View Full Version : Trafalgar - Oh the Irony!
Could be the last?
12th Jun 2011, 15:46
The Battle of Trafalgar (http://www.britishbattles.com/waterloo/battle-trafalgar.htm)
Royal Navy pilots forced to learn French - Telegraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/defence/8570983/Royal-Navy-pilots-forced-to-learn-French.html)
As it has been missed on another thread............ You can't make this up!
ghostnav
12th Jun 2011, 15:55
Seems to me a logical thing to do. It is a FRENCH Ship - or is Britain as arrogant as others think? We expect everyone else to speak English - you can do that if you are a world power.
We aren't!
RookiePilot
12th Jun 2011, 15:56
I believe the French have a motto pertinent to this; "To the sea! It is the time!"
or... "A l'eau, c'est l'heure!"
:E
RomeoAlphaMike
12th Jun 2011, 15:56
Is there a problem?
If you are living and working from A French ship, operating French aircraft then I don't think it's unreasonable to expect you might try and learn the lingo.
They should be grateful they have a boat to fly off at all.
TyroPicard
12th Jun 2011, 16:08
Never mind learning French, it's the "sleeping ... alongside French fighter pilots" that would worry me...
FODPlod
12th Jun 2011, 16:31
The Battle of Trafalgar (http://www.britishbattles.com/waterloo/battle-trafalgar.htm)
Royal Navy pilots forced to learn French - Telegraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/defence/8570983/Royal-Navy-pilots-forced-to-learn-French.html)
As it has been missed on another thread............ You can't make this up!
And as you have started another thread, I say again...
Foreign officers on exchange with the Marine Nationale. How novel. :rolleyes:U.S. Navy officers serve on French aircraft carrier (http://www.heraldnet.com/article/20110416/NEWS02/704169892)
Note the RN officer in the photo.
Bob Viking
12th Jun 2011, 18:38
It's good to see that humour is alive and kicking on Pprune as always.
A guy posts something to stimulate some witty banter and what does he get? A bunch of miserable old gits pointing out the stark reality that a guy serving on a French ship may just be required to speak the lingo.
Sacre bleu!
BV:rolleyes:
keith williams
12th Jun 2011, 18:44
So what's the problem?
When US Navy officers do exchange tours in the RN they have to learn to speak English!
Royal Navy pilots forced to learn French - Telegraph C'est la vie.....
Pontius Navigator
12th Jun 2011, 19:22
It's good to see that humour is alive and kicking on Pprune as always.
A guy posts something to stimulate some witty banter and what does he get? A bunch of miserable old gits pointing out the stark reality that a guy serving on a French ship may just be required to speak the lingo.
Sacre bleu!
BV:rolleyes:
And a fine wine cellar to boot.
I recall reading an exchange officer's end of tour report from the Jeanne d'Arc. It went in to fine detail on bunkerage, aircraft etc and concluded that the limiting factor on a cruise was the wine cellar.
Moore
12th Jun 2011, 19:57
It is so easy to misunderstand a radio call in English or for that matter in any language and so many accidents have been caused by simple errors. Any language study with cultural awareness has to be positive and particularly so in the unforgiving environment of the air. These pilots will learn so much and it will give them an extra insight into French culture that I was lucky enough to experience flying in Jodels with French people many years ago.
Rossian
12th Jun 2011, 21:29
...Super Etendards at Landivisieau a few years back, and I'm pretty sure that at the height of the "cheese eating surrender monkeys" BS there was an E2C on a US carrier in the gulf.
Politicians,eh? What can we do about them?
The Ancient Mariner
reynoldsno1
13th Jun 2011, 03:27
Did a sortie aboard a Kriegsmarine Atlantique may years ago - all the herren spoke English throughout the trip, and I don't think it was for my benefit (and I could get by in Deutsch anyway).
birrddog
13th Jun 2011, 03:39
Was there not a story aways back of a RN officer on exchange on a French ship, with one of his duties to give the daily news onboard in English to help the crew with their English....
Off to a rocky start in the beginning, until he did the English news in English with a French accent!
SilsoeSid
13th Jun 2011, 03:47
One senior Royal Navy officer said: “Who would have thought that more than 200 years after the Battle of Trafalgar, we would be asking the French to train our Naval fighter pilots?
Who would have thought that more than 300 years after the American War of Independence, we would be asking the Americans to train our Army Apache pilots.
