Xenophon Private Members Bill - Foreign Crews [Archive]

ACT Crusader

29th Jul 2011, 07:39

The Senator is getting the wheels in motion....

NEW LAWS NEEDED TO STOP FOREIGN CREWS ON AUSSIE PLANES FROM BEING EXPLOITED

Independent Senator for South Australia Nick Xenophon will introduce a Private Senator’s Bill that will force Australian airlines to provide the same flight and duty conditions for foreign crews as are currently given to Australian crews.

The move follows revelations that Jetstar's Bangkok-based foreign crews regularly work on flights that travel from one Australian location to another, and that most passengers would believe are domestic flights.

Under their contracts, these crews also have no limit on the hours they could be expected to fly, and say they are regularly fatigued to a level that they believe puts passenger safety at risk.

"I don't think a lot of people realise that the crew member on their flight from Brisbane to Cairns may actually be based in Bangkok, earning a base pay of less than $300 a month, and that they may have worked hours that Australian crews would not be allowed to," Nick said.
The Bill would require Australian airlines to offer foreign-based crews the same flight and duty time limitations that are offered to Australian crews under their industrial agreements.
The Bill would also apply to international airlines in which an Australian airline owns more than a 20% stake.

"This is a basic issue of fairness and safety," Nick said. "We shouldn't have an underclass of cabin crews flying around Australia on Australian carriers."

"In the event of an emergency, I believe passengers have a right to expect that their cabin crews are going to be alert enough to get the door open and the passengers out," Nick said.
Senator Xenophon has also said he will take up the issue of the low wages foreign crew are paid while employed by Australian airlines.

“It’s not good enough for Jetstar to say that a base wage of $300 a month is good by Bangkok standards," Nick said. "These workers are employed by an Australian airline, they are flying in Australia, and they deserve better."

For more information, please call Rohan Wenn on 0409 696 531 or Nick Xenophon on 0411 626 677

sprucegoose

29th Jul 2011, 07:53

And that should go for flight deck crew too.

The Green Goblin

29th Jul 2011, 07:53

Go get them Nick!

Keep the bastards honest :D

bobhoover

29th Jul 2011, 08:12

keep up the good work Nick, soon you shall have your own chairmans lounge provided by the grateful crews of the australian aviation industry

Howard Hughes

29th Jul 2011, 08:31

Perhaps a seat a little further forward than usual!:ok:

ACT Crusader

29th Jul 2011, 08:49

Please tell me this is legit

The Senator issued the media release this afternoon. As with all private member bills, its all about trying to get support.

Howard Hughes

29th Jul 2011, 08:54

A letter to your local member would be a good place to start!:ok:

Variable Incidence

29th Jul 2011, 09:08

Good on ya Nick!

Nice to see that someone in government has some integrity, a sense of fairness, the guts to stand up for workers rights and the balls to try and stop the rot. This cancerous, spreading exploitation of foreign workers is not in the spirit of what Australia and Ozzies are about.

A fair, equal wage for doing the same day's work as your co-workers! That's the Ozzie spirit we should be promoting.

Hudson Fysh and Co would be turning in their graves if they could see what AJ & BB were trying to do to their beloved airline. Whatever happened to "The Spirit of Australia, the Flying Kangaroo"? Clearly AJ & Co just pay lip service to this too now!
:D

Mud Skipper

29th Jul 2011, 09:41

bigbrother

29th Jul 2011, 09:51

I have previously congratulated Sen. Xenaphon on other important issues confronting our great country. Coal Seam Gas, Foreign ownership of prime farming land, overseas ownership of our mineral resourses and a few others. This guy is amazing in how he has turned attention to issues that SHOULD be mainstream thinking by the major parties. I strongly suggest anyone of simlar thinking should contact him firstly, then as was suggested to me, contact your local Member of Parliment to tell them you support Nick's views and more importantly, his actions. I'm not a political lobbyiest but I do support this guy.

If we can only get some traction on the ****e way this industry is in a race to the bottom for pilot w&c, let alone the lack of any reasonable level of respect.

