Logging time JAA logbook question

[B767PL]

Hey guys.

Just finished my JAA conversion. Flew a total of about 13 hours in Europe, including exams. All my other time, sign offs, check rides, are logged in my FAA logbook.

I assume since my other flight time is spent in the U.S and according to FARs, I do not have to re-write this information into the new logbook. But my European flights do need to be written in a JAR logbook?

Another question. I am continuing to fly in the U.S at the moment. In what logbook and format should I log this flight time? I currently just ran out of space in my old logbook, and will be buying a new one, not sure if I should just buy the JAR one, and log the time according to that, or whether I should do it otherwise.

Thanks for any info, suggestions, ideas. :ok:

[B767PL]

Also, if I was to log FAA flights in the JAR logbook, I am missing names of many of the commanders I have flown with, as I have not kept track of that. Is that a required field?

What are the required things you must log?

[zondaracer]

It doesn't matter that much what kind of logbook you put your time in. What matters are the rules under which you log, and that you log accurately. For example, when applying for JAA licenses or jobs, safety pilot time under FAA is PIC but not under JAA. Just make sure your logbook reflects correctly.

[BigGrecian]

As zondaracer racer says as long as it complies it will be accepted.

The Air Navigation Order does require mandatory items and LASORS details these at :http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/33/srg_lts_LASORS%202010%20Bookmarked.pdf
Section A Appendix B.

JAR-FCL IEM 1.080/2.080 also lists recommended information which is also listed on the LASORS reference.

Now that is for the UK only - other JAA members (even though there isn't JAA anymore) may require by law that the recommended information are included which do actaully incude the name of the PIC, and also the take off and landing times.

However, to practically check every nation would take forever.
So I would start complying with all of the area of Appendix B and JAR-FCL IEM 1.080/2.080 as much as you can with immediate effect.

[B767PL]

Thank you both very much for the replies.

Ok, so to make this simple, the hours and totals I have now logged in my FAA logbook, I could leave as they are.

But should from this point on log everything according to JAR requirements, at least to make things easier in the future?

Would this be OK?

Or would I have to go through my old logbook, add everything up again, subtract all the PIC hours I have totaled thus far, that were flown with an instructor, etc? Basically I am not sure about what to do with everything I have written into the old logbook, which basically goes up to sometime last year. I have over a year of catching up to do (not fun), and will try to just log it in accordance with the JARs... however I do not have any of the names of commanders, as I did not make note of this, will this be OK in the JAR logbook, and just from now I will write in the names? Somewhat confused. Reason for this question is to find out what totals I should include in various job applications.. not all of which are in Europe.

[zondaracer]

You are supposed to go back and subtract all the PIC time. It is a pain, but you don't want to be scrutinized by a future employer/authority.

[172510]

You have to keep records according to both regulations, if you want to keep your two licences. You need them to prove experience to an employer, and also to prove your currency, and to prove you qualify for the issue of a future licence and/or rating. May you fly such an approach under JAA and/or FAA? The answer will be in your logbook, provided you've kept all the relevant information.
It's tricky, because definitions are not necessarily the same. For instance a FAR PIC is not exactly the same as a EASA PIC (for instance, a check ride?).
You'll end with many many columns in your logbook.
The simplest solution might be to keep two logbooks.... although it is not simple at all.
The simplest example of the complexity: you revalidate your SEP with a one hour dual flight AND one hour ground instruction under FAR rules, in Europe the ground instruction is not required. Even if you have flown one hour with an instructor who is both EASA and FAA, if you don't have a record of the ground instruction, your FAR SEP won't be revalidated.
I'm sure that many pilots, and especially European pilots flying in Europe with a FAR licence and IR based on a EASA PPL are far from compliant with the rules of both wolrds

[zondaracer]

What I do is I copy everything over onto an excel spreadsheet, where I can put all the categories I want, FAA PIC, JAA PIC, JAA PIC Under supervision, etc... I also keep the paper logbook for the signatures and endorsements.

[lasseb]

Isn't IFR time logged differently also. For EASA the whole flight under IFR rules is logged as IFR. For FAA it's only the actual IMC time.
Anyone can confirm this?

[SA Brit]

Isn't IFR time logged differently also. For EASA the whole flight under IFR rules is logged as IFR. For FAA it's only the actual IMC time.
Anyone can confirm this?

actual or simulated conditions

see FAA FAR
61.51 Pilot logbooks.
(g) Logging instrument time.
(1) A person may log instrument time only for that flight time when the person operates the aircraft solely by reference to instruments under actual or simulated instrument flight conditions.

[Trolle]

And note that this does not necessarily refer to flying in cloud or under the hood exclusively. A moonless night, between layers may require aircraft operation solely to instruments even if on a VFR flight.