North American Institute of Aviation

[Sprawler]

Guys, I'm posting this here (hope you don't mind) because I know a lot of Scandinavian Pilots have done and are currently doing their training with NAIA in South Carolina.

Just looking for some views/comments from any of you that did your training with them. What was your overall impression of the place; e.g. instructors, aircraft, accommodation. I'm hoping to head out for a visit next month.

After much deliberation, I have decide to go the FAA route. I'm fortunate enough to be in a position where I have the right to live and work in America (Green Card), so I'm going to give it a shot for a few years. I reckon I'll head Stateside to do my training. Then maybe spend 9-12 months instructing during which time I might study for my JAR ATPL's. Then, hopefully after a year I would have enough experience to get a job with a regional. Then, maybe in few years, head back to Europe if I want.

Anyway, feel free to email me with any comments about NAIA if you don't want to post here.

Regards,
Sprawler

[ 11 July 2001: Message edited by: Sprawler ]

[KADS]

Haven't been there my self but know many who have and they all hold great positions today and were happy with their training. But remember that things change quickly over there and after a sudden management change, a school, although the name is the same, could be of a different quality. Best bet is to head over for a personal look and compare it to some other schools you might be interested in. (you're investing quite some money)
On your decision to go to the states I say that is the best of your choices considering you have the right to work there. You will probably find yourself wanting to stay there for the rest of your life and find that finding work there is much easier, and flying much more fascilitating.

Best o' luck!!

[AK-SF]

I went to NAIA New Mexico campus in 1989-90.
I think they closed it and kept running the one in South Carolina. Whenn I was there the training was quite good. Lots of sunny days to get your training in. Some parts of it could have been better but in general it was OK. Some of my friends been in the South Carolina campus and are currently workin here in USA and some in Skandinavia. One thing you are going to run in to is that they are not offering a 4 year degree with it. Thats something you might want to consider. Some schools do.(Emry_riddle, Spartan, Univercity of North Dakota) just to name a few. Good luck I know you are going to enjoy it.

[polar bear]

Hi there!

I am a former student, and now an instructor at NAIA. If you are thinking about starting at the school, then go for it. I'm not saying this to spread propaganda or recruit new students, but as a piece of advice.

Well then, what makes this school better or more attractive than the others? First of all, in my opinion the price/quality ratio is very good at NAIA. If you compare the prices at other schools for the same training as you get at NAIA, you will most probably end up with a cheaper price if you choose NAIA.

The training quality in my opinion is good, and the aircraft are well maintained, i.e. safe to fly. A fact however is, that the planes are not of the latest vintage, equipped with the latest "goodies", like IFR-GPS, autopilots etc. So, the cheaper price tag is visible at this point.

The training can be done Part141 or 61. I would recommend 141, but the pace does not suit everyone. A new "thing" at the school is a an option to receive the flight training required by the JAR-regulations, making it easier for the European students wanting to get a JAA-certificate as they return home to Europe. Note however, that the training DOES NOT lead to a JAA-certificate. As far as I have understood, you will still have to do some additional training in Europe. I am not involved in the "JAR-program", so my knowledge about it is not very thorough. If you are interested in it, please call the school for more details.

All in all the school is a very good one, and the owner and management changed some time ago. The change was in my opinion to the better, and it seems that investments and improvements are slowly being introduced. But as with all flight schools, there are down sides. The worst things about NAIA are in my opinion, the delays that sometimes occur during the training. These are due to various reasons, sometimes within and sometimes beyond control of the school. Stage checks, scheduling check-rides, and bad weather are sometimes (at least for me they were) causing delays, which are sometimes hard to understand and very frustrating.

Another good thing to remember is that the price of the program is assuming minimum hours (same in all the schools), which is not always the case. Some times exceeding the minimum required hours is due to bad luck, but most of the time it is due to the student skills or motivation. Some students come with the attitude that they do not have to study, just fly. This will not work, and it will usually be seen as higher training costs. So, a dose of self-dicipline is needed. No worries, there is still plenty of time for "normal life".