We need another 100 Nick Xenaphons.

wing it

29th Jul 2011, 10:06

On Domestic flying in Australia at the moment you can have Cabin Crew on 3 different contracts and wages., EBA, Team Jetstar and Casual.
On International, you can have 4 different contracts., AWA, Team Jetstar and Singapore and Thai crews.
We all do the same work and yet get paid very differently. There really should equal pay for all.

my oleo is extended

29th Jul 2011, 10:44

Senator Xenaphon, You are proving yourself to be possibly the only politician I have seen in decades who is worth something. You are elected by the people, you are paid by the people, you are expected to represent the people.
You have ticked all three boxes in my opinion. At least you can sleep well at night knowing that you have tried to correct and make safe the Australian aviation industry. Good work.

Note to other politicians and QF management - Take notice. This countries citizens have had a gutful of your spineless, self serving greed , lies and spins. You are on notice. The troops are growing restless, look around the globe, times are changing and your days are numbered.

Howard Hughes

29th Jul 2011, 10:58

Nick Xenophon for President after the revolution!;)

Apologies for the thread drift...

D.Lamination

29th Jul 2011, 11:39

Mud Skipper
Thanks for the email list.

My email to MPs urging them to support the bill has been sent.
:D

Handbrake

29th Jul 2011, 11:47

Thanks MS, that's hours of research. You can take the rest of the day off!

bandit2

29th Jul 2011, 11:48

Maybe we could send the above pollies a polite email & let them know what actually is going on at our National icon. Some call it Qantas. Think I might.

DirectAnywhere

29th Jul 2011, 11:59

Nick, you're a legend.

Thanks.

muffman

29th Jul 2011, 12:05

If the rest of our pollies had the integrity and were half as proactive as Nick Xenophon the world would be a much better place. He's doing a lot of good things for Australia, not just in aviation.

The Kelpie

29th Jul 2011, 22:16

Jetstar (Buchanan) has said in the media that legislation is not needed because they have a fatigue management system in place.

No, what you really mean Bruce is that if there is legislation you will have to abide by it, which obviously you don't want to do. You would much rather interpret a washy washy QANTAS group fatigue policy that can be interpreted in many different ways to suit as many situations as necessary.

I would have to check the Senate Inquiry Hansard but I am sure that John Gissing testified that the QF group fatigue management policy was under review given deficiencies that had been identified. Yet, JG was blissfully unaware when senator Xenophon asked about the failings of certain systems. Sounds like a shambles to me!!!

More to Follow

The Kelpie

airtags

29th Jul 2011, 22:58

Mr Gissing told the Inquiry that at best the FAID system is only an broad indicator and that it is not a precise tool.

Noted that post Inquiry the term FAID has been dropped from Q-speak.......

Also heard that that the CC's OH&S Committees have been locked out of the FRMS project despite Q's project leader stating on record that:

"FRMS is not industrial - it's purely a safety issue" [this will be an important declaration in the future I suspect]

AT

- seem to recall BB & The Orange Emperor stating in the Inquiry that FRMS is consistent across the entire QF Group.......:yuk:

ACT Crusader

30th Jul 2011, 00:41

airtags - that "consistency" message was repeated by Jetstar in their written message to Lateline earlier in the week and then by BB on ABC radio on Thursday morning.

I guess the "Qantas Group" could include or exclude any number of entities depending on ones point of view!!!!

SimonBl

30th Jul 2011, 03:05

I've emailed Senator Xenophon, I will email others over the weekend.

Take five

30th Jul 2011, 10:41

Nick Xenophon for Prime Minister.:D:D:D
Go hard mate:ok:

lame1

30th Jul 2011, 20:35

great article.
Get used to it, miffed airline workers told | The Australian (http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/get-used-to-it-miffed-airline-workers-told/story-e6frg8zx-1226104604944)
This guy has so much experience

Ian Douglas is a senior lecturer with the Department of Aviation.
His research interest is focused on ASEAN aviation, and his DBA research addresses the tensions between economic and institutional factors in development of airline strategy.

