Atlantic Airlines Upgrades !!

[hopefullthinker]

Hello All,



Been with AA for many years now flying the elegant ATP as a FO and love it!! But still waiting to upgraded,We all had the email about cutting back ect ect ect... is it time to move on ? No pay rises to cope with inflation and no hope of UPGRADES!! The mood within the camp at AA seems to be low amongst the pilots. AA needs to be careful and start looking after us pilots As I know of 5 pilots both captains and FOs that are waiting for contracts and start dates to come through the post for other carriers also many others going for interviews! I ask, was it just coincidence that a few pilots were off all on one day? I don't think so !!! Hopefully the start of this thread will bring all the rumours together and we will try and make out the truth.

Looking forward to reading other pilots comments from AA.

[viperstings]

Hello Hopefullthinker fellow co-worker who ever you are :D

I have been hearing much the same I think AA will be very short of pilots in the near future as a few people are waiting for their new contracts to come in the post and many others going for interview's mostly out in the sandpit was what I had been told. We already need more captains. I think you should look else where as not much chance of upgrades, regarding the email on cutting back I think there are still recruiting for the cadet scheme and its more to do with the West Air side of the business as they just lost some contracts.

[Atlantic_Conveyor]

Same old Atlantic. Always short term thinkers. Senior management think, "lets hammer down pay, conditions and show them what real hard work is about." To them you are White Van Man. Unskilled labour, toddling around the sunny sky, just putting in bare minimum effort. Thinking that pilots and engineers have no grasp on commercial reality and the pressures that drive the company. The senior management were always detached from the reality of the business at the front line. They don't see that the heart of Atlantic, is engineers and pilots out there on the line, going the extra mile, giving the commercial types an unbeatable product to sell.

To be honest, leavers probably are going to end up just as fed up in the desert or wherever they go. Management will probably try the old trick of not bothering to replace them until the company is undercrewed to meltdown point. I hear that now they want to bring in the pay for type rating/will fly for food mob.

The sad thing is that by constantly trying to screw their people, Atlantic, will break down the will to go the extra mile and Atlantic, will be nothing. Who will this benefit?

[viperstings]

Well said Atlantic_Conveyor :D Hit the nail on the head ! I know they have a pool of pilots ready to hand over 17k for the type rating if they read this DON'T DO IT!!! Look at it this way 17K for a Turboprop rating at a company which will give you 350 max hours a year if you lucky and we are the only company to operate the ATP so what other use outside AA does it have ? Now if you did not have to pay I would say take it !! but for a extra 7k you can go to ryanair and get a well worth TR money better spent along with better wages !! Also once you go down the TP route its hard to get yourself out into a jet job !! The minute I get the chance I am out of here and trust me I am trying everyday to move on like the rest of the pilots here, and I can see in the very near future AA will have a massive under crewing problem but I am looking forward to it as more hours for me :O Atlantic used to be well respected in the industry but how things change and its all down to management. as for pay look at pilot jobs network at all the other TP operators in the industry and you will see the pay difference salary wise its about 5kpa more ! ah well moan over least I have a job and did not have to pay for my TR unlike the poor chaps trying to get on now days.

[Mr Angry from Purley]

Its a shame someone like DHK don't use AA as a "feeder" school for it's F/O's, least you guys know the good bad and ugly of night freight! :\

[viperstings]

I wish they did too ! but again a rumour at AA is that management asked DHL to stop taking pilots from AA blocking the way for us to move on !! Is that even legal ??

[bermudatriangle]

If you fancy a change,Qatar are recruiting heavy turboprop captains onto their jet fleets.drop them your cv.

[Doctor Cruces]

Sounds like Emerald, and look what happened to them!!

[Best foot forward]

We have a few ex AA crew at DHL and they are very good.

[ABUKABOY]

We had more than a few come to TNT over the years, and they were consistently good. I remember one turgid winter's night an AA light twin, single crew, being chartered at the last minute to position some senior TNT crew from Stansted to Liege. The young guy's performance on that night in very high workload icing conditions earned him a job offer from the fleet Captain on landing!
AA have always been a good trainer of pilots, especially in the practical experience side of things.

[Doctor Cruces]

I think that's the point. It's certainly the point I was making. The Boys and girls on the front line are, doubtlessly, hard working, can do go getters, sorely let down by management.

