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Gordy
7th Aug 2011, 04:49
Wow...this hit the news in Salt Lake City before it made it to JB...

See Here (http://www.fox13now.com/news/kstu-london-riot-riot-hits-north-london-following-police-shooting-double-decker-bus-and-patrol-cars-set-ablaze-20110806,0,3542456.story?track=rss)

rh200
7th Aug 2011, 05:10
I must admit I was surprised how long it took to get here, though I suppose it's to be expected with the Yanks being distracted after getting a smiting from S&P's.

Slasher
7th Aug 2011, 05:19
This isn't going to help Tottenham's house market values (if there is any).

Lon More
7th Aug 2011, 05:28
More on the background shooting here. (http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard/article-23975846-man-shot-dead-by-police-in-tottenham.do)
Man fails to stop for armed police; policeman gets shot and people are surprised when the cops return fire?

This isn't going to help Tottenham's house market values (if there is any).

All social housing I suspect, even Baroness Tesco couldn't have sold this for votes

driftdown
7th Aug 2011, 05:52
The question as to who shot who first may eventually be known after an inquiry. I can almost understand people gathering near a police station on hearing the news.

The fact it turned into a riot with shops being looted is not at all surprising. It suggests to me those doing the looting have very little in the way of sympathy for the deceased or their family and more about getting their hands on some free kit.

Having just watched TV footage of people pushing shopping trolleys down the street loaded with stuff I see it as a sad indictment of the state of certain sections of society in the country.

hellsbrink
7th Aug 2011, 06:43
Just been reading about the riot, and if one part of the report is right then it's certainly one of the strangest riots I've heard of....


There were also reports that youths had stormed McDonald’s and had started frying their own burgers and chips.

Parapunter
7th Aug 2011, 07:51
I had a great day out at Spurs yesterday.

Still can't believe I knocked the barbeque over after the game though.:uhoh:

Capetonian
7th Aug 2011, 08:34
Time for the police to get the kid gloves off and start using machine guns against these vermin.

rh200
7th Aug 2011, 08:38
On a positive note, it doesn't appear that they have been trying to hack the heads off any of the Mr Plods this time, though they may just not have gotten the chance to.

OFSO
7th Aug 2011, 08:56
According to Sky News five minutes ago, looting still going on in some areas, no police in sight.

D SQDRN 97th IOTC
7th Aug 2011, 08:58
I would not be surprised to see further such incidents elsewhere across London in the coming days.
It is vital the police get it right when responding to them.

sitigeltfel
7th Aug 2011, 09:21
I have just watched helicopter footage of burnt out buildings including the local McDonalds, the populace will starve. I presume they didn't also attack the benefits office.

A BBC journalist put a loaded and inflammatory message to a "community worker". "Has recent police activity in the area maybe contributed to this situation"?

Yes, they stopped a minicab carrying an armed gangster and one of them was shot in the process. The gangster was then shot dead in return.

Lon More
7th Aug 2011, 09:42
Time for the police to get the kid gloves off and start using machine guns against these vermin.
No reason why the Sefefrikaan solution would work in the UK. It doesn't even work in SeffEfrika

tony draper
7th Aug 2011, 09:44
Been saying for year we should have a branch of the military that can be deployed in these situations cleared to use deadly force against anybody throwing petrol bombs or looting because it is obvious the Police cannot cope,they are terrified to do anything lest it is caught on a mobile phone cams and fluffist howls fill our screens about police brutality for the next month.
Also help if the police had the power to declare a media free zone,throw the bloody newscamera teams onto the bridewell until it is over
Read the riot act then send in the Dragoons sabres drawn

Parapunter
7th Aug 2011, 09:55
Yes, and had a plod had his head hacked off then we might have put another innocent man into jail for twenty years like we did in 1985, or to give you armchair colonels your head, execute him only to be proved wrong in time.

Can't you people all go and live together in some underground militia commune to talk endlessly about guns, muslims, wogs & queers- preferably without an internet connection & leave the real world to realistic people?

BOAC
7th Aug 2011, 09:57
One less..

Utrinque Apparatus
7th Aug 2011, 10:01
Another sad indication of the gradual destruction of a once great country from within, with the connivance of weak, self obsessed and corrupt politicians and an emasculated police force.

Cacophonix
7th Aug 2011, 10:02
Can't you people all go and live together in some underground militia commune to talk endlessly about guns, muslims, wogs & queers- preferably without an internet connection & leave the real world to realistic people?


Colonel Blimp (or at least his spirit) is alive and well here on this fine forum that's for sure! ;)

Utrinque Apparatus
7th Aug 2011, 10:09
Ah, but where are the realistic people ? Those who agree with you PP, of course, but one can be forgiven a certain Schadenfreud when listening to Enoch Powell's so called "inflammatory" speech all those years ago and watching it all unfold as he predicted. Sadly, the right wing throughout Europe grows quietly ever stronger with the tacit head nodding of a disenfranchised, dispossessed and frustrated general public.

The looting and scenes we see at each of these staged events is positively third world and anger is growing that the police are impotent in the face of it for fear of being smeared "Institutionally Racist", the one phrase which has achieved so much in terms of racial disharmony in the UK.

Avitor
7th Aug 2011, 10:14
Is it about a grievance, or is it cover for a thieving spree?

finalchecksplease
7th Aug 2011, 10:27
No mentions of any arrests made, did the police not manage to grab any of those "protesters"?
I find it a shame for the small shopkeepers, whose premises got destroyed / looted by thugs not there to protest but to steal and destroy. Agree it’s time to take off the kid gloves and stamp this out before it all gets further out of hand.

ATNotts
7th Aug 2011, 10:32
Looking at the BBC coverage this morning it occured to me how many of the rioters were wearing balaclavas, with holes cut into them for eyes.

Made me wonder how many ordinary folk even own a balaclava, let alone one with slits for the eyes!

This was no spontaneous incident, clearly some people had been spoiling for a fight for a while, and the shooting was the excuse.

Utrinque Apparatus
7th Aug 2011, 10:41
Just listened to those tossers on Sky News, stirring things up further. The Government won't comment until the Police have submitted a full initial report but Sky know it alls can't resist their constant nonsensical speculation.

The pundits view is that the police should leave these communities alone and stop being "heavy handed", exactly the reason why so many black kids are gunning or knifing, or being gunned down and knifed to death in these modern, self inflicted Gettos.

prospector
7th Aug 2011, 10:43
The story I heard over here was that thie person that was shot by police was exchanging fire with the police during the course of a robbery. Is this correct??

The thing that gets me upset is that our TV news items do not just say a person was shot by police. it is that a black person was shot by police.

Is the fact that he was black enough justification for all the rioting and looting, or is that just par for the course?.

hellsbrink
7th Aug 2011, 10:49
Dunno about it being in the course of a robbery since the taxi he was in was stopped in the middle of a bridge.

Cacophonix
7th Aug 2011, 10:56
To be fair to the police, it seems that they handled (are handling) this unexpected outbreak of violence pretty well. I suspect that urban touchpoints will become even more volatile (whatever the racial mix there) over the next couple of months as people who have been marginalised or who live on the margins of society struggle with the current economic climate.

Doubtless it was criminality that sparked this incident but the resulting rapid support from some of the citizenary to the conflagration points to a deeper malaise and there are likely to be a number of other factors that contributed to the riot of which poverty will be one!

Who would want to be a policeman in the age of Twitter when a mob can be summoned up within minutes?

Caco

I leave the ludicrous censorship of (rhymes with titter) in for humorous effect

robtheblade
7th Aug 2011, 11:21
1) 300 mostly black youths riot causing millions of pounds worth of damage. What happens? Police stand back and let them do as they please. No doubt a few arrests will be made in the next few weeks, but not too many as to upset the locals and those arrested bailed to walk free ‘till they get 100 hrs community service .

2) 100 mostly white working class lads come out of a football match and fancy a bit of a tear up with 100 like minded opposition fans. What happens? Police horses charge through women and children, officers with dogs wade in, riot police, batons drawn, club down as many as possible and let the dogs savage as many as possible. Just happen to be walking by? Tough, shouldn’t be there and ******* move or you’ll be next.

I am not saying it is ok for football hooligans to do as they please without redress, but it seems there is one law for one group and one for another.

aviate1138
7th Aug 2011, 11:34
BBC Radio Five [barely alive] this morning, was hosted by a woman who asked extremely biased questions but then the BBC would be anti police/law and order wouldn't it?

One local interviewee was allowed minutes on air and managed to say "See what I mean/fink","at the end of the day', "basically" and little of any substance in between! Brilliant news editing.

Sad that the local community unzipped a bank, clothing shops, phone shop, electronic goods, etc., carrying off trolley loads of swag.

If the independent report finds the earlier incident's resultant dead man had fired first [he had a gun? What for?] then sadly the family will have to accept the Police did the right thing and disposed of a gunman, while firing in self defence.

Lawfully.

Unlike the looters.

Mr Optimistic
7th Aug 2011, 11:41
Have they run out of rubber bullets and tear gas in London ? As someone alluded to earlier, maybe threaten to close the benefits office. On a diverse note, while gang violence may be favoured by one or two minorities, at least looting remains a undiscriminated pastime.

RedhillPhil
7th Aug 2011, 12:15
Is it about a grievance, or is it cover for a thieving spree?

With a time dely of two days most definately the latter. The Anarchists and Socialisr Workers Party people take two days to muster their troops and get the left wing lawyers cards printed to hand out to the poor innocent and peaceful protesters.

stuckgear
7th Aug 2011, 12:24
shame the riot didnt spread on to the lefty enclave of islington.

irony and poetic justice in the same event !

Mr Optimistic
7th Aug 2011, 12:39
prospector: odd you should say that ! Over here they never mention colour even though when it comes to gang violence it is most definately relevant. I wish the London police would generate a mosaic of all the gun crime victims over the course of a year and next to it the same thing but with those found guilty of the crimes. Would make it kind of obvious that one side of our community generates more than its fair share of aggravation.

rh200
7th Aug 2011, 12:40
The problem is most of you people have forgotten one thing, and the rioters have every right to do what they are doing. You see the police clearly where in the wrong as they did not follow the new rules of engagment.

The use of deadly force shall only be used when your life is clearly threatened ( note this means you must have been shot at least once, as the first could have been an accident), the perp must be a caucasian, wealthy and a christian.

sitigeltfel
7th Aug 2011, 12:53
The looting and scenes we see at each of these staged events is positively third world
Time and time again you see third world peoples transplanted into 1st world societies, and do they modify their tribal, ethnic and cultural behaviour as a consequence?

You have seen the answer.

Lord Spandex Masher
7th Aug 2011, 13:17
His sister, Kay, 38, said: "They said he shot at police but I just can't understand it, he had his kids, his life - I'd have killed him if he'd have done anything like that. Everyone is totally devastated."

Well love, that's apparently what happened.

What are you complaining about? Not being allowed to pull the trigger yourself?

larssnowpharter
7th Aug 2011, 13:24
The looting and scenes we see at each of these staged events is positively third world and anger is growing that the police are impotent in the face of it for fear of being smeared "Institutionally Racist",

I take mild offence at rating this series of events 'Third World''.

I live in the third world and, in the city I live in, we don't do this crap.

