people suffer blurred night vision after surgery, not great when trying to drive or fly at night in teeming rain with lights coming towards you.
If spectacles do the job perfectly well then stick with those until laser surgery is much more advanced and proven to be more successful

[BOMB-DOCTOR]

I am a UK ATPL holder. Had lasik surgery at Moorfields London. No dramas had the procedure, follow up the following week, took the drops. Had a 3mnth report from the consultant sent it to the CAA who then asked to see me. Looked into my eyes and sent me home. Been flying ever since without glasses etc.:ok:

BTW, did contact my Loss of Licence provider and asked if I was covered should the consultant accidentally slip and chisel out my eyes. And they said yes it was. Perhaps in hindsight I should have got it in writing but didn't need to as it turned out.

[fantom]

. Perhaps in hindsight I should have got it in writing but didn't need to as it turned out.

1. The chisel would have prevented you seeing it in writing.

2. You wouldn't have had any hindsight - or much at all.

[zero1]

Don't bother, the risks are against you and if if goes wrong then you have lost your job for life. I went down this path but stayed with the bins, you are better sticking with the glasses to keep your class1/2.

[cavortingcheetah]

I daresay though that it counted somewhat with the CAA that the procedure was done at Moorfields.

[sapperkenno]

I had LASEK at Ultralase in Leeds. At the time I was around -5.5 in each eye, with astigmatism.

My reasons were that I was in the Army at the time, and sick of wearing contact lenses. I did it without getting permission (I'd asked during my whole Army career and was told not to get it done) as I'd signed off and was in my last year. It resulted in a medical downgrade for 6 months, but I didn't care as I was getting out anyway. I didn't want to spend the rest of my life as a slave to contacts/glasses for short-sightedness, and my father and Aunt had had surgery prior and couldn't rate it highly enough.

I had a Class 2 medical with VDL, and spoke with the CAA (around 2006) at the time to see how I would go on about getting the Class 1, if surgery was allowed, and how to remove the VDL. At the time there was a limit on eyesight prescription for a Class 1. The ruling was that if your eyesight was outside the limit prior to surgery, then having surgery wouldn't be allowed, but if your eyesight was within the limits, then you could have your eyes "lasered" and then be eligible for a Class 1.

So I had surgery in winter 2006/2007, then my Class 1 initial in October 2007. I'd had all the relevant eye tests post-Surgery which everyone was happy with, me especially as I now had better than 6/6 vision and had gone from barely being able to see the second line down on an eye chart while squinting prior to surgery, to reading the bottom line clearly afterwards.

Anyway, I passed the medical fine and was issued a Class 1, being a bit of a guinea pig at the time and attracting the attention of a few doctors and medical folks while at Gatwick... They took turns to view my eyes through their equipment, and said they probably wouldn't have noticed I'd even had surgery if I hadn't told them. So all in all, I was, and still am very pleased.

I don't suffer from any of the halo effects at night, or have any other problems. No dry eyes, or anything else to report. I did have very slight double vision for probably 1-2 months post surgery, which was attributed to the astigmatism correction on my left eye. So my eyes were now focusing slightly differently, but eventually my body would figure it out - this being the only thing I was ever concerned about afterwards. I only noticed when I was on guard duty a few nights one week on an Army exercise. It was a cold, crisp winters night with a full moon, and if I studied it with the naked eye, it was shadowed by an identical image a few millimetres offset. The more I looked at it, the more it would sort itself out, but if I was to turn away and focus on other things, then back to it, it would be doubled again until my eyes sorted themselves out. After 2 months or so after surgery to present, my eyes have been great. All I can describe it as, is when you get an eye test and a new set of glasses with the latest prescription, where everything is crisp and clear without a struggle... I have that all the time. To have that feeling nowadays, having known what it was like to have poor eyesight in the past, and without needing any correction is nothing short of amazing.

All I know, is that now I'm not having to endure a piece of plastic on my eye that I'm paying £20/month for, or wearing spectacles. I can wake up on a morning and see clearly from the off without the visual disability I had suffered prior to surgery. All in all, I'm chuffed and would recommend it to anyone.

Interestingly enough, I also know an eye surgeon who wears glasses! Their view seems to be that people get the op done for purely cosmetic reasons, and it's not really worth the hassle. It's just another thing that people can do once they've had their teeth fixed and whitened, their lipo's suctioned etc.

I don't feel that, and have my own reasons for having the operation. But each to their own.

[Hot High Heavy]

I have searched for some up to date threads on this but could find anything too recent.

I have PRK back in 2007 in Melbourne and subsequently became a pilot. I am now employed in a small airline. I have just renewed my class 1 and CASA have come back after all this time requesting another opthamologial asessment to check my "contrast sensitivity function". If this is not satisfactory i will lose night flying approval and this will mean losing my job.

Does anyone know what this is? How is it tested?

Has this happened to anyone before?

Im obviously a little stressed right now given the implications.

Cheers - HHH

[fmgc]

Never ever have eye surgery unless it is 100% guaranteed no ill effects! I know people who have spent thousands on surgery but as their vision was really poor they still need glasses!! Also several people suffer blurred night vision after surgery, not great when trying to drive or fly at night in teeming rain with lights coming towards you.

Do you have any stats to back this up?

[GlasgowBoy]

Hello folks, hope everyone is well. I'm glad I discovered this thread. Thought it was just me who was hindered by messed-up eyesight!

Anyway, allow me to provide a bit of background about my predicament.

I had my JAA Class 1 medical at Gatwick, back in September of this year. Everything went perfectly well until...wait for it...the eye test. Passed every single eye test, apart from the reading of the letters from a distance. My right eye, there was no issue at all (could read every line/letter), however, my left eye struggled. To quote what the CAA said when they sent me written clarification about failing the medical:

you were unable to achieve the JAA standard of 6/9 distance visual acuity in each eye separately even with the best possible spectacles prescription. You were easily able to achieve this standard even without spectacles, with your right eye but, regrettably, your left eye could only be corrected to 6/12. This is sufficient for JAA Class 2 medical certification...

Going by the CAA then:

Left eye corrected: 6/12

Now, I went to Optical Express this afternoon (yes, it's taken me 3 months to go for an eye test - busy life and all that). They confirmed that I have a "regular astigmatism" to my left eye, which CAN BE CORRECTED with either glasses or (my preferred option) laser surgery.

According to the CAA, I was told that my left eye wouldn't meet the required standards - even when corrected. Not so, according to Optical Express. This is what my prescription says:

RIGHT EYE:
Sphere: -0.25
Cyl: 0.00
Corrected VA: 6/5+

LEFT EYE (the weakest):
Sphere: +0.50
Cyl: +2.50
Axis: 117.0
Corrected VA: 6/6 -2

Safe to say, I'm at a loss trying to get my head around it all. One minute I'm unable to fly an aircraft (commercially), the next I can!:ugh::(

Also, I was considering applying to NATS and doing ATC (it was always my back-up plan, should the commercial pilot route stall) however I appreciate NATS have their own strict visual limits. Bearing in mind I currently hold a JAA Class 2, does this mean that I'd satisfy the criteria for the NATS medical?

Sorry for bombarding with all this, but if someone knows, then I'd be eternally grateful!:ok:

[B77L]

As far as I know, astigmatism must not be more than -2 dioptres, so I assume you failed for your left eye has -2,5. Just my personal explanation ;)
All the best for your career :)

[jim1937]

There are people saying it s hard to hide if you have had laser eye surgery, if it is detectable, how and what s the chance?

[RedBullGaveMeWings]

Yes, it is possible. Report them before undertaking the medical examination.
I know it is possible to detect it by examining the eye with corneal topography. As far as I am concerned, they don't always perform corneal topography though I would be totally honest.
If you had myopia the number of dioptres you needed is not a problem anymore as there are no pre-operative limits for myopia according to EASA Part-MED.
This should apply to astigmatism too.

I can't say anything about other refractive errors.

[Fostex]

Corneal topography is definitely carried out as part of a Class 1 initial at Gatwick.

With any medical history is it always best to be open an honest, there is no point trying to hide a condition as it will be documented somewhere in your medical history.

[steveppl]

I've got very poor vision in my right eye after a complicated retinal detachment operation in early November 2012, which was followed by a post operation glaucoma attack a few weeks later. I have a fold behind my macula which makes it very difficult to see things in my central focal point as there is a black line, and I cannot read using my right eye. Also images in my right eye appear lower than normal making double vision when I use both eyes. There was also damage to the optic nerve due to the glaucoma attack which has reduced my peripheral vision. The doctors are fitting me with a prism type lens. I am 49 years and hold a PPL from the Philippines CAAP for about 4 years now with around 200 hrs. I will probably lose my PPL when I go for the medical in Manila this July. Before this disaster happened to my right eye, I was actually planning to convert it to a JAR (EASA) PPL in England in late 2013 as I planned to pursue my dream job as a pilot in the General Aviation field when I retire at 55 (I'm 49 now). Reading these posts gives me hope to continue flying. I was wondering where (and/or who) is the best place in the UK to go for the medical with one bad eye and one good eye; obviously it would be better to go to someone who has experience with this. Any help will be greatly appreciated.:confused:

[Dufo]

I personally knew a pilot who was monocular and flew under JAR-OPS as a copilot on a citation. Limited to multicrew.

[GLuis103]

Hello everybody, I have a doubt that I would like to be cleared from anyone. 2 years ago I had Laser surgery to my right eye, now after having my Class 1 Medical certificate, my ophtomologist gave me a pair of glasses to wear whenever my eyesight is tired or when I´m using computer. This because my left eye (the one that´s tired and hadn´t been to surgery) was the one I 'used' for years before I had laser surgery to my right one. So my left eye had to see for both eyes, and that´s the reason it´s ´tired' somedays (0.5 diopter). My question is, can I have any problem at the AME, by wearing glasses and been to laser surgery ? Thanks in advance.

[RedBullGaveMeWings]

What is the process that a pilot must go through now in order to get LASIK eye surgery done?
Must the CAA be adviced prior the surgery takes place? What is requested afterwards? I'm referring to all the paper work and the process that a pilot must go through and for how long can the pilot not fly?

[ShyTorque]

Just bear in mind that you are obliged to inform the CAA of any serious illness or medical procedure.

Don't take my word for it, ask any CAA AME.

[Swiss Cheese]

I had LASIK two years ago, and I held a Class 2 medical for my PPL H. I notified my AME, who in turn notified the CAA. The CAA sent me a nice letter saying my Class 2 Cert was suspended (for 90 days from date of Op and subject to my AME being satisfied that Op done ok). My AME reviewed the Lasik Consultants post Op review, all was good. CAA duly informed, and Class 2 Medical restored without reference to need for glasses/contacts.