:rolleyes:
diginagain
13th Jun 2011, 04:55
Who would have thought that more than 300 years after the American War of Independence, we would be asking the Americans to train our Army Apache pilots.
Happy to be proven wrong, but I thought the colonies were cut loose 235 years ago, Sid? Granted, they may have begun mangling the language prior to that...........
Reinhardt
13th Jun 2011, 05:54
Yes, Marine Nationale does operate a big carrier (like the Ark Royal 40 from years ago, with nuclear propulsion added) on which they fly Rafale and Super-Etendard (you know, the one launching efficient Exocet missiles...)
They also have three helicopter-carrying ships, real warships (they are in the final process of selling three others to the Russians) - not cargo conversion like HMS Ocean ...
From one of them (the Tonnerre) nightly raids of Tigre and Gazelle helicopters are launched (total of 15 of them, compared with only 4 Apaches on board HMS Ocean)
So yes, within 12 years (or more) when British carriers are back, pilots on-board will be quite good in French procedures...
They don't expect the rest of the Charles de Gaulle crew to speak English because of their presence, don't they ?
I understand it might be difficult to swallow for some.
Anyway, they are welcome on board, away from any politician BS. Apart from our both nations, can you single out another really fighting country in that beautiful europe of ours ?
Wildpilot
13th Jun 2011, 06:08
At least the showers won't be as busy as a British ship.
Its a great exchange system we learn French they learn to queue.
diginagain
13th Jun 2011, 06:11
..... can you single out another really fighting country in that beautiful europe of ours ?
Well, historically-speaking..........
SilsoeSid
13th Jun 2011, 06:21
The original one, The Tuscarora War in 1711 ;)
Ok, if it makes you happy so early in the morning;
One senior Royal Navy officer said: “Who would have thought that more than 200 years after the Battle of Trafalgar, we would be asking the French to train our Naval fighter pilots?
Who would have thought that more than 200 years after the American War of Independence, we would be asking the Americans to train our Army Apache pilots.
or
Who would have thought that more than 200 years after the American War of Independence, Americans would be training our Astronauts.
:E
Nighty, night!
diginagain
13th Jun 2011, 06:46
Sleep tight, Princess. :E
Pontius Navigator
13th Jun 2011, 08:44
. . . in English with a French accent!
This has been true in many place especially Roma and Athenii when UK based crews calling Rome and Athens often had not luck.
Once we were called blind and responded in best of British and absolutely no joy. I said can I have a go?
" 'ool tool, dis is 'awk 'awk, loud and clear."
Thereafter we had no problems.
My French is poor but I learnt much from 'ello 'ello.
Laarbruch72
13th Jun 2011, 08:50
Apart from our both nations, can you single out another really fighting country in that beautiful europe of ours ?
I seem to remember Germany were pretty handy in the fairly recent past.
BEagle
13th Jun 2011, 09:26
Did a sortie aboard a Kriegsmarine Atlantique may years ago - all the herren spoke English throughout the trip, and I don't think it was for my benefit (and I could get by in Deutsch anyway).
I'm amazed that they spoke to you at all, if your referred to them as the Kriegsmarine! That title err, 'went out of favour' in May 1945. The Bundesmarine was formed in the mid-50s; after reunification with the Ossis' Volksmarine, the title became Deutsche Marine.
Fitter2
13th Jun 2011, 09:55
I suppose it might embarrass the cousins to point out that now, to hitch a lift to the ISS, astronauts of all nationalities have to learn Russian............
Rossian
13th Jun 2011, 09:56
...I too had the pleasure of several sorties (with the same crew the way the flypro ran) during the dreaded Tacevals. At the second briefing I suggested to the captain that rather than torturing the nav by making him brief in English they should do as they normally did. No, I don't speak german either; but I had the briefing signals and ASW-ese is easy to understand.
As it was the last trip of the exercise we were to be the "disaster plan trigger" on arrival back at Nordholz. The scenario in the brown envelope required them to go speechless on crossing into german airspace. After a short period my "minder" came aft wearing an O2 mask and carrying the little walkabout O2 bottle.
"Put your mask on, quickly"
"I haven't got one because nobody gave me one. And anyway the fuselage fire is just part of the scenario"
"No! Now we have a real fire in the co-pilots instrument panel!"
OOOooer missus!
But they pressed on with the speechless bit of the plan!
