Drunk SAS F/O at Stockholm Arlanda

[mattias424]

Just saw this news report in media.
Apparently a F/O working for SAS was doing the preflight groundcheck
when the police took him in for a routine check. The F/O apparently was found intoxicated with alcohol levels exceeding 1.0! It's the first time this happens here in Sweden since the new law was implented. Sad day for aviation even though it could have been alot worse if they hadn't caught the drunk F/O.

Pilot på Arlanda fast för flygfylla | Nyheter | Aftonbladet (http://www.aftonbladet.se/nyheter/article14804310.ab)

[Hotel Tango]

I hate the term "drunk" being used in these cases. For me it implies a lot more than the reality. He was over the legal permitted limit for the job but I'd challenge "drunk". No excuse for his actions but drunk? No.

[LiveryMan]

I'm with Hotel Tango on this one.
I hate the word "drunk" being used to describe a case such as this one.

[313X]

Apparently SAS immediatly removed all free copies of Aftonbladet from the gates and didn't offered them onboard their flights as soon as they had learned about the article. Can't blame them, I guess :cool:

It's a tragedy of course, you can't be feeling well if you show up drunk to a job that requires 100 % focus and attention.

[captjns]

Same old story... different airline.

Solution to the problem... don't drink before flying. Another solution for the individual who can't do without his/her drink... purchaser a BAC tester at your local druggest and blow before heading off to work, take action accordinly.

[AdamFrisch]

Just read they suspended his licence for a year and there will be civil charges as well, probably.

[PukinDog]

The dude was drunk, I wouldn't trust him to fly a kite. There's no "tragedy" anywhere in this story. On the contrary, glad they busted him before he climbed into the cockpit.

[somethingclever]

Spoken like someone who doesn't know the background story.

It's true that pilots should be within limits at all times. It's also quite possible that the reason behind this incidence is indeed a tragedy.

As much as people like to think of us as a plugged-in accessory to the FMC, the fact is that we are human. The bean counters are struggling to forget that fact, so don't help them along.

Maybe he's a party guy who doesn't give a damn.
Or, maybe his wife just left him.

It is a good thing he is not flying, true. That's not the same as "no tragedy here".

Your cowboy posturing is shallow and unprofessional.

[seat 0A]

Oh, come on!
Whatever tragedy led him to the bottle, I'm sure the 100+ pax and colleagues couldn't care less. He should not have reported for duty. Period.
Another smoking hole in the ground avoided.

[Two's in]

purchaser a BAC tester at your local druggest and blow before heading off to work, take action accordinly.

If you're routinely using a BAC tester before flying duties, you have a problem that requires professional help.

[CargoOne]

seat0A

Another smoking hole in the ground avoided.

Obviously you can list at least a few dozens of smoking holes made by drunk pilots at transport category aircraft controls?

[A and C]

As usual the calls from some for hanging, beheading and such vengeance but without the full facts we can't be in a position to judge the guy.

While the newspapers love another drunk pilot story the truth behind the headline is usually one of human problems that lead a normaly rational guy to loose the plot and drink too much.

On the other hand the guy could have consumed the alcohol unintentionally, I could quote two cases in the UK that have stood up in court, the first orange juice with vodka in it was left in the guys refrigerator without his knowlage and he had a little as he was called out, in the other the guys drink was spiked in a hotel ( possibly by a disgruntled hotel employee) and then an anonymous phone call was made to the police.

I think that Pukindog and seat 0A might well have a rethink if the above misfortune was to happen to them.

Be clear I am no supporter of drinking and flying but I do think that the circumstances of cases like these should be examined calmly in a court of law and the appropriate action taken, NOT an Internet trial but the PPrune red necks followed by a hanging from the nearest tree.

[seat 0A]

Obviously you can list at least a few dozens of smoking holes made by drunk pilots at transport category aircraft controls?

Well, the vast, vast majority of all accidents happens with sober pilots at the controls, so let's all get drunk for our next flight, shall we?

As a profession we pilots make ourselves look utterly ridiculous if we keep on defending colleagues who show up drunk for work.
Would you be so forgiving if the surgeon who operates on your little daughter does this while being drunk? Perhaps his dog just died?

[PukinDog]

somethingclever

Spoken like someone who doesn't know the background story.

It's true that pilots should be within limits at all times. It's also quite possible that the reason behind this incidence is indeed a tragedy.

As much as people like to think of us as a plugged-in accessory to the FMC, the fact is that we are human. The bean counters are struggling to forget that fact, so don't help them along.

Maybe he's a party guy who doesn't give a damn. Or, maybe his wife just left him.

It is a good thing he is not flying, true. That's not the same as "no tragedy here".

Your cowboy posturing is shallow and unprofessional.


Caring about the background story ends when he decides to put on a uniform and exercise his CPL or ATPL at the controls with paying pax in back when he's not sober.

Like it or not, that CPL or ATPL says you're held to a higher standard, and quite frankly it's asinine to consider doing so as "cowboy posturing" or "unprofessional".

Go "be deep" with him in counseling if you'd like. My sympathy ends where the flight line begins, and every passenger on that aircarft have lives just as worthy.

Like Seat 0A points out, would you let your loved one or yourself go under the knife of a surgeon who shows up to work on you 3 or 4 times the legal alcohol limit of what his profession allows to the point he'd be arrested for drunk driving? The anesthesiologist? Are you going to care that he's sad because his dog died or his wife left him? Get a grip kiddo.

[Ramrise]

Of course we dont want our family being operated on by drunk surgeons.