All very smooth and satisfactory. Class 1 is of course more stringent, and any suggestion of the eyes not settling down post LASIK will be an issue I suspect. Needless to say, it is worth getting the best LASIK surgeon to do this Op, especially if your job depends on it being done properly.

Good luck

[justasmallfire]

It was a few years ago I had mine done,I informed them beforehand,6 month suspension,had to get consultant to sign forms every checkup afterwards and after 6 month had final check up with surgreon then had to go gatwick and pay their AME for same checks before getting back medical.
My advice is go all out and get what they called 'wavefront' and the full works to limit possible side effects and to get best results.(night glare is biggest cause of failure.but can improve after time.I didnt get this as problem myself)

[FlyingDumbells]

Hello.

I was wondering if anyone could help me. I need to find out if my eyesight is acceptable to the UK CAA for an initial class 1.

My prescription done today is Left Eye: -5.50 sphere, -1.75 cylinder, 180 Axis and Right Eye: -6.00 sphere, -1.50 cylinder, 180 Axis.

I have read this below but I am unsure weather I meet the requirement as I do not know if ''refractive error'' means adding the astigmatism onto the refractive error to get a total? If that was the case then above left eye would be -7.25 so it would be out of limits. Can someone clarify what is correct, without having to travel to the UK to do the medical?

''Your visual acuity (measured by your ability to see, in this case, lines of letters on a chart at
6 metres) must be at least 6/9 in each eye separately and 6/6 using both eyes together, with
or without glasses or contact lenses (correction). If you need correction, the refractive error
(the amount of correction) must not exceed +5.00 dioptres of long sight or -6.00 dioptres of
short sight. This is in the most ametropic meridian (taking into account any astigmatism).
Astigmatism must not exceed 2.00 dioptres. The difference in correction between each eye
(anisometropia) must not be more than 2.00 dioptres. Your optometrist will be able to
explain these terms. If your refraction exceeds the limits stated above, please contact the
CAA medical department for further advice''

[7120]

Hi,

Your spherical equivalent (refractive error) is -6.375 left and -6.75 right. Although within limits for the astigmatic component you are respectively 0.375 and 0.75 dioptres over for left and right eye.

Don't despair. It's more than likely that your vision is better than the the 6/6 cutoff with the Optometrists' prescription. Go back and ask him to recheck your vision with a combination of sphere and cylinder that does not exceed -6.0 dipotres. Although you will be slightly defocussed, given that you slightly exceed the limits, you should get 6/6. Record this as your refraction. Ensure he tests your vision in as bright a light as possible - constricts the pupil creating a vision sharpening pinhole effect.

If you still have problems I'd be very surprised if an Ophthalmologist examination, as per guidance, doesn't clear you as OK

[FlyingDumbells]

7120 thank you for your response. I went and saw an Opthamologist today to see if I could pass the eye exam for this initial medical, I gave him the document that was quoted in the previous which brought him to ask the same question I asked before. If I revisit say an Optometrist this time, what would it matter if I had a script from him, saying overall spherical -6.00 refraction in either eye? I mean I'd have to pass on the day at Gatwick. Also would the glasses I need to bring then be this script? Also ''Ensure he tests your vision in as bright a light as possible - constricts the pupil creating a vision sharpening pinhole effect.'' Not sure how I'd do that on the day of it?

How does one work out the spherical equivalent with sphere and cylinder numbers?

Thanks

[7120]

Spherical equivalent is spherical plus half of cylindrical refraction. It looks as if the Ophthalmologist you have seen has reached a similar conclusion to myself. Looks as if you should have no problem meeting the visual requirements.

[ramseyoptom]

Hi Flying Dumbells,
Sorry but, you are outside the regulations in both eyes.

Spherical equivalent does not count in this case. If you read the regulations carefully then the most ametropic meridian (highest) in each eye is

Right -7.25 and Left -7.50

the cyl powers are within the regulations.

The information given by your Ophthalmologist is incorrect, plus the fact the test will not be done in very bright light, in order to get a pinhole effect.

As to ask your optometrist to give you a lower prescription to try and get you just within regulations, if it were from me - NO CHANCE. Something goes wrong and the optom will be on the wrong end of a "fitness to practice case" and that is some where none of my collegues want to be.

[TizerTheAppetizer]

Does anybody know of any airline pilots flying with one good eye and another that doesn't quite make the EASA Class 1 standard?

The CAA allows this now, if I am correct.

I ask because a rugby eye injury at the age of 18 stopped my childhood dreams of becoming an airline pilot.

I've had two successful careers in banking and the media since but now in my 40s I think this is my last chance of doing something I first wrote about when I was 12-years-old.

My left eye is very very good -- better than 20/20 when corrected.

My right eye corrected is about 20/30. But I had the natural lens removed due to the injury, so without correction it's +55 or something ridiculous like that. I also had some damage to the iris but I've played cricket, football, driven etc etc with no problems and the eye is stable.

I'm going to my opthalmologist on Tue with the CAA form...

But if the CAA don't give me a Class 1 medical I don't know how 'm going to take it.

Thank you.

[ramseyoptom]

It may be possible for your ophthalmologist to fit an Intra Ocular Lens (IOL) in your right eye, if you are as your post indicates aphakic (no natural or replacement lens). This does depend on what sort of damage you have done to the eye internally. If he will not then seek a second opinion.

Without further information it is not possible to comment further.

[TizerTheAppetizer]

Yes, thank you, I think that will be an option, together with an artificial iris if I want one, but I don't want to get it done now as the CAA will probably want 3 or 6 or 9 or who knows how many months for the eye to settle before seeing me again.

And as I'm having no difficulty with my vision I don't see the need to take the risk with surgery.

Thanks.

[oldpax]

Athough not in the flying business I still work and my vision was pretty poor .I had glasses with progressive lenses for long and short sight but even this was becoming of little use.Last month I took the plunge and had interlocular lenses fitted.I cannot tell you really what a difference this has made!!Apart from having the ability to see near and far all in focus my world of colour has come back(cataracts in both eyes).I have to go back in two months for a check up.The procedure was done with only eye drops and I could see all that went on ,it really was no bother and only slightly uncomfortable as irrigating water was dropped in.
I recommend this for anyone with eye problems.Had it done in Thailand at my local international hospital .

[TizerTheAppetizer]

oldpax -- I'm so glad it worked out for you. Sounds great. I'm sure I'll have an IOL implanted at some stage, but not just yet because I don't want to give the CAA an excuse for failing me my Class 1... by which I mean, them saying "You've only had the op done recently and we want to wait until it settles down etc etc"

[truckflyer]

TizerTheAppetizer: with +5.5 you will not pass your initial Class 1 examination, specially now they are part of EASA, I don't even think they will give you restricted UK licence, sorry to be the bearer of bad news, even if against odds they did give you class 1, it would be limited to UK AC only, which would make it more or less impossible to get a job with an airline!

Blunt but honest answer.

[CharlieDeltaUK]

I have a class 2 medical, with vision corrected for +6.5 (ish). If one applies for a Class 1, it looks like one needs uncorrected vision better than +-5. But, if I already have a class 2, is it possible to get a class 1 on the basis of corrected vision being OK, or am I forever precluded from a class 1 because my uncorrected vision is worse than +-5.0?

Having looked at the EASA doc, I think the answer could depend on whether a class 1 medical for me is an initial assessment or a re-validation. Also, I see that section e says there is no limit for incorrected visal acuity, which seems to contradict the previous paragraphs.

[Lets hope pilot]

I'd love to be an airline pilot!
I am marginally over the limit in both eyes both being over +5

Is there any way around this could I obtain a class one medical still ??
If not are there any other pilot jobs that don't require a class one ?

[truckflyer]

When you say marginally, what are the exact numbers?

Have you spoken to the CAA yet about it? You need to give full details to be able to give some advice.

[truckflyer]

CharlieDeltaUK - do you have link to the EASA documents?

It does seems you will not get class 1, from what you have told me, at least how it stands at the moment.
And I do know this is very hard to accept, as this is a rule that is completely nonsense, and it is a rule the CAA UK have been fighting against! But there are some other EASA members who have a more backwards view of this, unfortunately.

A quick question, during your class 2, did the CAA make records of your corrective eyesight requirement? If not, there might be some ways to get where you want, but nothing is clear in the water.

If you wish a career within aviation, I would suggest the way in would be going to the USA, and taking FAA licence, you probably would be fine for FAA class 1 medical, as they do not have a requirement for this with regarding uncorrected vision!
Of course, the chances of getting a job in Europe, could not be your priority, you would need to try to get experience via instructing, and get a job with a country that accepts FAA licence, so you will have more limited options, but not impossible, if you are young and have time to go this way.

If you PM me, I will give you more tips about other things you can do, however it does depend on what your exact situation is regarding this.

[Lets hope pilot]

+5.5 in one and +6 in other but both eyes are corrected to 20/30 I know that I think the one is corrected to 20/20 bar my eyes I'm fine.

[CharlieDeltaUK]

Truck flyer, thank you

Here's the link to the doc I was using (culled from a previous post): http://https://easa.europa.eu/agency-measures/docs/agency-decisions/2011/2011-015-R/AMC%20and%20GM%20on%20the%20medical%20certification%20of%20p ilots%20and%20medical%20fitness%20of%20cabin%20crew.pdf

I don't know what records were kept from my class 2 medical. They certainly kept some record because of course my medical has the usual wording about having specs. But I'd guess they didn't record the actual measurements.

This isn't about a career in aviation as such. It arose after someone suggested that I get a CPL to do some limited commercial flying when local opportunities arise - which they do. It's all GA stuff. Not teaching. I'm still inexperienced so it's more about getting a feel for my options and aspirations.

I will PM you as well.

[tpod]

Can anyone assist please? In order to obtain a Class 1 medical, the CAA require you to have N5 vision at 30 - 50cms.

Does anyone one know if this is a monocular or binocular requirement?

[kylejung]

Hi there

I recently went to an eye doctor and the doctor said I have a bigger than normal optic nerve cupping in both eyes (my left eye 0.7/1 and right 0.6/1, the average person having 0.4-0.5) He said that i am a "glaucoma suspect" meaning that there is a higher possibility for me to develop glaucoma compared to the average person. Besides the bigger than average cupping my eyes are both perfectly fine, my eye pressure and visual field is normal as well. I do not have any family history of glaucoma and my doctor said that some people are just born with a bigger than average cup. Should I be worried about this? Will this affect my chances of getting hired at an airline? Also, would I be able to get the Medical Class 1?

[Scottish.CPL]

i believe its binocular..