Ian joined UNSW in 2007 after 5 years with the School of Management at UTS, and 25 years at Qantas where his roles ranged through airport operations, fleet and airline planning, pricing, revenue management and alliances. At UTS Ian developed the consulting stream of the MBA degree. The contribution of this management consulting program to a range of community organisations was recognised in 2006 with both a university human rights award and a teaching award.

No wonder the kids come out twisted.
Im a little lost ,
I cant really see any history that makes him an expert in cabin safety.
What do they teach a MBA scholar.Looks like he worked for 25 yrs then had to go back to school to get the next job

Captain Peacock

31st Jul 2011, 03:09

Ian joined UNSW in 2007 after 5 years with the School of Management at UTS, and 25 years at Qantas where his roles ranged through...fleet and airline planning...
You call that a resume? You gotta be kidding me.

Worrals in the wilds

31st Jul 2011, 03:48

Mr Douglas said offshoring was not an excuse for unsafe tours of duty or onerous contracts. He said the same safety standards, rules and requirements should apply to all.

...and that's really going to happen without legislation as the rest of the article illustrates. Qantas are probably just miffed that they can't get away with paying them in potatoes.

Jetstar was this week criticised for its treatment of crew hired by a Bangkok labour hire firm 37 per cent owned by parent Qantas.
The airline told the firm, Tour East Thailand, to withdraw letters written to five Bangkok-based flight attendants who pulled out of a Sydney-Melbourne flight complaining of fatigue.
The letters said poor time management was not acceptable and required an undertaking they would not repeat their behaviour. The letters also castigated the crew, reportedly paid a base wage of $258 a month plus $7 an hour while flying, for damaging Jetstar's reputation.

For having the nerve to complain about fatigue. Very safe.

Of course foreign university staff in many places (academic and otherwise) earn a pittance compared to what faculty staff here are on. Maybe the unis should start offshoring some of their academic preparation and online tutoring work. They could make heaps by paying Indonesian rates for faculty staff but still charging Aussie students the same tuition fees at an 'Australian' university, while just employing a handful of Australian based academics to do the face-to-face lecturing.

Perhaps then some of these academic experts would start to understand why people get 'miffed' :yuk: about this sort of thing.

Good for the X man, anyway. :ok:

SpannerTwister

31st Jul 2011, 11:33

Of course foreign university staff in many places (academic and otherwise) earn a pittance compared to what faculty staff here are on........... and doing all "face-to-face" lectures via teleconferencing from someone earning $200 a month in Thailand.

Perhaps then some of these academic experts would start to understand why people get 'miffed' http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/pukey.gif about this sort of thing.

Just wondering why you think they even need to employ local staff for the face-to-face lectures ? :E :E :E

ST

rooboy83

31st Jul 2011, 13:51

One wonders whether Mr Xenophon or the general public is aware that it isn't just foreign crews subjected to these working conditions and duty period limitations. QCCA crew ( a subsidiary formed by Qantas to enable cheap cabin crew to work on the a380), work side-by-side Qantas Airlines crew who are earning double the money, whilst performing exactly the same role.

In addition, crew employed on the a380, not only have to work 50 more hours per roster; but also have considerably less rest entitlements both upline and at home than crew working on the 747.

a380 crew require just 24 hours planned rest in an outport for a duty in excess of 14 hours whilst 747 crew require 36 hours for a duty in excess of 14 hours.

Likewise, the rest at home base that crew require:

-after a 2 day trip: A380 crew:18 hours / 747 crew: 1 local night
-after a 3 day trip: A380 crew: 20 hours / 747 crew: 2 local nights
-after a Europe trip (normally a 6-8 day trip) A380 crew: 48 hours / 747 crew: 5 local nights.

So are crew that are employed on the a380 somehow immune to fatigue? Last time I checked, all crew are human beings and are affected equally in regards to long-haul flying.

So, while it is distressing that foreign crews are being treated differently to Australian based crew; we also have a situation in our own backyard where two lots of Australian based crew are treated considerably differently ( in relation to both financial reward, and fatigue management.)

Is it common knowledge that Australia's "premium" flag carrier is employing such tactics? Because let me assure you, it is not just the budget carrier guilty of such double standards.

