Berlin new airport BER opening delayed?

[Less Hair]

The new Berlin airport BER might not open June 3rd due to fire protection certification issues. The terminal seems not to be completed enough to be formally certified yet. Delay looks like at least to august or september.

No official statement yet. Press conference this afternoon.

Verzögerung bei Eröffnung des neuen Berliner Flughafens? - FLUG REVUE (http://www.flugrevue.de/de/zivilluftfahrt/airports/verzoegerung-bei-eroeffnung-des-neuen-berliner-flughafens.93479.htm)

[dwlpl]

The airport is to have an open day (this weekend?) to test all the systems.

[davidjohnson6]

Wonder if we'll see some of the routes that were due to be launched from the Berlin area actually starting at Schonefeld instead ? Perhaps Lufthansa could open a lounge at Schonefeld as well ? :E

[flugholm]

It's official now. "Der Spiegel" reports that "a new opening date shall be approached after the Summer break." Flughafen Berlin Brandenburg (BER): Eröffnung im Juni verschoben - SPIEGEL ONLINE (http://www.spiegel.de/reise/aktuell/flughafen-berlin-brandenburg-ber-eroeffnung-im-juni-verschoben-a-831989.html)

[Suzeman]

Oh er Missus :ooh:

My Google translation of the Der Spiegel article includes the following...

"That was more than a nasty surprise," said Brandenburg Minister President Matthias Platzeck (SPD). "I do not deny that I'm pissed, so a surprise may just not happen before."

And I'm sure he is! :O

Does anyone know how much time in the programme was set aside for testing and commissioning the system? Not leaving long enough for this element is often an issue that comes back to haunt the opening of new terminals...eg T5 and baggage..

Suzeman

[Tableview]

I would have expected the Germans to do better than this!

[Less Hair]

Second half of august is the new opening target timeframe Ministerpräsident Platzeck said. So just ahead of ILA. The networking of the smoke evacuation system's sections would not work properly yet so it couldn't get certified in time.

However hickups with airport openings are not entirely unheard of aren't they? T5 anybody or Denver back then?

[MaxRange120]

I would have expected the Germans to do better than this!

Try asking the bmi employee's that have lost a pension :ugh::ugh:

BA deal can't stop BMI pension scheme being shifted into protection fund | Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/money/pensions/article-2132654/BA-deal-stop-BMI-pension-scheme-shifted-protection-fund.html)

[Denti]

I would have expected the Germans to do better than this!
Me too, and i'm one. However berlin is very special. Just to give an idea about the timeframes: the airport was planned in 1992, should have opened around 2000 and is now nearly finished and already below the needed capacity.

Berlin Tegel already cannot cope with traffic as it is as quite a bit of handling machinery has been transported to the new airport already. Waiting 40 minutes for a push back truck is now normal during peak hours, as well as blocking the airport for 20 to 30 minutes because no marshaller is available to lead one into parking positions, not to mention someone to connect the stairs or drive the passenger busses.

Lufthansa planned to increase their route network by over 50% with the opening of the new airport in june and supposedly can do that from tegel. There is no chance in hell that tegel can cope with that amount of additional traffic. All airlines flying from and to berlin have a new flight schedule from june on for the new airport, most increased their capacity, those flights of course are already sold. That will bring in a lot of law suits as those flights cannot be operated.

[Charlie Roy]

I would have expected the Germans to do better than this!

Indeed I am in shock :oh:

[davidjohnson6]

Wonder what the Sun or the Daily Mail will have to say about this tomorrow morning...

[Less Hair]

Krauts miss their vloghaffn opening date.
Los Los now!

[lederhosen]

Sadly this kind of thing is not that unusual in Germany. Anyone remember the fiasco with the road toll system? There will however be people rubbing their hands with glee, particularly those paid to fix the problem. It is going to be an interesting (and expensive) summer in Berlin. Expect project management standard behavior: punish the innocent, reward the non participants!

[Mr Mac]

Have worked in Germany and indeed in Berlin and these issues are not uncommon on large capital project as has been said eg Rhine - Danube link canal ran years late, however at least it was done unlike LHR 3rd runway !:rolleyes:.
Have to say that canceling this late is unusual and I would have thought that these inspections from my knowledge would have been on a rolling program so you would have known somthing was wrong earlier than this late date. Will make enquiries with our German suppliers and competitors to try and find out more as some where on this project :hmm:.

[Mr Angry from Purley]

Anyone wanna bet the opening will coincide with the Berlin Air Show now:\

[terrain safe]

Now if there was an airport near the centre that aircraft could taxy on and off stand..............:E:E

[davidjohnson6]

Mr Angry - certainly a possibility. On the one hand it means extra publicity with all the assembled industry bigwigs in town. On the other hand whenever a major new airport opens it gets plenty of publicity anyway - so would coinciding be a major gain ?

