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jabird
18th May 2012, 17:23
I note that Emirates have sponsored this new cable car contraption that will wizz across the Docklands between Excel and the O2 complex.

This is still billed to open "in time for the Olympics", which makes me wonder what BA, as official Olympics sponsor have to say about it?

It is also setting a precedent for sponsorship of Tube stations, which could lead to no end of clutter on the originally beautifully simple tube map.

Emirates Air Line (cable car) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emirates_cable_car)

AlpineSkier
18th May 2012, 18:04
Probably not of interest to too many people, however it is a gondola system (multiple cabins ) and not a cable-car ( two cabins only, used as counterweights ).

Ancient Observer
18th May 2012, 18:08
Once the blooming CEOs and Marketting folk get their private parts out and put them on the table, the whole "I've got a bigger one than you" set of corporate rubbish can be expected.

Mr H will not like to be out-shone, so I guess Wates will get the contract to build Boris's Etihad bridge. If Wates build it, I gues it won't wobble.

SpringHeeledJack
18th May 2012, 18:20
I had the dubious pleasure of sitting in a mock-up gondola some months back and was at the time suprised that such a vanity project was being financed by a company not of the land, especially in an Olympic year. But then, this is the UK and just about every decent large company has been sold off or diluted to foreign interests :*:rolleyes: Oh well, at least post Olympics it will make for an interesting commute for some people.


SHJ

jabird
18th May 2012, 23:40
Alpine Skier -

Of course it is of interest, we are all technocrats and we want to get our terminology correct.

So, from the usual referee (right 100% of the time of course) on these matters:

A cable car is any of a variety of transportation systems relying on cables to pull vehicles along or lower them at a steady rate, or a vehicle on these systems

And a gondola lift is given as a subsection of cable cars, together with the type used in San Francisco, which I have always considered to be a different, but related concept.

Cable car - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cable_car)

I think it is a rather rare application of the technology, as it is usually used to scale heights where a rail system would be very expensive to install. I remember seeing the cog railway being replaced with a cable car in Lauterbrunnen, CH.

The only other example I can think of where the system runs across a flat profile is the one that runs across the Rhine in Cologne - also emulated recently in Koblenz.

As for the politics, yes it is a corporate affair, I was more interesting in learning whether or not BA had anything to say about it!

AlpineSkier
19th May 2012, 21:07
jabird

Your response rather reminds of the time I had to translate Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle : that wasn't very intelligible to me either.

Your Wiki link includes the essential elements of what is a cable-car, but these are not highlighted in the initial sentences and I am not sure you have cottoned on to them.

As I understand, the principal defining element of a "cable-car" is that it is moved by a tractor-cable which only provides traction and no carrying capacity. In my experience this means that a cable-car must stay on the same track i.e. if you have an uphill and a downhill station and each side has an arrival and a departure side called ABC and D, the one cabin will always travel between A and B and the other C and D i.e. it does not cross the tracks at the terminus.


Gondolas on the other hand - to which I count the Cologne system - are attached to a cable which is simultaneously traction and suspension. This cabins -travelling between the same ABC and D stations - will travel between, then round and through all stations because they are on one cable and not two separate ones as in a cable-car.

UniFoxOs
20th May 2012, 09:02
The only other example I can think of where the system runs across a flat profile

One or two in theme parks - Alton Towers for example.

UFO

ExXB
20th May 2012, 09:24
Just out of curiosity, how much does EK pay for such sponsership? And what about their sponsorship of other UK icons? I think there is a Emirates stadia somewhere, and I can recall seeing Fly Emirates on some blokes sporting jersey.

This is becoming so ubiquitous - their sponsorships must exceed what European airlines make as profits. Are they shown on EK's books or are they paid by some sheik or other, as a favour to the ruling family?

hellsbrink
20th May 2012, 09:42
Arsenal play at the Emirates Stadium, and the sponsorship from Dubai is more widespread than you think (you have to remember that Emirates is owned by the Government as part of their "Emirates Group" of investment companies, so it ain't just airline money being bandied about). The sponsorship deal with the cable car is reported as being 36 million over 10 years.