Seabreeze

31st Jul 2011, 23:44

Lame1, Worrals and others:

It seems to me that Douglas is only telling it the way it is, (as now has rooboy83). He doesn't set industrial relations policy nor determine what foreign owned companies do.

Perhaps also its time that CASA gets on their bike and does something about cabin crew fatigue. It seems they do have some teeth after all.

Keep your energy for where it is needed, watching company activities for unethical or illegal behaviour and supporting the good Sen X etc.

There is no point shooting the messenger......

Worrals in the wilds

1st Aug 2011, 01:16

Fair enough Seabreeze, but I think it's easy for 'experts' to gaily predict doom and gloom here and in the press because it doesn't affect them. If it affected their industry, their pay or their conditions they wouldn't be so quick to tell us all to put up and shut up.

The more often 'experts' jump up in the press and predict doom and gloom (Geoffery Thomas on Sunrise for example) it makes the IR war harder and gives these companies more confidence to behave like erks, because the 'experts' are supporting them. Actually Douglas wasn't as anti-worker as some, and at least supports consistent safety and work standards for F/As no matter what their home port is.

I quite agree that CASA should be looking at fatigue issues across the whole industry. Qantas aren't a foreign company (yet :E) however much they pretend, and they should be answerable to the Australian government.

fishers.ghost

1st Aug 2011, 04:26

Foreign Jetstar crew seek relief Monday, 01 August 2011 Qantas group budget carrier Jetstar is facing calls for its Asia-based and other foreign crews to be offered employment contracts in line with their Australian peers. Independent senator Nick Xenophon says foreign-based crews employed by the Qantas-owned carrier are working under completely different conditions, with flight attendants in Thailand paid A$258 a month as a base salary, plus A$7 for every hour they fly plus allowances.
Xenophon says regulations are needed to protect any cabin crew whose contracts specify no limits on the hours they can be required to work.
"When cabin crew tell me that they are worried they won't be able to function appropriately in the event of an emergency, then that's a serious issue," he told Australia's ABC Radio.
Jetstar's cabin crew already have accused the airline of ignoring their complaints about fatigue after being forced to work up to 20 hours straight.
Xenophon now will introduce a bill to force Australian airlines to make their flight and duty conditions for foreign crews the same as their Australian crews.
“I don’t think all people realise crew on flights from Brisbane to Cairns may actually be based in Bangkok, earning a base pay of less than A$300 a month, and that they may have worked hours that Australian crews would not be allowed to (work),” Xenophon said.
The bill would also apply to any international airlines in which an Australian airline owns more than a 20 per cent stake.
The bill also would apply to crews based in PNG and New Zealand.

TIMA9X

2nd Aug 2011, 00:29

Plane Talking (http://blogs.crikey.com.au/planetalking/)
Hitting the replay button on Jetstar claims

August 2, 2011 – 9:17 am, by Ben Sandilands (http://blogs.crikey.com.au/planetalking/author/bensandilands/)

One of the features of the recent Senate Inquiry into pilot training and airline safety was the need to recall witnesses to sort out misunderstandings.
Which is why YouTube compilations like the one below by Plane Talking reader ‘Qanunder dog‘ or the full replay archives offered by the ABC on abc.net.au are important.
In this compilation Jetstar Group CEO Bruce Buchanan makes the points that the ABC TV Lateline show that highlighted the five flight attendants (http://blogs.crikey.com.au/planetalking/2011/07/28/what-are-the-jetstar-issues/) who called in fatigued at the end of a 20 hour shift of the type that Jetstar clearly doesn’t really roster at all were actually making up to $30,000 a year, and were in the top percentile of wage earns in Thailand, and that Jetstar’s operations reflected the 90 year tradition of excellence of the Qantas group.
The Lateline program was therefore, either a hoax, or the group CEO misunderstood the questions when he responded to the program the following morning.
If the five exhausted Jetstar employees are earning $30,000 a year, and they make around $3000 in base pay plus $7 an hour on duty, that means they need to average $2250 a month in that year to reach that total, and that means they need to average 321 hours a month on duty or more than 70 hours a week.
However Buchanan also said the Jetstar cabin crew only fly on average 24 hours a week. None of this adds up.
At the same time the company issued a statement defending the bonding of Thai employees of the labor contract company Tour East Thai to a repayment of up to four and half months base pay if they quit early or were fired for any reason as ‘compensation’ for the investment the company had made in their training.
Fortunately Buchanan make it clear this was not slave labor, that the company had robust arrangements to limit hours, and claims that it was outsourcing Australian jobs to Asia based employees were completely untrue.
Given that Senator Nick Xenophon (http://blogs.crikey.com.au/planetalking/2011/07/29/xenophon-bill-would-outlaw-foreign-cabin-crews-on-domestic-australian-flights/) is proposing a private member’s bill to outlaw the use of foreign based flight attendants on domestic flights in Australia, a fresh Senate inquiry with more time to deal with fewer issues than those considered by the earlier hearings could clear up all of these ‘misunderstandings’.

