ARMY PILOT TRAINING HELP

[gazzab]

Hi all

I am an NCO looking to become a SNCO AAC pilot.

Does anybody on here know how the army pilots course is structured? I am told that you do 2 weeks survival trg, then go to RAF barkston heath for 13 weeks flying the grob, 2 weeks leave, then DHFS shawbury for 13 weeks basic rotary and 11 weeks advanced, then back to middle wallop to do your conversion to type. Is this correct? Or is there periods of ground school also to attend?

Also if there is anybody who has done the course, whats it like for getting home at weekends? only reason I ask is as I have kids, and I would like to know how often I would be allowed home to see them. I will have to be unaccompanied for the 1st year.

Finally, how intense is the theory. A few of the officers in my regiment have been knocking my confidence to go for it, they think I dont have enough experience of navigation and radio operating etc. (Maybe even suggesting I am not clever enough :}). I presume this will all be taught on the course?

Cheers

[alfred_the_great]

Have you tried the ARRSE AAC forum?

Aviation (http://www.arrse.co.uk/aviation-36)

[diginagain]

Have you tried the ARRSE AAC forum?
Proceed with caution ;)

There are a few current aircrew on Arrse, and a far larger number who are not. There are one or two threads worth reading before you jump in with questions, the answers to which may have already been provided. There are one or two playground bullies who enjoy nothing more than taunting the junior members.

I wouldn't worry about the opinions of your colleagues; as has been posted, unless they've passed the APC, they have little in the way of knowledge to help you. You may also find that your unit puts obstacles in your path.

Best of luck. It's the most fun you can have with your pants on. :ok: I've PM'd you with a POC on Arrse.

[gazzab]

yeah, cheers iv tried the arrse forums. Theres a lot of out of date stuff on there. No point even asking a question on there, as most the time you are given a sarcastic comment.

[gazzab]

I thought as much. They are probably just jealous as they have passed the upper age limit :E

[parabellum]

Just to add two penneth. Have the officers who tried to discourage you been to the AAC and failed by any chance?:) Get the Radio Ops in your own unit to give you some tuition before you go and brush up on your map reading, navigation is a subject that is taught, you aren't expected to have a deep knowledge at this stage. Might help if you refreshed the right angled triangle trigonometry stuff but you don't need any thing more advanced than secondary school level when starting out, they will teach you the rest.

May not be the same now but a long time ago if you stated that you wanted to volunteer for pilot training then your own unit were not allowed to withold or delay your application, diginagain is more up to date than I am though.

[lj101]

This article gives an over view

Army Pilots Course - British Army Website (http://www.army.mod.uk/aviation/18097.aspx)

IN FOCUS: British Army fights to influence helicopter training choices (http://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/in-focus-british-army-fights-to-influence-helicopter-training-choices-363505/)

You will get time to be with your family albeit sporadically but any flying training course is intense, you will find your own balance.

I worked recently with an ex 1 para Tom who now flies the Typhoon. Go for your dream and as others say, ignore those that try and put you off, encourage those who have their own dreams.

Good luck.

[gazzab]

Cheers for your help all. Im going to go for it, stick my paperwork in for the selection on monday. Hopefully ill do good, I can only try. Id best dig out some maths books :sad:. My bosses cant really stop me from putting the paperwork in, they can just give me a weak reccomendation.

[Airborne Aircrew]

My bosses cant really stop me from putting the paperwork in, they can just give me a weak reccomendation.

Were they to do that without being pilots themselves they would just be showing their ignorance or small mindedness. You know them - you decide

Since you are a serving NCO I'll give you these three "gems"

1. Never trust a word of what an Officer tells you, go and find out for yourself.

2. An Officer telling you you're not good enough with a map is past laughable, let's just leave it at that... :rolleyes:

3. If you can talk you can communicate by radio. :ok:

Now, make sure you spell everything right on that app... Good luck...

[lj101]

Gazzad

Give yourself a bit of a head start and perhaps get some flying experience under your belt. These clubs aren't far from you and it will show your seniors that you are motivated. I would also check out the OASC Pprune thread as you will probably get very recent advice on the aptitude tests and what to expect.


