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Jane-DoH
1st Aug 2011, 03:10
I think this could be an interesting topic, and to start it out with, this could be an interesting subject.

Minority Rules: Scientists Discover Tipping Point for the Spread of Ideas (http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/07/110725190044.htm)

Now, how long before those in power will figure out how to make a horrifically bad idea popular to the 10% of the most impressionable of all of us...

Henry09
1st Aug 2011, 03:49
Now, how long before those in power will figure out how to make a horrifically bad idea popular to the 10% of the most impressionable of all of us..

They have just done it ;) With the press release from Obama and Boehner saying a 'deal' has been agreed. Economical with the truth and of little benefit to the economy over the planned decade of implementation, the Asian markets have surged 2% in as many hours. It's all gonna end in tears!

Interesting article. Scary for the use of religious doctrines.

Jane-DoH
1st Aug 2011, 05:13
Henry09

Interesting article.

Yup

Scary for the use of religious doctrines.

Tell me about it; that and CAGW...

hellsbrink
1st Aug 2011, 05:20
It's nothing "new", having a small minority shout the loudest, berating (or worse) any who have opposite ideas, to "convince" the sheeple to do what they say has been around since time immemorial.

It has no "implications" because it has ALWAYS been happening, in recent history you just have to look at the latest in the US debt fiasco, the Rise of Obama, ZaNuLabour in the UK, AGW, Adolf Hitler, etc, etc, etc, to see that.

parabellum
1st Aug 2011, 06:31
It's nothing "new", having a small minority shout the loudest, berating (or worse) any who have opposite ideas,


No better example than here on PPRuNe Hellsbrink, standard form of 'debate' from idealistic, libertarian left wing groups.

Krystal n chips
1st Aug 2011, 06:51
" It's nothing "new", having a small minority shout the loudest, berating (or worse) any who have opposite ideas, to "convince" the sheeple to do what they say "

Sounds very much like a few places I have worked at then.....

Or a Daily Mail / Sun / Excess idiotorial......:E

ORAC
1st Aug 2011, 07:59
Nothing new here.

Memetics - The Tipping Point (http://on-memetics.********.com/2011/05/tipping-point.html)

Wiki: Memes (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meme)

sisemen
1st Aug 2011, 09:52
Harley - It's not so much a screaming opposition or a right wing media monopoly, it's more a constant repetition of cock-ups and illustrations of abject incompetence that have turned Australia against the bunch of lunatics that are currently forming the government.

Oh, that and the fact that Juliar goes to camera and says one thing and then, having assured her seat of power, does something completely different.

Blacksheep
1st Aug 2011, 10:45
those in power will figure out how to make a horrifically bad idea popular to the 10% of the most impressionable of all of us...Just 10%? They've already done better than that - refer to Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya for examples.

Then there's global warming caused by too many people driving private motor cars. Don't forget the holes in the ozone layer caused by the use of aerosols as fire extinguishants and in refrigerators.

...and shush! Don't even mention the EU. :hmm:

tony draper
1st Aug 2011, 10:53
Well you can mention it but remember you have to spit after you do,makes for a messy keyboard though.
:)

Jane-DoH
1st Aug 2011, 21:55
Recently, I've heard of a program called Metal Gear, which is effectively designed to create sock puppets, allegedly to counter extremist, and enemy propaganda, and to only be aimed at foreigners who speak a variety of arabic languages.

Many civil rights, privacy advocates, as well as myself do not believe for a minute that this would not be turned on American citizens to drown out opposing opinions, and establish a false consensus (http://www.tgdaily.com/security-features/54733-us-military-says-metal-gear-sock-puppets-are-real).

While I'm not saying the objective is to make their views the majority by swaying 10% of the population; clearly though, their objective is to establish a false consensus to make their ideas accepted, so this could be possible a side-effect of something like this which makes it especially dangerous.

What are your opinions on the matter?


R.C.
"That being said, I'd like to remind everybody in a manner reminiscent of the SNL bit on Julian Assange, that no matter how I die: It was murder (even if there was a suicide note or a video of me peacefully dying in my sleep), and should I be arrested or framed for a criminal offense, or disappear entirely -- I think we all know who to blame for it"

hellsbrink
1st Aug 2011, 22:06
While I'm not saying the objective is to make their views the majority by swaying 10% of the population; clearly though, their objective is to establish a false consensus to make their ideas accepted, so this could be possible a side-effect of something like this which makes it especially dangerous.

Jane, they do that now. Look at Obama and all his "think of the children" antics over the debt crisis as a perfect example of trying to sway opinion.


