Jetstream 31/32

[formulaben]

Hello:

If there are any operators out there with familiarity operating a corporate Jetstream 31/32 who would be willing to share information regarding its operation and maintenance, I would gladly appreciate it! Please contact me via email/PM. Many thanks! :ok:

Regards,

Ben

[mad_jock]

its a heap of ****e which looks good on the intial purchase price and fuel burn. But when you look at the maint and pilot costs makes it a highly expensive heap.

BAe will screw you for ongoing cover and depending what CAA your under crew training is a complete pain in the arse. The only Jar sim is coming off line in Jan and there is one more in the US which is apprently is a heap with the graphics 20 ft up out of line and has the dynamics of a king air.

Its good for about 1.5 hours full load if you have a divert within 100 miles. Any temps over 20 degrees or above 1000ft pressure alt you are screwed.

There are a few JAR engineers out there but they are few and far between and if you get the brit one that is out of work you will more than likely have a revolt amongst the pilots if he is working for you. Personally I would walk out the door with zero notice if you took him on.

[hawker750]

Mad Jock,
Sounds like you are impressed with the machine

[500 above]

Sounds about as useful as the baggage hold in a Hawker! ;)

[formulaben]

Yeah, mad_jock, don't sugar-coat it...tell us how you really feel. :)

[mad_jock]

I actually love flying the old girl.

She is very responsive and fun to fly.

It takes a bit of a knack to land her gently but she is built like a brick ****e house.

They don't like sitting out in the wet.

Eastern have the J41 sim based in HUM and still have spares for the J32's. The J32 sim which oxford ran in Sweden is being taken out of service to allow another sim in its slot. Whats going to happen to it is still not known.

[S-Works]

You will have to renew in the aircraft like we do now MJ!!!

[Dawdler]

Ahh! The Jetstream 31. What memories that brings back. My first encounter with it was in the late 1970's Birmingham Executive Airways leased three of them from BAE for a start up BHX-CPH (and I think BHX- BRU) they had a 12 seat configuration and the flights were very comfortable. I seem to remember the CC had to be no more than 5ft tall. They seemed even then to be equipped with good low visibility equipment. I used the CPH flight many times and remember landing in Denmark in the thickest of fog. The Pilot who was under training almost got lost on the myriad of taxiways.

BEA then changed to Saab Fairchilds, but it lost some of the atmosphere. I also flew on a domestic flight in a 19 seat version of the J31 and considered it one of the most uncomfortable flights ever.

[mad_jock]

They seemed even then to be equipped with good low visibility equipment

The special equipment is called a window. :p

[Dawdler]

Clever Bugger!:D

[rigpiggy]

what mad jock said, out of yyc on a 20deg day, if I remember correctly down to 13800# on the WAT charts, or about 5 pax. Our AME told me that a wheel half was a 15k item, all the parts you get will be used with 15-20k cycles. Buy a KA200 does everything well.

[winkle]

The sim is going to the Netherlands.

[No RYR for me]

The actual DOC's of a J31/32 I worked with were only 15% below a F50 mainly due to MX... Enough said.. :sad:

[Hrbain]

Greetings to all
I want to run Jetstream 31 ​​aircraft in one of the African countries, and I want your advise on the plane is it suitable for the work , whether logical maintenance and are spare parts are available thank and appreciate your advice

[rigpiggy]

I only have about 1500hrs in them, but in africa, they will be legally be "tits on a bull". the J31 doesn't have enough installed power, at the very least you will need WM for every takeoff, and that adds up. If you ever lose an engine, the outcome is a foregone conclusion, the maintenance will ruin you, and anything less than 5500' runway you will be limited to about 6 people. For the same price you can get a J32, which is only marginally better. What kind of legs are you looking at runways, altitudes?

[Booglebox]

J31 19-seat version has truly appalling range with all the seats full (standard weights). IIRC, ~3000lbs fuel tank capacity, and you can put 1000lbs in with full pax. After mandatory reserve, contingency, diversion fuel etc. you have about 300lbs for the cruise (~20min) :sad:

[Miles Magister]

Mate,

You have asked a sensible question and seem to be based where you do not have experienced people to rely on. Your best option would be to pay an experienced JS31/32 operator to give you some genuine advice. By paying for the advice you are likely to get good accountable advice, free advice can often be good but is not a professional way to construct a proper plan and could be flawed.

One of the best JS 31/32 operators is AIS Airlines of the Netherlands. I do not know if they would be prepared to help you but they are a good team with a lot of JS knowledge available to them.

Good luck

MM

[south coast]

Spent several years flying in Africa and you didn't see Jetstreams much outside of regional operators in South Africa.

Contract flying north of SA was mostly done on King Air 200s and 1900Ds, with the Lett 410 becoming more popular recently.

