Potable water

[Kuchan]

I was flying as a paid pax on a long haul flight with an known international airline.
I asked for a cup of water and was offered straight from the boiler tap in the galley.
I didn't drink it as it is directly from the potable water.

During the meal, water was served from a metal pot............. So, I asked for orange juice.

Is it normal for an airline to serve water from the galley tap or just to save money???

Not being sarcastic, eating salad from certain countries washed with local water would give diarrhea. So, tummy pain after the flt is no more a concern for an airline.

[Betty girl]

I think that potable water is safe to drink from most countries. My airline does not pick up potable water from certain countries and as an airline we don't serve it in-flight as drinking water.

When I first started flying we used to use water from the potable supply but that has not happened for many years now; but I think this is more to do with customers and the general public actually wanting bottled water rather than because the potable water is not safe. It is more of a fashion thing, as also seen in restaurants nowadays, as years ago we would have had a jug of water in a restaurant also.

Potable water is specifically treated to make it safe but that can actually cause it not to taste too good and that is why airlines now mostly use bottled water. Potable water is however still used for the hot beverages that are made using the bev makers in the galleys.

[malcolmf]

The definition of potable is "safe to drink". Whether it is nice to drink is a different matter.

[Rwy in Sight]

Few years ago there was a study reproduced even here that mentioned the quality of the drinking, tap, water on board aircraft was below standards. I don't remember any details but it corroborates with airlines using mainly bottled stuff.

Now about the taste, my elementary chemistry class taught me that the water is odorless and tasteless.


Rwy in Sight

[TightSlot]

I didn't drink it as it is directly from the potable water.
Potable water is safe to drink - That is the dictionary definition of "Potable". Since airlines are concerned to ensure that their passengers are not made sick by the potable water, regular audits are performed of potable water uplift at all airfields and the airfields themselves have similar processes in place. Potable water is cleansed chemically (as is tap water) to prevent contamination.

On most flights, it is likely that passengers will consume both bottled water and aircraft potable water in some mix: A bar service might include bottled water whereas a refreshment round or an ad-hoc request might involve potable water. Hot drinks are normally made with very hot (not boiling) potable water.

Many customers are under the impression that the aircraft potable water tanks are little more than mobile cesspits, with algae fronds waving around in the sludge and a few coke cans, dead birds and used condoms tangled at the bottom. Urban myths die hard and slow.

[Dawdler]

Many customers are under the impression that the aircraft potable water tanks are little more than mobile cesspits, with algae fronds waving around in the sludge and a few coke cans, dead birds and used condoms tangled at the bottom. Urban myths die hard and slow.

As a member of the inland pleasure boating scene, I think there is a certain level of paranoia being exhibited here. Most inland boats have water tanks made out of mild steel as part of the structure which are (usually) painted on the inside with a black paint (Water Tank Black). As a result many boats have the same water in their tanks for weeks (even months) this water is often consumed directly from the tank. As a boater for nearly forty years, I have never heard of a mass epidemic of water carried diseases in the boating community. Some newer boats have either stainless steel or Polypropylene tanks and I assume aircaft tanks are of similar construction, so I would not worry about the water having been in the aircraft tank for a matter of hours.

As has been mentioned above the very term Potable water means it is safe to drink. That said however, in some countries it is not always palatable. So if you are thirsty on board and offered water from the potable tank, have a drink, it might not taste nice, but it is unlikely to kill you.

[glhcarl]

Why would you not drink the water from the "potable water" tank? Each "potable water" line has a filter between the tank and any outlet/faucet.

If you drink the coffee of tea you are drinking water from "potable water" tank.

The tanks are periodically sterilized and the filters changer.

[Marty172]

I think water from taps in the galleys is perfectlty safe to drink. Airlines would face major problems if they made people ill by giving them unsafe water to drink. It may not always taste the nicest though.

At my previous airline, we sold bottled water to PAX, and gave out water from the galley taps to those who didn't want to pay for it. It's the same at home - you either decide to drink the water from your tap, or go to the supermarket and buy bottled water.