[tpod]

Thanks ScottishCPL. Can I ask you please what that thought is based on? Cheers

[Scottish.CPL]

i might need to correct on this but at class 1 level near eyesight is tested at n5 at both monocular and binocular requirement, they will test each eye interdependently and then with both eyes.

you you have an issue with one of your eyes tpod, its best to contact gatwick for a proper answer

[stefanidieugen]

Hi,
I saw there are provisions related to the max allowed correction in case of miopia/hiperopia and also for astigmatism. What if a combination of astigmatism and hiperopia is present. The individual correction should be considered and checked against allowances or the sum of the two is to be done?
For example: a +3cyl for astigmatism (which is a pass for class ii certification) combined with a +3 for hiperopia (which is also a pass) will drive the attendant to a fail of examination? Can anybody explain?
Thanks.

[eyal1506]

hi all,
I want to know if After correction I still can't see 6/6 can I be CPL pilot?

I see 6/6.75.
my numbers is -4 and 0.25cyl in the both eyes.

thanks for the answer :ok:

[goumo]

I had LASIK procedure to correct my -3 myopia in 2011, the following year 2012 August, I went in CAA for a class 1 medical without notifying them in my application form about my surgery, second phase into my eye test after reading out numbers on the wall, optometrist tried to look into the back of my eye ball under the slitlamp, took her 2 seconds to spot scar on my cornea. she told me straight away that she saw scars and asked me if had refractive surgery, after I admitted it she continued the whole eye test, and later I had to do another test called the contrast test only for those who had refractive surgery. After completing the rest of the medical examination I was told by doctor that failing to declare medical history is an offense, CAA takes this very seriously and I received a court summon a month later, was charged with making false representation and I was fined £1000.

So before you make an appointment for your class 1, make sure you have got all paper works from the surgeon stating every aspect of your refractive surgery, its totally not worth to risk it for a biscuit.

[goumo]

Answer is yes, a close friend of mine had LASIK procedure to correct his -3 myopia in 2011, the following year 2012 August, he went in CAA for a class 1 medical without notifying them in the application form about his surgery, second phase into the eye test after reading out numbers on the wall, optometrist tried to look into the back of his eye ball under the slitlamp, took her 2 seconds to spot scar on his cornea. she told him straight away that she saw scars and asked if he had refractive surgery, after he admitted it she continued the whole eye test, and later he had to do another test called the contrast test only for those who had refractive surgery. After completing the rest of the medical examination he was told by doctor that failing to declare medical history is an offense, CAA takes this very seriously and then he received a court summon a month later, was charged with making false representation and was fined £1000.

So before you make an appointment for your class 1, make sure you have got all paper works from the surgeon stating every aspect of your refractive surgery, its totally not worth to risk it for a biscuit.

[Blues&twos]

Goumo I'd delete one of your posts if I were you....:}

[tasmuchin]

Hi 2All! Should my astigmatism at initial medical examination -2 in glasses or without glasses? For example, if a person has -3.5 D of corneal astigmatism at initial interview can he/she be fit if it can be corrected to -2 with glasses?

[Dr Jekyll]

The -3.5 is the amount of correction needed for you see as well as if you had no astigmatism in the first place, not a measure of how well or badly you can see.

In effect they are asking how strong your glasses are.

[tasmuchin]

Thank you for answer! I very afraid my first medical check, cause I have -0.7 of general astigmatism and -2.0 of corneal astigmatism, my eyesight is 20/20. I'm very scarred cause the limit for the first class at the initial medical is only -2.0D.

[pilot in command]

Hi,

I need to get my Initial Class 1 Medical done in the next few months and I have a few questions.

I am very, very squeamish and obviously this has a really bad effect on my blood pressure and heart rate. When I got my Class 2, my heart rate was double what it was meant to be due to nerves and my BP was really high as well. My AME obviously could see I was nervous and took this into consideration, but I'm not sure what will happen with a class 1, will my blood pressure and heart rate have to be below a certain level?

I would also like to know if you have to get a full blood test on the initial or is it just a finger prick test?

I was also on the CAA Class 1 medical page and was reading that the doctor checks your neck for any lumps. I have several lumps in my neck, I have had these examined by a doctor and I was told they are absolutely normal- I assume this won't disqualify me?

Thanks

[HEATHROW DIRECTOR]

Sounds like you suffer from something that I and many others have - White Coat Syndrome - and I can send the BP machine through the roof. AMEs are usually aware of this problem and will try to relax you and take several readings. On my penultimate medical before retirement my BP wouldn't come down so the doc fitted me with a 24hr BP device. Next day when he put the results in his computer it was 100% normal. Don't worry - I know it's difficult but that is the real problem.

[Talkdownman]

I have several lumps in my neck
"err, yuk, what on earth is that on your neck?.......oh, sorry, it's your head...."

[pilot in command]

Hi,

Just a quick questions I'm hoping someone can clarify: I have been on the CAA website and have looked at the Visual Standards form which details the Class 1 specification. I am wondering if I can take this along to my local Optician and get them to test my eyes and sign the form which I can send to the CAA? If I do this does it mean this would not be tested on my medical if I have already had an Optician do this?

Thanks

[HEATHROW DIRECTOR]

Unless things have changed since I held a Class 1, I am sure the answer Is no. I'm curious as to why you would want to do this? The eye test part of the medical is not demanding and I'd rather have my eyes checked by the CAA medics than a high street optician.

Good luck...

[custardpsc]

Guomo, full marks for your honesty in your first post. Your friend doesnt come out of it so well. I suggest you consider deleting the second post...

[Nick Lee]

It looks as though your first question has already been answered. Regarding the blood test, the one for haemoglobin is just a finger prick, which Class 1s should have at every medical. However, a Class 1 requires a cholesterol level at the initial exam. and again at 40, or if there is any doubt about whether it may be raised, and for that, a blood sample will be needed. As far as the lumps in the neck are concerned, it would help greatly if you could take along the report that you received from the doctor who told everything was OK.

[Jagdfalke]

BP limits are 150/90 for class 1. Anything in excess of that won't necessarily deny you the issue of the medical, but will delay its issue until you can demonstrate that your normal BP is within these limits.

White coat anxiety is a pain, and much like Heathrow Director, i too don't get along with the blood pressure machines. As mentioned, the AME's are well aware of this! I suggest that when they strap you to the machine, completely relax your body (slouch to the point where you are barely sitting in the chair - so much so that even your head is hanging limp) and control your breathing - deep, slow breaths. Smile and think of something that makes you happy.

All the best.

[marcbisbal]

Hey guys,

Ane of you have been under eye surgery for myopia ?


I'm thinking about it, but I'm not sure,


Thanks! :ok:

[Rebecca Jayne]

Is it correct that your refractive error is your Sph + (Cyl/2) ? For example: Sph: +3.00 Cyl: -5.25 = (+3.00) + (-2.65) = +0.375?

Just trying to get my head around all this number crunching.

[TheDaddy]

Evening all
Here's the situation. I think that my eyesight falls out of the boundaries by a single point on a single criteria (Cylinder). I've read through this whole thread and there's loads of great info but it's a little hazy on this point.So anyway here's my prescription - if anyone can advise me I'd be very grateful. As far as I can see (haha - not so much) it's only the cylinder I've highlighted that's out by 0.25 which will preclude me from a Class 1 and Class 2 medical.

Thanks for looking :hmm:

Right Left

Sphere -1.75 -1.25
Cylinder +2.25 +1.50
Axis 172 180
Distance Acuity 6/6+ 6/4.5
Near acuity N5 N5

[Al321]

I wonder, could anyone offer any personal experience or advice? My myopia is over the basic limits for a Class 1 initial. I have a current class 2 medical and had resigned myself to the consolation prize of PPLing but I still can't help but wonder if the wording of the eyesight requirement might allow an exception to be made in my case and that I might still pass a Class 1 and have a chance at a late starting flying career.

I am -7.75 & +0.75 in the left eye and -6.25 & +1.00 in the right, but the good news is that the correction works and I can see 6/6 with single vision contacts or glasses. Is there an abslolute limit for myopia beyond which no exceptions are made, or is there discrection for perfect correction?

It does certainly seem that there are provisions in place for those who exceed the uncorrected limit.

Visual System GM | Medical | Personal Licences and Training (http://www.caa.co.uk/default.aspx?catid=49&pagetype=90&pageid=13885)

(d) Refractive error
(1) At initial examination an applicant may be assessed as fit with:
(i) hypermetropia not exceeding +5.0 dioptres;
(ii) myopia not exceeding –6.0 dioptres;
(iii) astigmatism not exceeding 2.0 dioptres;
(iv) anisometropia not exceeding 2.0 dioptres
provided that optimal correction has been considered and no significant pathology is demonstrated.

(2) Initial applicants who do not meet the requirements in (1)(ii), (iii) and (iv) above should be referred to the licensing authority. A fit assessment may be considered following review by an ophthalmologist.

[Lawyerboy]

AI321, best news I've heard in ages, but still a little unclear. I have anisometropia of 2.5 diopters. Am otherwise fine for a class 1.

2 questions:

1. The visual system GM suggests that those who fail the myopia, astigmatism and anisometropia requirements should be referred to the licensing authority and reviewed by an ophthalmologist. Are there cases of anyone subsequently actually getting a class 1 following that review?

2. It may be bad drafting, but the GM suggests that those who should be referred are those who fail all three requirements (ie, those who do not meet the requirements of (ii), (iii) AND (iv). That's not right, is it?

[fallenetti]

Hi, first of all I got myopia (-7,5 in both eyes). This is beyond the limit for class 1. I don't know about UK, but in Poland new EASA rules replaced JAR just on April 8th. I read new rules and saw that there is a hope in "(2) Initial applicants who do not meet the requirements(...)".
So, I wrote to ULC (polish equivalent of CAA) and got a reply from one of the main licensing guys. He told me, that the rule actually applies and people who do not meet above requirements will be reffered to licensing authority and, if the ophthalmologist gives the green light, there are CHANCES of obtaining class 1.
So, I believe that even if consultation works well for us, licensing authority can still classify us as unfit :ugh:
All I can say for sure is: I don't know any people who passed their 1 class examination that way, mostly because EASA is new in Poland. And for second part of your question, you are right, you will be reffered to licensing authority only if you fail one of the regulations.
I'm going to call to one of the aviation ophthalmologists on Monday, I will ask him what depends on positive consultation resulting in passing class 1 eye examination.
I believe the ophthalmologist will have to do some other eye tests, that are not included in class 1 standard vision examination.
There is some information about it (from CAA website):

Assessment should be conducted by, or under the supervision of, an ophthalmologist and ensure that there is no underlying pathology or other ocular abnormalities. Monocular visual acuities shall be 6/6 or better. Assessment shall include:
1) Dilated, binocular, indirect ophthalmoscopy in cases of myopia exceeding –6.00 dioptres
2) Corneal topography at initial assessment (and at renewal where there is significant change in refraction) in cases of astigmatism exceeding 2.00 dioptres.