Interesting piece from Ben Sandilands.

ACT Crusader

2nd Aug 2011, 01:30

If the five exhausted Jetstar employees are earning $30,000 a year, and they make around $3000 in base pay plus $7 an hour on duty, that means they need to average $2250 a month in that year to reach that total, and that means they need to average 321 hours a month on duty or more than 70 hours a week.
However Buchanan also said the Jetstar cabin crew only fly on average 24 hours a week. None of this adds up.

Oh Ben, but when did numbers thrown out in media interviews ever add up.....

my oleo is extended

2nd Aug 2011, 01:47

Brilliant article from Sandilands.
It certainly appears that the QF/JQ game of smoke n mirrors is not good enough to fool the likes of Senator X. In fact, pretty much everyone can now see through the deflective barriers in place and the buls*it stories peppered with half baked facts and diversionary statements, hence Mr Sandlands accurate and well articulated comments ! If I were Senator X I would be pushing for an additional enquiry probing some of the raised issues in more detail, and investigating any comments, claims, statements or statistics put forward under parliamentary oath that are complete shisen.
It would be unwise for any misleadings or untruths to not therefore be addressed as this will initself simply highlight that Ministers have little or no authority over big business. This would have the effect of further eroding any confidence within Australian aviation safety and the abilities of Government ministers, so there is a lot at stake here.

C'mon Nick, you are half way there, the foreplay was great and I highly commend you for your work to date, it is now time to finish the job.

Keg

2nd Aug 2011, 06:43

If I were Senator X I would be pushing for an additional enquiry probing some of the raised issues in more detail, and investigating any comments, claims, statements or statistics put forward under parliamentary oath that are complete shisen.

A couple of rumours suggest that he may end up doing exactly that. Stand by for a slightly different enquiry into the aviation industry.

I suggest that interested parties should consider emailing him and indicate their support for the Parliamentary process to do a little bit more digging into QF, their exec and what they say publicly.

KRUSTY 34

2nd Aug 2011, 07:51

shadowoneau

2nd Aug 2011, 09:21

I can't believe that he and his mate Joyce haven't already been charged with purgery?

Giving them enough rope to hang themselves? :E

airtags

2nd Aug 2011, 10:12

Krusty - agree with your sentiment however its within the scope of the Parly Priv C'tee and the associated standing orders to act.

however..........that said, it's highly unlikely loose Bruce and the Orange Emperor (the alternate Maverick & Goose?) will be declared in contempt, but their own testimony clearly condemns them.

The real pressure must now be put on Clifford (& as he calls it...'his team') to question the likes of Joyce and Buchanan as it is more than obvious that the underlings are not correctly briefing the Board.

For the Unions, the key is to focus on the maths as Clifford is only interested in the numbers and sadly the numbers, like AJ & BB's cred do not add up.

They will no matter what gut QF on the 24th - the challenge is to ensure the appropriate (and to date missing) level of scrutiny is applied [cue: Kelpie - feel free to jump in here anytime...Justin, don't even think about doing an Olivia..............:E]

AT

thread drift - well done to the Minister for Mascot for totally ignoring the Aircrew Unions and representatives in the body scanner trials ....DOT has only had two years to do it ....definately the stuff of future QF Management material

SimonBl

2nd Aug 2011, 10:54

As I said I would, I emailed Senator Xenophon. To my amazement, I received a response the next day:

Thank you for your email to Nick. Nick is currently out of the office and has asked me to respond on his behalf.