[Ma. Bates]

Sounds like the final payout for the 4 bosses is finally due! The merger with WAS/WAL/AAL was supposed to pay out a fast amount of money to them after 3 years when profitable!!
The management pilots in AAL only care about there own shizzle and still think its there little flying club! @hopefullthinker .. some brown nosing before the test and your roots from the north will help you ;-)
Hope we still get our holidays this year!!

[viperstings]

That is all it's about management getting paid ! It will be quite funny really as AA are in the very near future are going to be under-crewed so they need to have some forward thinking if the rumours of new routes and planes are true, As for Qatar there is already one captain off to them excellent chap will be sadly missed but who can blame him we are all treated like mushrooms here 'kept in the dark and fed on ****' I know of 2 more pilot's that have been offered jobs at Qatar and are waiting for contracts to come through the post and 2 have been for interviews and one has a interview soon. As for you Electra pilots that might be coming onto the ATP WE DON'T WANT YOU BOYS on our inferior twin prop ! @ hopefullthinker if these boy's come over then kiss good bye to your possible command upgrade. As for the quality of AA pilots I think it will go down hill because they have started this pay to fly rubbish and we all know what kind of pilot that attracts, the last bunch of pilots we recruited one apparently failed the type rating ? whats that say !! and god knows what kind of pilots we have in the holding pool ready with their 17k

[Atlantic_Conveyor]

I'm sure the Electra boys don't want to get near the ATP and I'm pretty sure that management don't want them on it. Do you think they have any chance of retaining their current salaries? No I'm sure that another points based redundancy scheme has been worked out already.

Any news on the latest pay cut then? How have they dressed it up this time? Markets tough? It's really a pay rise because there are great deals on 42" plasma TV's and you can go one way to Lagos for just two hundred quid with Dana Air? If you don't like it leave? Or have they even bothered to tell you? In my time, they used all those excuses and more.

Yes, the management care only about themselves. Lets's face it, one of them got his hands on the wonga to but AA, by marrying into money which gives you an idea of how ruthless he is.

Problem is that when contracts are renewed with major customers, selling your pay and conditions down the line is the first thing that AA management will do. There will be some kind of business lunch and the customer, (probably making billions) will demand cost reductions and insist that 99.879878776 on time performance is just not good enough. First thing AA management do is roll over, offer them a discount based on not giving you a pay rise. Next thing is a letter stating another pay cut this year (in management speak) and you need to pull your fingers out and start improving that OTP. But hey, it's you getting the pay cut and flying tech aircraft around because they don't want to invest in parts and engineers. Managements doing just fine!

[argon18]

Viperstrings

-Would you prefer to see the Leccy pilots being made redundant than to be retrained on the ATP?

-Do you resent flying with the ex-Electra ATP Captains or are they OK?

'we are all treated like mushrooms here 'kept in the dark and fed on ****' - It reads like you think you have the right to be kept informed of management decisions. Do you think you do? Some undoubtedly have confidentiality clauses and most nothing to do with you as it's not your train set.

[Atlantic_Conveyor]

Would you prefer to see the Leccy pilots being made redundant than to be retrained on the ATP?


Put yourself in the shoes of the ATP FO's that want to be upgraded. Would you prefer it if the Leccy pilots get the sack and you get the upgrade. Or would it be better if Mr Leccy Skipper gets transferred and you have to listen to him going on about the good old days of Liege, whilst he can still barely afford to pay his rent. I think a lot of FO's WOULD deeply resent you, if you transferred.

The good news is that it's not the ATP, guys that decide who goes when the time comes, but management. Oh no, that isn't good news at all!

BTW I work for a large operation that does a far better job of keeping it's employees informed than AA did. They want us to be motivated and part of the success of the business, not bitter and alienated. Our management do it, not because they are nice but because it is good business sense to do so.

[argon18]

Well I won't disagree that the FOs salary (on both fleets) is low.

But from a personal point of view I would not wish redunancy and the process that goes with it upon anyone, so can not agree with you.

And though I'm not on the ATP, I certainly was not aware of any negative feelings towards the ex-Electra guys that transferred from L188 FOs to ATP Captains during the latter part of 2008, who may have stopped ATP FOs being upgraded. In fact, to the best of my knowledge, they are highly regarded, and personally, I enjoy catching up with them down route.