We have the DDS instead.:E

racedo
7th Aug 2011, 13:25
Cops not going to arrest many people on the evening as that just uses up the resources they need, the cameras on the street plus the evidence gathers will have picked out the faces so the next couple of weeks there will be knocks on doors at 5am.

Mate in the Met who had dinner with last night was talking about this when I joked about bullet proof radios being a requirement and he said community leaders were concerned that someone had been shot BUT he said community was not talking about black guys going around armed killing each other.

parabellum
7th Aug 2011, 13:30
This thread is deficient of the usual, "It's the Police's fault, whatever" brigade, where can they possibly be? Must be a Bank Holiday:confused:

AlpineSkier
7th Aug 2011, 13:34
@parapunter


Can't you people all go and live together in some underground militia commune to talk endlessly about guns, muslims, wogs & queers- preferably without an internet connection & leave the real world to realistic people\\

..and can't all you people who think these violent , thieving, scumbag shits are hard-done by whilst enjoying a life-on-benefits, tick the box that says you will voluntarily pay 500% more income tax to pay for their life-style ?

I have also always wondered why petrol-bomb throwers are not automatically assumed to be "attempted murderers ": I think it reasonable that they should be shot . I don't know if this would improve matters over the long-term , but would thin out the ranks of the scum.

parabellum
7th Aug 2011, 13:42
Yes Sir! I go with that too. In many countries looting in times of crisis is a "shot on sight" offence, no questions asked. If they are screaming for "Justice" do they really expect to find it in a shopping trolley full of stolen goods?

P.S. Where are all the "It was the Police's fault" crowd here on PPRuNe?

racedo
7th Aug 2011, 13:51
"It's the Police's fault, whatever" brigade,

Probably because most people here have had to work for a living and pay tax at some point in their careers.

LapSap
7th Aug 2011, 14:03
Since when does Man Shot = Steal Plasma TV?
:mad: Morons.

dazpoo23
7th Aug 2011, 14:26
So.. .multiple witness reports state the deceased was dragged from the vehicle and shot while 'pinned' to the ground. Is this not an issue for any of you?

Its sad to see this story descend into an oscillation between blacks as a problem and blacks as a victim Its the principle mechanism through which race is pushed outside of history and into the realm of natural inevitable events.

racedo
7th Aug 2011, 14:27
So.. .multiple witness reports state the deceased was dragged from the vehicle and shot while 'pinned' to the ground. Is this not an issue for any of you?

So how did he fire his gun then ?

crippen
7th Aug 2011, 14:50
http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/01965/RTV_DugganProtest__1965941c.jpg

A protest about the killing.

stuckgear
7th Aug 2011, 15:03
On on hand complaints on inner city estates that the police dont tackle the crime problems and deal with the gangsters that control the area, then, when a gangster, who moves around in public armed with an illegal weapon refuses to aprehended by a police officer and shoots an officer meets the repercussions of his actions they protest and riot.


no one wants to take responsibility for their own actions in this country, i really don't recognise what this country has become any more.
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/08/07/article-2023254-0D559E8D00000578-858_964x676.jpg


To be fair to the police, it seems that they handled (are handling) this unexpected outbreak of violence pretty well.


should be comforting to those who's homes and businesses have gone up in smoke.

Scum, inhabited by scum, who revel in scum, who support and admire scum. Welcome to the Olympic City 2012.

hellsbrink
7th Aug 2011, 15:12
multiple witness reports state the deceased was dragged from the vehicle and shot while 'pinned' to the ground. Is this not an issue for any of you?

I would say the multiple witnesses who saw him fire his gun at least once, and possibly twice since reports are that 4 shots in total were fired and only two came from a police MP5, at the police before one officer let off two rounds, killing the scrote, are a damn sight more credible than the ones in your version of events.

Of course, the locals there could have been confused by people trying to keep the scrote alive AFTER he was shot, but we won't let reality get in the way of a good attack on the police.

chksix
7th Aug 2011, 15:17
I saw it on the news this morning and was certain it was about some riots in Nigeria. :sad:

G-CPTN
7th Aug 2011, 15:17
Scope for some urban regeneration (and development) there.

Should provide jobs . . .

Hope they were adequately insured.

The business on the corner was a jewellery shop, then a Post Office next to the (purple) hairdresser's premises:-
London N17 9SX - Google Maps (http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=+London+N17+9SX&hl=en&ll=51.594744,-0.069259&spn=0.003219,0.00868&sll=51.592002,-0.069952&sspn=0.006372,0.017359&t=h&z=17&layer=c&cbll=51.594744,-0.069259&panoid=tgR_TpAS14puqTdAFDcJeA&cbp=12,110.24,,0,0)

Ancient Observer
7th Aug 2011, 15:22
Whenever there are warm evenings and the chance of a looting frenzy, "protesters" will gather in order to carry away some nice flat-screen tv.s.

In future, I propose that NO judge could be appointed to the UK Supreme Court unless they have lived for 10 years on the Broadwater Farm estate, or some other Highly Desireable estate in Peckham.

Broadwater Farm - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Broadwater_Farm#The_Broadwater_Farm_Estate)

B Fraser
7th Aug 2011, 15:30
The placards in the photo say "What about his children ?" or point out that he was a "family man". Well maybe if he had taken his kids swimming or was working to feed them instead of running around with a gun.........

Never let the obvious get in the way of playing the victim card.

Vuka Nkuzi
7th Aug 2011, 15:36
Quite a difference between the Britain of today and the Britain of 1907 when the Parade next door was built. The Edwardians of your country were a superior race of people to those that live there today. The Queen should go on television and complain about rioting in her realm.

Storminnorm
7th Aug 2011, 15:55
I'd like to see her turn out in an armoured car, brandishing
a machine gun.

Vuka Nkuzi
7th Aug 2011, 16:02
It looks just like the precision bombing you see on TV. Was the looting that precise? In the good old days when riots used to happen in Alexandria the rioters were very careful whose shops they destroyed.

OFSO
7th Aug 2011, 17:02
After the last set of G7 riots we had here in Barcelona - very violent - police released statistics on the arrested persons.

No one was surprised that a sizeable minority were illegal immigrants from outside the EU zone with no knowledge of the purpose of the (originally peaceful) demonstration march against globalisation.

Many didn't even speak Castilliano or Catalan, but just joined in when the window-smashing-and-looting in the Passeig de Gracia started.

And as usual one heard the older generation (and not just the older generation) say that such things would never have happened when Franco was alive.

************************************************

Sorry, but I'm with the law-and-order on this one. I pay my taxes and if a situation arises where I'm no longer able to protect myself, family and house, I expect public order to be maintained by the authorities -and yes, at any cost.

And don't even dare to suggest that the "rights" - let alone the life - of some thieving little git or slimy drug dealer is worth the same as mine or my wife's. They surendered such "rights" when they chose their lifestyle.

radeng
7th Aug 2011, 17:08
OFSO,

As a bleeding heart liberal, I agree with you.

If you shoot at the police, expect what you get.

Unless you are Stephen Waldorf.....

Parapunter
7th Aug 2011, 17:25
Or a Brazillian sparks going to work. Well said Radeng.

Steven Waldorf, the best advert for not buying a yellow mini there ever was. Hey boys, just the cost of doing business eh?:mad:

22 Degree Halo
7th Aug 2011, 17:27
So, we gonna get a repeat tonight?

stuckgear
7th Aug 2011, 17:42
So, we gonna get a repeat tonight?


Nope, they'll be too busy to 'protest' listing their looted goods on gumtree and fleabay.

Besides, Law and Order: UK is on ITV1 London at 9pm.

Al Fakhem
7th Aug 2011, 17:47
Another night in the ghetto.

stuckgear
7th Aug 2011, 18:15
Another night in the ghetto.


MP's are embarking on a scheme to incentivise/persuade businesses to seek alternative ways of operating druing the Olympics, like telecommuting and video-conferencing instead of having people commute into work as the public transport system is likely to collapse during the Olympics.

So, a crumbling public transport system operating over its capacity, in an expensive and over priced city, where the locals go on rampage riots becuase a gangsta is killed in the process of trying to evade arrest and attempting to murder a police officer..

Best advert for the London, home of the 2012 Olympics.

London today is a $hit hole and I say this as someone who was born and partly grew up in SW1 in what is seems was another era.

racedo
7th Aug 2011, 18:21
Nope as P.C. Rain is on patrol tonight.

Nobody riots when P.C. Rain, Wind, Snow are on patrol.

Lon More
7th Aug 2011, 19:14
I despair; a **** like Boris at the top and this lot at the bottom.

stuckgear
7th Aug 2011, 19:49
I despair; a **** like Boris at the top


what ! instead of t0sspot ken ?

SpringHeeledJack
7th Aug 2011, 19:59
One for the road...

‪The Clash - London's Burning (live)‬‏ - YouTube

It might be time to consider an equivalent to the Frenchie's CRS, they weren't messed around with when I lived in France and seemed to quell most public disorder incidents quickly. As someone said although large chains will have responsive insurance cover, it's all the little traders who will be choking on the ashes of their businesses when it all quietens down and that is pretty tragic for the local economy.


SHJ

OFSO
7th Aug 2011, 21:27
the Frenchie's CRS

..who appear like magic. Once upon a time Mrs OFSO and I were walking down a quiet backstreet lined with rather posh houses in central Paris when an elderly lady tripped and fell in the road about 20 metres away.

Before we could react, burly men in blue uniforms with plastic body armour, helmets with visors and carrying (I think ) H & K UMPs appeared as out of nowhere, picked up the wrinkly, stood her on her feet, dusted her down, walked her to the nearest pavement...and disappeared again. They were obviously discretely guarding a residence nearby.

One imagines any attempt at civil disobedience would be quashed instanters and probably without unnecessary recourse to the judicial system.

Parapunter
7th Aug 2011, 21:40
I once did a runner from a restaurant in Nantes, legging it round the corner, straight into a whole squad of CRS. I kept going, they looked on insouciantly.

One in the eye for yer Frenchies!:rolleyes:

FirstOfficer
7th Aug 2011, 21:46
Now there seems to be some youths trying to cause problems in Enfield... It is quiet so far... But they are around wanting trouble.

Nervous SLF
7th Aug 2011, 21:49
Re Insurance, I am sure when I lived in the UK Insurance companies made it quite clear that they would not cover damage caused by riot ?

Got to feel for the small business owners as someone said they are the real victims here.

stuckgear
7th Aug 2011, 21:51
Typical of Ken Livingstone, typical of the left, never miss an opportunity to plug your own campaign or blame the Tories.


Ken Livingstone has issued a statement following the events in Tottenham.

[...]

The economic stagnation and cuts being imposed by the Tory government inevitably create social division

http://www.kenlivingstone.com/tottenham

Shame the [email protected] can't understand that the UK doesn't have a Tory Government, but a coalition government.

Nervous SLF
7th Aug 2011, 22:35
Initial ballistics tests on the bullet that lodged in a police officer's radio when Mark Duggan died on Thursday night show it was a police issue bullet, the Guardian understands.
The Guardian's crime correspondent, Sandra Laville, reports:


The revelation will fuel the fury in Tottenham about the killing of Mark Duggan by armed officers.

It also undermines suggestions that there was an exchange of fire between Duggan and the police before he died.