I can only guess that because they haven't been used much so far is probably because the performance and financial numbers don't add up.

[mad_jock]

Are you sure about that Miles. They might have the sim but as for one of the best operators that's a bit wide of the mark.

The most mature operator in Europe is directflug . And after that now its probably BCI. Which are I suspect is the aircraft they are looking to purchase.

But all the Jetstream operators in Europe won't have a clue about plus 30 high density alt operations. For that you will have to go to the safas/zambians. You get start getting murdered for performance anything over 18 degs.

The biggest problem you will have is getting technicians/engineers that are experienced enough with the aircraft to keep it running and also getting spares. Which is hard enough in Europe with efficient custom clearing Africa you have no chance.

You have to remember Handly Page designed these things for the RAF 35+ years ago for the Uk climate. Its cracking in North climates with low temps but soon as it gets hot your kanckard. They did put water meth in for the South African market but it was never legal to be active in Europe or at least not with the UK CAA. Unless you get a machine which was Australian, SA or FAA initially you won't get Water Meth It tends to be only Australian and SA machines have it. I think there is only one water meth machine left on a European reg and its a J31.

There is one new operator in the Ivory coast, but they can't keep any European trained pilots. There is a rumour that they are looking for more aircraft but its only a rumour. And also direct flight in Zambia which is probably your best bet for advice.

The aircraft isn't very good on gravel and picks up damage when the flaps go to dump 70degs. Again something that the European operators have zero clue about. There is a gravel kit but don't know how effective it is but I should imagine you would eat props on gravel. The things are time life limited so as soon as they come out the prop shop the clock starts ticking so you can't even keep them on the shelf economically.

So contacting direct flight in Zambia would be my first phone call. They have J41's as well. Which are even more expensive per seat than the J31/32's although the 1650 engines do sort out alot of performance issues.

[Tequilaboy]

.. Contact Jon Ibbotson at Links Air Humberside Airport. He has 5 J31 and a 145 for them.

[WTON]

You may contact AVIES in Esonia, they have 4 J31 and 2 J32 .

[Hrbain]

Thank every one i appreciate your advice , but I did not get so far on any one expert or telephone number so that I can make the right decision whether the aircraft is suitable for work in Africa or not, I hope you gave me more advice and guidance before I befor purchasing jetstream 31
thank everyone for their cooperation

[mad_jock]

My advice would be not to purchase it. Lease one initially for a year.

If it doesn't have water meth forget it.

[Journey Man]

So contacting direct flight in Zambia would be my first phone call.

Just so you don't waste a lot of time hunting this mythical Direct Flight in Zambia, it's Proflight Zambia (http://www.flyzambia.com/). A J31 will be severely limited. Used to operate the J31 and J32 out of Lusaka. J32 is better however not much and WAT limits, plus availability of suitable alternates due facilities will hamper payload. As MJ says, water meth will be a necessity on the J31. May as well go ahead and remove a row of seats also. You'll never need the full complement, and it removes the temptation.

Other factors to consider are lack of facilities at most African internationals, so GPUs will not be widely available and there is no air conditioning until the engines are running. Sitting in an aircraft that's showing 48ºC cabin temperature, with all the passengers soaked, will no doubt hamper your client retention abilities.

[silverknapper]

Better yet get a 1900 or 300 in high density fit if you can manage with that.

[joaocastro]

Any information about the rating cost??

[jiggi]

About 40-45000€, call A.I.S. airlines in Netherlands, they have the only sim on this side of the pond... But you know, you can get 737 or 320 TR for less than half the money! :D

[joaocastro]

Tanks Jiggi, ridiculous amount of $$..

[lifeafteraviation]

It's a dangerous airplane that shouldn't have ever been legal to operate in the USA. It's killed many people including friends of mine.

If you want to kill people, it'd be a great way to control population except for the fortunate fact it can only kill 19 people at a time plus the crew (plus any on the ground it can hit).

They're good for scrap metal used to build real airplanes.

Disclaimer: I have about 4000 hours in this POS! (31 and 32)

one more thing...I can name several regulations written in blood as a direct result of the existence of this airplane.

Ooops...two more things....I personally know lawyers who've made a bunch of money as a result of the existence of this airplane.

ok...I'm finished now

[Kermit750]

Does anyone know if the -12 on the J32 had an option for Water Meth or is there a Meth STC? I know it is not standard. Perhaps M7 Aerospace would know? Perhaps they only purchase Fairchild rights, not Garret on other types.

[mad_jock]

there certainly was on the -10's on the jetstream's

But I think it was only legal on Aus aircraft models.

The metro had it though on the -12's.

But looking at the latest J32 manuals its not mentioned in it. And it is in the J31.


The J32 has Vmca issues I suspect the rudder can't take any more power which may be the limiting factor.