[TheDaddy]

So here's the update.
When I called Gatwick to ask if I could book a Class 1 medical, I was, as expected, asked for my glasses prescription.
To cut a long story short, they have invited me for a medical where the opthalmologist is going to examine my eyes more closely. The lady I spoke to said it was very positive, because if it was likely that my eyesight would fail the test they wouldn't have invited me. Fingers crossed....

[Lets hope pilot]

I would love to be an airline pilot it is my all time dream in any capacity in any country to fly a plane and be a pilot! I live in the uk and unfortunately can't pass the class one medical I would pass on every other variable apart from eye sight my refractive error is higher than + 5 apart from this I'd pass! Is there ANYTHING I can do to get a class one? I'm aware the CASA and FAA do not set limits on refractive error could this be an option anything at all I'm willing to do please help any advice is appreciated ! Cheers !

[Bearcat F8F]

Darn! Life is a bi*ch sometimes!

Have you asked this question to the guy who did your medical?

Otherwise find a way to emigrate and start your flying career in the US (I know that's much easier said than done though)

P.S. It's probably wise to phone up a few eye doctors and see what they have to say on the matter :ok:

[Lets hope pilot]

Blooming tell me about it!!! I haven't actually done the medical yet! Just done abit of pre research before I splash out 200 quid I've emailed the CAA for advice and few other independent caa officers I had a reply off one and he said refractive surgary is usually accepted lets hope!!!!!!

[Lets hope pilot]

Hi I've always wanted to be an airline pilot always! However I understand that to pass a uk caa class one med you need to have a LOWER refractive error than +5 I'm over by 1 and 1.5 In my left and right eye respectively is there anything that I can do ?!?!?!? Anything at all to become a pilot

Is there anything that I can do abroad ?

Is there anything I can do in the uk?

Is the CAA class one defiantly out of reach for me ?!?!

Any advice would be greatly appreciated !

[Krallu]

If you hold a valid Class 1 medical and you are able to pass it without glasses.

But you don't have 1,0 on each eye but you are within the limits to pass the Class 1 without restrictions. You maybe have around 0,8 or 0,9. Then you don't need glasses to pass the Class 1 medical.

You also do not use glasses in your normal daytime. But you feel that when driving car in dark and sometimes day or watching tv you can cope without glasses but you sometimes feel that it would feel more relaxing to your eyes if you had a couple of glasses to get a little more clear sight.

If you get glasses only for those occasions, sometimes for car driving and tv watching. Is that something you need to tell your medical examiner or CAA?

If I understand the rules correctly it says that if you need glasses regulary you should tell the CAA or medical examiner. But in this case when you only wish to use glasses now or then on special occasions but not all day long. And you still pass Class 1 medical without glasses.

Do I need to tell the CAA about that? Or where is the line between using glasses regulary and not?

Thanks!

[HEATHROW DIRECTOR]

Tell the doc at your medical and he may say you have to carry a spare pair of specs. Happens to all of us as we age.

[Lets hope pilot]

I'm about to send my vision off to mr chorley at gatwick, I've been told by an AME that you can pass the vision even if you're over +5 now with extensive tests my vision is ...

5.5 S + 1.25 C in my left 6/6

6.5 S + 1.25 in my right 6/7.5

What are the chances of me getting through my vision?

I'm 17 and have had that same prescription for the last 10 years

I also wear contact lenses !

[Lets hope pilot]

Hi I'm 17 and have always wanted to be a pilot :-)

I am applying for a CAA class one medical shortly to hopefully enable me to continue with my dream! Hopefully il pass :-)

However I have a high prescription my eyes aren't great however there corrected to the required standard and I'm told I still can pass with further eye checks !

Just wondering will the fact I have glasses and a high prescription affect me when applying for jobs ? Will it make me a less attractive candidate to airlines or as long as I have my class one medical will I be ok?

My eyes again to reiterate Are corrected to just as good as everyone else (6/6 20/20) I just have a strong prescription !


Do airlines even look further than the class one or will presenting that on interview or application be enough ?
Will my prescription affect me?
Thanks very much!

[suntorytimo]

Let me google that for you (http://lmgtfy.com/?q=uk+caa+eyesight+requirements)

:O Sorry I couldn't help myself, just a bit of a joke. Information is as below. Generally once you have passed the initial medical you are sorted as long as your eyesight can be corrected adequately. Companies would not frown on poor eyesight as long as it is corrected, I'm pretty sure.

Initial Class 1 (Professional Pilot) Medical Examination | Medical | Personal Licences and Training (http://www.caa.co.uk/default.aspx?catid=49&pageid=527)

Initial Class 1 (Professional Pilot) Medical Examination Eyesight - Eye examination form (MED 162)

Eyesight requirements are listed in the Class 1 Visual Standards guidance material. If you wear glasses or contact lenses it is important to take your last optician’s report along to the examination. An applicant may be assessed as fit with hypermetropia not exceeding +5.0 dioptres, myopia not exceeding -6.0 dioptres, astigmatism not exceeding 2.0 dioptres, and anisometropia not exceeding 2.0 dioptres, provided that optimal correction has been considered and no significant pathology is demonstrated. Monocular visual acuities should be 6/6 or better.

[atakacs]

Are you eligible for eye surgery (I mean technically speaking) ? It might be your best bet, not mentioning the huge convenience factor (I can personally attest :).

[Lets hope pilot]

Thanks for you're replys! I can pass (so I've been told ) and my eyes are corrected to 20/20 so that's good positive news ! Thank you :-)

[suntorytimo]

ehhh Lasic is a complicated area, I believe you can't take an initial within something like a year of the operation, and if you already have a medical it becomes invalid for perhaps the same amount of time.

[thetimesreader84]

Simply,

If you meet the required standard for issue of a class 1, and can maintain that standard for as long as you want to be a pilot for, no company will care about your eyesight (as long as you wear corrective lenses and carry a spare pair, as per the restriction on your medical).

[Jedi 737]

Hi everyone,

I'm wishing to apply for an Arab airline but I have an eye issue and I would appreciate your opinion. I have a retina scar on my left eye that takes me part of my central vision. (Kind of monocular central vision, but I have periferical visual field and depth perception). I'm flying with this issue for 15years with an ICAO first class's medical with a special issuance, and I once successfully applied for JAA and FAA class one medical with this special issuance too. But didn't find this possibility at the GCAA or CAAP assesment publications.
Do you have any experience about this to share? Or any useful information about it?
Best regards

[Rebecca Jayne]

Just looking at the requirements post-LASIK:

"iii) Pre-operative refraction should not have been greater than +5.00 dioptres. No refraction limits apply to myopia, astigmatism or anisometropia."

What exactly is the 'pre-operative refraction' that should not have been greater than +5.00? Is that the Sph values? As there are no limitations on astigmatism ect?

Any help would be very appreciated as this would clear it all up for me!

[mnehpets]

What exactly is the 'pre-operative refraction' that should not have been greater than +5.00? Is that the Sph values? As there are no limitations on astigmatism ect?

You should check directly with the CAA to be sure, but somewhere in the EASA medical documents, the refractive error is defined as the error in the worst median, so that means it's the sum of the sphere + astigmastism.

[josephfeatherweight]

Hello all,

I currently hold an Australian (CASA) Class I medical certificate - the visual acuity requirements stipulated by CASA are better than 6/6 (20/20) vision binocular and better than 6/9 (20/30) in each eye (corrected or uncorrected).
My eyesight is 6/5 in my right eye and 6/9 in my left due to a diagnosed astigmatism in my left eye. As this meets the CASA requirements (my binocular vision is 6/5 also), I do not wear corrective lenses.
I am considering undertaking an FAA First Class examination and note that the visual acuity requirement for each eye (corrected or uncorrected) is 20/20 (6/6). At this stage I have advice that corrective lenses may not be capable of correcting the acuity in my left eye to 20/20.
I am aware of an FAA "Authorization" being granted for some medical conditions. I am also aware that the form 8500-7 allows for a ophthalmic report to be assessed by the FAA and consideration given to things such as "quality of binocular vision" etc.
This leaves me with two questions which the community may be able to assist with:
Does the FAA ever grant an "authorization" for less than 20/20 vision in one eye for a First Class medical?
Has anyone had LASIK performed for an astigmatism condition?
As I am in Australia, the options of organising a Statement of Demonstrated Ability would be difficult and expensive to organise - and I don't know if they do these for First Class Medicals for visual acuity anyway...
Any other advice would be gratefully received.

[Rebecca Jayne]

You should check directly with the CAA to be sure, but somewhere in the EASA medical documents, the refractive error is defined as the error in the worst median, so that means it's the sum of the sphere + astigmastism.

Thank you. Do you know if the maths rule of negatives and positives applies? Eg. negative and negative = plus. Sounds really stupid but if unsure, no worries. I'll clarify with the CAA. Thanks.

[mnehpets]

Do you know if the maths rule of negatives and positives applies? Eg. negative and negative = plus. Sounds really stupid but if unsure, no worries.
That's actually a good question, and the answer is a little bit complicated because opticians use two different forms of written refraction.

If you're long-sighted, and your prescription is of the form +A.AA +B.BB, then the refractive error in the worst median is A.AA + B.BB.

If your prescription is of the form +C.CC -D.DD, then the refractive error in the worst meridian is C.CC.

[Otford15]

Hi, thanks for your explanation. It seems that you know what you are talking about so I'm going to pose another question or two to you.

I have been scouring the forums to determine whether I can pass the vision requirements for the EASA Medical 1.

We are all aware of the following requirement, but the part in bold is what is confusing.

At initial examination an applicant may be assessed as fit with:
(i) hypermetropia not exceeding +5.0 dioptres;
(ii) myopia not exceeding –6.0 dioptres;
(iii) astigmatism not exceeding 2.0 dioptres;
(iv) anisometropia not exceeding 2.0 dioptres
provided that optimal correction has been considered and no significant pathology is demonstrated.

I have astigmatism of 2.25 (my prescription is -1.25, -2.25 one eye, with a similar presciption in the other, but not quite so bad). With glasses, my vision is excellent with full 20/20 vision in both eyes. Does the bold part of the requirement above mean that my vision is acceptable as "optimal correction has been considered" (i.e. my glasses fully correct the error?)

Also, some people seem to suggest that it is possible to get the FAA medical certification in the US (which doesn't have the astigmatism requirement) and then apply for an EASA Class 1 recertification, which also allows for greater astigmatism. Does anyone know if that is really that case? If you have the FAA cert, do you have to meet the initial or recertification EASA requirements?

Thanks in advance to any responses.

[HighintheSkies]

Hello, everyone!