Having said that, at my current airline (where we give out drinks, rather than sell them), we pour cups of water from large bottles for PAX, unless we happen to run out of the bottles though...in which case we might revert back to using the galley taps.

[Rotweiler]

It is not if the potable water of the country is safe or not...

It is coming out form the water tanks of the airplanes. Have you ever been checked those water tanks? From inside? I did...

I suggest you to do this...
It is never drinkable...

[Avionker]

It is coming out form the water tanks of the airplanes. Have you ever been checked those water tanks? From inside? I did..


Really? When, where and how? Do tell us.

[TightSlot]

Internet Rubbish! - Ignore. No evidence, no way to test that evidence or the credentials of the poster. If aircraft drinking water was unsafe, large numbers of people would be falling sick hourly: They are not.

[Avionker]

Which is exactly why I'm calling him on it. How big does he think these tanks are anyway? How often does he think they are disinfected? I get really wound up by crap like this, posted by people who have never seen any part of an aircraft other than the cabin......

[BlueTui]

I do agree with the majority it is "safe" but tell me this, why do all major airlines provide bottled water for their crew?

Surely if it is then tap water should suffice?

Just playing devils advocate here....

[chaz1001]

I think the main reason that the crew are provided with bottled water is to help avoid all of the crew becoming unwell should there be a problem. The same reason that the flight crew cannot eat the same meal. It is also a lot easier to provide the flight crew with a couple of bottles of water than keep going in and out with cups of water every five mins!

[Avionker]

I do agree with the majority it is "safe" but tell me this, why do all major airlines provide bottled water for their crew?

Surely if it is then tap water should suffice?

Just playing devils advocate here....

Because as already mentioned the potable water, whilst perfectly safe to drink, does not always taste particularly pleasant. Also when you go to the lavatory on board and flush, and subsequently wash your hands, where do you think that water comes from?

The aircraft has only one water supply, the potable water. It actually makes sense to provide bottled water for drinking as much as possible as this then ensures adequate water supplies for hot beverages, and for supply to the lavatories.

[Mariner9]

Pilots with bottled water? :sad:

What about the terrorism risks? :=

They'll be giving them crash axes next :E

[boardingpass]

Also when you go to the lavatory on board and flush, and subsequently wash your hands, where do you think that water comes from?

In our Lavs (A319) the tap water for washing hands is not potable (or at least there is a sign saying not for drinking) whilst in the galley the taps/coffee brewers are potable. I suppose the galley has line filters whereas the lavatory does not?

[Dawdler]

Having been involved in an industry where products were designed to carry potable water, I am sure that most people contributing to this thread had no conception as to the testing involved. Each product (say an hose) has to undergo months of testing before it is approved for production. This testing (amongst other things) measures to the most miniscule degree any contamination of the water from constituent parts of the product including fungal growth. This testing has to be done by completely independent laboratories, the manufacturers own figures will not be accepted, by the health authorities.

If someone claims to have discovered a water tank in an aircraft that contains contaminated water, I imagine they also reported the fact both to the airline and Public Health. If true, it would have been stamped on immediately. I do not know for certain, but I imagine that part of a major service would include a close inspection of the potable water tanks. I know it to be the case for the "black water"(sewage) tanks.

I remain of the view that drinking water aboard aircraft is suitable for just that- drinking.

[saz71]

There is a sign in the toilets as it is a health and safety thing. Some people do not uphold the basic principles of hygiene as others......I don't think I need to say anymore.

[CEJM]

It is not if the potable water of the country is safe or not...

It is coming out form the water tanks of the airplanes. Have you ever been checked those water tanks? From inside? I did...

I suggest you to do this...
It is never drinkable...

Believe it or not but Rotweiler has got a point. Having been an enigneer for nearly a decade before I started flying I have to agree that if you have seen the inside of a water tank you would not drink the water.

The airline I worked for cleaned the water tanks once a month by flushing them with strong chlorinated water for an hour. Howeven during the yearly check you would still find some contaminants on the inside of the water tanks. Nothing that would make a person ill but just not as appealing to look at. The flushing with chlorinated water kills any bad bacteria but it doesn't stop a small layer of sludge to build up on the inside of the tank.

