Suckling Airways

[BAladdy]

ScotAirways has re-branded to its former name of Suckling Airways. The rebranding was announced on the same day that Loganair confirmed it had purchased the company. Suckling will continue to trade as a separate airline which holds its own licences and approvals. It operates a fleet of five Dornier 328-100 fast turboprop aircraft on ad-hoc and contract charter flights.

I only thought it right that the re-branded company had it's own thread.

Further information on the sale to LC can be found here: ScotAirways Home (http://www.scotairways.co.uk/news_4.asp)

[BAladdy]

WX have leased a D328 from Suckling to operate there 2 x daily flights from DND to LCY. The aircraft appears to be DND based through until 28th October.

In addition to operating the DND flights the aircraft will also begin operating one round trip from LCY to EDI 4 x weekly from August 30th.

[learjet50]

Can the DO328 land on the Beach


If it can and I dont think it should be a problem is this the answer to LC s Problem re replacment A/C for the Twotter at Barra

It would certainly be a cheaper option than buying new Twotters from whoever makes them now

we await with our breath bated

[tallaonehotel]

Learjet 50,

The DO328 won't be landing on the beach at Barra, positive it ain't certified either.

LC don't have a problem with the Otters at the moment, the PSO runs out in 2013.
They might be old, but they have still have plenty flights left in them.

As for a replacement, Viking are the TC holder for the Otter, and are producing the new -400 series at a slow pace.
New aircraft might be required going forward, this will be in the hands of the Scottish government and the next operator of the PSO.

I wish all at Suckling and Logie all the best for the future, good to see a good news story for a change.

T1H

[vaughan111]

Can the DO328 land on the Beach:eek:

I think you might be confusing the Do328 with the Do228. Suckling only fly the Do328. The 328 needs tarmac!

[BeeBopp]

There is a gravel kit option available for Do-328

[Wycombe]

Whilst not suitable for Barra, presumbaly the 328 would be for other airfields on the Logi network (with a decent amount of tarmac) like Benbecula, Stornoway, Islay etc?

[A4]

From memory, doesn't the Do328 have a pretty low x-wind limit (15knots?)

No idea about the Twotter but could be a factor during winter months....

Great to see the Suckling name resurrected though!

A4

[BAladdy]

According to Jethros fleet listings:

G-CCGS is back operating on behalf of Aer Arann. Anyone know what routes it is being used for and for how long it is planned to remain on lease?

G-BZOG appears to be based in Germany. Anyone know who this aircraft is operating for?

G-BWWT - Is on lease to WX.

G-BYMK - Currently at DND poss WFU.

Anyone have any further info on CB's future plans or contracts?

[Skipness One Echo]

G-CCGS is back operating on behalf of Aer Arann. Anyone know what routes it is being used for and for how long it is planned to remain on lease?

I've seen this one a few times this month at LCY operating the LCY-IOM in an all white scheme.

G-BWWT similarly all white appears to be dedicated to DND-LCY for AF / WX.

[Aero Mad]

BAladdy, I think that GS is on and off on IOM-LCY as well as various other routes on the Arann network (mostly domestic Irish) standing in for tech ATRs as and when they happen. I'm aware that Cityjet are using a 328 for LCY-DND and also some EDI movements at the moment, that arrangement is due to cease by the end of October.

Sorry not to be more specific, but that's my sixpence worth.

[scr1]

G-BZOG appears to be based in Germany

no it is currently at inv arrived yesterday with G-BWIR

staying till thusday

[GAXLN]

G-CCGS was at Newcastle this morning having brought NUFC back from their match against QPR last night.

[PlymouthPixie]

Are they going to get a lick of paint?

[hunty]

Gents

Can any one tell me if John Aldington is still with this outfit?

Cheers

Hunty :cool:

[EMX81L]

G-BYHG is currently on the Aer Arann IOM - LCY run

[blueskiesup]

John's still with us. The Cityjet stuff is going on to March.

[BAladdy]

LC announced last week that they will take over the operation of BE's MAN-NWI service from 05MAR12. LC will base a CB D328 at NWI to operate the flights. The D328 will also be used to operate the NWI to EXT service starting the 26MAR12 .

The D328 will operate as follows:

Norwich to Manchester (begins 05MAR12)

BE6873 NWI0700 – 0755MAN D38 x67
BE6875 NWI1505 – 1600MAN D38 x67
BE6877 NWI1820 – 1915MAN D38 x6

Manchester to Norwich (begins 05MAR12)

BE6874 MAN0850 – 0945NWI D38 x67
BE6876 MAN1645 – 1740NWI D38 x67
BE6878 MAN1945 – 2040NWI D38 x6

Norwich to Exeter (begins 25MAR12)

BE6867 NWI1115 – 1230EXT D38 x7
BE6867 NWI1450 – 1605EXT D38 7

Exeter to Norwich (begins 25MAR12)

BE6868 EXT1300 – 1415NWI D38 x7
BE6868 EXT1635 – 1750NWI D38 7

Does anyone know of any other contracts Suckling have for S12?

