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Roger Standby
17th Apr 2011, 13:52
Hmmm, couldn't happen anywhere else in the world! Could it? :zzz:

Roger Sir
17th Apr 2011, 21:41
Nah. No way.

Well, maybe just the odd micro sleep. Like 30 minutes or so.

ASA were considering double manning on night shifts after Uberlingen but it`s on the back burner until another........:yuk:

airsupport
17th Apr 2011, 23:42
And not just controllers either...... ;)

apache
17th Apr 2011, 23:56
but....

"it is the worlds BEST system!!!!!"

ozineurope
18th Apr 2011, 01:51
Not sure anymore about towers, but most certainly at 2 remote TCUs. Perth and Adelaide.

DEFCON4
18th Apr 2011, 03:59
WASHINGTON – Reports of sleeping air traffic controllers highlight a long-known and often ignored hazard: Workers on night shifts can have trouble concentrating and even staying awake.

"Government officials haven't recognized that people routinely fall asleep at night when they're doing shift work," said Dr. Charles Czeisler, chief of sleep medicine at Brigham and Women's Hospital in Boston.

Czeisler said studies show that 30 percent to 50 percent of night-shift workers report falling asleep at least once a week while on the job.

So the notion that this has happened only a few times among the thousands of controllers "is preposterous," he said in a telephone interview.

In a sign of growing awareness of the problem, the Federal Aviation Administration said Saturday it was changing air traffic controllers' work schedules most likely to cause fatigue. The announcement comes after the agency disclosed another incident in which a controller fell asleep while on duty early Saturday morning at a busy Miami regional facility. According to a preliminary review, there was no impact to flight operations, the FAA said.

Czeisler said the potential danger isn't limited to air traffic controllers, but can apply to truck and bus drivers, airline pilots and those in the maritime industry. Who else? Factory workers, police, firefighters, emergency workers, nurses and doctors, cooks, hotel employees, people in the media and others on night or changing shifts.

"We live in a very sleep-deprived society where many people are burning the candle at both ends," Czeisler said. He said that a half-century ago, just 2 percent of people slept six hours or less per night; today it's 28 percent.

Dr. William Fishbein, a neuroscientist at the City University of New York, said that when people work odd shifts "it mucks up their biological rhythms."

Hormones are synchronized with the wake-sleep cycle. When people change shifts, the brain never knows when it's supposed to be asleep, so this affects how people function.

People who change shifts every few days are going to have all kinds of problems related to memory and learning, Fishbein said. This kind of schedule especially affects what he called relational memories, which involve the ability to understand how one thing is related to another.

In addition to drowsiness and inability to concentrate, people working night shifts are more subject to chronic intestinal and heart diseases and have been shown to have a higher incidence of some forms of cancer. The World Health Organization has classified shift work as a probable carcinogen.

"We have 500 cable channels, we take work home with us on our Blackberrys and computers, both work and entertainment options are available 24 hours a day seven days a week and there is much more and brighter light exposure in our homes in evenings, which affects hormones involved in sleep, Czeisler said.

"And we are still trying to get up with the chickens because our work hours are starting earlier and earlier," he said.

Today, controllers are at the center of the firestorm, with recent reports that several planes couldn't contact airport towers for assistance in landing. Members of Congress are responding to a worried public, controllers have been suspended and the head of the government's air traffic control system has resigned.

President Barack Obama told ABC News that controllers must stay alert and do their jobs.

One old solution back in the news is allowing night workers to nap.

"There should be sanctioned on-shift napping. That's the way to handle night shift work," said Gregory Belenky, a sleep expert at Washington State University in Spokane.

A NASA study suggested that pilots on long-distance flights would perform much better if given a chance to take a scheduled nap, as long the rest was planned and the both pilots didn't sleep at the same time.

"But even though that's been known for decades, it's never been allowed because we prefer to pretend that these things are not happening," instead of managing the problem, Czeisler said. "We have a bury-our-head-in-the-sand attitude."

