Off Shoring Of Work.

[airsupport]

This applies to many jobs including Pilots and Flight Attendants, but primarily Engineering jobs.

Way back in the good olde days (cannot remember the exact date but over 40 years ago) when I was just an Apprentice, Ansett arranged for aircraft to be ferried to Hong Kong for major checks/overhaul, even though they had very extensive facilities here in Australia, a plan obviously to save money.

One of the Carvairs was the first aircraft booked to go, and it was also taking with it many components etc for overhaul too.

The Australian Government of the day, I cannot remember whether it was Liberal or Labor, stepped in and blocked this idea as they said it was against the National Interest, they wanted this work and the expertise of the people doing the work here in Australia to remain IN Australia in case of Wars etc and the possibly Australia may become isolated from where this work was being done off shore, also Ansett did much work for the RAAF as Qantas does now.

Surely the same still applies today, especially since 9/11 and we have Wars going on involving Australia, so why is it Companies are being allowed to do this now, Qantas seem to be doing it more and more and I believe (someone will correct me if I am wrong) Virgin too, I know they certainly used to.

Incidentally, that ONE Carvair was allowed to go as it was all arranged, but NO other aircraft were allowed to go, in the National Interest and keeping all that expertise IN Australia.

The current Australian Government should do the same thing for the very same reasons. :ok:

[Wellwellwell]

Virgin...I think goes something like this, my guess is:

ATR's Line and light 100% Aus to Toll via Skywest, Heavy ??? Maybe AirNZ offshored
E190's Line and light 100% Aus to Vtech, Heavy to John Holland
NG's Line and light 100% Aus to Vtech and John Holland, Heavy 50% to John Holland, 50% offshored to AirNZ and MAS
B777. Line and light 100% offshored to SIAEC, heavy to AirNZ
A330. Line and light 100% to John Holland, Heavy offshored to ??? Maybe MAS?

Pretty consolidated plan, low risk and even spread of costs. Virgin has a 100% outsourced policy. VT is still considered outsourced.....

Did I miss Something?

[600ft-lb]

And all of that went out the window the day the airline industry was dergulated. Today we have start ups like Tiger and 10 or so years ago like Virgin that have/had no industrial/employment footprint this country except a few jets and are able to cherry pick what they want.

You have Emirates which for some reason is allowed 5th freedom rights to dump A380's on the trans tasman route whilst their maintenance is being carried out by majority people from the 3rd world hired to work in Dubai.

You have an executive team at the former national carrier staffed with executives not from a traditional airline background pushing excellence in safety with $$'s invested locally, but with wheelers and dealers in Canberra trying to remove any hindrance to their plan to shell the company out to make it a full service Tiger Mk.2, within the bounds of the Qantas Sale Act. (14 Intl a/c by 2020)

Governments these days are more interested in providing a playing field that is intended to ensure competition is fair in a utopian globalised world. But the world isn't and this country will be good for 3 things soon, digging up dirt, writing laws to dig up the dirt and serving the miners and lawyers at mcdonalds.

[mostlytossas]

I agree completely. I too am old enough to remember we used to make TV's, airconditioners, washing machines, and aircraft. We built ships and made all our own steel.Was a leader in telecommunications. Had industries making all sorts of wigets.
What our pollies don't understand is when these industries go off shore so does the nations intellect.
You can't be a first world country if you don't have/ work in leading edge industry.
Take the humble sparky for instance. There is a world of difference between wiring houses to installing/repairing the latest robot technology found only in industry.
At this rate we will end up a nation of morons that can't do anything for ourselves.
Aviation is no different to any other industry in that respect. What happens when we can't service anything bigger than a C172?
We end up at the mercy of other countries and pay,and wait accordingly.:ugh:

[airsupport]

This was my point, it is bad enough actually losing this work, and having Aussies put out of work and losing all this expertise, but as the Government back then knew, but the current Government does not realise or just does not care, we could end up isolated from all this work. :(

[Wellwellwell]

I take it, you blokes know nothing about macro economics. Armchair experts?