My name is Richard, I'm 17 and I have been in love with aviation since my childhood. I still got 1-2 years left in school but as I'm thinking ahead , I decided to go check my medical according to JAA 1st Class Requirements with some local doctors. Everything was quite well till I got results from my eye doctor. She told me I got (Microstrabismus + Astigmatismus myopicus) which results in my vision alternating from Binocular to monocular and that I will never become a commercial pilot. :\ But as I am an optimist, I also made contact with another doctor which says that he thinks there is no point in having a corrective operation , because it will most likely result in double vision and that I will still not achieve binocularity. So my questions for you guys are:
1.) Has anyone of you guys had similar problem, which you have fixed with operation or in any other way?
2.) Can I become a commercial pilot in other places like America or Australia with this kind of problem?
3.) Is there a chance that in few years this restriction will be uplifted?

This is a real shame. Most doctors think they are heroes, because they are saving the day by not letting guys like me to fly , but the only thing that they are doing is breaking our dreams!

I am very keen for your answers guys!

[josephfeatherweight]

Hi there - just a quick question that someone may be able to assist with.
Do you, or do you know of anyone, who has been issued with an FAA First Class Medical who has LESS than 20/20 CORRECTED vision in one eye? (Binocular vision better than 20/20 - other eye better than 20/20)
I am about to consider a major career change and need to know if I should even get the ball rolling. I am unable to achieve 20/20 in one eye (I get about 20/25 corrected and 20/30 uncorrected) and I have an FAA Form 8500-7 from an ophthalmologist that states that I have no other visual acuity problems - am I in with a chance?
The fact that Form 8500-7 exists suggests there is room for approvals such as this, but it would be good to hear from someone who has had similar experience before I upheave my life!

[Eyetriguy]

I have had a lifelong ambition to become a pilot. However, I have less than 20/200 (6/60) in one eye but normal 20/20 (6/6) vision in the other eye. Looking on the CAA website and contacting them directly would suggest that I will not be able to obtain a Class one medical.

However, on this, and other forums I have seen that monocular commercial pilots do exist. Does anyone have any advice on the next steps?

[Captaincivvy]

can someone help explain what/ if there is anything i can do or give up?

here's my prescription details:

Distance

right:
Sphere +0.50
Cyl -2.00
Axis 180
Aided VA 6/18+2

Left:
Sphere - 0.25
Cyl -2.50
Axis 15
Aided VA 6/5-3

Binocular PD 67.0

I hope that makes sense to someone, it's a foreign language to me.

[RMC]

I know there have been many threads on eyesight requirements but would really appreciate it if someone could cast an eye over my results.

my most recent eyesight test showed

Right eye sph +1.75 ; cyl -0.5 ; Axis 85

Left eye sph +0.25 ; cyl -0.25 ; axis 5.6

From the CAA website

(d) Refractive error
(1) At initial examination an applicant may be assessed as fit with:
(i) hypermetropia not exceeding +5.0 dioptres;
(ii) myopia not exceeding -6.0 dioptres;
(iii) astigmatism not exceeding 2.0 dioptres;
(iv) anisometropia not exceeding 2.0 dioptres;
provided that optimal correction has been considered and no significant pathology is demonstrated.

I do not understand how the astigmatism and anisometropia of 2.0 is calculated (am I only 0.25 outside the 1.75 limit in my right eye)?

Am I correct in saying I can have a class one issued even though I currently wear glasses.

Thanks in anticipation.

[Captaincivvy]

I've just got my initial class 2, the AME said I would struggle with a class 1 because my left eye is 6/4 but with 2.5 astigmatism, my right eye is 6/12 with amblyopia. However, has improved since I started wearing glasses in January from 6/18-2!

I need perseverance suggestions, such as going to get my initial in the USA with a SODA, converting it, then getting a CAA renewal in the UK.

[aviationFan18]

Today I checked on the CAA Website, and I checked my Lens Prescription on there "Spec Calculator" - What I found out is my Lens Exceed the 2.0 for astigmatism. However It say's that I am unfit to pass the Initial Class 1 but if I was renewing a class 1 Medical I would be seen as fit. Is their anyway I can get around this, It seems a Bit weird how I can't get the Initial Class 1 but I was to renew a Class 1 I would be seen as fit.

thank-you

[jetopa]

Hi,

since a few years ago, I've been using corrcfive lenses (glasses) for both near and distant vision correction. Not much correction is needed, but when the (outside) light gets low, I start putting them on.

I have bi-focal glasses with near vision correction on the lower part and the distant vision part on the upper part. This doesn't help me though when looking at my overhead panel which is about 30 cm away from my eyes.

Until now, I've been pulling down my glasses when I wanted to read the overhead panel, but now I have been informed that there are tri-focal lenses that have another near vision part at the top. They are not cheap and before I order some, I'd like to here from anybody about her/his experience with them.

Thanks in advance!

[cavortingcheetah]

That's exactly the same problem which I had, especially at night with the overhead. Varifocals didn't work satisfactorily for me in such a confined space as a cockpit with so many rapid changes of vision depth necessary.
A good pair of trifocals, at considerable cost, with my old bifocals as back up in the flight bag, worked well. I had the lenses coated for extra protection and took very careful care of them, wearing one of those granny strings around the neck lest one hurl them around the cockpit in moments of fury at the activities of crewing.

[mezzanaccio]

Hello everyone,
I have one question regarding the EASA Initial Class 1.
I have read the specific documents about visual requirements but I am not sure I understood well. My left eye condition is -2.75 dioptres with -0.50 astigmatism. I have read that the sight defect should not exceed 3.0 dioptres: now my question is does it count -2.75 - 0.50 = -3.25 and therefore I would not pass the Initial Class 1?

Now I sent an email to an Aeromedical Centre here in Germany where I live with the same question and the answer was "Your eyes should not be a problem", which is not very reassuring as the initial check would cost me nearly €500.

Thanks a lot.

[GuinnessQueen]

Hi folks. I currently hold a UK issued EASA class 1 but suspect at my next renewal I might be marginal on the distance vision. I'm not sure if this is due to tiredness or too much time in front of a monitor but Nevermind. I have no restrictions on my medical at the moment.
I will most likely book in for an eye test this week but I was wondering what I need for my next renewal. Do I just turn up with a pair of specs (plus spare) and list it as a change since my last medical or is there paperwork the optician needs to fill out to satisfy the AME/CAA?

Any advice appreciated.

[Dr Jekyll]

When I did my initial class 2 the doctor didn't check my prescription or glasses at all but just guessed the figures from my uncorrected vision. Was within the limits anyway but not as comfortably as he reckoned. Mind you the AME in question was last heard of in prison.

[Ulster]

Well, well ! I wonder which one of my colleagues is presently residing AHMP ? Certainly not anyone who is personally known to me, I'm relieved to say ! :=

I will most likely book in for an eye test this week but I was wondering what I need for my next renewal. Do I just turn up with a pair of specs (plus spare) and list it as a change since my last medical or is there paperwork the optician needs to fill out to satisfy the AME/CAA?

I suspect that in most AME practices the former would be the case. A few might prefer to see a report on the refraction / prescription from the optician who has supplied your spectacles. If the change was sufficient to justify the addition of a glasses limitation to the certificate ( VDL being the most likely in this case ) then that can be added easily by the AME using the AME-online system (many other restrictions or limitations can only be added or removed by the CAA at Gatwick). :D

[mnehpets]

My left eye condition is -2.75 dioptres with -0.50 astigmatism. I have read that the sight defect should not exceed 3.0 dioptres: now my question is does it count -2.75 - 0.50 = -3.25 and therefore I would not pass the Initial Class 1?
Let's see. The medical AMC says: (med.b.070)

(d) (1) (ii) myopia not exceeding -6 dioptres
(d) (1) (iii) astigmatism not exceeding 2 dioptres

So there's no problem for you in that regard. However, (d)(5) says that since your correction is between -3 and -6 dioptres, you need to have 5 yearly checkups by an eye specialist.

[mezzanaccio]

@ mnehpets:

Thank you for your answer. Somehow I thought that the myopia limit was 3.00. That's definitely good news.

One thing is not very clear: does '5 yearly check-ups' mean I will have to have my eyes tested five times a year in order to have a valid EASA Class 1 medical? :uhoh:

Cheers

[Ulster]

does '5 yearly check-ups' mean I will have to have my eyes tested five times a year in order to have a valid EASA Class 1 medical?

Fear not, intrepid young aviator ! No, it doesn't mean that at all !
Perhaps a simple hyphen would have made it clearer ( "5-yearly check-ups" ).

It's easier to say that you would need to have your eyes and vision checked EVERY FIVE YEARS ! Hope that sounds better ! :ok:

[mezzanaccio]

Now I get it, thanks a lot!

[this is my username]

Might be worth trying these - not sure how well they would work when placed on top of another correcting lens but it wouldn't be expensive to find out!

Stick on bifocal lenses available in the UK (http://www.straightlines.com/safetyspecs/index.php?page=stick_on_bi_focals)

[Frontal]

Essilor used to make a varifocal with an upper segment at the top of the lens that used to be called "pilot" for obvious reasons.

Nowadays the only suitable lens is a double D trifocal.

[Captaincivvy]

Initial Class 1 in Canada...

With correction my left eye is 6/4 but with 2.5 astigmatism, my right eye is 6/12 with amblyopia.

I'm going to Canada in August. I'm wondering about going for my initial, then trying to convert it when I get back to the UK. Thoughts?

[tyer22]

Hey i was wondering if i meet the criteria for a monocular vision waiver in terms of the FAA standards. 20/25 in the left eye and 20/200 in the right corrected. Contact lens power is -11.0 in the left and -12.0 in the right. I read the regulations on monocular vision and they said that you can get a waiver the lens power is +-3.0 but im thinking to myself if i can get 20/25 why does the FAA care what power my lenses are. Any reason as to why or what i can do about it to get a third class medical. Really hope that the GAPPA Act passes so no medical is needed to fly private.

[jammah49]

Hi guys,

I'm looking to get a Euro Class 3, (same eyesight standards as CAA/EASA Class 1 medical) for ATC once I finish my aviation based degree this year. I have had lasik 9 months ago. My pre-op prescription was -6 in my left which passes, but -7 in my right which is past the limit. My eyesight is fine and stable now and in limits. Prior to my laser I held a CAA Class 2 as I was undertaking PPL training, but never had it renewed after my surgery.
Is there any chance the CAA or NATS medical centres may let me gain my Euro Class 3, or EASA Class 1?
The ambiguity of the eye requirement documents say contact the CAA for advice if your pre op prescription is out of limits, but i'm wary of doing that and it makes it sound like there is an almost grey area.
Any advice or experience with this issue would be much appreciated.
Cheers

[ZPPilot]

Hi there

I have a lifelong dream of becoming a pilot, and unfortunately i have quite a bit of Astigmatism in both eyes

I have -1.75D in the right and -1.50D in the Left.
....and some 0.5D of myophia in both.