[viperstings]

@argon18 No don't wish the Electra chaps to be made redundant and I like the chaps but the point I was trying to make is (badly I agree,sorry !) That the pilots on the ATP who are awaiting upgrades have worked there butts off flying and working more hours that the Electra counter parts and for less pay.Now possibly some Electra pilots will be retrained on the ATP and some as captains. I feel they should go to the bottom of the pecking order and start from scratch all as new fo's being a new type and all and be paid as an ATP pilot and not as a Electra pilot as I know for sure that the Electra pilots who come online on the ATP will remain on Electra pay but why ?? Do they really think they are better than the captains on the ATP?? same goes for the FOs why should they be paid more than there ATP counter parts ?? It happens in AA!! So really management are to blame for all the ill feeling in the company by creating situations were you have ex Electra capt's and fo's retraining on the ATP and retaining Electra salary how do you think that makes us ATP guys feel?? How would you feel if it was you ??

[Kirk out]

Atlantic conveyor, have you considered just concentrating on your job in your 'large operator', it may help ease the pain and bitterness you display each time you post on this forum. Without AA you wouldn't be in your job with your 'large operator'. I doubt this idea has entered into your 'large operator' mind set tho, has it? BTW, pretty repugnant username considering the 12 British servicemen that lost their lives on this vessel.AA is by and large an OK place to be, with a good set of people, doing their best in a difficult Market. Unfortunately resentments grow when movement stagnates. The sooner the Market opens up the better for all......

[underread east]

I would suggest that you try to get all UP to the Electra rate, rather DOWN to the ATP rate? Looooong time since I was involved at AAG, and sad to see this happening. How about unity of pilots vs management? Infighting is never pretty (and this is very public). Good luck all.

[fade to grey]

God, viper look at the big picture - you are working on a pointless type for a low pay cargo set up.Don't worry about an upgrade, worry about getting out and where might have you ?

All your 20T TP time is worthless to a heavy jet operator, I struggle to see what ME airline would even contemplate you as an FO.

Or would you rather have HSBC put 'Captain' on your chequebook, are you one of those ?

[Beer_n_Tabs]

Atlantic_Conveyor

In my time, they used all those excuses and more.


They were probably sodding glad to get rid of you, you whining little cretin.

Air freight in general is not in great shape at the moment (and I see and have seen the effects on various parts of the industry), so lets hear how your business case.....how would you run an airline?

viperstings...you rank up there with AC too.

What a right pair of....
http://forums.weebls-stuff.com/picture.php?albumid=205&pictureid=1703's

[Atlantic_Conveyor]

I struggle to see what ME airline would even contemplate you as an FO

Could only be one airline, Qatar Airways. The worlds most desperate airline that seeks the worlds most desperate pilots. So, how have you been getting along with your Qatar, application Fade to Grey. I had a quick peep at your previous posts and you seemed unable to work out how to fill in the application. Having any luck? You may look down your nose at the Atlantic pilots but your previous employer Cashstreaus was just as bad, no worse.

BTW, pretty repugnant username considering the 12 British servicemen that lost their lives on this vessel

That's Atlantic Conveyor, as in the one that gives Europe its temperate climate. Hope I didn't hurt your feelings too muck Kirk, but no, my name is nothing to do with dead sailors.

So what's been happening over at Cov then, any pay rises or upgrades? When are they saying the Electra is going, 2089 at the earliest?

[fade to grey]

AC,
I don't know what I did to offend you...? i'm not looking down my nose at anyone, just a reality check. Everyone in this game thinks their hours are really useful - truth is they aren't. The only hours that count for the bigger stuff have Boeing or Airbus next to them.

I'd love to know who you work for, I can probably guess, but your big operator (its obviously not BA) wants you to be 'part of the success', so you obviously believe that kind of bullsh&t.

And yes, I did apply for all the ME airlines - why not ?
i love your take on Astraeus, 'cashtraeus' was it ? Never actually heard that one. I will take it from that , that you paid for a TR but didn't get employed ?
That level of bitterness normally comes from that direction.

[fade to grey]

Oh, and another thing, i loved working for Astraeus.it were bloody great !