The bullet which was found lodged in the radio of one of the officers at the scene is still undergoing forensic tests. But reliable sources have said the first ballistics examinations suggested it was a police issue bullet.

These are very distinct as the Metropolitan Police uses dum dum type hollowed out bullets designed not to pass through an object.

The early suggestion from the IPCC was that the Met officers had returned fire after someone in the minicab opened fire. But the result of the ballistics early test suggests both shots fired came from the police.

Lord Spandex Masher
7th Aug 2011, 22:38
Erm, so the cops shot at themselves?!

Parapunter
7th Aug 2011, 22:43
Well, if this turns out to be true, then I guess we'll see another round of back pedalling, come to think of it, the 2nd in as many weeks from the gun jumpers round these parts.

The same people who've reacted in the same way ever since I've been coming here these past ten years. I have in mind the day they shot Jean Charles De Menezes & a distinguished poster expressed his feelings thus: "Good" within about ten minutes of the thread opening.

Not that I'm jumping the gun or anything.

tony draper
7th Aug 2011, 22:47
So the police have special 9 mm rounds with Met stamped upon em and the gangsters have Gang Banger stamped on theirs? :confused:
If you have a illegal firearm tiz quite possible you also have illegal hollow point ammo for same.
Not even sure if hollow points are illegal in countries where firearm ownership is not frowned upon.

racedo
7th Aug 2011, 23:20
Sorry guys but Operation Trident was set up because of Black on Black murders and a cry from within the community that the Police were not doing anything while the community acted out its own form of Darwinism.

421dog
7th Aug 2011, 23:28
Ok... In those countries wherein we let folks run around with handguns, we'd generally like them to leave their Joules where they aimed them. Fran
Frangible bullets (ie. Dum dums, hollow points, explosive bullets or whatever else you wanna call them) are just alternate names for rounds that expend all of their energy in whatever you shoot them at.
There's nothing wrong with that.

The lowest redneck from the darkest part of the most democratic county in west Virginia, will tell you that you'd better be darned shure of what you're looking at when you pull the trigger.

Of course, with the advent of the nanny state, it probably is really someone else's fault when someone pops a cap in an innocent.

Ozzy
7th Aug 2011, 23:29
Rioters and looters, mow them down. Ask questions later. They won't be looting again that's for sure.

Ozzy

hellsbrink
8th Aug 2011, 02:46
These are very distinct as the Metropolitan Police uses dum dum type hollowed out bullets designed not to pass through an object.

Of course, it must be police issue as the criminals would never use hollow points.......



Ooops, they do. Here's one report from Manchester dated 01/08/2011

Terrifying arsenal of weapons found in teaching assistant's Newall Green home | Manchester Evening News - menmedia.co.uk (http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/news/crime/s/1454309_terrifying-arsenal-of-weapons-found-in-teaching-assistants-newall-green-home)

And another from a year ago

James Bond-style weapon makers jailed for 23 years | Metro.co.uk (http://www.metro.co.uk/news/837685-james-bond-style-weapon-makers-jailed-for-23-years)

Oops, another one from January this year

A man from Lydbrook (Gloucestershire) who shot himself in the arm whilst he was drunk and depressed with a handgun he had made himself admitted manufacturing a prohibited weapon, possessing the weapon and possessing a round of hollow point exploding ammunition - he was given a 3 year 4 month sentence.


I could go on. The bottom line is that the round recovered is still being tested so anything said just now is speculation.

Jane-DoH
8th Aug 2011, 03:22
Uprisings like this worry the hell out of me. They aren't usually productive, and often end up making things worse. These kinds of riots can result in government crackdowns, with the possibility that the government will eventually act under the premise that all protesters and dissidents are terrorists.

This will of course embolden other nations to do the same.

SASless
8th Aug 2011, 05:00
The standard pistol round has become the Hollow Point variety and the solid bullet has become more a target round. The military still use round nose (military ball) out some sad adherence to International Accords.

The mere fact a Hollow Point bullet was fired....does not rule out the use by the Perp. Ballistics testing of the bullet for lands and grooves (caused by rifling wiithin the weapon's barrel), bullet size and construction, retained weight, and chemical composition will be used to confirm which weapon fired the round.

Shell casings will bear marks upon the Primer, extraction marks if auto loading, and scoring from imperfections in the weapon's bore that can connect a fired casing to a particular weapon and thus confirm if the weapon has been fired.

So....if the dead guy had a weapon, it can be determined if he fired it....and if the bullet that hit the radio was the one from his weapon. The only snag could be if the bullet in question is so shattered as to make those tests unreliable....but that is very rare.

hellsbrink
8th Aug 2011, 05:14
Uprisings like this worry the hell out of me

Jane, it wasn't an "uprising", it was a bunch of knobends going on a rampage.

Try and see the reality in things at least once, will ya.

:ugh:

Cacophonix
8th Aug 2011, 08:22
Was the looting that precise? In the good old days when riots used to happen in Alexandria the rioters were very careful whose shops they destroyed.

My gosh you are South African. I have many bad memories of riots and the townships... If half the armchair generals here had half a clue eh!

Caco

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 08:32
Brixton, Walthamstow, Enfield..

Perhaps this is the Chav Spring ?

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 08:34
My gosh you are South African. I have many bad memories of riots and the townships... If half the armchair generals here had half a clue eh!



'Necklaces for peace' was a winning action eh !

Capetonian
8th Aug 2011, 08:42
Lon More

No reason why the Sefefrikaan solution would work in the UK. It doesn't even work in SeffEfrika

Rather an ignorant and biased comment. First of all the two situations are not really comparable, and in any case it is quite clear that the UK solution is not working in the UK, so do you have a better one?

By the way it's South Africa (noun, name of the country), and South African (adjective or noun.).

IB4138
8th Aug 2011, 08:48
The Met Police should request the EDL and BNP to send in their private "army" to quell the criminals causing all the ruck, judging by the photos of the miscreants.

Would maybe kill two birds with one stone, so to speak.

Lon More
8th Aug 2011, 08:51
Capetonian wroteRather an ignorant and biased comment.
Pot, kettle, black?

the two situations are not really comparable
Then why sugest the Seffefrikaan solution?

Time for the police to get the kid gloves off and start using machine guns against these vermin.
Terreblanche lives on. SefEkrikaan describes the mind-set of a percentage of the population whose wardrobe would seem to consist only of kahki and who still use the term "Boy"

SpringHeeledJack
8th Aug 2011, 09:02
Brixton, Walthamstow, Enfield..

Perhaps this is the Chav Spring ?

:D Humour in tragedy.....

As I was listening to the radio talk show last night to lull me off to sleep, there was caller after caller phoning in with live reports of incidents all over the city, though in areas with certain ethnic demographics it must be said. The general picture was that yoofs, mainly 'black and asian' were coming from outside these areas and targeting businesses with 'stuff' that was desirable to them and simply looting en masse. Whilst saturday's events might have had a trigger of perceived injustice, all the others have been about gang orientated criminal activity carried out by said yoofs emboldened by the seeming inaction of the police for whatever reasons as yet unknown. Sadly the only way to deal effectively with said miscreants is to come down very hard on them, anything else will be laughed off.



SHJ

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 09:11
meanwhile...


Scotland Yard said officers were called at 4.15am on Saturday to Waylett Place, West Norwood.
The 20-year-old victim from Manor Park, east London, was taken to hospital suffering from gunshot wounds to the chest, and died just after at 5.30am, a police spokesman said.
A post-mortem examination gave Mr Famakinwa's cause of death as a gunshot wound.
Detective Chief Inspector Caroline Goode, from the Homicide and Serious Crime Command, said: "We now know Daniel had been out dancing that night with a group of friends and afterwards they were waiting for a bus at the bus stop at Waylett Place and Norwood Road.

"There was an altercation between Daniel's group and another group of black men who were also waiting at the bus stop which has resulted in Daniel being killed.

London Bus Stop Shooting Victim Is Named | LBC (http://www.lbc.co.uk/london-bus-stop-shooting-victim-is-named-43281)

Any riots /looting ? No? So it's ok if black on black shootings happen.

also just heard on LBC, a near riot broke out at King College hospital when two rival gangs who's members were being treated for stab wounds kicked off.

Best advert for the London Olympics 2012.

What a $hit hole the capital is.

tony draper
8th Aug 2011, 09:13
Said it many times, the Police have been castrated and now the very people who wielded the knife whine because they are impotent.
They sowed they wind now they can reap it.
:suspect:

pulse1
8th Aug 2011, 09:14
In a local museum there is an old notice which warns that anyone who vandalises public property will be deported. If they are under 18 years old they will be publicly whipped before deportation.

I think that Somalia would make a good destination for deportation these days. If these hooligans want to live in a society based on violence and disorder, why not give it to them. Ship them all out.

sitigeltfel
8th Aug 2011, 09:14
The Met Police should request the EDL and BNP to send in their private "army" to quell the criminals causing all the ruck, judging by the photos of the miscreants.

If it had been the Right causing the bovver, then the police would have come down hard. The Left and ethnics are allowed to rampage unchallenged.

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 09:15
If it had been the Right causing the bovver, then the police would have come down hard. The Left and ethnics are allowed to rampage unchallenged.


it's called vibrant multiculturalism.


FIFO.

Cacophonix
8th Aug 2011, 09:19
London is a great place. It has seen riots before and no doubt it will see them again.

Just spoken to the more harmonious side of the Cacophonix equation. She is working in Olympia and was quite amused by my concern. No evidence of any trouble and just another day in one of the world's greatest capitals.

Caco

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 09:21
Officers injured as gangs attempt to 'trap' police on Brixton estate

Officers injured as gangs attempt to 'trap' police on Brixton estate - Telegraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/8687969/Officers-injured-as-gangs-attempt-to-trap-police-on-Brixton-estate.html)


The hand-wringing has started...

Tottenham riot: a community blighted by drugs and gun crime

Tottenham riot: a community blighted by drugs and gun crime - Telegraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/8687487/Tottenham-riot-a-community-blighted-by-drugs-and-gun-crime.html)

So when a gang leader who carries an illegal firearm resists arrest and dies in the process, the communitee responds by looting and riots. Yeah! It's always someone else's fault. You cant make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 09:23
Must be a Para TA unit which could do with a bit of civil control training.


More appropriately move in the sanitation workers and wash the looters/rioters into the sewers with all the other turds.

Cacophonix
8th Aug 2011, 09:25
Stuckgear, get out. Take a walk look at the sky. Try and be happy! :ok:

yotty
8th Aug 2011, 09:32
No way the locals would tear up their own patch! Must have been an outside job!:*

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 09:44
Stuckgear, get out. Take a walk look at the sky. Try and be happy! http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/thumbs.gif


mmmmm. rioting and looting is cool huh.

buffoon.

Parapunter
8th Aug 2011, 09:45
Now now SG, let's not descend into the personal. Your missives are usually such good reads, Personally I'd be happy for you to keep it that way.;)

Cacophonix
8th Aug 2011, 09:46
Stuckgear

You sir, I maintain, should cool it before your bile drowns you!

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 09:47
point taken Para.

Caco, no bile, just fact.

Cacophonix
8th Aug 2011, 09:51
And by the way Stuckgear I have very good reason to know that riots aren't cool. Not cool at all!

Moderation in everything. Moderation in everything.