Furthermore if BER management want to coincide they need to be *very* sure that everything will work correctly.
If it coincides and goes wrong it's a major piece of bad publicity with everyone watching and a lot less slack in the system to fix foul ups.

Perhaps better to go for a slightly quieter launch and present it as a model of solid German efficiency (the 'made in Germany' brand) while doing their best to fix inevitable teething problems ?

[jabird]

This is a shame - I thought BER was going to be the one new airport facility which was open in time for the Olympics!

[Less Hair]

It's not that bad. There is still RAF Gatow entirely unused.

[nonemmet]

Except for the housing estate on the western half of the runway of course.

[Less Hair]

So it might even help to revitalize the good ol' Avro. Think Docklands.

[lederhosen]

The truth is that most of the airport infrastructure e.g. runways and aprons is all there at SXF. The terminal on the north side is I doubt at full capacity. Quite a lot of equipment is also already there (pushback trucks was mentioned somewhere). For some airlines I wonder if it would not be easier to keep at least some of the flights operating to SXF as originally planned. TXL is going to be a nightmare if the additional flights (LH and others) all try and squeeze in.

[ArtfulDodger]

Seems like the fightings started on this one.....


Story here....... Lufthansa wants payment for Berlin airport delay: Reuters « The Airport Informer (http://wp.me/p2jrV4-yX)

[Charlie Roy]

New date is August 5th

[davidjohnson6]

Charlie - is 5th August a confirmed opening date or just a 'will open no earlier than' date ?

[Charlie Roy]

I base myself on Ryanair's communication: 3 Jun - 4 Aug: Brandenburg Berlin Airport The operators of? (http://www.ryanair.com/ie/notices/gops/120511-Brandenburg_Berlin_-GB)

[Less Hair]

Latest rumours: Opening not before 2013. More said to become available later today.

[Airbus_a321]

now rumours that opening will be delayed until 2013.

welcome to berlin :ugh:

obviously this airport-management consists of nothing but a bunch of incompetent idiots

[Manchester Kurt]

After some advice on this.

Flying Manc to Schoenfeld in late July.

EasyJet flight due to land at 10:25.

Need to get to Berlin Hbf by midday to get train.

How quick is it to get out of the airport and how good is the public transport to Berlin Hbf?

[Surreyman]

The station is about a 5 - 8 min walk from the terminal, Trains to Berlin Hauptbahnhof take @30-40 minutes from memory.
Most of the trains are regional trains travelling via the airport station into Berlin.
My info is based on a visit 4 years ago, so has probably changed(and improved)
with the new airport development, will almost certainly be a web site you can access.

[Less Hair]

Should be the same today. But don't waste your time.
Try to hop on the red "Regionalexpress" double decker trains if one should be available. Same price but faster.

[jdcg]

The Deustche Bahn website is great for schedules. DB Bahn: bahn.de - Ihr Mobilittsportal fr Reisen, Bahn, Urlaub, Hotels, Stdtereisen und Mietwagen (http://www.bahn.de) (Am I allowed to suggest this, mods??) . From memory the S9 from the the Flughafen Schoenefeld stop takes about 40 minutes to get to the HbF and goes regularly.

[jabird]

Need to get to Berlin Hbf by midday to get train.

Berlin Hbf is a station like no other - an engineering marvel with a vast shopping complex sandwiched between the upper deck and the lower platforms.

For a geek like me Berlin will now have two world class gateways - the new airport and the existing station.

Anyway, you just want transport, so here's two points:

1) Berlin Hbf is at the centre of the transport network, and routes from there follow a simple cross - N & S, E&W. However, you may be able to chance somewhere else if your train stops there - check stopping patterns on D-bahn.

2) Naturally, I'd like to say allow time to appreciate the marvel that the station is, but if you want to pass through quickly and have heavy luggage, allow time to get between platforms, especially between top and bottom decks. Lifts can get very crowded at busy times.

And finally, as D-bahn website has been mentioned, that is a great tool for rail travel across most of Europe, not just Germany. :ok:

[Manchester Kurt]

Thanks for the info everyone, much appreciated.

Went through the Hbf a few years ago having arrived there by train from Amsterdam and it is indeed a fine building.

I will take the advice and get either the RegionalExpress double decker or the S9 - whichever comes in first.

I am praying for no huge queues at passport control or where ever that will cause me to miss my train that I will have specific tickets for.

Also, just hand luggage so should be able to leg it through the station if necessary.

One last thing, is there a supermarket or place that sells food and drinks in the Hbf?