[Kirk out]

The big ugly Conveyor Troll leapt onto the bridge gnashing his yellow rotting teeth, but the Coventry fug wasn't afraid he just stamped his feet and charged. Up, up in the air went the balding Troll, then down, down he came.....SPLASH the Troll landed in the middle of the Vltava and was never seen again.....until he surfaced belly up in the Elbe muttering " I'm with a big operator and they really do care about me......

[viperstings]

Well chaps things seem to be happening here @ AA I have some good news I have a Interview with Monarch so not to concerned about getting out of this job @ fade to grey !! As anyone else got a interview with Monarch from AA?? it seems they like AA pilots.A few will be leaving us rumours say 1 Pilot already off to Monarch , 1 to a gulfstram Job , 1 off to DHL, 1 to Qatar and hopefully more including me to Monarch !!!! :D

[Mr Angry from Purley]

Er Viper they'll just replace you?:\

[waco]

Nice one Anjin !!!!!

[fade to grey]

Well done Viper, I'm sure you will be sadly missed.
But an interview isn't a job offer, and I've known some good guys not get through that one.
And of course then you'll be climbing a cliff with the A320 TR.

No doubt you'll be back to inform us of your progress in due time.

[fade to grey]

I hope they have neither an English or punctuation test.

[OneMileHigh]

Oh dear Atlantic Conveyor...... For a guy (or girl) who left AA some time ago you love to keep throwing stones at your former employer.

[Atlantic_Conveyor]

And of course then you'll be climbing a cliff with the A320 TR.


I don't think so. The prop to jet conversion is a simple one, even I managed to do that. It's a bit more slippery in the descent but thats about it. The automation is very robust. Most of the guys I fly with now have never had a significant in flight failure in an aircraft. How many Atlantic pilots can say that? If it is so difficult how to all these 200hr pay to fly fools manage it?

The only hours that count for the bigger stuff have Boeing or Airbus next to them.


Yeah right. There was always a steady flow of guys leaving Atlantic for Boeings or Bus'. For an unemployed B757 Captain, fade to grey sure has a lot of condescending career advice to dish out. I am sorry you lost your job, it can happen to the best of us. However, why come on a thread like this one and start patronising a bunch of capable pilots that want to get along. Maybe, here lies the answer why you have all this big jet time that you say is so valuable, yet remain on the dole.

Keep at it guys, Atlantic is not the worst employer and there is no perfect employer. No business cares about you beyond what is good for them but there is better out there than a pay cut every year and the casual imcompetence of the people who drive the Atlantic show.

[bermudatriangle]

is the pay any better these days ? what kind of rise do you get year on year.considering the freight business is doing rather well compared to passenger traffic.

[JOE-FBS]

At the risk of being horribly flamed, I have to say that it seems to this lowly Coventry PPL that the AA crew(s) who have spent the last few hours flying circuits in the freshly repaired Electra must feel that they have had a good day at work!

It's been a joy to see and I hope the second one is repaired again soon as well.

[argon18]

JOE

You won't be flamed for that comment!! T'was great to get her back in to the air again.

Sadly I think it'll be a while before the other is ready to fly again, but fingers crossed it's not too long.

[viperstings]

The pay is still rubbish for us here @ AA FO basic is around 22K and CAPT around 45k on the ATP. It was good to see the Electra back flying but sadly AA will find themselvse very short of crew to fly it. With the 3 people already leaving for better jobs from the Electra fleet I know of two more who have got Interviews with Monarch not that will own up to it!! Friend of a friend works in recruitment for Monarch have talk about another 2 pilots from AA.

[Icelanta]

Did you guys hear any rumour about West Atlantic buying the assets of Bluebird Cargo?

[argon18]

Icelanta

No, haven't heard that one.

[fade to grey]

AC,
'capable pilots trying to get along ' - you appear to irritate at least 50 % of the posters on here. It's your whole tone, your whole egotistical tone that winds me up.

As for unemployment - I do actually still fly funnily enough, fortunately I don't get to sit with b*llends like you for 8 hours.

So you left Atlantic, and you applied for Monarch.So what are you a flexicrew now ? If so i wouldn't criticise the 'pay to fly fools' as you call them.

[Kirk out]

F to grey, you got the egotistical bit right, but I reckon he winds up about 99.99% of AA pilots. And no he ain't flexi crew, similar colour on the aircraft, but try a base in the east that uses 75's and don't carry too many pax. And yes we all know who he is......