:ugh::ugh::ugh:

Flash2001
1st Aug 2011, 22:10
Why is it that bad ideas are simple, easy to state and superficially attractive whereas good ideas take some work to understand? The majority, who are intellectually lazy, go for the bad ones every time.

After an excellent landing you can use the airplane again!

hellsbrink
1st Aug 2011, 22:12
That's because the ideas have to be simple enough for politicians to understand, that's why the bad ones always get through.

Caboclo
2nd Aug 2011, 04:24
Metal Gear sounds interesting, but I wonder how effective it will really be. Given the massive amount of communication of all kinds that westerners are used to, I think even the most gullible person would very quickly learn to doubt everything they hear. Those who don't are quickly parted from their money, can't pay their internet and cell bills, and thus drop out of Metal Gear's influence.

Regardless of the method of communication though, tyrants have always used lies to sway the people. Nothing new there. The only way to keep the politicians honest is with a gun, which is exactly why they don't like them. I spent last weekend at an "Appleseed shoot" hosted by the Revolutionary War Veterans Association. The schedule included both rifle training and history lessons. The history lessons focused on the sacrifices made by those who fought for independence, and on their skill at arms. Basically the whole thing was to get people more politically conscious and active, and give them the tools to do something about it.
Project Appleseed Home (http://appleseedinfo.org/)

11Fan
2nd Aug 2011, 04:51
Wait a second. How do we know that Jane isn't part of Metal Gear.....:cool:

sisemen
2nd Aug 2011, 07:27
Is it the same kind of brainwashing that prompts otherwise sane people to put inane epithets at the end of each post? Once is interesting or funny, more than once is.....

Yours,
Grumpy :(



After an excellent landing you can use the airplane again!

R.C.
"That being said, I'd like to remind everybody in a manner reminiscent of the SNL bit on Julian Assange, that no matter how I die: It was murder (even if there was a suicide note or a video of me peacefully dying in my sleep), and should I be arrested or framed for a criminal offense, or disappear entirely -- I think we all know who to blame for it"

Dog is a man's best friend

hellsbrink
2nd Aug 2011, 17:43
Wait a second. How do we know that Jane isn't part of Metal Gear.....

If she is then the project is failing miserably since nobody seems to be believing all the stuff about backsplatter machines, etc.

11Fan
2nd Aug 2011, 18:41
the project is failing miserably

Ah, but is it really? All of those links that she had been posting? What if they were Trojans and they planted a keyboard monitoring virus on my computer. They could be watching what I type right now. In fact, the camera could even be on and they are watching me as I type this.

Oh, hang on, there's someone at the doo

11Fan
2nd Aug 2011, 18:58
THIS MESSAGE IS FROM THE DEPARTMENT OF HOMELAND SECURITY.

All further contact with the poster formerly known as 11Fan should be terminated. This order shall be lifted once this non-compliant has been reeducated.

By order of:
G.O. Blowitoutyourass
General Commandant
Department of Homeland Security

Jane-DoH
3rd Aug 2011, 23:33
If I a 'metal gear' agent, the only reason I'd be criticizing the government would be for agent provocateur work -- find the people who are sufficiently dissatisfied to illuminate them, and then goad/entrap the hot-heads into doing something that could be used to justify their arrest.

Except the flaw in that would be that I've always been advocating non-violent approaches.

HowlingMad Murdock
3rd Aug 2011, 23:54
Sizeman: 'Dog is a man's best friend.'

'Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend...inside of a dog, it is too dark to read'.....Groucho Marx

11Fan
4th Aug 2011, 00:05
Seriously Jane? :D

If I (were) a 'metal gear' agent, the only reason I'd be criticizing the government would be for agent provocateur work

As least you would be getting paid for it. Now it seems you are just doing it for free. :hmm:

.....find the people who are sufficiently dissatisfied to illuminate them, and then goad/entrap the hot-heads into doing something that could be used to justify their arrest.

Entrapment eh? Well, good for you. Let's go get em. Wadda think, a couple of wire taps, some backscatter vans to watch their movements.... maybe monitor their internet use.

We should get some legal backing for that though. Call it something clever so people will support it.

I got it. The Patriot Act. Yeah. That sounds ultra cool. The Patriot Act. Dig it baby.

Jane-DoH
4th Aug 2011, 01:23
hellsbrink

That's because the ideas have to be simple enough for politicians to understand, that's why the bad ones always get through.

Probably true

Jane-DoH
11th Aug 2011, 05:12
11Fan

I don't know why I didn't respond earlier, but it's my opinion that the Patriot Act was dangerous legislation that should have never been passed...