As has been mentioned already, potable water is perfectly safe to drink. However if you have seen the inside of a water tank after a year of use before it is cleaned you will stick with bottled water.

[Hedge36]

And if you've seen the tanks in use at the bottling company, you might decide that a bit of digestive evolution might be a good thing.

Tanks are tanks, folks, whether they're on an aircraft, tucked in the belly of a ship or sitting above ground in a water bottling facility.

[Mariner9]

On one of the tankers I sailed on, we had a problem with the fresh water evaporator when discharging in Lagos, so filled the forepeak potable water tank with fresh water for the ballast passage to Capetown.

The water tasted dreadful but we put it down to the fact it had come from Nigeria. The taste got progressively worse, so on arrival at Capetown pumped the water overboard and despatched an AB with a firehose into the tank to swill it out.

On entering the tank he immediately spotted the problem - the decaying bodies of two stowaways. :yuk:

[bingofuel]

How many people with domestic cold water tanks in their attics clean their teeth using the cold tap in the bathroom without a thought for what the tank is like.
If they saw inside the tank and the amount of contamination they may change their habits..

[Dawdler]

Actually the cold water tanks in a house (There are usually two of them) are to feed the (1) The domestic hot water system and (2) The central heating. Any water coming out of the cold tap comes usually direct from the mains without visiting a tank anywhere on the premises.

[HotDog]

Passenger aircraft carry tanks of drinking water for use by crew and passengers in flight. The source of drinking water on planes usually is the municipal water supply of the airport where the water is boarded. Water is loaded into aircraft tanks via pipes and hoses from a public water source, or from water tanker trucks.

In the United States, several government agencies share responsibility for the safety of drinking water on airliners.

The Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) oversees maintenance for all parts of the aircraft, including the potable water system.
The Food and Drug Administration (FDA) has jurisdiction over "culinary water" - ice, for example - and the pipes, tankers, or other points at which aircraft obtain water at airports.
The Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) regulates water quality in public water systems, thus it regulates the systems that supply water to airports. EPA also is responsible for the safety of the drinking water on board the aircraft.
Over a period of several months in late 2004, the United States Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) carried out water quality sampling on commercial passenger aircraft. They tested water from galley taps, water fountains, and lavatory faucets.

In two rounds of sampling, a total of 327 randomly selected domestic and international passenger aircraft were sampled. Of those, 49 aircraft (about 15%) were found to be positive for coliform bacteria.

[TightSlot]

Facts at last! Might it be reasonable to assume that in the 6-7 years since this failed audit (I'd say 15% was unacceptable) things have improved?

[WillDAQ]

Probably not to be honest.

If the quality of portable water were ever to gain sufficient prominence as an issue then you may find manufacturers modifying the tank designs to improve quality (more filtering, greater ease of cleaning etc).

Until then, it's the same system in the same aircraft.

[CD]

United States EPA: Aircraft Drinking Water Rule (http://water.epa.gov/lawsregs/rulesregs/sdwa/airlinewater/basic.cfm)
Health Canada: Aircraft Inspection Program FAQ (http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/hl-vs/travel-voyage/general/airplane-aeronefs-eng.php)
Health Canada cautions air travellers with compromised immune systems regarding water quality on aircraft (http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/ahc-asc/media/advisories-avis/_2006/2006_53-eng.php)
UK: The Microbiological Quality of Water Onboard Aircraft (http://www.hpa.org.uk/web/HPAwebFile/HPAweb_C/1197382219738)

[HZ123]

Some of you are talking utter nonsense and clearly no nothing about the on load of potable water !

[Avionker]

Would you like to expand on that comment HZ123? I see from your biography that you are a Ramp Operations trainer.

[bubblyguy]

The airline I work for does not allow us to serve potable water unless from the boilers for hot drinks.

All cold water we serve comes straight from bottled spring or mineral water.

I know another airline such as Qantas use potable water for the majority of all their services.

[bingofuel]

Any water coming out of the cold tap comes usually direct from the mains without visiting a tank anywhere on the premises.