[airsupport]

I take it, you blokes know nothing about macro economics. Armchair experts?

Correct, and I do NOT want to. :rolleyes:

I take it you know nothing about Aviation. ;)

[mostlytossas]

www
Certainly don't. I actually work in the real world industry" hands on".
Unlike most of these economists with their economic theories that change every 5 minutes to suit their own ends at any given point in time.:ok:

[Metroboy]

Maybe you should drive the car you drove 40 years ago. And use the phone. Because of course the world hasn't changed one bit...

[mostlytossas]

The reason my friend we have cars in this country that are equal in safety and technology to the best in the world (in the same price range) is because we have a car industry here and hence a regulator that sets the standards for safety equiptment etc.
If Ford, Holden and Toyota moved out of Australia we would get what is offered, take it or leave it as our local market is too small to justify a special model/s.

[c100driver]

Sorry I don't follow that logic!

NZ does not have a car industry but the regulator still requires the cars to up to a standard that is not a take it or leave it from overseas.

The local market is still a market and a sale is a sale.

[mostlytossas]

That depends on what NZ standards are? they maybe much lower that Australia's? That aside here is an example of what would happen.
Few countries make cars the size of the Commodore or Falcon, engine for towing and sedan size (5 adults). What you would be offered if they weren't around would be either a small compact probably 4 cyc or a people mover or a 4WD such as the Navara. Now you maybe happy with that but I suspect most families wouldn't. This was proven when the last locally made Mitubishi was released in Australia. It was too small, sold poorly and the rest is history. No one is going to make that size car (Falcon etc) just for Australia. Our market is too small.

[airsupport]

If Ford, Holden and Toyota moved out of Australia we would get what is offered, take it or leave it as our local market is too small to justify a special model/s.

A little off topic, however I read recently where the current model Commodore is to be the last designed and built IN Australia, even the design work is being lost to Australia. :(

[airsupport]

Maybe you should drive the car you drove 40 years ago.

If only, they were much stronger and safer. :ok:

[Normasars]

Airsupport,

That last statement of yours is without doubt the biggest load of rubbish I have EVER heard on PPrune, and that my friend is quite a big accolade.

So the development of ABS, Dynamic Stability Control/Airbags/Electronic Brake Distribution, Crumple zones, Side intrusion bars etc etc etc(could list a myriad of things here) is not improving SAFETY in your eyes??

Give me a break mate.

Stay with your HX Premier with RTS and 4 on the Floor mate. Just don't drive too close to me on a greasy,slippery road at night with your sealed beam headlights.:ugh:

[airsupport]

This is way off topic, however if you insist. :rolleyes:

The roads and the cars on them were much safer back then, now you need the airbags etc whenever you drive anywhere because of all the idiots on the road who drive so fast, cut everyone off, and drive up the back of everyone because they have these cars with ABS etc. :(

Cars back then did not have airbags and ABS etc, but they had a chassis.

Same with aircraft, IF God forbid I was going to be in some emergency landing I would rather be in say a DC9 or B727 than this modern plastic cr@p. :ok:

Anyway, any hope of getting back to the topic, PLEASE. :ok:

[Normasars]

I know what you meant mate, it's all good. I agree, the cars did have a proper chassis, but safer, no way. :ok:

[De_flieger]

Crash Test Wars: 1959 Chevy Bel Air VS 2009 Chevy Malibu - The Consumerist (http://consumerist.com/2009/09/crash-test-wars-1959-chevy-bel-air-vs-2009-chevy-malibu.html)
The video is a couple of years old but as the link suggests, shows in fairly graphic detail the effects of a headon collision between a 1959 Chevrolet Bel Air and the rough 2009 equivalent, its quite an impressive demonstration. :8 Anyways, back to the thread topic...

[Tidbinbilla]

At first I thought this thread was something we've been over many times in the various Qantas bashing threads.

And I was correct.