ChrisVJ
20th May 2012, 11:51
Funny Gondolas on the flat should be mentioned as I am pretty well looking at one at the moment.

There is one at Nha Trang, (Vietnam) that goes across the narrows to a an amusement park on an Island. (Called Vinland.) It is over 3KM long and the towers are about 20M high.

We also have a Cable car system between the two peaks in Whistler, though we call them Gondolas. Just over a Km I think between Blackcomb Mountain and Whistler Mountain. Longest peak to peak in the world, though I can't think why they bothered, surely the whole point of a ski resort is to go down the damn hill, not directly from peak to peak.

Checkboard
20th May 2012, 11:57
The Emirates stadium, the O2 arena, the British Airways London eye, the Emirates cable car, advertising projected onto Buckingham Palace (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2054910/Bob-Geldof-offers-advertisers-chance-turn-Buckingham-Palace-billboard.html) ...


... is anything is this country actually British any more? :confused:

G-CPTN
20th May 2012, 12:05
How many recall that the Millennium Wheel was sponsored by BA as the London Eye (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/London_Eye)?

It seems that the BA money ran out and it is now called the EDF Energy London Eye.

AlpineSkier
20th May 2012, 14:07
The Eye was initially (part ?) owned by BA. I recall that early on it made more annual profit ( 9 million ? ) than the airline business did.

jabird
20th May 2012, 21:10
Your response rather reminds of the time I had to translate Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle

Good for you. That is well above my (cable car / gondola) station!

I completely understand the technical differences as you have explained, and that would indeed by visible to any user who was interested in the technicalities, but within the UK at least, they would all be generically referred to as cable cars.

One or two in theme parks - Alton Towers for example

Not last time I looked - quite a deep valley between the pylons. Heights of Abraham is a very steep incline - try cycling or running from Cromford to Middleton Top and saying it's flat :O

Are they shown on EK's books or are they paid by some sheik or other, as a favour to the ruling family?

When you already operate in an environment with no corporate or income tax, the motivation to shelter profits is a great deal less - hence more money to burn on vanity projects.

I can't think why they bothered, surely the whole point of a ski resort is to go down the damn hill, not directly from peak to peak.

Whenever you have a resort which offers a particular activity (skiing, gambling, whatever), there will always be a portion of non-participants, and from what I understand, Whistler is not just very good at the apres-ski bit, it also has plenty of non-ski activities. In the summer, smart ski resorts open up to mountain bikes who can't be bothered to use their own energy to get to the top.

Presumably, summit A connects to summit B and one of them connects to Whistler village?

Likewise, you can travel by (I think) cable car between Zermatt and its Italian counterpart, taking in superb views of the Matterhorn.

Cpt_Pugwash
20th May 2012, 23:45
"The only other example I can think of where the system runs across a flat profile"

The (now Haven ) Butlins holiday camp at Pwllheli used to have a chairlift system to transport holidaymakers from the main complex out to the beach. This was removed along with the funfair when Haven took over the site.

This site (http://www.butlinsmemories.com/pwllheli/index.htm) has a pic of the system at bottom left.

ChrisVJ
21st May 2012, 05:39
Yes, in Whistler both peaks are served with lifts, which kind of negates the point of the cable car a bit.

We actually do more business in Summer these days than we do most Winters, and with about the same results down at the clinic, Twenty broken bones and forty cases of Chlamydia a day.

If you think the guys on skis and Circus Soleil are cool you should see what some of the guys do on bikes, triple reverse somersault with pike and layout is just the starter, only these guys do it over rocks with not safety net. For finals they do it through flaming hoops.

We also have Ironman races, cycle races, downhill world championships, half marathons and an annual doggie walk.

angels
21st May 2012, 08:52
As some one who can see the cable car from my road, it looks okay.

But the waste of money!