Seahawk Gliding - Cornwall Gliding (http://www.seahawkgliding.co.uk/aboutus.html)


About Us | Yeovilton Flying Club (http://www.flyyfc.com/?page_id=6)

[Wizzard]

Gazzad,

You're correct when you say that your parent unit cannot stop your application but that will only get you as far as selection. Not much you can do about the medical but try to find out as much as you can about the AAC and the army in general, you will be probed on the interview and during the selection tests as to your knowledge about how the army works.

I came from the infantry and had a lot of help from some of my Bn with publications that could expand my overall knowledge of the army.

As has been said before, don't take too much notice of the naysayers, it's probably down to lack of drive and pure jealousy.

Have a go! The worst that can happen is that you will still be doing the job you're doing now and it might just change your whole life.

Good luck.

[tezzer]

Just bought a book, on my kindle, Dressed to Kill, written by Charlotte madison, an army Officer who went throught the training courses to become an Apache pilot, well worth a read.

[diginagain]

My bosses cant really stop me from putting the paperwork in, they can just give me a weak reccomendation. They can also 'mislay' your paperwork, as has happened to applicants in the past. Give it a go, but don't be afraid to pester the system in the furtherance of your ambition.

diginagain is more up to date than I am though.
Possibly not, as my experience dates back to the 1980s, but I do have a very good handle on those on Arrse who are current.

[airborne_artist]

Gazzad

Those officers are unwittingly doing you a favour. You should now have even more determination to get on the course and pass.

Many years ago I had to get an officer's approval to start selection for a then little-known organisation. He allowed me to go, but said I would fail. I didn't. ;)

As an NCO you should already know that one of the British Army's most dangerous assets is an officer with a map. They really should leave the technical stuff to their chaps.

[Pontius Navigator]

Two points:

Someone I know was a SSgt and wanted to go for a commission. Obstacles were put in his way so he decided to switch to the RAF. They told him he couldn't as . . .

He applied, got accepted, got commissioned and 11 years later is a Lt Col equivalent. Sweeter he has even been in command of ruperts that were his previous bosses.

Secondly brush up on your mental arithmetic. Do as many time/distance problems as you can. Car and helicopter speeds are not too different so do them as you drive around.

[Airborne Aircrew]

Car and helicopter speeds are not too different so do them as you drive around. What were you on, Whirlwinds or Belvederes? :E

[gazzab]

Cheers all for the advice.

Ill stick the paperwork in on monday. Ill get practicing with the maths. Im not too bad at the speed distance time questions, the fuel calculation questions are throwing me more

eg. You travel 130 NM. How much fuel will you need if you burn 12 lbs per hour, and are travelling at 78 kts?

Answer= 20 lbs.


I can do them, they just take me longer.

Its a poor do you cant take a pen and paper in the oasc exams.

[Two's in]

The only reason Army helicopters fly at 120 Kts is because there's a fighting chance the pilot can divide by 60 twice (if he uses his big watch of course) and so deliver a rough ETA.

[Sloppy Link]

Mate,
I have the same handle on arrse and think my contributions have only been sarcastic where a rapier wit demanded it. Try again, people to look for are Lord Flasheart, Mighty Gem and Porridge Gun.

[SilsoeSid]

eg. You travel 130 NM. How much fuel will you need if you burn 12 lbs per hour, and are travelling at 78 kts?

Answer= 20 lbs.

How are we reading that question?

Possible answers;
a. None, I am already here.
b. Depends how much further you have to travel :E
c. 20 lbs + start up, take off and landing fuel :ok:

[Pontius Navigator]

A-A, Mrs PN, driving over the Dromochter, looked up and watched two Buccaneers, inverted and flying slowly down the Glen.

Then she glanced at the speedo and saw that they were not going THAT slow :}

[Rosevidney1]

Back in the days when men were men (!) we trained on the Hiller 12B and 12C. Although the B & C looked rather different (one had several panes of perspex the other had a bubble) they had one thing in common - a 55 kt cruise speed. A nautical mile per minute meant a gentle chuff wind. Ah, those were the days!