Controllers are often scheduled for a week of midnight shifts followed by a week of morning shifts and then a week on swing shifts. This pattern, sleep scientists say, interrupts the body's natural sleep cycles.

Many of the Federal Aviation Administration's 15,700 controllers work schedules that allow no realistic opportunity for rest. Their record for errors on the job has grown sharply over the past several years.

FAA rules prohibit sleeping on the job, even during breaks. Employees who violate them can be fired. But controllers told The Associated Press that napping at night where one controller works two jobs while the other sleeps, and then they swap, is an open secret within the agency.

Czeisler also is urging screening of truck drivers for sleep apnea, a breathing problem they can be prone to because many are obese. He estimates that as many as 250,000 people in the U.S. doze off while driving every day, mostly in the daytime.

Studies have shown that a sleep-deprived driver is as impaired as someone with enough alcohol in his blood to be considered a drunken driver.

Even a drunk has some reflexes. "If you fall asleep, your performance is much worse," he said.

___
Online:

Brigham and Women's Hospital's Division of Sleep Medicine: BWH Sleep Medicine - Sleep Medicine at Brigham and Women's Hospital (http://tinyurl.com/3sll8q7)

National Sleep Foundation: National Sleep Foundation - Information on Sleep Health and Safety | Information on Sleep Health and Safety (http://www.sleepfoundation.org/)

Follow Yahoo! News on Twitter, become a fan on Facebook
......

SAME SHJTE
18th Apr 2011, 04:03
Cairns TWR has single person doggos as does the Cairns TCU.

airsupport
18th Apr 2011, 04:08
It would seem to me that IF a control tower (anywhere in the World) NEEDS to be open any time, then that tower should have at least 2 people manning it. :ok:

SAME SHJTE
18th Apr 2011, 04:52
airsupport, I couldn't agree more, and as it turns out we aren't the only ones. It was announced last week by the powers that be in the US that there will no longer be single person doggos. Will Airservices follow suite? Hmmm

airsupport
18th Apr 2011, 05:06
airsupport, I couldn't agree more, and as it turns out we aren't the only ones. It was announced last week by the powers that be in the US that there will no longer be single person doggos. Will Airservices follow suite? Hmmm

Well they certainly should do the same.

IF a tower does not need to be open, okay it is closed, but if it NEEDS to be open it should have at least 2 people manning it, just common sense.

flyingfox
18th Apr 2011, 06:14
... and if the pilots sleep too it could really blow the slot times!!

Mr. Hat
18th Apr 2011, 06:34
Just pretend it doesn't happen and the problem will go away.

skybed
18th Apr 2011, 07:13
it's just many aviation unions don't engage and lobby to have it on top of the agenda.:ugh:

Artificial Horizon
18th Apr 2011, 07:38
TOUGHEN UP PRINCESS'S!!! :eek:

gruntyfen
18th Apr 2011, 08:23
FAA takes action.

Press Release – FAA Announces Changes to Controller Scheduling (http://www.faa.gov/news/press_releases/news_story.cfm?newsId=12668)

Press Release – FAA Announces Changes to Controller Scheduling



Print (http://www.faa.gov/news/press_releases/news_story.cfm?newsId=12668&print=go)
Email (http://www.faa.gov/email_page/?title=Press%20Release%20%26ndash%3B%20FAA%20Announces%20Cha nges%20to%20Controller%20Scheduling&pageurl=%2Fnews%2Fpress%5Freleases%2Fnews%5Fstory%2Ecfm%3Fne wsId%3D12668&sid=true)

For Immediate Release

April 17, 2011
Contact: Laura Brown ([email protected])//Sasha Johnson ([email protected])
FAA – NATCA Call to Action on Professionalism Begins Monday in Atlanta