I think you will find in the UK only the cold water tap in the kitchen is direct from the mains, traditionally the bath and wash hand basin cold feed was from the attic tank.( with all the associated contamination)
Some modern plumbing solutions are direct feed cold and mains pressure hot with a small header tank to flush toilets, but they are not usual, most plumbers don't bother with attic tanks for flushing toilets if fitting combi boilers, and connect direct to the main feed.

[MathFox]

The airline I work for does not allow us to serve potable water unless from the boilers for hot drinks. All cold water we serve comes straight from bottled spring or mineral water. I know another airline such as Qantas use potable water for the majority of all their services. There could be several reasons for that, serving cold water from the tanks requires that you have good quality water in there, which means regular cleaning of the tanks and taking care of where you take in water. Some airports provide water that (though safe) tastes worse than the potable water in other airports. On the other hand, bulk is significantly cheaper than bottled, but supplying only bottled reduces the maintenance required for the potable water system. (Finances may balance out differently domestic vs. intercontinental.)

[Dawdler]

I think you will find in the UK only the cold water tap in the kitchen is direct from the mains, traditionally the bath and wash hand basin cold feed was from the attic tank.Not in any of the houses I know. There is no reason to include a tank in the pressure system in the mains supply. this will usually supply all cold taps and WC cisterns. The only deviation from this would be a garden tap which requires a non-return valve upstream of the final faucet to prevent siphon back issues.

Some modern plumbing solutions are direct feed cold and mains pressure hot with a small header tank to flush toilets, but they are not usual, most plumbers don't bother with attic tanks for flushing toilets if fitting combi boilers, and connect direct to the main feed.My point exactly. The only tanks are usually for gravity fed hot water systems with an additional (steel/plastic) tank to top up the intergral copper tank on the hot water tank. The other tank is to top up any losses in the central hot water system.

So I maintain that contrary to your view, no drinking water passes through a tank in the house, (unless you are in the habit of drinking water from the hot water system).

However we are now getting WAY off topic.

[bingofuel]

Let us agree to disagree.
Indirect System

An indirect cold water system is when water is supplied to the house at mains pressure, this water is fed directly to a cold water storage cistern via the supply pipe called the 'rising main'. A branch pipe off the rising main delivers drinking water to the kitchen and garden tap/faucet, cold water to all other taps/faucets and appliances is provided indirectly from the cold water storage cistern (not for drinking) under gravity pressure not mains pressure.
The hot water storage cylinder is also supplied with cold water from the same cistern.

[barnstormer1968]

Just to add my two penneth

An indirect system refers to the way the water is heated in the hot water cylinder, and NOT in any way to the delivery method of the cold water.

That is of course IMHO based on being a plumber for over twenty years :)

[Kuchan]

Small aircraft uses a single water tank of approx 45 US gallons where as a bigger aircraft has 2 tanks to a total of approx 90 US gallons.

The same tank supplies the galley and toilet tap or toilet flushing ( vacuum type).

The galley has a small filter which is changed at a major maintennance check.

The potable water is disinfected with chlorine at a specific scheduled check which is far in between.

The chlorination takes time. It needs a 2 hrs soaking followed by 2 to 3 completed rinsing. Every boiler must be rinsed too. It is done normally in the hanger together with a maintenance check. So it is very unlikely to be done every month. It takes a couple of 2 man hours to dump the 90 gallons water unless you want to flood the hanger floor. The whole process would take over a whole day.

So, short cut is always the way to go in chlorination of potable water. Most of the time, a simple rinsing is carried out after the aircraft is outside of hanger. That explain why the water tastes horrible after a check.

Never in my memory that I have to open a potable tank for inspection in my many years of aircraft maintenance doing numerous C and D checks.

I would not drink the potable water, same as I would not drink the tap from a hotel or cold water from house upstairs. I know what can be inside a tank. It might not make you sick but you may not be lucky every time.

My question is " will the airlines be responsible for a pax off sick after a flight with tummy ache"

Every one has his own degree of immune system. An Indian will not get sick drinking with his own country water, but you as a British will.