I do not remember and as I have a long train journey ahead I was hoping to grab a bit of food and drink in the station to have on the train (cheaper than buying from the on board restaurant coach).

[jabird]

One last thing, is there a supermarket or place that sells food and drinks in the Hbf?

Depends on your definition of supermarket. Small store selling bottled drinks and snacks - yes, Tesco metro - pushing it.

I do not remember and as I have a long train journey ahead I was hoping to grab a bit of food and drink in the station to have on the train (cheaper than buying from the on board restaurant coach).

I'm curious now, where are you off to? East? I've done BER-POZ by train, then up north to catch a ferry to Denmark. Just happened there was an event on in Berlin in the week and a friend to meet in Poznan who was home that weekend, but the train journeys are all part of the fun!

[Manchester Kurt]

Freiburg, southern Germany.

Wanted EasyJet to be flying Manc to Basel, but doesn't start until the autumn so flying Manc to Berlin, then ICE down to Freiburg.

Reasonable price and I really quite enjoy a few hours on a high quality German train wizzing through the countryside at top speed.

[jabird]

Best I can find for a shops list is here:

» Hauptbahnhof - Berlin Guide in English (http://berlin.barwick.de/sights/famous-places/hauptbahnhof.html)

Couldn't see an obvious link on the DB "bahnhof" website but those long German words are never easy to break down without some serious study!

You'd have thought they'd have something more prominent, the Germans are probably second only to the Swiss for turning their stations into mega malls.

If there is one problem with the Hbf, it is that it was built in a relatively remote location, so you can't just nip outside and find a grocery store. Germany bakeries are usually pretty good places for snacks.

[Manchester Kurt]

Thanks for that, pretty sure Kaisers is a supermarket. Reckon that they will sell me what I will be after.

[jdcg]

17th March 2013 - oops! The Bavarians in Munich will be relishing the full schadenfreude of this moment...

[davidjohnson6]

Has any comment been made about licencing of Tegel beyond 31 Dec 2012 ?

[iggie]

Manchester Kurt

Do not take the S9 train as it no longer goes through central Berlin. It goes north east to Blankenburg and will take you out of your way. Stick to the 'Airport Express' regional train which will take you direct to Hauptbahnhof.

[davidjohnson6]

Brandenburg's head of operations has left the company. Contract with a company for planning has been terminated

[flugholm]

Berlin --- Wir können alles. Nur nix richtig.

(Roughly: We can do everything. But we can't do anything right.)

[el_visigodo]

Flying Manc to Schoenfeld in late July.

EasyJet flight due to land at 10:25.

Need to get to Berlin Hbf by midday to get train.

How quick is it to get out of the airport and how good is the public transport to Berlin Hbf? DB BAHN - TravelService - Query page (http://reiseauskunft.bahn.de/bin/query.exe/el?)

(http://reiseauskunft.bahn.de/bin/query2.exe/el?ld=9648&seqnr=1&ident=60.01936248.1337541264&rt=1&)

[jabird]

17th March 2013 - oops! The Bavarians in Munich will be relishing the full schadenfreude of this moment...

Not that much after last night, and certainly not in the English Garden ;)

Sorry, couldn't resist.

Did you say 17th March next year?

I know the dome on the Reichstag is our design (Foster & co), but have we got anything to do with this project?

[davidjohnson6]

Looks like 17th March 2013 may not be possible as an opening date
New Berlin airport likely to be delayed again - sources | Reuters (http://uk.reuters.com/article/2012/08/14/uk-germany-berlin-airport-idUKBRE87D0RV20120814)

[davidjohnson6]

Late October 2013 now seems to be the likely date.
Media Report Says Berlin Airport to Open in October 2013 - SPIEGEL ONLINE (http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/media-report-says-berlin-airport-to-open-in-october-2013-a-853804.html)
I wonder how many more flights can be squeezed into Tegel until then....

[jabird]

Late October 2013 now seems to be the likely date.

Oh dear, has someone put that wall back up and then stopped them from bringing in enough Polish builders to finish it?

[Denti]

Even the october date won't be the last one. Expect at least 2014 as opening year.

[Mr @ Spotty M]

Just an observation, is Boeing building this airport? :E

[jabird]

Expect at least 2014 as opening year.

So which will open first, the new BER or Stuttgart Hbf?

[pee]

Oh dear, has someone put that wall back up and then stopped them from bringing in enough Polish builders to finish it?
Schönefeld used to be on the Eastern side of the wall. But generally, it's not just about finishing, the airports is almost ready. It's all about the project's unnecessary complexity and obvious design errors, read more in Spiegel Online International (http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/documents-reveal-extent-of-problems-at-new-berlin-airport-a-847434.html).