I know that there is a limit of 2D for the initial exam, and a limit of 3D for the renewal... so i might just pass the initial one, but what if it gets worse over time? How big is the chance that it will go from 1.75 and above 3..

Is there anyone in a similar situation or has some advise?

[Bryan Tan]

I've just gotten my eye checked, and it shows 6/7.5 for both of my eyes when I wear spectacles. Is that good or bad?

[TizerTheAppetizer]

Quite an odd one this one ...

If you had an intraocular lens (an artificial lens inside the eye that replaces your natural one) and an artificial iris AND a DSAEK corneal graft (that's just the innermost layer) ... but could get 6/9 monocular with that eye and 6/6 binocular ...

Could you get a Class 1?

This is assuming the eye is stable some months after the operation, which was required because of trauma.

If not, what is the point of medical advances?

[Blues&twos]

I think the problems are related to the 'other' effects of such surgery, such as corneal hazing, halos and glare, rather than the basic visual acuity.
The point, I guess, of ophthalmic advances is that non-pilots might benefit too.....

[TizerTheAppetizer]

Thank you for replying Blues&twos.

I have spoken to ophthalmic surgeons at Moorfield's about this -- the latest artificial irises are so good that I'm told an optician would struggle to detect them, even under a slit lamp.

There shouldn't be any glare or halos.

The old corneal grafts had all kinds of problems associated with them, astigmatism for example, and rejection.

The replacement of just the inner (endothelium) layer is so good that they tell me the cornea will be as healthy as the other eye, two to three weeks after the graft.

With all that in mind, how can the CAA say I'm technically monocular? Assuming they will, that is. Or that they don't trust the procedures.

My point is, advanced biotechnology and surgical procedures mean that 20 years ago this would have been impossible. Today it can be done.

If I can get 6/9 or even 6/6 (highly likely according to the docs at Moorfield's) on what grounds can the CAA refuse a Class 1. I would even accept a (temporary) OML.

If I sound desparate, that's because I am ...

[Blues&twos]

Hello again Tizer. I hope you have a successful op. I had a corneal graft 30 years ago and with glasses was getting 6/9 to 6/5, depending on the day(!) things have certainly moved on a bit since then. Recovery times are considerably reduced, and you don't have to spend time laying on your back in bed after the op..
Maybe the CAA are being cautious because they have the luxury of being able to, or maybe there are other clinical reasons. It probably doesn't help much, but having 6/9 or better after a surgeon has been at your eyeball is nigh on miraculous.

Absolute best of luck to you!

[TizerTheAppetizer]

Blues&twos ... do you mind me asking if you got a Class 1 after the graft. It sounds like the surgeons did a pretty good job. It's still going 30 years later, and that must have been the old-fashioned type graft, if you don't mind me saying so.

I haven't given up though. At least the surgeons seem to be on my side.

But I haven't had the op yet though!!!!

[Blues&twos]

I've only flown light a/c under instruction, so no medical issues...sorry , can't help there.
You're right about the type of graft, full thickness.

[TizerTheAppetizer]

Perhaps I need to rephrase the Qs ...

Does anyone know of any pilots who have had an intra-ocular lens (an artificial lens placed inside the front of the eye to replace the natural one) ..

Or Any pilots who have had a corneal graft ... and who have managed to get a Class 1?

Any pointers would be really helpful?

[Canuckbirdstrike]

I had traumatic damage to my right eye in 1992 from a piece of metal. The piece was removed and damage repaired. Six days later I had an intraocular implant put in. 30 days later the sight in that eye was 20/40 and two months later it was 20/25 and has stayed like that. Despite a slightly damaged iris, I have no halos etc and the eyesight in the damaged eye is now better than the undamaged one. It took 4 months to get a restricted medical back and then after one year I was given full Class 1 medical with no restrictions other than an ophthalmologists report annually. After 21 years I still have a Class 1 medical and still fly for an airline.

The whole business of getting your medical is proving the net risk. In my case it was getting the doctors to see that my worst case scenario in the event of a problem I would be monocular, something that is allowable for airline pilots in many jurisdictions.

[TizerTheAppetizer]

Canuckbirdstrike

Thank you for your reply. That does give me hope.

Are you 20/25 uncorrected but can get better visual acuity corrected?

Either way, there is hope and I'm glad the doctors and civil aviation authorities can be sensible about these things. I hope that's the case with the CAA as well.

[Canuckbirdstrike]

Yes my vision is 20/20 corrected. As a matter of fact until 2007 I did not require any correction to my vision to maintain a Class 1 medical.

The challenge we face as pilots are the inconsistent standards between countries. In many jurisdictions I cannot hold a Class 1.

The best event I had was having a medical and the double take the doctor did after I did the eye test and then he actually looked at my eye and noticed the misshapen iris......

[TizerTheAppetizer]

Oh well, if the CAA at Gatwick don't give me a Class 1, I'll come and try and get one in Canada. They obviously have more sense about these things in North America.

Beautiful country, I've been across it by train, I'd love to live there. People are so friendly.

And the beer ... Moosehead, Labbatt's ... unbelievable.

[jollyrodger]

Yet another eyesight post…apologies!

Had my Class 1 revalidation this week, all ok thankfully. At the end my AME said the CAA (UK) system had flagged up that I need to get an Ophthalmology Exam done at an opticians. I've never had a problem with my eyes, was a little surprised that I need to visit an opticians even though I seemingly passed the eye exam.

Anyone else had something similar? Slightly concerned the AME may have spotted something and this is his subtle way of getting it checked without worrying me!

[Scottish.CPL]

Possibly due to the prescription strength!!

[Capn Bloggs]

You need "occupational bifocals". I've had them for years and work well.

Occupational Bifocals and Trifocals for Presbyopia - AllAboutVision.com (http://www.allaboutvision.com/over40/work_bifocals.htm)

The top and bottom bits are the same, for reading (and overhead panels) and the middle bit for distance.

These are not individual bits of glass stuck together; the three sections are machined out of the same piece. The price isn't too bad either.

[tlc456]

Hi everyone,
i have read in the CTC Wings website that one of he entry requirements for the Airline Pilot Cadet Programme is to be able to obtain an EASA Class 1 medical without restrictions. What does that mean? I have myopia, can this be a drawback getting a Class 1 medical?

Thanks in advance.

[kt3186556]

hello guys, i recently got ICL (implantable contact lens) done for my eyes. My prescription before operation was -10.00 in both eyes. Post operation i have 6/6 for both my eyes. my eyes are perfect now with no problem of glare in day and night.

would i be eligible for class 1 or class 2 medical certificate?

any information would be helpfull.

thank you

[Reely340]

As of 8.4.2013 EU-Reg 1178/2011 http://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/PDF/?uri=CELEX:02011R1178-20120408&qid=1397930709721
is the sole source for FCL requirements.

Section MED.B.070 specifies the eyesight limits for obtaining a medical of class 1, as certain "distant visual acuity" limits with or without correction.

The whole document lacks any reference to max. uncorrected myoptic dioptres (as did the old JAR FCL 3.xxx, -6/+5 dioptres)

Is it therefore correct, that even with say -10 dioptres (myoptic) one can be assigen a class 1 medical as long as his "distant visual acuity" is at least 0.7 per single eye and at least 1.0 with both eyes?

If not where do I find the mandated Part-MED (post April 8th,2013) dioptre limits?

[CoolingThunder]

Hi all,
Last year I got my class 1 in Belgium to start my ATPL. I got it without too much problems (except an extra colourvision test) and there is also a mark "VDL" on it, probably referring to the fact that I need glasses because my left eye is nearsighted. Today I went to the optician to get those glasses since my revalidation has to be done soon. Note that I see perfectly with both eyes, it's just the left that has -2.25 for correction. Now I found those values to be quite high, so I looked at EASA PART-MED, and there I found that the max difference is 2 dioptres (ico anisometropia) result: I'm quite scared now to lose my licence because of this, thereby rendering all my hard work (and dream) useless. Now it does say that you can have more if it is checked every 5 years, but I wonder why they didn't tell me this on my initial examination. Are these concerns justified or not?
I'm quite anxious about it now!

[The Cleaner]

I have a difference of 2.50 between my eyes, it is max 2.00 for initial ( which I got via deviation route) but for renewal it is a higher limit, not sure what it is without checking. Suffice to say I still have passed several revalidations without a problem.

[CoolingThunder]

Thanks for the answer, thing is, last year I had -1.50 or -1.75 (can't remember correctly anymore) so I was 'safe', now with my recheck I will have gone out of these limits by half a point in a bit more than a year (which I would contribute to a bit of eye strain due to some fatigue, and loooong time spent behind the books everyday, staring at books for a long time can also hurt your eyes. The fact that I went out of the -2 and then immediately a decrease of -0.5 dioptres is what's worrying me now... Anyway, this is already giving me some good hope.

[TSLexi]

Hi guys!

I'm about to start flight school. I have a class 3 medical certificate, as right now I only want to pursue a PPL and IR.

I have anisometropic amblyopia due to retinopathy of prematurity in my right eye. My left eye BCVA is 20/20, while my right eye's BCVA is 20/40. But due to my amblyopia, I effectively only use my left eye to see.

Hopefully at the same time I do my PPL checkride I can also do the MFT for the SODA to upgrade my medical certificate.

So here's an interesting question: why does the FAA even care about distance vision? Shouldn't they just require instrument training for ALL pilot licenses, require all flights to be IFR, and eliminate VFR? If one is trained to fly in zero visibility using just the flight instruments, the only reason you need distance vision is to detect traffic if ATC hasn't warned you about it. And if the plane is equipped with a TCAS II, looking out the window is completely un-necessary.

As long as you can read your charts and instruments and communicate with ATC, your near vision and hearing is what determines whether you can fly safely.

IFR is safer as you will have ATC tracking you, and you are required to file a flight plan, which will assist search and rescue in case anything happens. So why do we still have VFR?

[Sepp]

"looking out the window is completely un-necessary"

:=

After spending too many years as a Training Captain, I really hate to offer a negative comment without including a constructive suggestion but: your learning curve is going to be very steep, old son.

[amityes2002]

Hi all,

Recently i went for my CAA Initial Class 1 Medical , All went fine except the Blind Spot Test.

My left eye is fine , but on my right eye i missed two spots and they performed the test again on my right eye , this time again i missed spot but not on the same area. :ugh:

The CAA wants me to do the check up with eye specialist because i had Lasik Laser Surgery in the past (14 yrs ago) and to make sure about my blind spots as well.