[Aero Mad]

They tend to be of fairly short notice... CB are also operating NWI - NQY on a seasonal basis from 5th May.

[girlpower]

Hello

I was wondering if anyone knows for how long the Do 328's will be used for the Exeter, Newquay and Manchester routes out of Norwich on behalf of Flybe. i.e is it just a once off year deal or is it a permanent contract. What would a typical FO roster be like (based on the contents of the post from BAladdy)?

Many thanks

[ZOOKER]

Do they still serve home-made cakes on board these flights?

[DB6]

Suckling is now owned by Loganair, who operate as a franchise partner of Flybe, so the Norwich routes are a long term arrangement (well, as long term as things get in the airline world).

[Wycombe]

So I wonder if the NWI-based Dornier will appear in BE colours?

[bmaviscount]

would love to see a copy of the 40 minutes documentary made about them in the Cambridge days

[BISH-BASH-BOSH]

WT is currently in Bournemouth, being painted in full Flybe livery, due out Thurs.

[girlpower]

DB6,

Thank you very much for the information.

Does anyone know what a typical roster would look like for a base with one a/c? What I'm really getting at is the average monthly hours flown or some sort of "guestimate".

Thanks

[vaughan111]

I don't think the term 'typical roster' and Suckling go hand in hand.

Mix of schedule services, charters, weeks overseas away from base and standbys.

[BISH-BASH-BOSH]

Girlpower, things are looking up at SA, six months ago we all thought that we would all be out of work by xmas.

With the Loganair buyout, things are going from strength, to strength, lots of new faces on the flight deck, new bases opening at NWI, and LCY, 5th March, new routes for citijet out of LCY, busy summer ahead. Happy days. :)

[BAladdy]

It looks as if the two aircraft leased to WX for the Summer will be

G-BWIR & G-BYMK

Suckling Airways (http://www.jethros.org.uk/fleets/fleet_listings/suckling_airways.htm)

One to be based at LCY and the other at DND.

Does anyone know if the aircraft will operate flights to destinations other then DND and EDI from LCY??.

The reason I ask is because it appears that at least one aircraft will be sat at LCY for about 6 hours on most weekdays based on WX's current schedule.

[globetrotter79]

Looks like schedule will be something like this:

First aircraft (DND based) operates on weekdays:
AF5170 0825 arrival from DND (Day 1 only)
AF5173 0855 departure to DND (Day 1 only)
AF5172 1230 arrival from DND (Day 1 only)
AF5170 1000 arrival from DND (Days -2345)
AF5163 1300 departure to EDI (Days 12345)
AF5166 1630 arrival from EDI (Days 12345)
AF5165 1655 departure to EDI (Days 12345)
AF5168 2025 arrival from EDI (Days 12345)


Second aircraft (LCY based) operates on weekdays:
AF5161 0700 departure to EDI
AF5162 1025 arrival from EDI
AF5123 1240 departure to DUB
AF5122 1550 arrival from DUB
AF5175 1620 departure to DND
AF5176 2000 arrival from DND
AF5177 2025 departure to DND

[BISH-BASH-BOSH]

Aircraft are off to Dublin as well, to fill the day.:)

[PlymouthPixie]

G-BWWT Dornier 328-110 Flybe | Flickr - Photo Sharing! (http://www.flickr.com/photos/leeweston/6795595498/in/contacts/)

Doesn't look good on a D328 imho.

[BAladdy]

Does anyone know if WX operated 5 or 6 x Daily from LCY to DUB last Summer.

[Cloud1]

Doesn't look good on a D328 imho.

I agree - but I think its because the Flybe on the tail is too small, the letters should be larger to fill some of the space. It is a bit like the Flybe colours that were put on the E145s after the BAcon days - it looked a little, well cheap and nasty

[Cyrano]

I agree - but I think its because the Flybe on the tail is too small, the letters should be larger to fill some of the space. It is a bit like the Flybe colours that were put on the E145s after the BAcon days - it looked a little, well cheap and nasty

I agree that the flyBE on the Dornier tail looks wrong. I think they have sought to avoid painting the rudder (wanting to avoid having to have it rebalanced) and that only leaves a relatively narrow vertical fin, which determines the maximum (and IMHO insufficient) letter height.