[fade to grey]

Thanks kirk, I thought it was just me. Sounds like an airline that drops , hides and loses stuff. Ideal really as no passengers for him to annoy.

[viperstings]

FYI I got the call today from Monarch and got the job with a Febuary start date out of EMA :O

[N747EX]

If some of you AA guys are off to Monarch, do you expect AA to recruit in the near future? If so on what type?

Also good luck in Monarch :ok:

[Livesinafield]

i doubt it... guys there are averaging about 15 hours a month at the moment on the ATP

[viperstings]

I agree , Dont think we will be taking on any newbies things are not great here , ATP fleet not doing many hours at all ! We have a holding pool of pilots waiting to hand over 17k for a useless type rating for 250hr max a year and cadets as well. I have also heard a rumour that AA are going to get rid of the holding pool shows how bad thing are.

[waco]

.................and I will have a two pence bet that things are not wonderful at Monarch.............

[viperstings]

Maybe not Waco but a step in the right direction. Ever since I have been at AA I have been trying my hardest to move into jets but my TP hours seem to count for nothing as there are plenty of jet experience guys around already TR. I spoke to one cheif pilot of a airline and he said my hours would count for nothing "your hours are no better that having 1000hrs on a seneca, airlines will still make you pay for your type rating " was his words, Is this true ?? All I know is that I tried every day to get a jet job and my experience counted for nothing when applying. Thank god I got Monarch as I was starting to worry that this was it for me.

[fade to grey]

well done Viper,
That's the reality mate, regardless of what AA thinks.
Good luck with the move, you'll enjoy that.

[Ma. Bates]

..just stay put boys and girls!!!! The management went fishing in Iceland and caught a BlueBird ;-) !!!

[Icelanta]

Were does this rumour about West Atlantic buying Bluebird Cargo come from?!?
Has this been announced by your management?

[viperstings]

Well not long now till I hand in my notice (December) Things are starting to crank up a notch and the pressure is on for AA regarding crewing. Another FO handed in his notice this month, thats 4 confirm leavers and I will be doing the same in 6 weeks so that will be 5. I also know of another Capt waiting on a reply from a well know middle east airline in Dubi after his interveiw last month . I am working quite hard as we seem to be struggling to crew, but in typical fashion AA are still sitting on their arses thinking it will solve it's self :{ we said it would happen !!


If I were you Id leave it out!!! Hogg

[Beer_n_Tabs]

I will be doing the same in 6 weeks

http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQK1VkXNg_ZojWNxCbncWI-HNkcqxfW1L4yIqK_A2U5i7naq3WkXbQ30pNh8g

And people let you fly airplanes?

There is an old phrase (tweak it how you like)...

"Don't p*ss off the people you meet on your way up
Because you might need them again on your way down"


http://gtc.mm.st/bellend.jpg

[JennyB]

Why not hand in a long notice now rather than wait til the last moment if you have the job to go to?

People will sit on their arse not recruiting if they don't know for sure that people are going, the longer the notice the more time to recruit, the less pressure that you put on colleagues who are still there through undercrewing.

[variometer]

Firstly Viperstings I wish you all the best for the future. Hopefully the job with Monarch will work out well for you.

One of the main reasons we are busier at the moment seems to be because crew are taking their remaining holiday before the end of the year rather than loose it.

If you think there is a serious crewing problem at Atlantic, why don't you send an email to the chief pilot. He may not be aware that you have a definite job offer. Personally I've always found him very open and honest.

Good Luck, Luke.

[Livesinafield]

Personally I've always found him very open and honest.


:yuk::yuk::yuk::yuk::yuk::yuk: really...some people!!

[OneMileHigh]

:ok: Hahaaaaa....... I was just waiting for someone to make that sort of comment. :D

[HarrySpotter]

Any more news on the upgrades???

[Livesinafield]

yea 2 upgarded

[HarrySpotter]

I've been following this (and other) thread(s) for a while so...... Are Atlantic recruiting more / losing more pilots? :ok:

Vipersting: You don't seem very happy there..... have you handed in your notice yet? :ok:

[turbine100]

Any info when FO recruitment might be advertised or required?