[parabellum]

I remember the Hiller, (course 173), they were painted blue with Bristow down the tail boom - did they really only cruise at 55kts? No wonder we never went very far away from Wallop in them!

[Genstabler]

Remember wearing out a pair of flying gloves acting as rotor brake on the tail rotor drive shaft. Fond memories!

[Sqwark2000]

Hi all,

Not military and not in the UK, but enjoy perusing the forums.

For the OP, I recently found and viewed the 1997 BBC Doco-series "Flying Soldiers". 15yrs old and prob out of date re: aircraft etc, but can't imagine it would've changed that much since then.

Episode 1: Flying Soldiers episode 1 - BBC 1997 documentary about trainee army helicopter pilots in the uk - YouTube

Good Luck with your application.

S2K

[diginagain]

........but can't imagine it would've changed that much since then.

I believe it has; massively. It was filmed in 93/94 ISTR, which, as we all know, might as well be another planet. (One of the chopped stood me many a beer shortly after, as I regailed him with tales of the fun he was missing).

[Rosevidney1]

Reference the Hiller rotor brake (for the innocent among you I must explain that there was no such mechanical device installed) one of my course nonchalantly threw his flying scarf around the wet drive shaft, and was tossed into the air in a graceful arc between the turning blades and deposited less gracefully on the other side of the machine. Until then I had never heard him swear!

[lynxgem]

Mate, i spent 14 years or so with the AAC. I left in 2010 so i cant imagine i'm that out of date. PM me for more info if you wish. What you need to ask yourself is how far are you going to go in your current regt, re pensions etc. AAC MCM Div dont like promoting people (thats not a bitter sentiment, just that aircrew in the AAC dont get their rank in a cereal box like the ground crew do!). If you stay as a sgt for the rest of your career in the AAC, that is obviously what you are pensioned on. If you think you're likely to be the next Academy SM at RMAS in your current unit then stay where you are.....

However, flying over SPTA / BATUS / Belize etc etc etc watching squaddies tabbing everywhere whilst i'm flying made me realise what a good decision i'd made! Plus i got paid a ****e load of money to fly on awesome days (and ****e days too i might add). In short, go for it, but weigh up all the pros and cons in advacne as your commitment will be sorely tested - a lot of RAF instructors hated NCO Pilots (I'm ex RTR).

Time off - yes. You're entitiled to a qtr at Wallop so bear that in mind when the commuting pain rears its head. Leave, should be between the various phases. Dont bother going to a flying club first, i never did. You need to show improvement in your 13 hr grading sessions and if you've already flown then the margin will be smaller. A pal of mine that i met on grading had a PPL - he failed and i passed! (Having never set foot in a light aircraft before!). The rodneys in yr unit are talking out of their arrse. There are only 2 selections (providing you're not in a protected trade like Int or similar) where you cannot be prevented from applying - Hereford and AAC. IIRC Annex J to Chapt 43 of AGAIs was the place that explained the process; not sure if that's still the case (I applied in 97 so things have changed somewhat). The flying soldiers programme is well out of date - one of the guys on there is now a grandad!!

Whatever paperwork you submit in duplicate, make a further 4 copies! They have a habit of disappearing - mine did and this sound advice was given to me by a QHI in BATUS once.

If you get on the course, dont heap self induced pressure on yourself. If you're still reading / planning etc at 10pm, stop it and go have a pint in the bar. If it isnt in by then, it wont go in, your brain is too tired. That pholisophy worked for me and i passed!

I used to work woth Lord Flasheart and i know how much of a sarky tw@t he is. Instead, get hold of the AAC RLO (if one still exists) at HQ AAC in Wallop. They primarily deal with rodney selection through RMAS etc, but can point you in the right direction. Failing that, pm me and i'll dig out a few names for you.

At the end of the day, do you want to be sat around at 60 thinking "i could've done it"?? Loads of squaddies i met once i'd passed said that they wished they'd done it. I'm just glad i did and remember, you don't know until you try!!

Best of luck