The weather in South Carolina, is most of the time good for flying, but can sometimes be troublesome. The thunderstorms in the the summer do often lead to cancelled flights, slowing down the training.

best regards,
polar bear

[Sprawler]

Guys, many thanks for all your comments and help. I'm heading over in August on holidays and I'm going to try and pay a visit to NAIA while there.

Just a quick question for Polar Bear. Do NAIA take on many of their students as instructors afterwards?

Again many thanks for you help guys and thanks for letting me post here in English
;)

[vmommo]

Check out Kansas State University in Salina, Kansas at www.sal.ksu.edu. (http://www.sal.ksu.edu.) Nice school, good instructors and a reasonable place to live. They offer a 4 year degree as well.

[aviator]

I trained at NAIA some years ago and was pleased with the training I received.

Their website is http://www.naiasc.com/
and a look at the list of former students will give you an idea how people have progressed after graduating. A number of my classmates are flying for US and European airlines now.

[piapus]

If you are planning to convert to JAA licences after training at NAIA, i would have considerd the following:

The theoretical knowlegde req. for the JAA exams are tough. If the plan is to stydy this part-time whilst instructing in the US, I would have reconsiderd. It is not a spare time activity....

Good luck! :)

[hdaae]

I took my CFI CFII and MEI at Comair Aviation Academy and were very happy with that school. I also got a job there as a instructor afterwards. Some ppl got jobs as CFI's afterwards, and some didnt. But if you put a decent effort into your training and show a good attitude, you will get a job, be it with NAIA or Comair. I dont think its any different at any 141 school. The level of expertise amongst CFI's in USA is pretty uniform. After my J1 visa expired at Comair I got a visa with Sierra Academy of Aeronautics, which is were Im currently working. Again, requirements to get a job as a CFI were pretty similar to what they demanded at Comair. Some of my collegues at Sierra got their ratings at NAIA, and they have good knowledge and flying skills. I would say they are at my level of expertise, no higher, no lower.

My only comment about NAIA is the lack of really busy airspace. At Sanford (Comair) we have Orlando Class B overlying the training airport. At Sierra we have San Fransisco class B, and Class C airspace left and right.
This wont be a big problem as such, since, as I said, the instructors I work with that have background from NAIA are VERY competent.
And since you have a greencard, I would say you have it made. The demand for pilots are quite high here in the US, and if I had a greencard, I know I would have been able to get into LearJets within a month or two.

Bottom line. 141 schools are fairly uniform, and both Comair and NAIA are good.
You wont have much problem getting a job if you have a good work moral.

[AK-SF]

I must emphasize again the importance in the future and now. Airlines like to see a 2-4 year degree. I must say from experience that without it you will probably end up flying for some second class freight/passenger company where money/work environment is nothing to brag about. If I have to do it all over again, which I probably would not, I would go to some university that offers a degree with flying licenses followed by some FO-Program with one of the commuters.
But if you think you are one of the lucky ones that will get hired without a degree, Good luck !?
It is hard to go back to school later in your career. Believe me I know!

[LimaNovember]

Sprawler,

You are about to make a very important decision. Take a deep breath and think it over again. It could well be that NAIA is good. But how do you define good? What I`m trying to say is; you have to look further than your nose, and AK-SF is probably right, check out a college/university where you can combine your flying with a degree. You should also familiarize yourself with the process of getting a JAA FCL from a FAA licence. Not easy!!!

[hdaae]

I agree with the two last posts. CFI ratings takes you to the regionals here in USA. Beyond that a degree is usually required.

Of course, you can work as a CFI while working on your degree. I have several friends that are doing it that way, and they are doing quite fine. BUT, as you can imagine, its hard work with little time off since you often work 6-7 days a week as a CFI. Top that of with a degree part time, and your looking at 100% aviation, 0% free time.

[Sprawler]

Guys, many thanks for all your responses and comments.

