IR renewal while on job seekers,help!

[mbATPL]

Hi all i dont often post on here,but just wanted anyone's take on the problem of being unemployed, and on Job Seeker's Allowance, and the problem of keeping current. Sometimes feel I am the only Pilot on JSA.
The big problem I have at the moment is that I am coming up to my 5 year deadline to renew my IR. Otherwise its back to CAA Staff examiners for the test.
I am probably gonna get shot down here with some saying that I've had 5 years to sort it, and there must have been a way for me to renew prior to now, but life isn't always that black & white, and often its complicated.

My rating runs out on Saturday, and I've been to the Banks for help, the Job Centre, and even called BALPA for advice and the only advice they could give me was to email me a booklet on 'How to become a Pilot'..it would have laughable if it wasn't so serious ! I've been working my socks off to try and get the money together for quite some time, but its hard enough just to keep bills etc going let alone put much to one side for a renewal !

I've approached Flying Schools, but havn't found any that do payment terms for an IR Renewal anymore.

Any advice or suggestions would be greatly appreciated ! Is anyone else finding themselves in this situation ?

[bingofuel]

Have you considered renewing in a single SEP/IR, will be a lot cheaper and is still an IR to keep you valid re 5 years etc

[mbATPL]

hi yes have talked about this with friends and with PAT bournemouth but they seemed to think it wouldnt make a lot of difference ,cause i would still have to do the multi IR ,another thing iam thinking of is the fact , you wouldnt be able to apply for any jobs that become available.

and the most important thing is, money! as JSA only nets me £64 per week

[bingofuel]

All it would do is give you a valid IR so the clock starts again. I thought that was the main thing you were trying to achieve, avoid the return to panel examiners, and the costs, and also keep your ATPL theories valid.

[rmcb]

I thank God I am not in your position, but I would heed bingofuel's advice. You haven't had any joy from the job market to date but your number one priority is to keep your IR current.

The cynic in me hears PAT telling you what is best for their books. Are you current in a ME aircraft? Why make your task both more difficult and expensive?

[windypops]

I thought the system was changing slightly and there would be no more staff examiners. I heard that there are fewer staff examiners about and they are not replacing them. Initials will be able to be done by any IR examiner.

Slight thread drift.

[mbATPL]

A priority is to keep my IR, but my main point is how do you do it when you are on either a low income or JSA @ £64 per week..Its impossible !

As for my joy from the job market and my experience, I have worked as a Pilot in the following capacities :
Flying Instructor for 2 Flying Schools
British Regional on a J41 for a brief spell
Streamline/Emerald Airways on a SD330/360

The work as a Pilot just hasnt been forthcoming for a while, hence the position I am in now !

[mbATPL]

windypops..I'll have to look into that as I know a lot of changes are happening, for example getting your licence changed over to EASA by April next year. This change won't be a problem for me as had it confirmed by the CAA that all I need is a current medical, a class rating within the last 5 years (any class rating will be ok, ie SEP,MEP,IR etc), and then for a fee of £238 if I go to the CAA they will automatically change to an EASA licence.

The way medicals are being done is changing..after 5 years you will have to have an Initial at Gatwick (I'm ok on that one).

[zondaracer]

mbATPL, I'm not sure I understand what you said about the change in medicals. Are you saying that if I go over 5 years without a licence renewal, I will have to get an initial medical? Or were you saying something different? Thanks

[mbATPL]

with regards to the medical,if for any reason you dont renew it for 5 years(maybe you gone off to do something else eg travelling) you will have to go back to Gatwick for an initial.

[Genghis the Engineer]

I wonder if there's any flying school that will do your IRT for credit against your working for them before, or even after, as an FI.

If the income and business expense cancel out and no actual payment was made, hopefully you can make it "not income" for JS purposes, and who knows, it might also give you a chance to impress them enough that you'd pick up some subsequent remunerated instruction? It's initially low risk for them anyhow.

Admittedly doing this before Saturday seems a bit optimistic, but you can only ask (very very) nicely.

G

(Disclaimer, I only know about aviation law, maybe a little about contract law, virtually nothing about tax law.)

[mad_jock]

Its classed as benifit in kind Genghis.

And for the OP remember the 5 years is from the lapsing of any IR so even if you last IR was a MPA type its from then.

Eastern have been interviewing recently have you tried them?