I need advice whether i will be able to clear the Class 1 or not.:confused::confused:

Thank you

[Maltese Falcon]

I have recently been told by an eye specialist that I have "narrow angles", a situation which could, but will not necessarily, lead to angle-closure glaucoma. The standard preventive treatment for this condition is an iridotomy, where a laser is used to cut a small hole in the iris.

I have tried to research the implications for my medical certificate if I have the procedure done but there is very little information out there. What I really want to know is how long I can expect my Class 1 medical to be suspended for (assuming the procedure is 100% successful) or if it might be permanently revoked. Anybody with personal experience in this area with FAA, CAA etc?

[Transsonic2000]

Hi there,

I was wondering if there is anybody who can help me with the following question, is it possible to undergo a Lasik (eye) surgery without loosing your EASA 1st class medical? I know that in the US (FAA) it's possible, but I'm particular interested what the EASA says about Lasik for pilots.

Many thanks!

[Scott96]

Hi,

I have myopia currently at -4.50D. I see the CAA limits for myopia for a class 1 medical is -6.00D. What happens if my myopia gets beyond this limit? Am I simply never allowed to get a class 1, even though with correction (glasses) I have 20/20 vision?

[Scoobster]

Give them a call and ask the question... There have recently been changes in the Medical Staff at the CAA so they should be able to answer you directly.

Having said this I do recall that (and someone will probably be along to correct me shortly if I have it wrong).... I do recall that the "process" for medical related questions had changed somewhat and in the first instance your AME should be the first point of contact.

I suspect if you are out of limits they may be able to consider you for a restricted medical.. possible an OML.. but don't quote me on this.

I had a turbulent time regarding vision.

You could also always book in for a "Opthalmological Assessment" without taking the initial examination at LGW and they Eye Doc should be able to give you an answer.

Good Luck.

Scoobster

[Bramb90]

Hello all, I went to renew my medical certificate(1st class) and the AME told me that I need glasses because it looks like I am not 20/20 on my right eye. I have known for many years that my right eye isn't perfect but because I am still young(24yo) I can still focus and see just fine. I went to an eye doctor right after the examination with the AME to get a prescription and the doctor said that I don't really need glasses because like I've been told many times, I can still focus 20/20! What do I do??

Is it bad to have a "must wear corrective lenses" limitation on the medical certificate? Will the airlines be hesitant to hire you?

[UCDflyer]

Hi all,

I am just wondering what are someones options if they go over the limit for shortsightedness (-6). I am 21 at the moment and my eyesight has been getting worse over the past few years and going over this limit is a constant worry of mine. Does anyone know what the options are if this happens?

Thanks

[J_I_Logan]

I have a CASA Class 1 Medical which restricts Rotorcraft and Agriculture (this year CASA scrapped the International restriction) due to Amblyopia. My medical expires in March and I will be moving to San Jose California for a gig teaching aerobatics. If I apply for a Class 1 in America will it be treated as an Initial or Renewal? Will I need to do a SODA? Will it help if I bring the complete write up from my DAME here?

Thanks in advance.

P.S.
Ag never interested me but fire bombing does. Will my CASA restrictions still apply in FAA space? If I get a fire gig in the US, will I be able to keep that rating when I come back to Oz?

[Parson]

For a start, do not base any career decisions on what you can/cannot find on here. Some posts are, though well intentioned, inaccurate.

Speak to the CAA Medical Division. Eyesight is one area where the initial and renewal limts differ, ie your vision will naturally deteriorate over time/with age and reasonable allowances are made for that.

[Mickey Kaye]

Post your full presciption including VA.

The CAA visual standards are avilable on.

They allow 3 dioptres for revlaidation.

[Parson]

S7R,

Yes, I would if you have concerns. Also speak to your own optician. The limits are published by the CAA.

My comment re potentially inaccurate posts on here does not relate to MK who I believe is professionally qualified to advise on this subject.

[DrAviator13]

Hello!

Newbie here. Working towards my PPL with the aim of continuing to my CPL asap. Problem: my left eye astigmatism is -2.75, not going to fly (pardon the pun). Possible solution: Laser eye surgery in that eye (my right eye is well within the CAA requirements). Anyone here had laser eye surgery and got a class 1 medical ok? What are people's thoughts on it? The CAA's official line is that they don't tell people to go get it done, but if you pass the additional tests they do for laser eye patients, it must mean they aren't adverse to the procedure?

Cheers

[pilotjetstyle]

Hello fellow pilots!

I have a question to you all and wish someone of you have been in my situation or can help me with my enquiry.

If a person have PPL-A with medical class 2, attend a medical class 1 and fail, lets say becuse of his vision was below the requirments. And fix them with vision therapy can he just have a new test?

I tried that in my home conutry and was refused and was told that I can`t just come and take another one as it suits me, and since my report was just from a "commerical" specialist they woudn`t accept it.

Can I then convert my current PPL-A to a UK issued one, and take a new medical there?

Hope someone can answer this as soon as possible!!!!!

[pilotjetstyle]

Hello

Quick question.

If I have PPL-A and a medical class 2, and fail my medical class 1, can I then convert my current PPL-A with medical class 2 to another country and take the medical again over there?

This case is in Europe.

The reason for this is that I strongly believe I now are able to pass my medical class 1, but was told that I cannot just take another medical class 1 (in my home coutry) as it suits me..

[Highasakites]

Hi guys, I'd just like to know something about the UK CAA EASA Class 1 Medical eyesight requirements. I know that they have the refraction error requirements, but do these requirementether s only matter if you need correction. Because I know that for the UK CAA EASA Class 3 it's only if you need correction, and previously when it was JAR Class 1 it was also if you need correction. However with the current UK CAA EASA Class 1 it is not clear. It does also say that the JAR Class 1 requirements are very similar to the EASA Class 1 requirements on the NATS website. Do any of you know whether it's only if you need correction or whether you need correction or not? Thanks:)

[pilotjetstyle]

Is there any limitation on how many EASA Medical class 1 atempts one can have? If the person believe he or she is now within the limits, can they just book another test?

Also, can someone take a medical class 1 in any EASA country as he or she wish, even if previously failed in one country?

[Flyin'Dutch']

Why do you think you would fail once and pass the next time? It is not a written test for which you can practise.

You can go to another country to get the class 1 but you have to declare a failed test.

Not declaring what has gone before would be unwise. If it transpires later that you obtained a medical by deception you will be in trouble.

[pilotjetstyle]

@flyin dutch

There are several things they can fail you at on the Medical class 1, that you can do something about without doing surgery.

I failed because of a issue regarding my eyes, and have fixed this trough hard traning and I have been on several vision tests since and I am now withing thoose limits needed.

It will be easier for me to go to another country because where I live, they won`t let me take a retest for some reason..

[Ryder19]

What happens if your eyes, say after 3 years of getting a class 1 with constant successful yearly renewals, suddenly turn out to be -6 and thus outside the boundaries? Does this mean you instantly fail the medical, or is it allowed providing glasses can correct and your we're under -6 at your first medical?

[Radix]

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[pilotjetstyle]

Need Advice..
My lifelong dream has been to become an airline pilot and at the age of 15 I embarked on my journey towards my career as an airline pilot.
I completed my PPL-A and got a Medical class 2, I have been to several tests in my life, including my general military health test for military service and none of them has concluded that anything was wrong with me.
I have flight experience from Scandinavia and UK with a night rating.
On February 2014 I took at initial class 1 in Oslo, and they failed me because my hyperphoria was outside the limits, I was gutted, but didn`t want it all to end now.
So July 2014 I started on a vision therapy program 3 times a day, quit my job and did everything in my power, every day for now over 8 months to get my eyes fixed, I also when regularly to a vision therapist.
My results were astonishing and I got my height deviation down from an 8 to 2 at the end of my program, 1 month later, I visited an optician and it was about 1-1.5, and I saw a light in the tunnel.
A few days ago I scheduled an initial class 1 at Gatwick, and I now need further assessment from a specialist eye doctor to see whether or not I am at the risk of developing double vision. This will either give me a un-restricted, co-pilot restricted or not any at all, depending on the results, but my luck hasn`t been to good lately.
What are my chances of getting a class 1 medical, even with restrictions? What limitation does this create for me job wise?
If I went on and got a FAA CPL, IR and CFI (with SODA), how are the N-registered market in the UK, around London?
Do anyone have experience with Botox treatment for ocular instability?

[Radix]

..........

[Radix]

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[speedbird72]

Hi Guys

have a close lookout the link below :

http://easa.europa.eu/system/files/dfu/CRD%202013-15.pdf

part-MED is being amended regarding dioptres limits especially for hyperopia .

It shall all be completed by1st quarter of 2016 .

good news !

[WillIBpilot]

If you wear glasses or contact lenses it is important to take your last optician’s report along to the examination.


An applicant may be assessed as fit with hypermetropia not exceeding +5.0 dioptres, myopia not exceeding -6.0 dioptres, astigmatism not exceeding 2.0 dioptres, and anisometropia not exceeding 2.0 dioptres, provided that optimal correction has been considered and no significant pathology is demonstrated. Monocular visual acuities should be 6/6 or better


Here are my eyes sights' details:


Right Eye: -5.00 (Myopia) /-2.5 (Astigmatism) / 173
Left Eye: -5.00 (Myopia) /-2.5 (Astigmatism) / 175


Since Astigmatism exceed the limit.... Does it means I will have ABSOLUTE zero chance to become a commercial pilot ?
Is it really that hopeless !!!???


Many Thanks

[Radix]

...........

[RedBullGaveMeWings]

If you wear glasses or contact lenses it is important to take your last optician’s report along to the examination.


An applicant may be assessed as fit with hypermetropia not exceeding +5.0 dioptres, myopia not exceeding -6.0 dioptres, astigmatism not exceeding 2.0 dioptres, and anisometropia not exceeding 2.0 dioptres, provided that optimal correction has been considered and no significant pathology is demonstrated. Monocular visual acuities should be 6/6 or better


Here are my eyes sights' details:


Right Eye: -5.00 (Myopia) /-2.5 (Astigmatism) / 173
Left Eye: -5.00 (Myopia) /-2.5 (Astigmatism) / 175


Since Astigmatism exceed the limit.... Does it means I will have ABSOLUTE zero chance to become a commercial pilot ?
Is it really that hopeless !!!???


Many ThanksYou will be fine, don't worry. If you don't have any particular pathology there's no reason why they should reject your medical certificate. I had -3 dioptres of astigmatism.

And you could Always get eye surgery, as I am planning to since my vision at 23 seems to be established now.

[Time81]

Hi Guys

have a close lookout the link below :

http://easa.europa.eu/system/files/d...%202013-15.pdf

part-MED is being amended regarding dioptres limits especially for hyperopia .

It shall all be completed by1st quarter of 2016 .

good news !