[JSCL]

For the sole-operator type routes these D328's are going to be operating, does it actually matter, honestly? The brand is there, that's enough. If people need to fly the route, there's only one brand flying them, that's BE/Loganair Franchise. It's brand presence but I highly doubt it's a priority.

[Cloud1]

No JSCL it doesnt - but we are just voicing our opinions on the livery. Its funny how on one type of fleet the colours look good yet on another just looks naff. I dont think any of us actually mentioned passenger perception though??.....

[LH-OAB]

The letters on the tail seem to be much closer together on other flybe franchise types.

[Aero Mad]

So long as passengers see the brand, I'm sure they will associate it. Clearly rudder balancing is an issue: when Scot (Suckling) operated a 328 for Blue Islands, it looked like this:

http://www.flightglobal.com/airspace/media/galleries/images/11299/500x400/dornier-328-110-g-byhg-blue-islands-at-zurich.jpg

[learjet50]

I think the answer may be (Dont shoot me if I wrong)

the picture is taken from the wrong side if you imagine a picture from the other side

Fly be would have to start on the fuselage and Fly is larger than be

so if they increase the size of FLY BE it would ave to start awfully close to the dorsal fin where the regitsration is .

I think if you saw a picture from the other side it will look better maybe


I hope you get my drift(dribble)

Also

can I ask is the Sucking AOC still current

i e is the Aircraft operated under either the following AOC

1/ Sucking

2/ Loganair

3/ ??? please clarify

regards to all our readers

:)

[Cyrano]

I think the answer may be (Dont shoot me if I wrong)

the picture is taken from the wrong side if you imagine a picture from the other side


Nice try, but...er... no. (Leaving aside the issue of a "right side" and "wrong side" for a livery...what's wrong with a livery that looks OK on both sides?)

See for example this online photo:
http://i1194.photobucket.com/albums/aa379/bizfreeq/Flybe%20Dornier/IMG_7577.jpg

Do you really want to tell me it looks better on this side?

(Incidentally, this and other photos are here (http://www.civilianaviation.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&p=33340) - I happen to think the aircraft looks quite good in this livery with the exception of the tail. Where's Mrs Thatcher's hanky when you need it?)

[Aero Mad]

The answer would have been to move the registration slightly further along the fuselage, and then thicken the logo (yes, I know the airline doesn't really care).

[BISH-BASH-BOSH]

Cyrano, the aircraft has been completely re-painted, along with the control surfaces.

[BISH-BASH-BOSH]

Learjet 50, the Suckling AOC, is still very active.

[Sonic Bam]

Looks great to me. Even better is to see the aircraft still flying and people still working with them. If Loganair hadn't come in when they did then who knows what would have happened but I doubt it would have been good.

[Cyrano]

Cyrano, the aircraft has been completely re-painted, along with the control surfaces.

Fair enough, but it still seems to me that there was a reluctance to paint any of the logo on the rudder. Would you agree that the letters would look better proportioned if they covered the whole vertical surface?

(I realise this is a slightly abstract debate - I would be (happily) surprised if the airline changed this now!)

[BISH-BASH-BOSH]

Cyrano, the scheme was designed by Flybe, specifically for the 328, jets have applied the scheme as per the drawings, provided to them.

[Skipness One Echo]

Looks OK if a little different. I remember seeing the scheme on the KLM ERJ190s and realising the logo was way too far up the tail. "Dear Sir......." hmmmm

[DB6]

...and back at Dundee, with colour co-ordinated hangar
http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n107/DB6Mk2/IMG_0274.jpg
http://%3Ca%20href=%22http://s110.photobucket.com/albums/n107/DB6Mk2/?action=view&current=IMG_0274.jpg%22%20target=%22_blank%22%3 E%3Cimg%20src=%22http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n107/DB6Mk2/IMG_0274.jpg%22%20border=%220%22%20alt=%22Photobucket%22%3E% 3C/a%3E

[Sonic Bam]

Hangar colour scheme doesn't look too good. Could do with a wash.

[BISH-BASH-BOSH]

WT, positions to Norwich Sunday lunchtime.

[Sonic Bam]

Hangar could still do with a wash.

[WHBM]

Suckling in an interesting position nowadays if you think about it.

Now owned by Loganair, who do all their flying under the FlyBe brand, who in turn have a minority ownership and much integration with BA, and thus OneWorld.

However, apart from the aircraft shown above in FlyBe colours and for a FlyBe branded route, a lot of what Suckling do is out of London City (and it's good to see them increasingly back here again doing this, with multiple based aircraft again. Now this is all under the CityJet brand, and they are in turn owned by Air France, and thus under the SkyTeam banner.

Any of the Star Alliance carriers got any work for them ?

[JobsaGoodun]

WHBM - take a look at Flybe themselves.