Still trying to decide what route to go down, FAA or JAA. I already have a University Degree and I am currently working in the Financial Services sector. To be honest the FAA/NAIA/JAA route is just one of many ideas that I have had. The idea being to do my training Stateside and hopefully study for the JAR ATPL exams while instructing. Then after about 18-24 months I would probably be in a better position to decide whether or not I wanted to stay in America or return to Europe.

To be honest, having done a little more research it may be more feasible to do my JAR licence here in Europe first. If I then decided to go the America, the conversion from JAA to FAA would seem easier than from FAA to JAA. Also, the costs probably work out roughly the same in the long run.

Again, many thanks to you all.

Best of luck with your own careers

[hdaae]

The volume of jobs are MUCH greater in USA, and the amount of hours you can rack up per month is quite impressive.

Currently Im in contact with different schools in Europa to figure out the best way to convert my FAA lisense to JAA. In a month or two I will order the ATPL theory books and start preparing for it. Since I got a visa for another 14 months, I got loads of time to build time, get my FAA ATP and hone my skills and knowledge.

Back when I started as a pre private student in Norway I and a friend decided to go to USA together and do our ratings. In the last second he decided to stay in Europa and I left for USA. Now I got all my ratings over here, a decent amount of hours and got my second job as a CFI without any trouble, both jobs with major 141 schools.
My friend back in Europa still are working on his ratings, have low total time and the volume of flying jobs for low timers arent that many. And IF you dont get a job right away, the loan ppl usually get to do their ratings will hurt alot.
I do to have a loan, but with no problems to get myself jobs, Im not concerned at all.

BUT...with the new JAA rules, things might have changed in Europa. To be honest, I havent paid too much attention too the cost and workpossibilities in Europa.
But, the FAA route have worked out nicely for me so far.

[ 08 August 2001: Message edited by: SkyBug ]

[JJflyer]

Tell you what...

Hard road how ever you decide to go. Lets put it this way. I got quite familiar with San Pablo Bay and Mt.Diablo areas :D

FAA licence offers you opportunities that are quite different from those available in Europe. If anything you will get to fly and get paid for it much faster than going the JAA way.

I have some friends in Spain that obtained their JAA CPL and 'Frozen' ATPL's. Additionally they have instructor ratings.
These fellows are flying approximately 25 hours a month. So it will take quite a long time to get to the magical 1500 hours.
So when you look at the amount of flying, clearly US is better choise.

Now lets have a look at the situation when you go back. Whooa... Will you be surprised.
First you will face the attitude that your FAA licence is not worth more than the paper you use in toilet to wipe you a*s.
Second you'll find that you have to sit in most of the ground schools again. Now this is not all bad as JAA groud schools ae quite comprehensive and can teach you a lot about transport category aircraft systems. Problem is that it takes you a while to complete all the required training.
Meanwhile you are not earning anything. So you rack up quite a bill. Lucky you if your parents have the moolah to support you otherwise you bank will sleeping with you for a looooong time, especially as the training is not cheap. And fligh-training in a single is about as expensive as Sierra BE76 without an instructor ( Thats a lot )

:mad:

Presume that you have all your wonderful JAA ratings. Now what. There is no guarantee of a job. I have found that out the hard way. Many of the airlines prefer to hire pilots directly to their AbInitio programs with 0 hours flight-time. Many of those companise that do hire pilots with experience want to see 500 hours in the type they operate. That is they are looking for experienced pilots.

You can always return to US and keep instructing while you send your CV's around and see if something comes up. If nothing else, you'll be current and flying.

If flying is what you want to do for your living. Go for it. What I have heard NAIA is a pretty good place. A busy airspace can be an advantage but it can also slow your progress and increase you costs as you spend more time waiting in the Eastern run-up area of a busy airport instead of practising your manouvres. I know many guys that gratuated from NAIA and now fly for major airlines. With certain companies NAIA has a pretty good name. When I was selecting a school to obtain my FAA ratings NAIA was highly recommended. Unfortunately they didn't have a course available when I wanted to start.

Hope this helps :p