WASHINGTON – Secretary of Transportation Ray LaHood and Federal Aviation Administration Administrator Randy Babbitt today announced changes to air traffic controller scheduling practices that will allow controllers more time for rest between shifts.
“We expect controllers to come to work rested and ready to work and take personal responsibility for safety in the control towers. We have zero tolerance for sleeping on the job,” said Secretary of Transportation Ray LaHood. “Safety is our top priority and we will continue to make whatever changes are necessary.”
“Research shows us that giving people the chance for even an additional one hour of rest during critical periods in a schedule can improve work performance and reduce the potential for fatigue,” said FAA Administrator Randy Babbitt. “Taking advantage of the time you have to rest is also a professional responsibility.”
The new scheduling rules have already been put in place and will be fully in effect by the end of the week:


Controllers will now have a minimum of nine hours off between shifts. Currently they may have as few as eight.
Controllers will no longer be able to swap shifts unless they have a minimum of 9 hours off between the last shift they worked and the one they want to begin.
Controllers will no longer be able to switch to an unscheduled midnight shift following a day off.
FAA managers will schedule their own shifts in a way to ensure greater coverage in the early morning and late night hours.

On Monday, FAA Administrator Babbitt and NATCA President Paul Rinaldi will be in Atlanta, where they will begin their Call to Action on air traffic control safety and professionalism meetings. The goal of the Call to Action is to reinforce the need for all air traffic personnel to adhere to the highest professional standards.
Over the course of this week, they will visit air traffic facilities in and around the following cities: Atlanta; Dallas- Ft. Worth;Kansas City; Chicago;New York; and Washington,DC. The two will also visit the air traffic control training academy at the Mike Monroney Aeronautical Center inOklahoma City.
Senior members of both FAA and NATCA leadership teams will also be visiting additional FAA facilities nationwide over the next few weeks.
In addition to changes in scheduling practices, the Call to Action effort will include the development of a fatigue education program to teach controllers the risks of fatigue and how to avoid it.
The FAA will also commission an independent review of the air traffic control training curriculum and qualifications to make sure new controllers are properly prepared.
NATCA will expand its own Professional Standards program nationwide which focuses on peer-to-peer education for controllers on how to maintain the highest degree of professional conduct.

fmcinop
18th Apr 2011, 09:13
What if the single controller becomes I'll? Has a heart attack, stroke or some other debilitating illness with little or no notice? What if they just need a toilet break?

How can occupational health and safety allow a single person to operate such a critical and crucial job solo?

I worked for a number of years for the government in 24/7 computer system and for that very reason we always has 3 on shift. 1 could be on break leaving behind to operate the system in total safety!

Roger Standby
18th Apr 2011, 14:26
Just pretend it doesn't happen and the problem will go away.

They are... but it isn't :zzz::zzz::zzz:

Senior manager's response to the issue being highlighted? "Just give him/her a nudge..."

What we want to know is, are we overstepping the mark if we wake up sleeping managers?

welcome_stranger
18th Apr 2011, 22:46
I can remember being kept away all night, along with the rest of the crew in Brizvagus.

The reason why we were all bright-eyed(?) and bushy-tailed that night?

The snores from the System Supervisor!!!!!


Yeah napping on nights doesn't happen - just ask :mad: management who get to sleep in their beds every night - helped no doubt by a red or two purchased with their "productivity bonus".

:yuk::yuk::yuk::yuk::yuk::yuk::yuk:

airsupport
18th Apr 2011, 23:06
Of course it is not only controllers, I had a very worrying night flight many years ago now, from BNE to TSV in a Kingair, the only Pilot was asleep for some 20-30 minutes during cruise. :eek:

And although not a danger to Pilots and their pax, this problem of long hours at night can be dangerous in other ways too. Over the decades I did shift work at airports there are numerous times I didn't remember a lot of the drive home in the morning after night shifts. One morning I will never forget, scared the hell out of me, stopped for a red light at a major intersection, next thing the light is going red again, scary thing was I still don't know if I nodded off and missed one more changing of the lights or more than one. :ooh:

max1
20th Apr 2011, 09:55
On certain single doggo sectors, controllers are rostered on standby if someone becomes unavailable for the night shift (doggo).
Controllers have argued that if you want me to be on standby and I prepare for the shift anyway why don't I come in and share the shift and reduce the fatigue of the poor schmuck working it? ASA do not want this, their level of animosity to controllers seems to have no bounds. There is a corporate pathological dislike of controllers.
Airservices Australia do not care about their operational people, the culture is flog your people to death and prove that you are a hard assed manager. This is why those that can are leaving.