Caco

Al Fakhem
8th Aug 2011, 09:53
Enoch Powell was spot on!

tony draper
8th Aug 2011, 09:55
Injustice!!!...down with injustice!! right lads lets storm Currys.:rolleyes:
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a194/Deaddogbay/storming_the_bastille1.jpg

Flap 5
8th Aug 2011, 09:57
Enoch Powell was spot on!

I think your handle should be Fakhem Al.

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 09:57
And by the way Stuckgear I have very good reason to know that riots aren't cool. Not cool at all!

Moderation in everything. Moderation in everything.


Your exclusion of looting is noted. So, Moderate rioting is ok, as is looting.

Thanks for the clarification.

:ok:

Cacophonix
8th Aug 2011, 10:02
Stuckgear you really are off on a tangent today and know little of what I speak I suspect.

Try and maintain some equilibrium, old chap.

You don't always seems a bad sort! :ok:

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 10:10
Caco,

I'm yanking your chain. Take a walk, enjoy the blue sky; Your bile will drown you.

Cacophonix
8th Aug 2011, 10:14
Take a walk, enjoy the blue sky; Your bile will drown you.

I'll be in good company then eh! ;)

rh200
8th Aug 2011, 10:33
At this stage I'm thinking the machine gunning idea's the best, act like savages treat them like savages, think a American president said that once.

The problem is there's no fear any more, and young people are getting to understand that the authority's actually have no control unless they use deadly force. Hence you get things like this, out of control partys, riots etc etc. The police can only enforce order, if they are backed up by the community, or by the point of a gun.

Blacksheep
8th Aug 2011, 10:38
Perhaps alone among those posting here, I have an emotional involvement in Tottenham. Our youngest daughter lives there. She and her partner bought a ground floor flat hard by Seven Sisters tube station, as they were able to afford a mortgage there. We spent Saturday night glued to the TV watching the progress of the riot as it moved away from the well defended Monument Street and Seven Sisters towards White Hart Lane. Then in the early hours, looters appeared, back in Tottenham Hale just along from Seven Sisters, helping themselves to the contents of the shops at the Tottenham Hale Retail Park and even cooking their own breakfasts at McDonalds. Thankfully these were mostly peaceful family "shoppers" taking advantage of the early morning Bonanza Sale.

Word on the street in Tottenham on Friday was that the police had called on a man to stop as he was running away and then shot him when he failed to respond. They also shot one of their own coming from the opposite direction. And that, gentlemen, is the reason why a large group were holding a silent vigil outside Tottenham Police station on Saturday afternoon, while waiting for an official statement from the police. That the very tense situation in Tottenham erupted into a violent riot is not all that surprising, given the "facts" being circulated from large numbers of people who say they witnessed the events outside Tottenham Hale tube station in broad daylight at 6.15 pm on a Thursday evening.

Whether or not the rumours are a true reflection of what actually happened is neither here nor there, in "The 'Hood" the word on the street is what matters. The silence of the IPCC and the Police has created a very bad situation that will not be helped by continuing to hide behind the official " we cannot comment as the matter is under investigation" policy.

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 10:38
The police can only enforce order, if they are backed up by the community,


It would seem in this case that the community support a gang leader who carries an illegal firearm and resists arrest, all the while community leaders moan that their estates are run by criminals and no go areas for the police.

Never let a good opportunity for opportunity for rioting and looting go amiss, even if it is moderate.

Storminnorm
8th Aug 2011, 10:47
Anybody want to buy a new telly?
A bit scratched and singed, but works OK.

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 10:50
Word on the street in Tottenham on Friday was that the police had called on a man to stop as he was running away and then shot him when he failed to respond. They also shot one of their own coming from the opposite direction. And that, gentlemen, is the reason why a large group were holding a silent vigil outside Tottenham Police station on Saturday afternoon


Dont know about that version of events


Dated Friday 5th:

THE DEATH of a Tottenham man last night came after a pre-planned operation to arrest him, police have confirmed.
A 29-year-old man, named locally as father-of-four Mark Duggan, was shot twice by an officer from the Metropolitan Police's specialist firearms team CO19 in Ferry Lane, as part of the force's Operation Trident after a shoot-out at about 6.15pm.

The officer who was shot at appears to have been saved by his police radio, after a bullet was found lodged in it. The officer was taken to hospital but later discharged.

The Independent Police Complaint Commission, which is investigating the shooting, said that officers stopped a minicab in Ferry Lane to arrest the 29-year-old passenger, but the attempt ended in him dying at the scene.
Operation Trident was set up by the Met in 1998 to investigate gun crime in London's black community



Mark Duggan AKA Starrish Mark:


... the man whose violent death triggered the Tottenham riots at the weekend makes an unlikely martyr.


On the streets of the Broadwater Farm estate, where Mark Duggan grew up, he was also known by another name: ‘Starrish Mark’.


It sounds like an innocent nickname; it was anything but. In fact, the word ‘Starrish’ denoted his membership of a notorious ‘crew’ called The Star Gang who strut the streets of London’s N17.

The stock-in-trade of such ‘postcode’ gangs is violence, intimidation and, more often than not, drugs.

Duggan himself, according to some residents, was a crack cocaine dealer who routinely carried a gun.




It was an argument over a woman and drugs, they say, that resulted in the death of his cousin Kelvin Easton, 23, who was stabbed through the heart with a broken champagne bottle at the Boheme nightclub in Bow, east London, in March this year.

‘Duggan was paranoid about what happened to his cousin,’ said one local. ‘He had a gun to protect himself because of what happened to Kelvin.’



Operation Trident:

Operation Trident or Trident, is a Metropolitan Police Service unit set up to investigate and inform communities of gun crime in London's black community, with special attention being placed on shootings relating to the illegal sale of drugs. The initiative was set up in March 1998 by members of the black community following a series of shootings in the London boroughs of Lambeth, and Brent.

OFSO
8th Aug 2011, 10:59
Many years ago when I had a house in rural France (Haute Savoie) , I was told of someone nearby whose rural house was broken into several times when he was away.

This individual then built an explosive device inside a large boombox radio, which he marked "danger: explosive device" and locked and padlocked in a cupboard, also marked "danger - explosives". He locked his house as usual before going on a business trip, having placed yet another warning notice on the front door. All of these precautions were photographed by the householder.

A week or so later some local yoof was admitted to hospital with both his hands blown off at the wrist, and at the instigation of the said youth's parents the householder was prosecuted. The Judge found that the householder had taken suffiecient precautions to warn visitors of the dangers of explosives in the house and could not be held responsible for subsequent events. He was borne from the court on the shoulders of supporters who were fellow house owners and many of whom had experienced thievery from the same youth.

Now for the interesting bit: in recounting this story to English people, on several occasions I was amazed to be asked: "Surely you're not suggesting that the loss of both hands was an appropriate punishment for just a minor act of theft ?"

Imagine the results if the police implemented the many excellent suggestions on this thread and actually shot some of the London rioters. Oh, the wailing, the hand-wringing, the bleating about "human rights" and "they were only young people".

What HAS gone wrong with our system of values today ? String 'em up !

rh200
8th Aug 2011, 11:03
The silence of the IPCC and the Police has created a very bad situation that will not be helped by continuing to hide behind the official " we cannot comment as the matter is under investigation" policy.And that is part of the problem, every one wants instant answers, then when they get them, and they don't turn out right they are accused of coverups. This is not new, that's why they say, wait until the facts are known.

The other month an aussie soldier was killed, in a camp some where in Afganistan. The story changed stuff knows how many times in a few days, at this stage I don't even know what the end result is, lost interest.

And there's the problem, we won't stop and wait, then pick at the answers if needed. You are correct about the word on the street bit though, its irrelavent what the truth is, only what is believed.

Lord Spandex Masher
8th Aug 2011, 11:04
Clegg has "utterly condemned" the violence and looting.

Well done, what are you going to do about it then?

IB4138
8th Aug 2011, 11:04
Surely, if footballers are allowed to play for the countries of their grand father's birth, then deportation of these rioting miscreants should also follow suit on similar lines.

maliyahsdad2
8th Aug 2011, 11:13
Apparently, after the looting of the Carpet right building, Tottenham is now awash with rug dealers!

G-CPTN
8th Aug 2011, 11:15
Diane Abbott, (black) Labour MP for nearby Hackney has announced that the current government is responsible for the rioting.

OFSO
8th Aug 2011, 11:32
The Riot Act[1] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riot_Act#cite_note-0) (1714) (1 Geo.1 St.2 c.5) was an Act (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Act_of_Parliament) of the Parliament of Great Britain (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parliament_of_Great_Britain) that authorised local authorities (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Local_government_in_the_United_Kingdom) to declare any group of twelve or more people to be unlawfully assembled, and thus have to disperse or face punitive action. The Act, whose long title (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_title) was "An act for preventing tumults and riotous assemblies, and for the more speedy and effectual punishing the rioters", came into force (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coming_into_force) on 1 August 1715, and remained on the statute books until 1973.
Contents


[hide (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riot_Act#)]

1 Introduction and purpose (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riot_Act#Introduction_and_purpose)
2 Main provisions (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riot_Act#Main_provisions)

2.1 Proclamation of riotous assembly (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riot_Act#Proclamation_of_riotous_assembly)
2.2 Consequences of disregarding the proclamation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riot_Act#Consequences_of_disregarding_the_proclamation)
2.3 Other provisions (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riot_Act#Other_provisions)

3 Subsequent history of the Riot Act in the UK (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riot_Act#Subsequent_history_of_the_Riot_Act_in_the_UK)
4 The Riot Act in other countries (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riot_Act#The_Riot_Act_in_other_countries)

4.1 Australia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riot_Act#Australia)
4.2 Belize (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riot_Act#Belize)
4.3 Canada (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riot_Act#Canada)
4.4 United States (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riot_Act#United_States)

5 "Read the Riot Act" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riot_Act#.22Read_the_Riot_Act.22)
6 Notes (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riot_Act#Notes)
7 See also (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riot_Act#See_also)
8 External links (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riot_Act#External_links)
Introduction and purpose

The Riot Act was introduced during a time of civil disturbance in Great Britain (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Britain), such as the Sacheverell riots (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sacheverell_riots). The preamble makes reference to "many rebellious riots and tumults [that] have been [taking place of late] in divers parts of this kingdom", adding that those involved "presum[e] so to do, for that the punishments provided by the laws now in being are not adequate to such heinous offences".

Main provisions

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/f/f9/The_Riot_Act_text.jpg/220px-The_Riot_Act_text.jpg (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:The_Riot_Act_text.jpg) http://bits.wikimedia.org/skins-1.17/common/images/magnify-clip.png (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:The_Riot_Act_text.jpg)
The full Riot Act. The lower part contains the proclamation that was to be read out loud.