But, what about fatigue? I can tell you that fatigued pilots are a much bigger problem than intoxicated pilots. I am not excusing the actions in question, but it seems to me that the public(news services) focuses on the wrong issues. I have yet to see alcohol being a contributing factor in an accident. Fatigue has already been mentioned as a contributing factor in accidents.

I am glad this pilot got stopped, but I am worried about the tired pilot on the flight deck. And that is an everyday occurence.

[Burpbot]

I am betting its not uncommon for surgeons to work after a big night out, Im betting in excess of the limits imposed on aircrew! Why is the limit lower for engineers or ATC than it is for pilots? Surely it should be a limit for all personel? Right or wrong, I dont think I have ever heard of an accident caused by drunk crew. The closest I can remember was an american who had a coke problem that killed the singer alia.

[Bank_Left]

I would not like to have my daughter being operated on by a drunk surgeon. Therefore it is good that the F/O was caught before he got to fly. He should not have reported for duty. I also think the suspension is appropriate. There may have been a tragedy in the pilot's life and a year off might give him time to sort this. Maybe he is an alcoholic, which is a vicious disease, and a year off might be exactly what he needs to get treated and back on track. So, after a year, and when he is sober and sorted, I might absolutely want to fly with him. I also would be okay to have my daughter operated on by a surgeon, who, after a year's trouble, has come back on track. Life sometimes comes in the way of flying and while it is so, one needs to be grounded. But after that, I see no reason why one should not fly again.

[skadi]

It's unfair to use the term drunk unless the facts indicate he was really drunk.

His alcohol level was over 1 per mille, so definitely drunk!

[somethingclever]

Caring about the background story ends when he decides to put on a uniform and exercise his CPL or ATPL at the controls with paying pax in back when he's not sober.

Like it or not, that CPL or ATPL says you're held to a higher standard, and quite frankly it's asinine to consider doing so as "cowboy posturing" or "unprofessional".

Go "be deep" with him in counseling if you'd like. My sympathy ends where the flight line begins, and every passenger on that aircarft have lives just as worthy.

Like Seat 0A points out, would you let your loved one or yourself go under the knife of a surgeon who shows up to work on you 3 or 4 times the legal alcohol limit of what his profession allows to the point he'd be arrested for drunk driving? The anesthesiologist? Are you going to care that he's sad because his dog died or his wife left him? Get a grip kiddo.

Captain Empathy who just did a shot of testosterone through his left eyeball declares "mission accomplished".

I think, given the choice between a drunk SAS first officer and you for my right seat, that the choice would be less obvious than one would have thought.

[HeadingSouth]

Now thats something rather unclever. I know who i d prefer next to me in the pointy end...

[Shane C]

I'm sorry but for the life of me, I can't comprehend as to why an airline pilot who has worked so very hard to get to his position and but himself in major debt would throw it all away...because of alcohol.

What an idiot.

[Ramrise]

Shane C,

One could accuse you of being the same.

Alcoholism(if that is what is at play here) and/or stupidity do not know any boundaries. They "strike" with impunity and do not discriminate. And usually the person in trouble finds it impossible to see his/her way out of the quagmire. In othe words, they cannot fix it themselves.

I hope it never happens to you,

[Shane C]

Ramrise - Yeah very true, that particular pilot who ever he was, may indeed be an alcoholic...but flying isn't an avarage type of job. In this job, making mistakes and being intoxicated if he was, could end up killing himself and passenger's :(

He should of seeked help but, I don't know the reasons behind it of course. Just speculating :)

To me though, he has lost his job etc and he worked so hard to get there too. Real shame :(

[captjns]

It's nice to know the number of responsible, regulation abiding pilots out weight eh number of those who just can't seem to get it right.

[radar707]

Why is the limit lower for engineers or ATC than it is for pilots?
It isn't lower for ATC it's exactly the same

[Capt. G L Walker]

It is part of our professional remit to identify problems that will endanger an operation.

Pressure and stress can be insidious, difficult to recognise and hard to accept. As more young lowtimers become involved we must expect a proportionate percentage to get it wrong. I am pressing for a study that compares the possible increase in this kind of behaviour with the reduction in terms and higher workload that has crept into the cockpit in recent years.

Customers expect pilots to act impeccably and they should expect the same from airline management. The days of expecting a business to follow rules in the spirit in which they were intended are over. "Safety is our main priority" might be printed on the card but the motivational posters were taken down in the office a while ago.

I believe the CAA must be firmer with airlines, especially in the current economic environment and the EASA proposals on FTL are an example of this. I have been sending the link in the T&E forum around my email contacts for a while now and I urge more people to do the same.

[seat 0A]

Excellent post, mr Walker.
Perhaps you should make a new thread about this?:ok:

[SFI145]

To quote Pukin Dog
'Like Seat 0A points out, would you let your loved one or yourself go under the knife of a surgeon who shows up to work on you 3 or 4 times the legal alcohol limit of what his profession allows to the point he'd be arrested for drunk driving? The anesthesiologist? Are you going to care that he's sad because his dog died or his wife left him? Get a grip kiddo.

In fact in the USA 195,000 people every year are killed by medical error. Far more than those killed by drunk pilots. The person most likely to kill you in the USA is a doctor.
Pilots are monitored to the extreme - who is monitoring the doctors and how far advanced is medical CRM compared to aviation CRM? I suspect not very far.

[Mac the Knife]

Yup, in 2010 - 32,885 deaths in USA from car accidents, 14,748 murders and 195,000 killed by doctors!

We're doing well! :ok:

[Dusthog]

EASA wants to approve 16 hours of duty time. That equals a couple of pints of beer. So what's the big deal.