The Last Days of Empire, you've seen it with 'traffic restrictions due operational requirements' it will get much worse and Minister Albanese is probably hoping it won't be on his watch.

Dick N. Cider
28th Apr 2011, 23:26
Fatigue fear for air traffic controllers: staff want changes to improve safety at Australia's airports | The Australian (http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/aviation/fatigue-fear-for-air-traffic-controllers-staff-want-changes-to-improve-safety-at-australias-airports/story-e6frg95x-1226046403548)

Fatigue fear for air traffic controllers: staff want changes to improve safety at Australia's airports

Steve Creedy, Aviation writer
From: The Australian
April 29, 2011 12:00AM

AIR Services Australia has been urged to review its roster arrangements and night operations amid claims air traffic controllers have fallen asleep on the job.

The air traffic controllers' union, Civil Air, has warned that Australian air traffic controllers work alone at night in many locations without adequate breaks in a situation similar to those which have caused a furore in the US. It wants Australia to follow the US and ban single-person night operations.

Civil Air president Robert Mason said the combination of single-person operation, inadequate break provisions and understaffing was contributing to controller fatigue.

Mr Mason said even in major centres there were groups where only one traffic controller was responsible for "whole swags of airspace" without an available replacement.

He said there had been instances where controllers had dozed off and had to be nudged awake by colleagues. The situation was worse in smaller centres such as Perth, Cairns and Adelaide where single operators could be alone in one building.

"We've had a couple of instances over the past couple of years where someone has fallen asleep during the night and been unable to be roused by phone calls or normal intercom calls," he said.

The issue has generated a fiery debate in the US where a string of highly-publicised incidents involving sleeping controllers has claimed the scalp of the head of the Federal Aviation Administration's Air Traffic Organisation, Hank Krakowski.

The incidents led the FAA to ban single-controller overnight shifts but it has remained under fire for failing to previously address fatigue issues.

The termination of at least three controllers has also fuelled an angry debate between the FAA and the US air traffic controllers' union amid calls by the US safety watchdog, the National Transportation Safety Board, for updated fatigue rules.

Although against the decisions to sack controllers, Mr Mason applauded the FAA move to ban single-person overnight operations and said Airservices had been heading in the same direction but the move was wound back because of staff shortages.

He said Airservices had a fatigue risk-management system based on research done by the University of South Australia.

"That is in the process of being revamped at the moment and that certainly talks about the individual opportunity for sleep and designing rosters that should provide opportunity for people to sleep," he said. "But it doesn't measure real fatigue with all the variation patterns in the real world.

"For instance, I could have done the morning shift this morning and be back on the night shift tonight and the risk modelling would say I had 10 hours in which I could sleep across that period. Of course, the reality is that you may not sleep at all just because of what the real world is like -- kids screaming, someone digging up the road outside your house, those sorts of things."

The Civil Air official said short-comings in the fatigue risk-management system were compounded by the ongoing staff shortages and the pressure to keep airspace open.

"We've seen airspace closure in a couple of instances recently to the north of Sydney. They are simply unable to provide staffing," he said. But Airservices said it was unaware of any instances of sleeping controllers and it had in place a robust fatigue management system that ensured controllers were rostered for duty in a way that minimised fatigue.

It said this included a 10-hour break between shifts that was already in excess of recently extended nine-hour breaks in the US.

Spokesman Rob Walker said the Australian system was different and far more rigorous in terms of how it managed work flow and preparedness for work.

Even the systems the FAA was introducing now to counter its sleeping controller problem was not as robust as the current Australian system. "Airservices is confident that we have appropriate mechanisms in place to ensure that controllers are given opportunity for appropriate rest breaks while on shift and between shifts," Mr Walker said.