Proclamation of riotous assembly

The act created a mechanism for certain local officials to make a proclamation ordering the dispersal of any group of more than twelve people who were "unlawfully, riotously, and tumultuously assembled together". If the group failed to disperse within one hour, then anyone remaining gathered was guilty of a felony (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Felony) without benefit of clergy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benefit_of_clergy), punishable by death.
The proclamation could be made in an incorporated town or city by the Mayor (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mayor), Bailiff (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bailiff) or "other head officer", or a Justice of the Peace (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Justice_of_the_Peace). Elsewhere it could be made by a Justice of the Peace or the Sheriff (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sheriff) or Under-Sheriff. It had to be read out to the gathering concerned, and had to follow precise wording detailed in the act; several convictions were overturned because parts of the proclamation had been omitted, in particular "God save the King".[2] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riot_Act#cite_note-1)
The wording that had to be read out to the assembled gathering was as follows:
Our Sovereign Lord the King chargeth and commandeth all persons, being assembled, immediately to disperse themselves, and peaceably to depart to their habitations, or to their lawful business, upon the pains contained in the act made in the first year of King George, for preventing tumults and riotous assemblies. God Save the King!

Consequences of disregarding the proclamation

If a group of people failed to disperse within one hour of the proclamation, the act provided that the authorities could use force to disperse them. Anyone assisting with the dispersal was specifically indemnified against any legal consequences in the event of any of the crowd being injured or killed.
Because of the broad authority that the act granted, it was used both for the maintenance of civil order and for political means. A particularly notorious use of the act was the Peterloo Massacre (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peterloo_Massacre) of 1819 in Manchester (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manchester).

Other provisions

The act also made it a felony punishable by death without benefit of clergy for "any persons unlawfully, riotously and tumultuously assembled together" to cause (or begin to cause) serious damage to places of religious worship, houses, barns, and stables.
In the event of buildings being damaged in areas that were not incorporated into a town or city, the residents of the hundred (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hundred_(division)) were made liable to pay damages to the property owners concerned. Unlike the rest of the act, this required a civil action. In the case of incorporated areas, the action could be brought against two or more named individuals.
Prosecutions under the act were restricted to within one year of the event.
Subsequent history of the Riot Act in the UK

The Riot Act caused unfortunate confusion during the Gordon Riots (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gordon_Riots) of 1780, when the authorities felt uncertain of their power to take action to stop the riots without a reading of the Riot Act. After the riots, Lord Mansfield observed that the Riot Act did not take away the pre-existing power of the authorities to use force to stop a violent riot; it only created the additional offence of failing to disperse after a reading of the Riot Act.
The death penalty created by sections 1 and 4 and 5 of the Act was reduced to transportation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penal_transportation) for life by section 1 of the Punishment of Offences Act (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Punishment_of_Offences_Act).
The Riot Act drifted into disuse. The last time it was read in the United Kingdom was in connection with a delinquency at the bonfire festivities in Chiddingfold in 1929 and prior to that in Birkenhead (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Birkenhead) on 3 August 1919, during the second police strike when large numbers of police officers from Birkenhead, Liverpool and Bootle joined the strike.[3] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riot_Act#cite_note-2) Troops were called in to deal with rioting and looting that sprang up, and a magistrate read out the Riot Act. None of the rioters subsequently faced the charge of a statutory felony.[citation needed (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed)]
The Act was repealed on 18 July 1973 for the United Kingdom by the Statute Law (Repeals) Act 1973[4] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riot_Act#cite_note-3) (by which time riot was no longer punishable by death).
At the battle of George Square (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_George_Square) on the 31 January 1919 in Glasgow (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glasgow), the city's sheriff was in the process of reading the riot act to a crowd of 90,000 – when the sheet of paper he was reading from was ripped out of his hands by one of the rioters.
The Riot (Damages) Act 1886 provides compensation for Losses by Riots.[5] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riot_Act#cite_note-4)

Utrinque Apparatus
8th Aug 2011, 11:32
G-CPTN

Phew, lucky her son goes to a private school in a much more select area of London or the poor wee disadvantaged ethnic minority might have been caught up in the riots. She is all that is hypocritical and wrong with the left in the UK. New Labour destroyed the economy and built up a bloated public sector, while ignoring the decaying inner cities and spending huge cash windfalls on pet projects with absolutely nothing to show for it.

Brown took the brakes off the banks too, in another smart move to match that of selling off the country's Gold reserves at bargain basement prices. He was a bigger and more destructive looter than any of the tw*ts in Tottenham, Brixton or Enfield

How can anyone sort out the usual Labour bankruptcy inheritance in just over a year ?

sitigeltfel
8th Aug 2011, 11:41
The Home Secretary, Theresa May is flying back from holiday.

That'll sort them out!

Blacksheep
8th Aug 2011, 11:57
Dont know about that version of eventsMark Duggan AKA Starrish Mark:Operation Trident:You forgot to quote this bit of my post...
Whether or not the rumours are a true reflection of what actually happened is neither here nor there, in "The 'Hood" the word on the street is what matters.

MagnusP
8th Aug 2011, 11:59
"Surely you're not suggesting that the loss of both hands was an appropriate punishment for just a minor act of theft ?"

Did any of them ask "Surely you're not suggesting that being burgled was an appropriate punishment for just a minor act of going on holiday?"

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 13:09
Blacksheep, dont get get me wrong, i wasnt having a pop at you or your post, it was indeed very poigniant and relative.

the information i posted following your post was/is common knowledge and directly relates to the weekend's events, yet fact is disregarded by those in the communinee as some kind of justification for mass lawlessness.

in response to Diane Abbott's mewlings, it's two faced, lefty t0ss holes like her that are directly to blame for events such as these, while playing pass the pass parcel with responsibility and seeking to politicisize such events, it detracts from the responsibilities of those who took such actions. You throw a concrete slab through the local Currys window and load up with laptops and flat screen TV's that your fault not anyone elses.

Labour brought the victim culture forward, the i loot, riot, rape, murder and i'm the victim.. well f:mad:k the lot of them, take some personal responsibility.

The whole situation is a prime example:

A known gang leader, crack dealer resists arrest and is in posession of an illegal firearm.. and dies. suddenly he's a family man and he's the victim. it's the likes of Dianne Abbott that perpetuate this [email protected]

he took responsibility for his actions with high velocity lead poisoning. tough.

crippen
8th Aug 2011, 13:17
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/08/08/article-2023554-0D58092100000578-911_308x591.jpg

Sitting on a stereo dumped outside a looted Curry's, this woman was one of 100 arrested in a second night of violence and looting in London.

:suspect: Tottenham riot: 100 arrested as it emerges top officer flew on holiday hours before carnage | Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2023554/Tottenham-riot-100-arrested-emerges-officer-flew-holiday-hours-carnage.html)

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 13:21
I love the Daily Rage's missive there "100 arrested as it emerges top officer flew on holiday hours before carnage" | Mail Online

What's the world coming to when senior officials dont look into the future and act before hand.

Sheesh you just cant get the staff these days !

Evanelpus
8th Aug 2011, 13:44
Time for the police to get the kid gloves off and start using machine guns against these vermin.

A little over the top but not by much.

Why should our Police men and women have to put up with having stones, rocks and petrol bombs thrown at them by scum who don't know what they are doing there in the first place but fancy a ruck and a free telly.

Let the shackles off the police and let them baton charge these hooligans and give them a dose of their own medicine. Leave a few with brain damage and it might make the rest think about what will happen to them if the rozzers catch up with them.

Not very PC but I'm sick and tired by PCness and watching my great country go down the Kermit faster than Usain Bolt.

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 13:47
Leave a few with brain damage

It's doubtful if they have the required physical attributes !

sitigeltfel
8th Aug 2011, 13:49
As previously mentioned, resurrect the riot act. Bring it up to date by mass messaging every mobile phone in the area, then go in..... HARD.

rab-k
8th Aug 2011, 14:11
Watched the TV footage of council workers cleaning up the aftermath and burned out vehicles being taken away. Should've left the lot in situ for a month as a reminder to those responsible that if they want to behave in such a manner, they can go ahead, but they'll be left surrounded by the consequences.

Instead of which, the tax payer and the insurance companies (or to be exact their customers in the form of all of us) must stump up in order to turn the place back to normal ASAP; followed quickly by millions spent on fluffy community initiatives to make the t**ts feel better about themselves and less likely to behave like the neanderthals which they apparently are. What a country....:ugh:

IB4138
8th Aug 2011, 15:16
Does Britain still have them offshore concrete forts sat in the Channel ?

Would seem ideal places to dump the idiots on...plenty of sea water to drink and fish to catch for life preservation....no other supplies of food or water :E

Give the navy something to patrol, with instructions to sink, without trace, any attemptees of escapism.

Don't think Ms. Abbott will be getting a Christmas card from Michael Portillo this year, nor will he want to appear on a sofa with her on a late night political TV show any time soon...she has totally lost the plot.

Blacksheep
8th Aug 2011, 15:35
rab-k:

1. Why should the mess left behind by the few - and many of the rioters were not from Tottenham - be left in the faces of the overwhelming majority of decent people who live there and for whom the High Road is/was an open air community centre?

2. Insurance will pay? The majority of insurance policies have an exemption clause for civil disturbance. They don't pay. The shopkeepers and car owners will bear the cost themselves. As will those who were burned out of their homes.

SpringHeeledJack
8th Aug 2011, 15:37
We need Del Boy!

‪OFAH Fatal Extraction part 7 Riots‬‏ - YouTube


SHJ

hellsbrink
8th Aug 2011, 17:09
One does have to say that those involved in the events in Tottenham are certainly not the sharpest knives in the drawer...........


http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/08/08/article-2023667-0D59940300000578-97_634x604.jpg

dazpoo23
8th Aug 2011, 17:20
So how did he fire his gun then ? I would say the multiple witnesses who saw him fire his gun at least once, and possibly twice since reports are that 4 shots in total were fired and only two came from a police MP5, at the police before one officer let off two rounds, killing the scrote, are a damn sight more credible than the ones in your version of events.Looks like these questions have been answered by ballistic results confirming the only bullets fired were from police issued weapons.


Doubts emerge over Duggan shooting as London burns | UK news | The Guardian (http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2011/aug/07/police-attack-london-burns)


There was a just reason for protest, the malice slurs of protesters that litter this thread is not justified.

Remind me again what this topic has to do with race or multiculturalism?

tony draper
8th Aug 2011, 17:44
The talking heads are now whining that the police did not offer enough support for the family of the finger they shot,since when did the police force have to act as bloody social workers?:uhoh:

hellsbrink
8th Aug 2011, 17:48
Looks like these question have been answered by ballistic results confirming the only bullets fired were from police issued weapons.

Got a link to that? All I see is "maybes" because the ballistic reports haven't been released yet.

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 17:53
Looks like these question have been answered by ballistic results


please provide a link to ballistics results.


Aside, he was still a gang leader and crack dealer that was perpetually armed with an illegal firearm, in public and resisted arrest.

vulcanised
8th Aug 2011, 17:56
I see that odious Abbott creature is now revelling in the situation.

She is a part of the problem and has no solutions.

Ancient Observer
8th Aug 2011, 17:57
How can we stop these folk from breeding??

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 18:00
How can we stop these folk from breeding??


lock them in a council estate and let them kill each other ?

hellsbrink
8th Aug 2011, 18:00
please provide a link to ballistics results.

I don't think he can, everything I am seeing says the OFFICIAL REPORT will be released in the next 24 hours.

In other words, it ain't been released yet.

G-CPTN
8th Aug 2011, 18:02
I remain apolitical, but the comments from Home Secretary Teresa May were reminiscent of something contrived by 'Yes Minister' . . .

RIP Sir Humphrey.