I have passed on your comments to Nick and his senior advisors for their reference and consideration.

Nick remains extremely concerned by what was revealed in the Lateline story last week. You can read a transcript here: Lateline - 27/07/2011: Jetstar crew members claim exploitation (http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2011/s3279602.htm). It is an extreme concern if crew do not believe they will be able to cope with an emergency. I have attached Nick’s press release for your interest.

You will also be aware that the Senate Committee has handed down its Inquiry report into aviation, which confirms fears of slipping standards.

The Committee has recommended tougher safety standards, better incident reporting guidelines and improved fatigue management, including extending fatigue rules to cabin attendants.

Nick has called on the Minister for Infrastructure and Transport, Anthony Albanese, to urgently act on the recommendations in the report. You can also read the full report here.

Thank you for taking the time to write to Nick on this important issue and for you support on this issue.

Very impressed with the response and not often I am with a pollie.

Going Boeing

2nd Aug 2011, 22:13

Rumour going around that the 5 Thai Flight Attendants who complained about being tired have just been fired.

If true, the media and Senator X will be all over it.

airtags

2nd Aug 2011, 22:19

Need to get a confirmation on that ASAP - if true then Clifford and his team must give BB a red card given his denials. also just backs up the fact that QF culture is not 'just' but aggressively punitive.

Pilots must focus on getting CAO 48 limits to apply to CC as an insurance measure.

Also highlights the need for all crew to forget the BS internal safety reporting systems and go straight to the Regulator - JQ just like QF manages it's SMS by manager emails rather than transparent auditable systems.

rooboy83

7th Aug 2011, 04:56

Interesting to note there has been no response to my post that Qantas cabin crew receive double the pay, 20% less hours and drastically greater rest periods both at home and while overseas than their colleagues they work next to who are employed by QCCA.

This suggests we are more worried about the rest periods and fatigue management of foreign crew working on Jetstar aircraft, than the well-being and safety of Australian crew.

The foreign based Jetstar crew situation brought to our attention by the media through Senator Xenophon is also happening right under our noses, in our OWN country. No less, these tactics are happening at the "flag carrier", the "premium airline" and the "national icon". So it is not just the low cost carrier guilty of employing such poor standards.

Ace Wasabe

7th Aug 2011, 08:38

QCCA CC are being exploited.
Rosters can be generated to 240hrs/56 day Bid period
Base pay for an F/A is around $36K
There is no bid system...rosters are allocated
No arduous tour of duty provisions
Tours of duty can be in excess of 20hrs in unplanned circumstances.
No minimum rest requirement in the port following an extended TOD
The list goes on...their EBA takes them back to conditions prior to 1974

MR WOBBLES

8th Aug 2011, 09:07

BUDGET airline Ryanair has come under fire for allegedly failing to provide life-saving CPR to a passenger, instead delivering him a sandwich.

Per-Erik Jonsson, 63 went into cardiac arrest during a flight from the UK to his home in Sweden, his stepdaughter Billie Appleton told Fox News.

When he lost consciousness his wife alerted the crew, however it is alleged that they were unprepared to give him treatment.

Instead the staff gave him a sandwich and a drink.

“They said he had low blood pressure and gave him a sandwich and a soda,” she said. “And they made sure he paid for it.”

A nurse, Appleton slapped her stepfather on the chest and he began to breathe again.

Hope this helps as an example Nick

Fuel-Off

8th Aug 2011, 09:26

Why use a European example when we've got one right at home! Wasn't there a case brought forward to The Inquiry with a SIN-DRW JQ flight where the SIN crew were not able to attend to a sick passenger? I'm pretty sure Kelpie can provide a few examples!

Fuel-Off :ok:

1a sound asleep

8th Aug 2011, 10:24

BUDGET airline Ryanair has come under fire for allegedly failing to provide life-saving CPR to a passenger

Problem is half of Europe is flying FR. They have 275 Boeings and are one of the most profitable airlines.