Now when we did speak to ATC, when all on the base knew that this was the "exercise" fire
it took some time to hoist aboard the "real" situation. It all was eventually sorted out and we were carted off the med cen where the doc said, when he saw my UK flying suit, "Sorry I don't listen to chests in English."
"I can say "neunundneuzig" honest"
"Not really good enough"
Amusing in retrospect. But when I tumbled down the ladder through the fuselage onto the ground I was confronted with what looked like the final sequence of "Close encounters.."
Different coloured flashing lights, sirens, spotlights and and someone with a loud hailer shouting at me in German.
Very energising it was, so I fled into rthe dark beyond the lights got to a safe distance and had a cigarette. Then got on the bus. Phew!
The Ancient Mariner
NutLoose
13th Jun 2011, 11:23
Priceless...... I did a check on one of the RAF's finest many moons ago and found the locally purchased smoke goggles were actually protective goggles, you know the ones with the air holes all around the sides of them to stop them steaming up LOL :ugh:
Was lost on stores that the idea was not to let the air in..
Blacksheep
13th Jun 2011, 13:17
You're supposed to use bodge tape to cover the holes, silly. Everyone knows that.
As for the French, our Airbus rep greeted us all this morning in his best 'Allo, 'Allo English. I responded in my native north-eastern dialect. "Ahm Champion thanks, how's tha'sen?" He looked puzzled for a moment and then asked me what version of English is this? When I told him he said "Ah, so that is why zis Cheryl was sent home from America, no?"
reynoldsno1
14th Jun 2011, 01:20
if your referred to them as the Kriegsmarine
... quite so Beags ... association of ideas, or something, I watched the 'Sinking of the Bismarck' on TV the night before (I posted)!
Reinhardt
14th Jun 2011, 06:23
I seem to remember Germany were pretty handy in the fairly recent past.
I 'm talking about present times, 2011 - and the past 30 years : which european nations have been fighting in Africa, Lebanon, Balkans, Iraq, Afghanistan, Indian ocean ? ... ?
By fighting I mean bombing from above*, using ground troops, allocating significant assets, killing bad guys, and unfortunately losing the lives of some good soldiers.
Answers expected.
(*) like bombing Lybia in 1987
BEagle
14th Jun 2011, 07:52
In 1999, the Luftwaffe's Tornado ECRs acquitted themselves in the SEAD role over Kosovo, flying 2108 hours and 446 sorties. 236 HARM missiles were fired on enemy targets. All the Tornados returned safely to Germany when the conflict ended.
Germany's Armed Forces are also involved in the Afghanistani theatre of operations.
Just because a nation has leaders with more respect for national policies than the sycophantic Bush bottom-licking poodle Bliar, it doesn't mean that their Armed Forces are incapable of giving a good account of themselves.
Laarbruch72
14th Jun 2011, 08:02
By fighting I mean bombing from above*, using ground troops, allocating significant assets, killing bad guys, and unfortunately losing the lives of some good soldiers.
Answers expected.
Norwegian and Swedish SF have been carrying out ops in Afghanistan in some very dangerous areas close to the Pakistan border for years, taking casualties and causing a lot more. Belgian and Dutch aircraft have undertaken CAS duties and dropped plenty of ordnance in Afghanistan. Dutch troops have been taking part in combat operations alongside the British and Canadians in ISAF South since 2006 although they're withdrawing now. Danish troops have fought in Afghanistan and aircraft ar committed to Libya.
I think your point is that many countries don't do their fair share and I accept that but to say that no-one else in Europe is a "fighting country" probably does a lot of people a disservice.
Who would have thought that more than 200 years after the American War of Independence, we would be asking the Americans to train our Army Apache pilots.
Are we? Thought they were trained at Wallop? :confused:
Reinhardt
14th Jun 2011, 18:16
Just because a nation has leaders with more respect for national policies than the sycophantic Bush bottom-licking poodle Bliar, it doesn't mean that their Armed Forces are incapable of giving a good account of themselves.
I think your point is that many countries don't do their fair share and I accept that but to say that no-one else in Europe is a "fighting country" probably does a lot of people a disservice.
Beagle and Laarbruch 72, I take your point and I pay respect to all the courageous crew and soldiers involved from the countries you named.
What I mean is that two european countries only, for the past 30 years, have been in all the theaters I wrote, with no opposition from their own civilian public.
And to come back to the subject, only one nation in Europe still has a real aircraft carrier - that must be known.