SpringHeeledJack
8th Aug 2011, 18:03
Whether the original perp did or didn't fire his weapon, whether or not he was black, white, mixed race, whether or not the police are bar$tards, there is NO justification or connection to any of the subsequent rioting, looting and vandalism that has since taken place. I sincerely hope that the police didn't fire onto one of their own for various reasons and similarly I hope that they didn't fire at an unarmed man. We will know the truth (or something close) in due course.


SHJ

Ancient Observer
8th Aug 2011, 18:03
Did she say that lessons will be learnt?

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 18:04
hells,

so what you are saying is, is that dazpoo doesn't have a time machine ?


dammit, that's fooked my money making idea.

hellsbrink
8th Aug 2011, 18:05
I hope that they didn't fire at an unarmed man

He was armed, there's no question about that. And if he's been stupid enough to pull even a replica handgun out in front of armed police then you know there will always be only one ending to that.

hellsbrink
8th Aug 2011, 18:06
dammit, that's fooked my money making idea.

You wouldn't make any money out of his time machine, he'd just go back in time and bump you off after he's gotten all your money........

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 18:12
SHJ,

and to keep perspective, he was a crack dealing gang leader that was armed in public, with an illegal firearm. that much has been corroborated by the locals.

Lon More
8th Aug 2011, 18:26
Riots now spreading to HACKney. Time to send in the Argylls (http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2011/aug/08/british-soldier-taliban-fingers-souvenirs) They definitely don't take prisoners

Part one of five of the complete documentary available on LiveLeak

With the gubbamint closing down the RAFthere must be a number ofairfield fire engines left. Already equipped with water cannon would it cost much more to armour them up? Make an excellent crowd disperser

hellsbrink
8th Aug 2011, 18:31
You've got troubles in Shepherds Bush, Hackney, Lewisham and Clapham so far.


Now it's time for the Army to be sent in, and for the police to be equipped with water cannon that sprays out a dye that cannot be washed off for use in future incidents. That way anyone who is involved gets sprayed and anyone who is that colour after the event can just be picked up at the convenience of plod.

anotherthing
8th Aug 2011, 18:37
Arm the Police/send in the Military and shoot (to kill) anyone actively seen rioting or looting. Nothing but scum, why should we waste taxpayers already stretched money on court and prison (though doubt if they will get prison sentences because the lefties don't want to be seen to be victimising the criminals)?

One person on the news stated it was because the yoof of today don't have many opportunities so they resort to taking things.

Try working harder at school :mad: .

I can imagine that those guilty will be better looked after than the poor souls burned out of their houses in Tottenham.

G-CPTN
8th Aug 2011, 18:37
As the aggression appears to be aimed at the Police (albeit with looting included), the deployment of HM Army should be considered IMO.

APCs on the high streets (and they must exist in reserve somewhere) would deter the attacks (or at least ameliorate the effects).

aviate1138
8th Aug 2011, 18:42
Why are the police just watching the scum in Hackney loot shops and are doing absolutely nothing!

If we had some spare Army guys they could stop it in a few minutes.

G-CPTN
8th Aug 2011, 18:50
BBC News - Theresa May: London rioters 'will be brought to justice' (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-14449979)

Lon More
8th Aug 2011, 18:56
They are cunning, not stupid. As long as they don´t go for Harrods and the like the cops won´t be out in full force.

skydiver69
8th Aug 2011, 18:58
To answer Mr Draper (sorry I can't work out how to use direct quotes) The talking heads are now whining that the police did not offer enough support for the family of the finger they shot,since when did the police force have to act as bloody social workers?

Ever since we have been expected to treat kids playing football as anti social behaviour, where we run around looking for missing people because staff at secure units let them out, where anyone who mentions suicide gets a grade one response, where we get expected to mediate between scrotes or get used in order for one scrote to attempt to get even with another, where councils don't have a problem funding statues in a park but debate cutting funding for a local rape investigation suite, where 12 year old kids have long criminal records yet no one has spent any time trying to intervene with his family to get them to take responsibility for their errant DNA, where council staff expect the police to act as taxis for kids missing from children's homes, where very few people take responsibility when they get caught bang to rights...:mad:

dazpoo23
8th Aug 2011, 18:59
Got a link to that? All I see is "maybes" because the ballistic reports haven't been released yet.

please provide a link to ballistics results.


Apologies, post edited, source added, time machine fixed.

Doubts emerge over Duggan shooting as London burns | UK news | The Guardian (http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2011/aug/07/police-attack-london-burns)


...

lomapaseo
8th Aug 2011, 19:02
It would seem from far away that the issue of police vs the oppressed is less significant in the near term to acheiving law and order and arresting and punishing those people who rioted and looted.

IMO the riot laws should be upgraded or applied because that is the ignition of the looting. The looters just take the opportunity as soon as the police are occupied defending themselves from rioters.

aviate1138
8th Aug 2011, 19:04
Simple question.

Why do the police not have access to water cannon? A few of those in action would have stopped the looting in its tracks.

Wake up Cameron and Do Something!

G-CPTN
8th Aug 2011, 19:08
Why do the police not have access to water cannon?
A spokesperson said it was because Britain didn't want to associated with oppressive regimes.

Sallyann1234
8th Aug 2011, 19:13
As long as they don´t go for Harrods and the like the cops won´t be out in full force.
The police ARE out in force. Friends in the force tell me that leave has been cancelled and routine work abandoned. They are simply out-numbered.

Every arrest takes about three hours of police time to process, plus time to give evidence in court. Multiply that by the numbers arrested.
In addition many officers are now off sick after being injured.

Policing only works by the consent of the great majority, so that force can be concentrated in a small area at a time. When the yobs start rioting in several places at once the police are just unable to cope.

The other big development that works against the police is twitbook. In Egypt etc it allowed legitimate protesters to coordinate and fight oppression. That's good, but here it is being used against public order. It's just as effective though.

END BAG
8th Aug 2011, 19:18
Army and water cannons is the only way.Fill the water cannons with a WHITE dye mixture that ruins their clothes permanently and stays on their skin FOREVER.The little ba*****s will run out of clothes before we run out of water.The police just round up all the ones with white dye on them and let them dogs have a bit of teeth sharpening exsercise on them.

Crosswind Limits
8th Aug 2011, 19:28
The first responsibility of government is to implement effective law and order -the rule of law! Without that basic building block, there can be no effective government! Balancing the books can wait!!

sitigeltfel
8th Aug 2011, 19:37
Wake up Cameron and Do Something!

He is preoccupied with placating poor Italian waitresses.

Which city is next in line for the torch? Birmingham, Manchester, Liverpool?

cavortingcheetah
8th Aug 2011, 19:37
Surely it's time to ask the BNP and the English Defence League to send in their skinhead militia forces to help the police restore order. As a precaution any rioter arrested could be handed over to these volunteers for safe keeping prior to processing. This would free up the police for more conventional duties while at the same time ensuring that any one detained was not in a position to cause further violence.

hellsbrink
8th Aug 2011, 19:42
A spokesperson said it was because Britain didn't want to associated with oppressive regimes.

Unless they're selling stuff like that to said regimes.


Which city is next in line for the torch? Birmingham, Manchester, Liverpool?

It's already kicked off in Birmingham.

Add Deptford to the list of London Boroughs where the pondlife are kicking off.


Edit: Elephant and Castle area too

SpringHeeledJack
8th Aug 2011, 19:42
I'm just watching a burning building in Peckham live on TV and the miscreants torched it and by the time the fire brigade got to it it was completely torched and the neighbouring buildings in danger. It's only a small part of the whole, yet I feel a great anger and resentment against the rioters and the damage that they are causing to the fabric of a local area. :ugh::(



SHJ

tony draper
8th Aug 2011, 19:45
There are no gun shops in those areas are there?:suspect:

dazpoo23
8th Aug 2011, 19:45
Fill the water cannons with a WHITE dye mixture that ruins their clothes permanently and stays on their skin FOREVE

Surely it's time to ask the BNP and the English Defence League to send in their skinhead militia forces to help the police restore order. As a precaution any rioter arrested could be handed over to these volunteers for safe keeping prior to processing.

What rational thinking, why aren't you two in power. Such action surely would never warrant repercussion.

It seems rioting is due to spread out of London and already hitting Birmingham. This truly is opportunistic criminality, nothing more.

D SQDRN 97th IOTC
8th Aug 2011, 19:46
I have a feeling this is only the start of much much worse to come.....

The majority of the public will stay out of harm's way, rather than risk being arrested as a trouble maker when actually they wanted to help.....

The army on the street. In my view, a lot of harm can be done before that happens.

For me....I live just beyond SE London. So I have cancelled all plans to go out in the evening into central London for the forseeable future, as I don't want a journey home on the bus / rail / taxi through Peckham and Lewisham. No doubt there will be others who don't fancy such a return journey home.

Just a thought...these people clearly don't care about the future of neighbourhoods that have riots. You were about to buy a house there but haven't yet exchanged? Well thank your lucky stars. You haven't sold your's yet? Good luck to you.

How do you stop this? Not by watching it, that's for sure. Will the perpetrators be brought to book? Oh yes Ms May....we'll throw them in jail, where they will do time in air conditioned gyms, and be forced to play games on last year's play station model. Poor darlings that you want to rehabilitate.
Will Ken Clarke be offering them all reduced sentences if the little didumses plead guilty?

dead_pan
8th Aug 2011, 19:50
This will all blow over in a few days or so when plod finally get their act together and catch up with the ringleaders. A sign of the times methinks.

D SQDRN 97th IOTC
8th Aug 2011, 19:53
I doubt it. This country is about to have a spell of hot humid weather...which will encourage people to stay on the streets past sunset.

If it was mid winter, then it wouldn't happen. But sadly it aint.

It will blow over? There are ring leaders to these ferral youths?

sitigeltfel
8th Aug 2011, 19:53
I bet the BNP and EDL recruiting lines are ringing red hot.

Well done rioters :ugh:

Sir George Cayley
8th Aug 2011, 19:53
An interesting resonance from the past. Credit Wikip

Stephen Waldorf was a 26-year-old film editor who was shot and severely injured by Metropolitan Police officers in London, England on 14 January 1983, when he was mis-identified as an escaped prisoner, David Martin.

On the evening of 14 January 1983 police officers in unmarked cars were following a hired Mini in which Stephens was sitting on the back seat, occasionally looking out of the rear window. The driver was Lester Purdey, and the front-seat passenger was freelance film editor Stephen Waldorf, who the police thought was Martin. When the Mini came to a stop due to rush hour traffic congestion in Pembroke Road, Earls Court, a detective was sent forward to confirm the identity of the front-seat passenger. The only one who knew Martin was Detective Contable Peter Finch, who had been one of the arresting officers when he was detained the previous September, so he approached the car along the pavement on foot with his revolver already drawn. Finch later said that at this point the driver glanced at him through the window, then said something to the passenger, who turned and reached toward the rear seat.

Sir George Cayley

paully
8th Aug 2011, 19:53
Yup, those attending for the Olymics next year will be able to come to London(istan) and have a `smashing time`....:}

Jane-DoH
8th Aug 2011, 20:00
hellsbrink

Regardless of whether it's a riot or not -- I'm sure the US will exploit this for one reason or another including any of the following.


