Walter mitty Fto's and Aoc's

[fluffy5]

Well we have preyed upon the Walter Mitty thread, but what about the good old companies in the uk and internationally that have bent the truth. The howlers that I have had the misfortune of working for in the uk. Such as selling an aircraft that does not belong to you.......complete and absolute lies of training experience.............corporate reach around........aircraft mismanagement and knowingly passing on the aircraft............complete falsification of maintenance
Records................complete falsification of Aoc's flights with weights / fuel and cat a procedures.
In fact I could reel off a host of uk companies that have all done one of these and many of them.
So why are we preying on a guy that has not even joined the the frey yet ( Walter Mitty thread ). He may not have his wings, or a Cpl to entitle him to wear his bars, but the **** that flies around in the civilian companies in what they get up to, is nothing in comparison to a guy wanting to get along.

Fluffy

[itwasme]

A mate of Siam Kidd are you? Think it's OK to live a lie just to "get along"? What's next for someone like him? Where does he draw the line? Sharp-penciling his log book to speed progression up the ladder? Falsification of official documents? Failing to report a torque exceedance or overspeed perhaps?

A degree of integrity is needed in this business. Just because you may have come across some unscrupulous individuals in life doesn't mean that it's a good idea to follow their example.

[fluffy5]

No it is not right to falsify anything at all, like normal pilots that get along and follow regulations and laws. But if I had a penny with the many names of certain pilots that have put in Parker pen hours to get there job, charter pilots that have falsified their experience....... These certain civilian people have been flying in and still are in the police and ambulance units and very prevalent london Aoc's companies, but hey they have got away with it for many a year now and are no doubt competent in what they are doing now, but when they first snagged a job on falsification and hours to begin with, does that make it right.
To brand a guy that has obviously been caught out, he will know doubt hopefully learn from it. If he does not then quite simply he will enveloped by the civilian industry and the join the rest of the Walter mittys that float around the training and corporate sector of the uk.

Fluffy

[itwasme]

Yep, caught out for sure. Then he came on here and took us for fools and was quickly found to be b*llsh*tting.

If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck and quacks like a duck...

[fluffy5]

I suppose that it took me many hard years, the loss of my house, divorce and complete devotion to the helicopter industry, and for many years she was a cruel mistress and along the way I saw and dealt with the Walter mittys that passed me by and got the job. Myself now I fly internationally for many years and now content. Maybe I feel quite bitter about guys that have told half truths to get employment and that at that time I could have been considered for.
The time I spent in the Uk working for some of the most advertised compnanies and having to put up with the lies, the general managers / chairmans / sales lies and the only purpose of it was to maintain their buisiness, and to screw your licence if it went tits up.
So this Guy Siam, is only trying to get a foot on the ladder. I used to have a website trying to get work for training,( I was qualified ), but the fact remains that the guy is motivated, has the energy to succeed and hopefully will use this in accordance to good business ethics and following the authority's regulations, if he does not then we know what may happen, over confidence / fantasist of his abilities in a helicopter........ What could possibly go wrong.

Anyway want to hear about a Chief pilot who try to do a demo flight in an aircraft that he was not even typed on, and had to ask over the radio what the light means that came on the console.... A well known TRTO in the UK.

Fluffy

[itwasme]

...it probably is a (fluffy) duck!

[fluffy5]

Thats right, all I was pointing out was .......Quack ! Quack !
As I was saying that any reasonable person would have to go along with .......Quack ! Quack !

Fluffy

[Savoia]

Fluffy: While I admire your willingness to stand-up for the errant wannabe-newbie I have an aversion, especially in aviation, to reducing standards to the lowest common denominator.

What one should be looking at are examples of standards worthy of commendation.

[Camp Freddie]

Disregarding Siam for now, I have to agree with fluffy that there is a lot of nonsense goes on in the UK, particularly "private flights" that are clearly charter being one of the biggest, often flown by PPL's who sometimes wear 4 bars for added effect.

Everyone knows its happening but it doesn't seem to get any better, as I understand the CAA's position you have to provide them with proof rather than allegations as they don't have the capacity or willingness to investigate.

A CAA guy once told me about a "charter" he witnessed about to depart battersea, as the pilot with 4 bars was helping the pax get on board, he thought he should ask him a few questions, it turned out he was not only a PPL but had an expired LPC, this type of thing goes on all the time unfortunately

[fluffy5]

Yep, I will have to agree. Maybe I look for to much negativity in the business.
Standards must be up held and the industry looked upon in a positive light.
Unfortunately as camp Freddie has pointed out, we have all come across guys doing the dodgy stuff, or even quite amusing to watch. For example you get the new PPL holder walk back into his flying school with a white shirt and four bars on, with his business cards and ATM cards now changed to Capt .....
Hopefully this is as far as it goes, there is more of a problem with private owners and their mates doing under the radar stuff. Such as Cheltnam / Silverstone where the guy drops off his mates ? And then an hour later drops of more of his mates ? Maybe it is just the nature of the beast in the general aviation world.

Myself on one occasion have reported an operator many years ago, for flying trial lessons. The guys end part of the lesson was to pull a 45 degree angle of bank turn, 40-60 kts,10 ft of the ground, right in front of the observation area by about 20 ft. The only thing separating the aircraft and the families with small children was a white rope, how the punters clapped, ducked and laughed. It enraged me so much the complete lack of safety, especially with young children standing there. I was on the phone that day to the Caa, talking to Fred about it, unfortunately they were not aware of the situation, and said they would go up there and have a word. Transpires that it was an old ppl instructor, who liked wearing his captains bars.....

I personally found that instead of using your business cards to pick up young ladies in nightclubs,saying that you are a dolphin trainer works the best.

Oh my ! I have just realized that I myself am a Walter Mitty in the dolphin trainer world.....

Fluffy

[Epiphany]

We all know it goes on Fluffy. Unfortunately there are many ostriches who would rather only see the positive side of the industry so these practices continue. The whistleblower is usually vilified - often by those who used these practices to get where they are.

[nigelh]

haven't you got any friends then ? sometimes I will drop off dozens of my closest mates into Silverstone ....all it proves is that I am an exceedingly generous fellow :D. I don't however commit the cardinal sin of wearing a white shirt with gold on my shoulders .....nor do I wear wings as I'm not completely qualified yet ......

[Epiphany]

Se what I mean Fluffy?