BoJo said the tax and rate payers wouldn't have to pay a penny for his vanity project. Wrong. We're into it millions already. The thing essentially goes wfrom nowhere (the tip of the Greenwich peninsular) to nowhere (the Excel Centre).

It is meant to be an integrated part of the transport system but certainly is not. They haven't set the fares yet, but they've already changed the Tube maps so that Emirates will get their money's worth, even though the thing isn't open yet.

Excellent local blogger had this the other day.

Edited to add the system is rejecting the url. Search for 'diamond geezer dangleway'

ExXB
21st May 2012, 09:57
When you already operate in an environment with no corporate or income tax, the motivation to shelter profits is a great deal less - hence more money to burn on vanity projects.

Yes but EK tries very hard to appear to be profitable. The more expenses you can keep off the books the better for this objective.

ThreadBaron
21st May 2012, 10:18
Thanks for that pointer, angels. Just wasted an hour perusing, and enjoying, Diamond Geezer's blog! ;)

angels
21st May 2012, 10:59
Good stuff Mr B.

It really is a very good blog. The guy holds down a job as well. God knows where he gets the time! :ok:

MagnusP
21st May 2012, 12:26
Interesting cable car trip a couple of years ago to the summit of Sass Pordoi in the Dolomites. 800 metres ascent free-hanging, no intermediate pylons.

Groundgripper
21st May 2012, 16:29
...the system runs across a flat profile is the one that runs across the Rhine in Cologne - also emulated recently in Koblenz.

I wouldn't call the one in Koblenz flat:

http://i925.photobucket.com/albums/ad98/cb1943/P1010292.jpg

GG

603DX
21st May 2012, 17:37
Little snippet of information about the imminent cable/gondolas system of crossing the Thames to the O2. Back in 1998/99, there was a well thought out project to build exactly this form of passenger transport at the same location, in order to complement the anticipated access needs of the Millennium Dome exhibition. The company planning this was doing pretty well with matters associated with planning permissions, agreed pylon and cable heights related to flight patterns into and out of London City airport, liaison with the Dome project, and so on.

At a late stage the company's negotiations with City bankers for financial backing collapsed, with a blunt refusal of their requests. As a result, the project was abandoned. Of course, if many more millions/billions had been sought than were actually required to underwrite this relatively modest scheme, probably for projects without credible security and prospects of repayment, then no doubt the bankers would have gladly stumped up .... After all, that is precisely what the pin-striped geniuses went on to do, landing us all in the financial crisis we are told we are "all in together", isn't it?

So access by cable car to the Excel centre and the former Dome (now the fantastically successful O2 entertainment venue) could have been in busy and profitable use for the past 12 years, if the same brilliant *ankers that have landed us all in penury had not "pulled the plug" back then! Another example of their wise and far-sighted financial acumen. Give those men obscenely huge bonuses!!!! :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

AlpineSkier
21st May 2012, 18:43
Likewise, you can travel by (I think) cable car between Zermatt and its Italian counterpart, taking in superb views of the Matterhorn

There is a cable-car up from each side but the top stations are some considerable distance apart so you have to ski ( or walk with crampons ) between the two.

I believe the reason for the Whistler peak-to-peak cable-car is to avoid a descent to the valley and then having to take a bus or other transport between the two ski-areas. The new cable-car eliminates this necessity which is preferred by skiers who do not like taking off their skis and having to get on a bus: uncomfortable and a bit difficult in ski-boots.

jabird
21st May 2012, 23:20
GG - thanks, I stand corrected on that one.

It really is a very good blog. The guy holds down a job as well. God knows where he gets the time!

The whole point of a blog is that it is a log of opinions, not a scientific report.

All you would have to do to keep it going is have a routine which allows you the time to do daily updates, and stay away from JB!

I'll get my coat! :D

Vercingetorix
22nd May 2012, 01:51
ChrisVJ

forty cases of Chlamydia a day.

well, it is a ski resort!

:ok:

The SSK
22nd May 2012, 12:23
Curiously, European companies are prevented from sponsoring events in the UAE - there could never be a British Airways Dubai Golf Classic, for example.