To justify the implementation of some sort of draconian plan (such as REX-84) to perform aggressive crack-downs and round-ups
To justify labeling all protestors (violent or not) as either terrorists and anarchists
To justify greater domestic surveillance as well as data-mining (To identify people who may, at some point in the future, commit a crime).


Make no mistake we live in a world where some governments see crises as opportunities to make power-grabs. Rather than have a government that protects us, we have a government that waits for any opportunity it can to screw us over.

hellsbrink
8th Aug 2011, 20:28
hellsbrink

Regardless of whether it's a riot or not -- I'm sure the US will exploit this for one reason or another including any of the following.
To justify the implementation of some sort of draconian plan (such as REX-84) to perform aggressive crack-downs and round-ups
To justify labeling all protestors (violent or not) as either terrorists and anarchists
To justify greater domestic surveillance as well as data-mining (To identify people who may, at some point in the future, commit a crime).

Make no mistake we live in a world where some governments see crises as opportunities to make power-grabs. Rather than have a government that protects us, we have a government that waits for any opportunity it can to screw us over.

If all that means less drivel being posted about how a government outside the UK will use the events in London to label people like yourself as a terrorist, then I'm all for it.

Get real, will ya. How in hell's name could some pondlife going on a looting spree be used by the US Gov to bring in restrictions on YOU!!

:ugh::ugh::ugh:

sled dog
8th Aug 2011, 20:29
Why not send a request to the French for a few CRS police to help out ? They do not take prisoners........ :eek:

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 20:35
Add Deptford to the list of London Boroughs where the pondlife are kicking off.


Edit: Elephant and Castle area too


Good stuff, a firestorm will improve those areas no end.


See what i did say this morning.... is this the chav spring?

What do we want? benefits!, When do we want them? now !

Welcome to London, host of the Olympic city 2012, mind the burnt out bus.

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 20:38
There are no gun shops in those areas are there?


Fer Chrissaske tony, who in those areas would buy a gun between 9-5 that means getting up early!

Yer local gangstaa can deliver one to your door with your crack.

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 20:41
meanwhile some good news....


Asda, which was the first chain to announce cuts this morning, that it will cut the price of unleaded petrol and diesel by up to 2 pence per litre. Morrisons followed suit, saying it will cut unleaded by 2 pence per litre and diesel by one pence per litre at most of its 296 forecourts. Tesco will drop its prices by one pence per litre on both unleaded and diesel at "the majority" of its forecourts


petrol bombs are cheaper for the feckless now !

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 20:44
Army and water cannons is the only way.Fill the water cannons with a WHITE dye mixture that ruins their clothes permanently and stays on their skin FOREVER.


'yeah but no but yeah but, thats like racist innit'

it would cause a looting spree and lefties would have to blame the tories

SpringHeeledJack
8th Aug 2011, 20:45
It's ironic in the extreme that the 2012 Olympics will take place exactly in this time period and in and around some of the flashpoints in this urban festival of violence. Right here, right now people from all over the world are watching this dysfunction unfold live on TV, what an advertisement :yuk:


SHJ

vulcanised
8th Aug 2011, 20:48
Have they had a go at the Olympic Stadium yet?

Perhaps that's scheduled for after the Notting Hill carnival.

IB4138
8th Aug 2011, 20:48
Well, why not use Orange paint instead....I can't see how that could be considered racist.

All you have to do then is round up the ones who have been Tangoed.

hellsbrink
8th Aug 2011, 20:50
Well, why not use Orange paint instead....I can't see how that could be considered racist.

All you have to do then is round up the ones who have been Tangoed.

And how do you figure out which one is a rioter and which one has just chavved up on the fake tan or has been spending too much time on the sun bed?

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 20:52
It's ironic in the extreme that the 2012 Olympics will take place exactly in this time period and in and around some of the flashpoints in this urban festival of violence. Right here, right now people from all over the world are watching this dysfunction unfold live on TV, what an advertisement http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/pukey.gif



Quick get Tony Blair and his PR people on the phone to spin this as a vibrant multicultural celebration festival !

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 20:53
And how do you figure out which one is a rioter and which one has just chavved up on the fake tan or has been spending too much time on the sun bed?


ohh good point.

how about spray them with shit.

hellsbrink
8th Aug 2011, 20:54
They'd probably wear it as a badge of honour..............

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 20:55
what do you reckon on my chances as a commentator for the Olympics ?

IB4138
8th Aug 2011, 20:57
I suppose you will say green paint is no good either, as they will look like Martians.

I'm just waiting for the claims against the police for unlawful restraint methods to start, as come they will. Should keep the Police Complaints Authority busy for a few years and waste more public money.

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 21:01
suppose ypu will say green paint is no good either, as they will look like Martians.


too much environmental connotations.

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 21:02
Lagos blue perhaps ?

Lon More
8th Aug 2011, 21:02
Thought I'd posted this before. Take all the redundant RAF fire tenders add some plating across the windows and underneath and just rinse them away. Add some liquid soap and they can have a free shower.

Firestorm
8th Aug 2011, 21:03
It's OK. Panic over. Boris is on his way back to London. Phew! Everything is going to be alright!

hellsbrink
8th Aug 2011, 21:06
Add Croydon to the list, alongside New Cross and East Ham


Oh, East Dulwich too

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 21:09
Soylent Green is a 2011 remake of the 1973 American science fiction film directed by Richard Fleischer, starring Charlton Heston.

The film overlays the police procedural and science fiction genres as it depicts the aftermath into the death of a crack dealing gangster in a dystopian future suffering from pollution, overpopulation, depleted resources, poverty, dying oceans and a hot climate due to the Diane Abbot effect. Much of the population survives on food rations processed from defunct Euros, called "soylent green".

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/1/13/Soylent_green.jpg/220px-Soylent_green.jpg

ok, so it's 11 years out !

hellsbrink
8th Aug 2011, 21:13
Looks like Oxford Circus area is away to get hit next, time to close down the tube network so the little bahhstuds can't keep running from area to area

hellsbrink
8th Aug 2011, 21:16
Reports are that "Diddy" David Cameron is to return to the UK overnight.

That'll scare them, he'll start the "Hug a Hoodie" scheme up again

SpringHeeledJack
8th Aug 2011, 21:18
Huge fire in Croydon, looks like the massive roof is old asbestos sheeting, that will be unkind to the residents downwind.......Apparently Clapham Junction being looted all around the station. FFS! the Army might well be needed to restore order.


SHJ

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 21:19
Looks like Oxford Circus area is away to get hit next, time to close down the tube network so the little bahhstuds can't keep running from area to area


bet they dont dare tear up chinatown

Firestorm
8th Aug 2011, 21:19
Serious point: if mobile phones are being used by the criminals to organise this thuggery is there a reason why the Old Bill can't order the networks to be shut down? The Emergency Services all use there own communications nets so shouldn't be affected.

sea oxen
8th Aug 2011, 21:20
hellsbrink

you beat me :-)

I like Lon More's idea, can they be adapted to spray molten lead?

SO

GROUNDHOG
8th Aug 2011, 21:20
It all went wrong when the good guys were stopped from defending their own property by the ass that is the law, human rights etc....

In 1966 a gang of Mods tried to smash up our village, they were swiftly dealt with by the locals and made to walk the 10 miles back to town and their scooters piled in a heap by a farmer with a shovel on his tractor.

Try doing that today...... oh no mustn't do anything politically incorrect.

hellsbrink
8th Aug 2011, 21:20
Army should have been on standby last night, SHJ, it was clear that it was going to continue across London tonight.

And live rounds only please, these pieces of vaguely human excrement need to be taken down. Permanently.

SpringHeeledJack
8th Aug 2011, 21:26
According to reports in the know, they are using Blackberry's closed network to link up and act and then withdraw to the next venue...... I would be happy at this point for rubber bullets and/or other effective non-lethal means, but ultimately if it escalates.....


SHJ

GROUNDHOG
8th Aug 2011, 21:28
BBC website says disorder in Birmingham too.

hellsbrink
8th Aug 2011, 21:29
That's why I say that shutting the tube down, or the entire London Transport network, is something that has to be done NOW so they can't travel from area to area to break into stores.

And it's past the time for rubber bullets, they should have been deployed yesterday too. Now the pondlife has it into their heads that they are "invincible", so unless some drastic action is taken to get that notion out of their heads they will continue night after night.

Firestorm
8th Aug 2011, 21:44
A ringing endorsement of Dave's Big Society then. We're all in this together (except for those on holiday of course). Communities helping themselves (although I don't think that Dave meant to other people's property).

Only one problem with sending the Army in: they all busy trying to keep law and order in other people's countries. Will this be deemed sufficiently serious to recall Parliament? I (as a voter and tax payer &c) certainly hope so.

Of course Dave could just take his tie off and go and have a bit of a chat with them to find out what's really going on.

IB4138
8th Aug 2011, 21:44
Oh for a squadron of Volvo loading shovels...better than tanks for dealing with this garbage.

GROUNDHOG
8th Aug 2011, 21:44
But its OK because the police are going to arrest the culprits and put them before the courts. Where they will be told they are very naughty and given the bus fare home.

AlpineSkier
8th Aug 2011, 21:48
Just to keep the technical side of available retaliatory measures up-to-date.

Water-cannon

Often used in Germany, but don't seem to be very effective. Tremendously unwieldy when full. Of course the Germans have never added either dye or irritants to the water.

C.R.S. (French)

Unfortunately they no longer seem to be as good they were. Rioting in the "hot" areas of French cities very common with the yobboes frequently trying to draw the cops into ambushes. You may recall riots in Sarcelles ( N E Paris suburbs) a few years back when Sarkozy made his comment about "washing away the scum with a Karcher (pressure-washer ) " CRS weren't the solution there.

About 18 months ago , two French of Arab descent in their 20's robbed a casino near Grenoble using AK 47s and opened fire on the police when chased. One was shot dead ( with a hand-gun ) and this caused several days of violent rioting/burning/looting. Standard procedure for the vermin.

When it's not even acceptable to machine-gun a boat-load of heavily-armed Somali pirates, what can the police do ? It really seems as if our pathetic, multi-cultural, politicians who can never give away too much of our taxes, really are prepared to deliver us to our fate at the paws of the raging morons.

GROUNDHOG
8th Aug 2011, 21:53
Water Cannon - seems we do not have any apart from a few in Northern Ireland.

tony draper
8th Aug 2011, 21:55
Seemed to be a awfull lot of people not involved in the main event just standing around rubber necking,perhaps a curfew is in order, the scum would ignore it of course but it might make like easier for the police.
Time we put together a National Guard like the Cousins.

Gooneyone
8th Aug 2011, 22:08
Anarchy: the simple absence of publicly recognized government or enforced political authority.
The end result of extreme PC. Poor England, for you to have fallen to this.

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 22:14
Anarchy: the simple absence of publicly recognized government or enforced political authority.
The end result of extreme PC. Poor England, for you to have fallen to this.

Bang on.

The result of huggy fluffy policies, everyone's a victim, everything is everyone else's fault, no personal or social responsibility, the sense of entitlement for nothing and lukewarm response to criminality.

glad i left that crap hole london and moved out to the countryside, anyone wants to have a crack here i've got my 20in and 16 chainsaws handy :E

boofta
8th Aug 2011, 22:18
You think any of these rioters work?
These morons are robbing everyone on a daily
basis by living on welfare. It's never enough,
you can't support their lifestyles with just
welfare.This is a godsend for them,something
to do and a huge boost to their income.
It's not looting, it's income redistribution.