[viperstings]

Happy New Guys!!!
AA took 3 direct entry pilots out of the holding pool in November/December together with one of our cadets which made 4 new FO's. I also hear of rumours that 1 of the FO's out of the pool had well under the hours that was stated on the website for DE FO's so again why work your arse off as a cadet as time after time very low hour DE pilots get took on.
Upgrades, Well we all had the email 2 out of the 4 will be upgraded and from the way I read it will it be the best 2??? I will leave that up to you all to discuss that on the flight deck.
Recruitment, Outlook don’t look good for AA they took on 4 FO's , Upgrading 2 and the other day I herd of another FO handing in their notice so do the maths yourselves seems they only benefited 1 FO out of all that so maybe there might be recruitment again but I know there is still a few in the holding pool waiting for the call.
If you want to fly the ATP then look at Air Ghana, new company they have got themselves some ATP's looking for pilots and the hours requirement is low and you get to fly all over AFRICA!!!! Better than working for AA.
Handing in my notice................................................. let you know in a few weeks

[Livesinafield]

So you think flying for air Ghana will be better than Atlantic? Flying the same old plane around some sh*thole corrupt country...

Wow

[Dynamic Apathy]

You're not a happy soul at Atlantic are you Viper!!!

[OneMileHigh]

I heard a rumour that Viperstings hasn't yet put his (or her) notice in. It's a bit late isn't it if you're starting at Monarch in Feb!!! :uhoh:

[OneMileHigh]

Well, thus far nobody has handed their notice in at Atlantic with a move to Monarch.

I think therefore it is safe to assume that Viperstings does not work at Atlantic, unless of course Viper did not get his covetted start with Monarch.

Why are you so bitter towards Atlantic then Viper?

[FreightDogMillionair]

Over the last twelve months it has become rather unclear upon which direction the business pursuing. As an ex-employee I believe it's about time that for your sanity that all the myths are dispelled.

Lets begin... The 'Mighty' Etcetera will be sadly replaced by 2 737-300's in June this year. The two rust-bags are on their journey from the sandpit as we speak. Which from what I've been told their mainteance is quite possibly worse than Atlantic's own. The 73's will be crewed by monkey, Ryanair rejects, so unlucky superior fleet pilots, the gayTP awaits at best.

[MD11Man]

Does anyone know if they're interested in a 737 type rated person, with just over 1600 hours on type?

[magicmick]

Hi MD11, have you considered Jet2? Their careers site is still advertising for 737 rated F/Os with 500hrs on type and at least 300 on type in the last 12 months, not sure if you meet the last bit of that but it's worth a punt.

[OneMileHigh]

FreightDogMillionair.....(E)

Are you Viperstings renamed....... Your grammar is equally as bad!!

[sonnyd]

Kindly pardon me for asking, but if annual pay cuts are in fashion at West Atlantic, why hasn't the establishment of a labor union come to pass?

[Rubberchicken]

It's a shame.... The same old vitriol comes full circle once again...
As ex AA employee and lucky enough to get a command on the Electra, you have to see AA for what it is. A great foot hold on the ladder, a great set of credentials for those able to move on to the next rung. Real hands on flying and pragmatic and an expeditious mind set which is recognised and acknowledged by many larger operators. The pay and conditions very rarely change as the company is reliant on a high turn over of pilots.... Service the bond and move on!
Sadly like everything in life it's subject to the wider economy and a downturn causes stagnation. It not personal just tough SH#T!
Every Airline I've worked for so far has had its big fleet vs small fleet friction and having dodged the dole queue/redundancy bullet on more than one occasion I wouldn't wish to see anyone out of a job just because they parachuted in from a perceived larger more senior type.
As for T's&C's, there will alway be a situations where two people flying the same type earn differing amounts in the same role. It's purely down the contract available to you at the time of joining.
Just remember..... It's all a numbers game. You take your deli counter number and pray to the Gods of the sky that your career ends before the airline does...:)

[EastMids]

ATSG - owners of ATI AND ABXAir - is acquiring a 25% equity stake in West Atlantic... and "... In addition, Atlantic Airlines Ltd. is currently adding the B767 to its operating capability..."

Air Transport Services Group, Inc. (http://www.atsginc.com/pr2013-12-09.html)

Does anyone sense the UPS European flying contract that is currently with Star Air but is up for renewal might have something to do with all of this...?

[Leofric]

Another B737, this time a 400 series, has been delivered to Atlantic Airlines this morning. It has recently been converted to freighter configuration in the States.