And this is where AJ came from. God help Qantas

skybed

8th Aug 2011, 21:25

I am pretty sure the senator is aware of the QCCA conditions.
acewasaby DO NOT put incorrect info on this site. This does not help. Stick to facts.
"No arduous tour of duty provisions" there are limited to 20 hours! you are ask to "volunteer". Unfortunatly too many decide to go on for personal reasons.
Tours of duty can be in excess of 20hrs in unplanned circumstances.Only of you "volunteer" to go on.Say NO
No minimum rest requirement in the port following an extended TOD. Yes, there is minimum rest, look it up in the EBA
FACTS Only Please.

rooboy83

9th Aug 2011, 01:15

I believe my facts detailing the stark difference between QCCA and QAL conditions to be not only accurate; but alarming!

HOw can such an "esteemed", "safety-first" airline be getting away with such discrimination in the workplace?

One look at the the new Virgin Australia CC EBA again demonstrates the philosophy underpinned by Mr Borghetti... look after your people and your business will look after itself.

the Red Rat just doesn't get it!

DrPepz

11th Aug 2011, 04:12

From this link

https://www.singaporeair.com/jsp/cms/en_UK/global_footer/cabin-crew-appointments.jsp

It seems SIA is recruiting cabin crew from all over Asia, but they eventually have to be based in Singapore. With basic salary of S$3500 a month upon graduation, the annual salary with bonuses and other wage supplements common in Singapore, is about S$50k-ish a year, which is usually tax-free because the salary is structured with a low fixed base.

SIA doesn't discriminate based on nationality though, it seems they all earn the same regardless of whether they're from Japan or Indonesia.

SIA is located in a high cost city surrounded by extremely low-cost countries, and has never ever contemplated setting up crew bases elsewhere.

It's an extremely poisonous working environment when one colleague realises the other colleague is getting paid much more for doing the same work on the same plane.

skybed

11th Aug 2011, 06:37

DrPepz it does not help if you have different cost structures aroud the network as in QF. Australia has 2 different international plus NZ and LHR have also different conditions. not good for morale:=

ACT Crusader

17th Aug 2011, 02:52

Well yesterday in the Parliament Senator X got a process going by moving the following motion,

Senator XENOPHON: To move:

That the following bill be introduced: A Bill for an Act to amend the Air Navigation Act 1920 and the Civil Aviation Act 1988 in relation to aircraft crew, and for related purposes. Air Navigation and Civil Aviation Amendment (Aircraft Crew) Bill 2011.

fdr

17th Aug 2011, 04:22

I've said it before. Buchanan is a liar, pure and simple. The thing about liars of course, is to get away with it for any length of time, one must have an exceptional memory.

I can't believe that he and his mate Joyce haven't already been charged with purgery?; KRUSTY34

At the moment what is apparent is that the drivel being sprouted by the company appears to be rather self serving at best, and disingenuous if in polite company.

"purgery" AKA PERJURY.... also known as forswearing, is the willful act of swearing a false oath or affirmation to tell the truth, whether spoken or in writing, concerning matters material to a judicial proceeding. That is, the witness falsely promises to tell the truth about matters which affect the outcome of the case. For example, it is not considered perjury to lie about one's age unless age is a factor in determining the legal result, such as eligibility for old age retirement benefits see wiki.

For the Australian Senate, the issue of false statements would be... contempt.

For giving false or misleading information to the shareholders, refer to the ACCC.... see "stock market manipulation", "disseminating false information", "intentionally acting dishonestly".

For civil remedies, any impact to an individual or entity resulting from such information would presumably be actionable as a civil tort;

Misrepresentation is a tort, Bridge LJ, in Howard Marine and Dredging Co. Ltd. v A Ogden & Sons

Negligent Misstatement is a tort, Hedley Byrne v Heller

If (and it would be a big if.... :}) the masters of the SS Qantanic are telling porkies... it is not a good thing for a resume.

It won't come to pass unless those that have evidence that can substantiate that the shareholders are being given information that is less than shall we say, "complete", provide that into the public domain, or provide it to the ACCC, Senate or AFP.