Lon More
8th Aug 2011, 22:23
Carol Vordemann on tv this evening spouting about the lack of educational qualifications. All most of this lot could/would do is work out just how much they can screw out of the state in benefits.
When the ex GF nd I shared a flat in Docklands it was amazing how many nearly new BMWs, usually black, were cruising the streets. Not many displayed a tax disk. Not for nothing called Black Man's Wheels.

Davaar
8th Aug 2011, 22:24
As they tell me, without large-scale immigration and multi-culti, Britain would not be able to meet its employment needs, and would suffer a slow death from lack of ethnic restaurants. I know this is true because I have been reproved right here over some years for holding an opposing view. Everything seems to be moving as planned.

tony draper
8th Aug 2011, 22:39
There was another reason of course,
"Look chaps the people who used to be at the bottom of the ladder have ceased voting for us so we need to create another electorate,I know, lets import another lot of people with their arses hanging out their kecks"

CathayBrat
8th Aug 2011, 22:43
The Riot Act
Our Sovereign Lord the King chargeth and commandeth all persons, being assembled, immediately to disperse themselves, and peaceably to depart to their habitations, or to their lawful business, upon the pains contained in the act made in the first year of King George, for preventing tumults and riotous assemblies. God Save the King!
Change above for modern times.
If a group of people failed to disperse within one hour of the proclamation, the act provided that the authorities could use force to disperse them. Anyone assisting with the dispersal was specifically indemnified against any legal consequences in the event of any of the crowd being injured or killed.

The water cannons in Kenya were filled from some of the "streams" that went through the local area, a good dose of cholara(sp?) for all!
I understand rubber bullets have not been, nor allowed, to be used on the UK mainland, only in N.I. Why? Are the 6 counties not part of the same country, therefore the same rule apply throughout!
Maybe we should ask the First Battalion of the Parachute Regiment to do crowd control.

22 Degree Halo
8th Aug 2011, 22:47
United Kingdom riots

What? UK riots? Please change the title.....

You mean London, Birmingham and possibly other cities well south of Wales, NI and Scotland.

Indeed, if similar riots occured up here, John Smeaton and ilk would soon sort these feckers out.:mad:

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 22:50
How about bombarding the rioters/looters with child support payment demands and minimum wage job vacancies ?

that'll clear the streets.

dead_pan
8th Aug 2011, 23:00
possibly other cities well south of Wales, NI and Scotland


NI had their riots last month I believe. The northern half of England is safe for the time being as heavy rain is forecast over the next few days.

Surprised there aren't more citizen vigilantes out on the streets protecting their property and communities.

tony draper
8th Aug 2011, 23:05
Chap on the telly just reported Kurdish chaps have taken to the streets and are defending their shops.
Good for them,hope they smash a few skulls,our police aren't allowed to.

Lazy Gun
8th Aug 2011, 23:06
Journalist on TV, in the midst of the chaos and surrounded by looters made the following comment: "...young people they are all young smashing in the windows...lets move up here see whats happening... every shop they can find they are looting...this is just extraordinary stuff... ah Waterstones is OK!"

He actually seemed quite surprised bless him.

LG

Right Way Up
8th Aug 2011, 23:07
Deadpan,

If the authorities don't start getting more serious I think it will be there will be plenty of vigilante groups. This has the potential to get far worse!

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 23:10
Chap on the telly just reported Kurdish chaps have taken to the streets and are defending their shops.
Good for them,


You're right there TD, the Kurds have faced a lot worse !

Jane-DoH
8th Aug 2011, 23:11
hellsbrink

If all that means less drivel being posted about how a government outside the UK will use the events in London to label people like yourself as a terrorist, then I'm all for it.

So you're for labeling people who hold views you disagree with as being terrorists? :ooh:

Get real, will ya. How in hell's name could some pondlife going on a looting spree be used by the US Gov to bring in restrictions on YOU!!

Because the actions of one nation can embolden other nations to adopt similar policies. Worry over a violent protest in the UK can result in the US adopting all sorts of policies to "protect itself" from violent protests here.

This could include more surveillance and data-mining to help sift out people who are unhappy with the status quo (while most of these people aren't violent, that hasn't stopped a power-hungry government from acting as if they were), additional authority to deal with protest including aggressive crackdowns and mass-incarcerations (While this would be prefaced under dealing with riots, violent protest, and domestic-terrorism, it would inevitably be rapidly expanded if not used from the outset to crack down on any and all protesters).

Right Way Up
8th Aug 2011, 23:16
Have never liked Ken Livingstone, but he is being such a [email protected] on BBC that even the BBC presenter is accusing him of campaigning.

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 23:17
Because the actions of one nation can embolden other nations to adopt similar policies. Worry over a violent protest in the UK can result in the US adopting all sorts of policies to "protect itself" from violent protests here.

This could include more surveillance and data-mining to help sift out people who are unhappy with the status quo (while most of these people aren't violent, that hasn't stopped a power-hungry government from acting as if they were), additional authority to deal with protest including aggressive crackdowns and mass-incarcerations (While this would be prefaced under dealing with riots, violent protest, and domestic-terrorism, it would inevitably be rapidly expanded if not used from the outset to crack down on any and all protesters).



Did that happen following the vancouver riot ? i recall some other riots in the US of recent times too ? Also London has not been the only location to host riots recently. Egypt, Libya, Tunisia etc etc...

S.G.
No trees were harmed in the creation of this post, however some electrons were slightly inconvenienced.

TURIN
8th Aug 2011, 23:25
It's kicking off in Ealing now according to BBC News.

Mimpe
8th Aug 2011, 23:25
The oficial response is way too pc, too many rights - and ineffective?

Twas a time for an immediate curfew legislation, no gatherings over 3 people, and temporary enforceable bans on all head coverings and sunglasses.

Tear gas and water cannon would help if push came to shove.
When they find the critters, they should be put to work fixing every single bit of damage.

The arsonists should pay for the entire value of the buildings burnt...that will keep them gainfully occupied for many lifetimes....the poor darlings....Who are their parents? If they were my kids they'd be out on their ear until thry paid for the damage and made a suitablygrovelling apology to whover has been harmed.

Tankertrashnav
8th Aug 2011, 23:28
Seeing aerial shots of buildings burning out of control in empty, presumably cordoned off streets, I'm assuming the fire brigade are not being allowed to attend. As an RAF fire officer I accepted that danger was an integral part of the job - so why is there such an aversion to allowing firemen to take a risk to prevent small fires turning into infernos that could destroy a whole block, including peoples homes and livelihoods?

btw - Never mind Red Ken - isn't Darkus Howe a total t**t!

stuckgear
8th Aug 2011, 23:32
btw - Never mind Red Ken - isn't Darkus Howe a total t**t!


I would go so far as to say the lefty mouthpiece media whores are guilty of incitement.

racedo
8th Aug 2011, 23:36
Ken is forgetting that those who vote hate this and will be against in a big way any candidate seeing as pandering to it.

stuckgear
9th Aug 2011, 00:03
you can bet the farm that no MP will touch the subject that all the areas that saw looting and rioting are dominant 'multicultural' areas.

paully
9th Aug 2011, 00:14
This is what happens when you have 13 years of dumb everything down, crank up the pc shite, from Labour.....:{

Lord Spandex Masher
9th Aug 2011, 00:17
Elderly woman being interviewed on the box. Says she woke up in bed with one of these rioters standing in her room.

FFS it's about time these feral cnuts were taken down, for good. Balls to PC 'strongly condeming' and coming home from holiday.

End the life of each and every one of them.

stuckgear
9th Aug 2011, 00:24
The chap who owned the furniture store in croydon that went up in flames this evening made a valid point on the news this evening, that we've come to a point where the law needs to punish criminals not reward them and re-establish responsibility.


i have to agree.. martial law anyone ?

Gooneyone
9th Aug 2011, 00:47
Agree with martial law. Looters shot on sight. Assault a policeman and face immediate deadly response. Throw a petrol bomb - same as looters. That would stop this in a very short while.

Having seen half a city burn, I have no sympathy for these people - when you act like an animal you should be treated as one.

Doors to Automatic
9th Aug 2011, 00:51
Army in - Human Rights Act Out

Cacophonix
9th Aug 2011, 01:05
A thoughtful piece by Mary Riddell in the Telegraph on the ongoing rioting...

Riots: the underclass lashes out - Telegraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/8630533/Riots-the-underclass-lashes-out.html)

Jane-DoH
9th Aug 2011, 01:09
Cacophonix

A thoughtful piece by Mary Riddell in the Telegraph on the ongoing rioting...

Riots: the underclass lashes out - Telegraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/8630533/Riots-the-underclass-lashes-out.html)

Whether or not this rioting was caused by long pent-up anger, or somehow aggravated into the fever pitch it now is due to agents provocateur (the worse this gets, the government gets more and more justification to lower the hammer on things; best yet, if it gets really bad, the public will beg them for it), these riots are just not the way to go about fixing the problem. Yes, the way the political class has become increasingly unaccountable to the public will is troubling -- violent riots will just result in a violent reprisal by the government and a curbing of freedoms, which I'm sure none of these rioters (nor do most people) want.


Everybody

London riots: how BlackBerry Messenger has been used to plan two nights of looting - Telegraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/blackberry/8688651/London-riots-how-BlackBerry-Messenger-has-been-used-to-plan-two-nights-of-looting.html)

I think one of the many ways innocent people will suffer for this will be a crackdown on social media in general. Make no mistake that this is a blessing to all sorts of powerful interests who basically want to outlaw any sort of privacy (The private-message feature on Blackberries will almost certainly be the first in the cross-hairs).

Wedge
9th Aug 2011, 01:22
A surreal evening here in South London. I walked the 100 yards to the Tesco Local to get some dinner and saw that it was in the process of being looted. Police nowhere to be seen. When the TSG (Territorial Support Group) did pitch up, sending the youths scattering, they pressed straight on now doubt headed for another trouble hot spot.

The Police lost control of the streets of London tonight, and I never thought I'd see that kind of lawlessness in London. Not with my own eyes anyway.

Without making any comment on the calls for execution of the rioters/martial law, and I'm glad to see that PPRuNe is as liberal as ever it was: :rolleyes: It has occurred to me that we could see troops on the streets of London if this escalates; but it would be an absolute last resort for David Cameron. To deploy troops would send a message that he's completely lost control of the streets, and lost the confidence of the general public. He's not daft and he'll know that it would be a politically disastrous move. But as a last resort, he might have to consider it.

TBirdFrank
9th Aug 2011, 01:28
Well spotted Caco - Mary Riddell has it spot on - our version of capitalism is providing employment only for the well educated - and compliant. The rest fall by the wayside, while the rich get richer.

Those who once were the fodder for the factories and mills have no place in our high tec world - so seek to sustain themselves by whatever means they can - to our detriment.

I'm no bleeding heart liberal - God knows there are redundancies and unemployment in this family, as well as degrees and professional qualifications - but we aren't feral and are not stealing or committing arson.

Short term - regain control - by whatever means.

Long Term - give a country's residents a stake in its future - all of them