15% owned by British Airways, in a joint venture partnership with Finnair for Flybe Nordic. Considerable codeshare operation with Air France and if rumours on this site are to be believed, about to enter an agreement with Brussels Airlines.

All three major alliances covered and yet still independant. I'm not sure there is anyone else in Europe in commercial agreements of some description with all three competing alliances.

[Cyrano]

I'm not sure there is anyone else in Europe in commercial agreements of some description with all three competing alliances.

Aer Lingus comes immediately to mind: BA, KL and UA codeshares.

[JobsaGoodun]

Cyrano - understood, however my main point was that BE's relationships with the three main alliances is more than just codeshares.

BE themselves are part owned by BA. With AY, BE share part ownership of another airline.

With SN, BE appear to be verging on providing longer term wet lease contract services, and with AF the main CDG routes from BHX/MAN are operated as joint services (verging on part contract really), with a fairly extensive codeshare on other routes.

[Cyrano]

Ah yes, OK, I see what you mean.

Arguably the stronger relationships are the AY and AF ones where BE is effectively flying for the other carriers. The BA shareholding came about - as I understand it - as part-consideration for flyBE's acquisition of BA Connect, rather than BA wanting a strategic investment in flyBE as part of its network options.

With this Brussels Airlines deal (like the Olympic one a couple of years ago), BE is essentially providing cost-effective feeder capacity, much like the regional carriers in the US do for their mainline partners. What's interesting is that in the US, it's common for a single regional carrier to fly for two or even three competing mainline carriers, i.e. to have subfleets painted in the different liveries. In parallel with their "own" network, perhaps this is one path forward for flyBE?

[JobsaGoodun]

I think you're absolutely right and the Chairman and CEO of BE said just this in a recent interview in the Telegraph commenting that he could see BE taking the lead in providing contract regional services to a number of EU airlines.

It will be interesting to see how this might develop.

[goldeneye]

With BE operating for other carriers looks kind of like Pinnacle Airlines Group or Republic Airways who operate for UA, DL, AA, US, F9 etc.

[fjencl]

Does anybody know if Suckling airways has a cabin crew base at Edinburgh.

Also, how are things going now that Suckling has been bought by Loganair, has there been any significant changes to working conditions or are there any new plans for new routes for the dornier 328 planes to be used on.

Cheers.

[BISH-BASH-BOSH]

SA no longer fly routes as such, all ACMI stuff now for other operators.

2.5% payrise in the offing, for those staff remaining, effective 1st Oct.

Morale not good.

[tallaonehotel]

2.5% payrise, not bad in the grand scheme of things.
I would say Suckling would have gone under without Loganair's intervention.

I'd say Bish needs a new job elsewhere, plenty fresh faces needing their first flying job.

[SWBKCB]

Suckling seemed to have cornered the market in shuttling Premier League football teams around, with Eastern and BMIR a long way behind - don't seem as prevalent this year, anybody know why?

[ragamuffin]

SO whats new at Scotair nowadays? They still at Cambridge? read years ago that local authorities were proposing closing the airfield down as it is prime land for housing. Any info?

[Aero Mad]

You've a little catching up to do.

Wikipedia will be your friend on this one (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suckling_Airways).

[ragamuffin]

Strewth! impressive how they continue to operate in the current state of the industry. They seem to adapt and survive. Who's running the place now?

[tallaonehotel]

The SA fleet are all tasked with long term contracts, hence very few football charters.
As for running the place, Loganair are keeping a tighter ship as Mrs Suckling has all but left the building!

[WHBM]

Anyone who actually encountered one of Suckling's major football team charters will have found that one of the aspects of success was the way that Mrs S personally, having worked on the commercial and sales side of such work during the week, would then very often go along with it and ensure that everything was just so at every stage of the proceedings. That sort of service sold these high-earning charters.

One has gone, and now the other has gone. No surprise there.

[tallaonehotel]

WHBM, couldn't agree more with what you have said.

But one or two football charters won't pay the bills long term, hence return to profit this year with all available aircraft flying. Mrs S was good at the commercial pink and fluffy I'll give you that!

[ragamuffin]

Which sim do they use? Maastricht still?

[BISH-BASH-BOSH]

Sad day, all remaining CBG staff have been served notice, Suckling AOC to be relinquished, and everything to be absorbed by Logan. Merlyn has resigned as a director. End of era.

[G-UNYT]

Sadly it was only a matter of time before this happened once Suckling had been acquired by Logan - such a shame that the company could not have remained independent. :sad:

Feel so sorry for all those affected by this as, despite the infamous reputation of some of the management team, I had some of my best working years at this company, meeting some wonderful characters amongst the flight crew and CBG head office staff.

Truly is the end of an era, my best wishes to you all. ;)