After investigating the changes planned in the document above (and some related ones): does that mean, that in case of hyperopia exceeding +5.00 dpt you can only have your Class 1 Medical when you reach 6/6 visual acuity in each eye separately? The current regulations are, that after successful review by an ophthalmologist, you could get your medical (and visual acuity was 6/9 in each eye separately and 6/6 with both eyes). Now it seems to be harder in case of hyperopia exceeding +5.00 dpt - am I correct or did I miss something?

[Gomrath]

To be told 'don't worry' is a bit of an understatement made by somebody who does not know and has no medical experience.

You are asking questions that only an authorized AME can answer. You need to go talk to them to get the full facts as they apply to you.

[g07279]

i am planning to apply for the cadet pilot program from cathay pacific, however i have congenital cataract would i be fail the medical tests?

[QwertyFly]

Hello everyone. I recently started the process of trying to become a Comercial pilot but I seem to have fallen at the 1st hurdle.

I went for my eye test today at my local opticians (I don't currently wear or feel I need glasses) however, once I'd finished my test I was told my left eye wouldn't meet the required standards.

I have astigmatism in my left eye to the value of -3.00 about the requirements for a Class 1. (-2.00)

I spoke to the CAA and they said even with corrective surgery/ Glasses or Contacts it wouldn't be possible to obtain Class 1 Medical for Comercial Flying because they use the results BEFORE corrective vision.

Has anyone had or know anyone who's has a similar problem?
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance for any replies given.

[jmskydancer]

Have my EASA/JAA Class 2 with VDL for 3 yrs but going for CPL so need Class 1.
Everything is good except vision.
The machine (refractometer or smth) shows -3.25 in one eye and unstable, changing by hours, may as well be -2.25 in the morning or -3.75 in the afternoon (I told them to check the machine). 100% distant vision with glasses, about 70% distant without glasses. Adaptation is excellent they say. In reality I can easily live without glasses but I mostly do wear them not to lose them.

Well, after all, according to Part.FCL limit for 1st time 1st Class is -2 astigmatism, so the decision is now to be made by additional ophtalmologist check. They offer me Class 1 with following limitations:
VDL - that's obvious
TML6 - they want to check the tendency in 6 months
OML - as first officer only or with first officer having good vision only - that's odd but, well, let it be
RXO - meaning they want to check my vision every checkup, ok

My question about TML6 - when I come back in 6 months, that will be a revalidation, right? At revalidation Part.MED says astigmatism may be more than -2. So basically, if there is no bad tendency, they will have no arguements at revalidation right? They will have to remove both TML and OML, right? Any comments, experience?

[jmskydancer]

Hey, just checked the proposed amendment for Part.MED - it seems very hopeful for us half-blind :hmm:

[Dr Jekyll]

The AME will need both the correction and the vision once corrected so both prescription and chart.

[Radix]

............

[greatal]

Hi everyone,

Do you know if HK has any medical flight test to get HKCAD's Class 1 medical? I know that most of other countries have it, but i am curious to know if my home town has it or not, cause I currently could not find any info related to medical flight test in HK.

The underlying reason I ask is I was told that Cathay Pacific Cadet Pilot Program does not take candidates with Lazy eye (amblyopia). First of all, i do like to know if this were to be true or not. If true, i am trying to find an alternative path to be a pilot.

Either way, thanks in advance for the comments. Thanks and have a good day.

[greatal]

Hi RavenII,

I am new here and still a pilot wannabe. I just want to ask something about the medical flight test for Class 1, as I also need it for my career progression.

1) Do you know the medical flight test for class 1 should be taken right after PPL, or after CPL?
2) Also, by general norm, if you passed the medical flight test, you get the class 1medical along with the SODA right? but, will it the regionally retricted? e.g. if u pass your medical flight test in US, will the medical certificate be applicable only in the US?

Thanks a lot in advance for your insight. Cheers.

[Gregitto]

Im sure this has been answered before but unfortunately I cannot read the whole thread :)
I know and understand the initial class 1 limitations for eyesight. My question is, do the same limitations apply after the initial class 1?
Thanks for answers

[MattLR]

Hello,

I'm looking to achieve my dream of becoming a pilot. Currently 16 years old with good GCSE's.

The problem is that one of my eyes isn't up to the standards required for a Class 1 medical from the CAA. However, the other is perfect and both combined vision is 6/5 (better than average).

1) Is there any way for an exception and a way to still gain my Class 1?
2) With a class 2, can i become a cargo pilot for eg. Fedex or UPS?

Any help or guidance is greatly appreciated,

Regards,
Matt

[seen_the_box]

For your first question, check the CAA website (link below). The bit you're interested in is probably 'anisometropia'. You'll find that many of the medical requirements are qualified with 'a fit assessment may be considered...' In other words, falling outside the requirements is often not an automatic no-go: they will just require a specialist's report before considering issuing you with a medical. If in doubt, call them and have a chat. They are generally helpful.

With regard to your second question: 'cargo pilots' are subject to exactly the same licencing requirements as those flying passengers. Further, you won't be working for FEDEX or UPS without a green card or US passport!

Visual System GM | Medical | Personal Licences and Training (http://www.caa.co.uk/default.aspx?catid=49&pagetype=90&pageid=13885#eyeex)

[Mickey Kaye]

Could you post your spectical refraction and VA

[RedBullGaveMeWings]

I just want to say that pre-operative limits have been removed. What I mean is that you can still get your first class medical certificate even if anisometropia is over 2 dioptres, provided you meet the requirements with correction.
With new EASA regulations, Europe has gotten a bit closer to FAA standards.

However there might be some airlines with internal and more stringent requirements. One of these is Lufthansa, who won't ever hire a candidate who had a succesful Lasik surgery or myopia is over -3 dioptres, despite meeting the requirements for the safe conduct of a flight.

[Transsonic2000]

By the way, is Lasik surgery now allowed under EASA rules? Thought that'd would disqualify a candidate/pilot here in Europe.

[RedBullGaveMeWings]

It does not. In the UK you can be assessed after 3 months, in Italy they told me after one year, in Poland 4-6 months... Just contact your local authority!

[RatherBeFlying]

First of all, there's no need to do anything until your intra ocular pressure, IOP, becomes elevated. Check the IOP at your optometrist who will advise on how often you need the check.

Drops will reduce IOP for a time.

Selective Laser Trabeculotomy takes out individual cells in your iris to increase drainage.

DO NOT accept argon laser which blows big holes in your iris. SLT is the new standard of care.

[MattLR]

Thanks for the replies. I found this (below) online under the CAA link that 'seen_the_box' gave me.

It suggests that I could take a flight test to prove my eyes worthy of gaining a Class 1. Am i right?

Just seems annoying that my binocular vision is perfect (6/5) and yet i cant be a pilot :(

Class 1
(c) Substandard vision
(1) Applicants with reduced central vision in one eye may be assessed as fit if the binocular visual field is normal and the underlying pathology is acceptable according to ophthalmological assessment. A satisfactory medical flight test and a multi-pilot limitation are required.
(2) An applicant with acquired substandard vision in one eye may be assessed as fit with a multi-pilot limitation if:
(i) the better eye achieves distant visual acuity of 6/6 (1.0), corrected or uncorrected;
(ii) the better eye achieves intermediate visual acuity of N14 and N5 for near;
(iii) in the case of acute loss of vision in one eye, a period of adaptation time has passed from the known point of visual loss, during which the applicant is assessed as unfit;
(iv) there is no significant ocular pathology; and
(v) a medical flight test is satisfactory.
(3) An applicant with a visual field defect may be considered as fit if the binocular visual field is normal and the underlying pathology is acceptable to the licensing authority.

[RedBullGaveMeWings]

What refraction error do you suffer from exactly?

[MattLR]

Not really sure what any of these mean :

Right Sph: +2.25
Right Cyl: -1.50
Right Axis: 170

The left eye has perfect vision and no problems atall

[ION 16]

Anyone out there have any experience of maintaining a class 1 here in the UK once your eyesight exceeds the limits?

I have had a UK class 1 for many years and have always been rather long sighted. As I approach middle age I now have the onset of presbyopia (age related long sight) on top of my already long sight which has caused my uncorrected vision to become much worse. I now sit at the limit of +5.00 diopters in each eye so no doubt over the next few years I will exceed that limit.

I can still achieve excellent vision with spectacles and have no underlying pathology. Anyone out there have any experience of maintaining a class 1 here in the UK once your eyesight exceeds the limits? Is it possible?

[Mickey Kaye]

Ion16

Most (if not all) hypermetropes have an increase in prescription with the onset of presbyopia and I don't know what the CAA stance on this is.

I have heard of one person in your position who decided to have refractive surgery which then effectively eliminates any risk of loss of medical.

In your case clear lens extraction might be your best option.

[HEJT2015]

Do you know how long it would take for an individual to get their class one medical certification after LASIK? e.g.

a) A non-pilot before having an initial medical.
b) A pilot with an airline and an exisiting medical.

Thank you, I appreciate your time :)

[RatherBeFlying]

You might get the medical, but have difficulty finding employment with a history of LASIK.

Have a look at LASIK Complications, Risks: 10 Reasons NOT to Have LASIK (http://www.lasikcomplications.com)

[vikdream]

I have got several friends with a history of LASIK, all of them employed all around Europe.

[Byrne11]

Guys, I'm doing my initial Class 1 in April. I've wore glasses since I was 5, is there a certain type of eye form i have to have my local optician fill in to bring along?

Also if my eyesight does not fit in their limits they use as guidelines online, i believe it is referred to a specialist? is that correct.

[Time81]

Anyone out there have any experience of maintaining a class 1 here in the UK once your eyesight exceeds the limits?

I have had a UK class 1 for many years and have always been rather long sighted. As I approach middle age I now have the onset of presbyopia (age related long sight) on top of my already long sight which has caused my uncorrected vision to become much worse. I now sit at the limit of +5.00 diopters in each eye so no doubt over the next few years I will exceed that limit.

I can still achieve excellent vision with spectacles and have no underlying pathology. Anyone out there have any experience of maintaining a class 1 here in the UK once your eyesight exceeds the limits? Is it possible?

I might be wrong on this (so I hope someone can confirm that) but even though presbyopia is called age related long sight is has technically nothing to do with correction required for distant vision and I think it's only the latter on which the current limit is applied. As long as your hyperopia doesn't change you should still have the same distant vision with the correction you currently have and presbyopia would only lead to problems when trying to read something rather close to your eyes.

So I would assume nothing changes for your medical except - when your presbyopia leads to poor near vision - you might require glasses to correct for that.

However, as I said, I'm in no way an expert, just someone having almost the same problem (+5.00 but not yet developing presbyopia), so I tried to gather as much information as possible about this.