[windypops]

Is the J41 a common type rating with the J31? If so Blue Islands in Guernsey would be very interested to hear from you.

What I would also say is because you have passed a couple of type ratings and have some time on type you shouldn't have any problem passing an IR initial again with a bit of training. I think if I was in your shoes I would not spend any money on keeping current while on JSA. I would then sit tight and as soon as a job came along (any job) I would start putting money aside so that when the flying market picks up pace I would have money to get all my licences back. Just my two pence worth though and I'm sure you have a million and one other factors going on.

[mad_jock]

Nope not now, according to rumour it used to be until someone from the CAA actually sat in one who had been in a J31/32 then it got split shortly afterwards.

It is a different beast. Not completely different but enough things that they are not to keen you being dual rated on them both at the same time either.

But as his J41 rating was with British Regional, they got shot of there J41's to Eastern in 2002/3 his rating will be well outside 5 years which means he would have to do the rating again.

[Bealzebub]

Well, lets be blunt.

Unless you have a generous friend or relative, the timescale is unrealistic.

Renewing these ratings, running a Mercedes, having an expensive hobby. They are all unaffordable on any form of unemployment benefit, because the benefit is only intended to address basic living costs.

The short term answer would appear to involve finding a job that pays you more than state benefits will. This will obviously provide additional income as well as a platform for a possible credit line from banks.

Your location is given as Bournemouth, which is not a notorious unemployment black spot. There should be paid work available. I know more than a few pilots who have had to take temporary or seasonal jobs (in Tesco, M&S, etc.) in order to survive through the difficult times.

I am afraid that these businesses are not charities, and no one is going to give you something for nothing. Not flying schools, not BALPA, and certainly not the banks.

You are not alone in this predicament, and yes "life is complicated," but the harsh truth is, that you need a better awareness of your situation. That clearly involves raising your monthy income, and in turn that will involve finding a job that will help in providing the solution, rather than relying on the state benefits that quite simply will not.

Finally, I would say that stopping a rating from lapsing, is nowhere near as important as keeping body and soul together. Obviously it is a setback and disappointing, but it is a problem that can be overcome later on. You are most certainly not the only person in this position. Sometimes it is very hard, but you need to stop and re-prioritize. Get the motivation back, and work your way back towards the goals.

[Mikehotel152]

I think Bealzebub has to be right in this case.

After so long out of the cockpit, you probably ought to concentrate on building up an income stream, getting mind and soul together and return to flying afresh once you've done so. I know if I hadn't flown IFR for even 6 months I'd need some pretty intensive time in the sim before being ready for work.

Good luck with whatever happens.

[Torque Tonight]

Firstly, you posted on Wednesday about your rating expiring on Saturday! By that stage you'd already screwed it, it can take weeks to get a slot to renew, just as I can't phone up my aviation doctor and ask for a medical renewal within three days (unless I'm very lucky). Asking your questions two months ago may have yielded results - three days before the deadline virtually no chance.

Secondly you're not the first to be in your position. I was there a couple of years ago. I decided after a couple of weeks that sitting around on the dole waiting for the big break whilst receiving £55 per week or thereabouts is no way to exist. Apart from the fact that you can't afford to eat and put fuel in the car on jobseeker's allowance, the existance is pretty soul destroying and directionless.

Get a job, not necessarily an aviation job but ANY job that you can do. Lay bricks, sweep the streets, empty bins, flip burgers, pull pints: whatever you can find. It will put some structure and purpose back in your life. You'll feel better about yourself, have some self respect, you'll being doing yourself a favour and, in fact, taxpaying society a favour. Most importantly, you will have more income than you do now: not a lot, but enough to stay afloat and maintain your qualifications. It will also look a lot better on a CV than a significant gap and you might even learn a new skill - you never know when that might come in handy.

Good luck,

(RAF Flt Lt pilot; Starbucks barista; airline pilot).

[wangus]

You aren't the only pilot on JSA. And you aren't the only pilot thinking the phone will ring soon.... A job is around the corner...... I think a reality check is due, and I do not mean to sound harsh. I have been waiting nearly 4 years since I qualified. Two friends of mine have bought type ratings, and still cannot get an interview. And they have nearly 1000 hours SEP. I have dozens of highly placed contacts. Useless. Currency doesn't seem to figure that highly. Deep pockets, and a school with "arrangements" seems to be the key. try and get a non-aviation job and keep your sanity. It's nearly working for me. Nearly.....