Safety items

[Diver_Dave]

Morning all,
This may be more suited to Safety and CRM, so, Mods
can you move if appropriate?

Just a quick query regarding two safety points.

1) Are the Exit signs required to be illuminated during the
takeoff and landing phases? [1]

2) Is there a set point the safety brief should be completed?

I'll leave this deliberatly vague for the moment as I don't want
to influence any opinions, except to say, this is not a legacy loco
fight etc... I'm mearly after knowing if there is a set requirement.

Regards

DaveA

[1] I'm used to them being on until gear up and then
again from gear down, and, not always being part of the brief

[Mr @ Spotty M]

I can answer question 1 for emergency exit signs, not sure on other exit signs.
No, the signs only illuminate when the emergency lighting system is activated.

[Diver_Dave]

Thanks,

That's interesting, certainly flying Air Malta and I thought
Flybe too that they were illuminated by the overwing exits
and aisle until gear up and then again prior to landing.

Convinced enough that I noticed the abscence on
a flight the other day.

The reason for asking about the safety video was basically
I was surprised it was still running giving a...

"So please ensure you seatback is upright and tray table stowed..."

Whilst we were accelerating down the runway.....

Regards

DaveA

[jet2impress]

You'll find that the emergency exit locator lights are only illuminated on some aircraft types.... usually airbus. This is however an operator option, it can be programmed to active at certain times, such as when the gear is lowered or activated when a certain flap setting is selected.

As for the safety brief.... this should be fully complete BEFORE take-off. At my airline, we are not permitted to pass the 'cabin secure' signal to the flight deck crew until the safety demonstration is finished and the cabin secure check competed.

[Diver_Dave]

Thanks Jet.

Both flights I noticed it not being on were Boeing and
I know KM fly Airbusses (AirBusii????). I'm wondering if it's
the same kind of seting on the E195 as well. I'll have a look
next week.

I must admit the crew did look a little surprised by a flight deck,
"Cabin crew one minute to take off", announcement.

Thanks for the responses to what's really idle curiosity!

Regards

DaveA

[Pontius Navigator]

"So please ensure you seatback is upright and tray table stowed..."

Whilst we were accelerating down the runway.....

When there is inbound traffic approaching the point where the runway must be clear the Tower may give permission for an aircraft on the ground to take-off with the condition "Expedite".

If the aircraft on the ground does not expedite and has not entered the active clearance may then be cancelled and his take-off delayed until the approaching aircraft has landed and cleared the active.

If, having been told to expedite, the aircraft on the ground enters the runway but does not expedite this will cause the inbound aircraft to overshoot and the aircraft on the ground to incur the ire of ATC.

Expedite saves money all round hence on the occasion you mention expedite seems to have breached intrinsic safety. It would have been worth an email to the CEO.

[PAXboy]

Very interesting PN. If (if) the CC had told the FC that the cabin was secure (on the basis that under normal timing, it would be complete by the required time) then the FC might have more readily responded to any Expedite call. But no one will ever know. I shall try to bear this in mind if I encounter such a confluence of events.

[Hotel Tango]

In my experience the FD will not accept a line up and immediate take-off type of clearance if they haven't received the cabin secure call from CC. I believe that's pretty standard SOP with most operators. Perhaps in this instance there was some sort of miscommunication, or the FD accepted an expeditious take-off clearance taking a := naughty gamble that the cabin would be secure by the time they reached the runway.

[Diver_Dave]

As far as I could see, from the right aisle seat row 35
on a 747-400, the cabin was secure, just that the video
itself was still playing. Although crew did have to move
rapidly to their seats.

I obviously don't know how ATC move traffic in Mumbai
at 03:15 in the morning, however, I gather there was a runway
closure issue that would have probably resulted in the 'expedite'
mentioned above.

Thanks for the replies, very interesting reading!

Regards

DaveA

[Piltdown Man]

The EXIT light illumination are type, operator and national regulator specific. The only consistency is that when the Emergency Lights are activated, these should be on as well. Having said that, most EXIT lights are on exactly when you stated, with gear down.

There really should be two parts of "cabin secure". The first, less obvious and often over looked part is a statement/signal from the cabin saying that the cabin is secure for taxi/push-back. The second is another statement/signal saying that everyone has been briefed, the cabin checked, bags stowed, galley locked etc. and the cabin is ready for flight.

PM

[PAXboy]

VERY sensible suggestion PM. given the wide range of very short taxi times at outlying fields and the protracted times at congested ones (I recall departing JFK and waiting 55 mins between push and turning onto the active) then this could make a difference.

[Diver_Dave]

From last night's MAN-SOU E195 flight.

Exit signs not illuminated at any point.

I'm guessing it's the Airbus thing and I've only
just noticed!

Thanks all.

DaveA