Mr Walker confirmed that tower and terminal control unit facilities at Cairns, Perth and Adelaide were staffed by single controllers during night-time operations but said staff in these facilities talked regularly to other Airservices staff located either in the same building or other Airservices facilities, as well as individual aircraft in flight.

Roger Sir
29th Apr 2011, 00:52
"Airservices is confident that we have appropriate mechanisms in place to ensure that controllers are given opportunity for appropriate rest breaks while on shift and between shifts," Mr Walker said.



Perhaps Mr. Walker could inform me as to what an "appropriate" rest break is on my night shift?. Last time i looked at the roster there was nobody but me for the entire shift.

I recall watching a video produced by the University of South Australia many years ago. They calculated that a night without sleep left one with the reactions the equivalent of a blood alcohol reading of .05%. From memory the "guinea pigs" were in their teens or early 20`s. After many years of shiftwork i can tell you my reactions at 5 a.m. are veeeeery sloooww.

The current calculations performed to assess fatigue take no account of age. The numbers are occasionally manipulated by standing you down early from a shift if you`re returning for a night shift. As little as 5 minutes from the end of your shift can see you drop below a trigger level and "hey presto" good to go for the night shift.:ugh:

max1
29th Apr 2011, 08:30
But Airservices said it was unaware of any instances of sleeping controllers and it had in place a robust fatigue management system that ensured controllers were rostered for duty in a way that minimised fatigue.

It said this included a 10-hour break between shifts that was already in excess of recently extended nine-hour breaks in the US.

Gotta love 'spokespersons'. They have absolutely no idea about what they are talking about but can stay on message until the cows come home.
ASA are 'unaware of sleeping controllers' and will continue to be unaware until forced to admit it.
10 hours is in excess of nine hours (controllers are hired for spatial/time awareness and so must spokespersons), in Australia controllers can return for duty after 8 hours and overtime rates are paid. In actuality controllers can continue to seperate aircraft with your loved ones after any break period and get penalty rates as long as the controller who is offered the 'money' or other inducement considers themselves fit for duty. This is an ASA example of a robust system. Work 8 hours, have a 4 hour break and work unassisted for 6 hours. Don't worry a 'robust' system will protect your family and friends.
If we throw enough money at a controller, can they reasonably assess their fitness for duty and continue working? A theme that keeps coming through in all fatigue studies is that the fatigued person is the last person to realise that they are affected by fatigue. Alot like alcohol and its effects.
There are ASA managers on bonuses who will lose money if the airspace goes TIBA/TRA. They won't be happy if this happens, does the controller want/need them to be unhappy and make their immediate managers life miserable? If they make your 'contract based managers tenure' uncomfortable, may they re-assess your next advancement? Does the 2 year controller want this to happen? Is this robust?
From the Oxford Dictionary, robust in this instance means vigorous, sensible and straightforward. I understand that at some airlines that when your FAID score reaches a certain level that you are considered not 'fit for duty' there are no inducements or threats, you don't take the responsibilty of looking after other peoples lives, your companies robust Fatigue Risk Management Sysytem kicks in. This seems sensible and straightforward to me.

kiwivol
29th Apr 2011, 08:59
Mr Walker confirmed that tower and terminal control unit facilities at Cairns, Perth and Adelaide were staffed by single controllers during night-time operations but said staff in these facilities talked regularly to other Airservices staff located either in the same building or other Airservices facilities, as well as individual aircraft in flight. Yep, so we are relying on other staff to make sure that everyone stays awake?
As long as they are talking to other controllers, they must be awake and therefore can't possibly be fatigued...
I didn't realise that coord was able to be used that way. :hmm:

max1
29th Apr 2011, 12:23
In relation to my above. The people in ASA who are responsible for the Fatigue Risk Management System (FRMS) have developed, alongside outside consultants, a reasonably decent system if it is followed properly.
The clincher in this whole system is that the controller (like the pilot) is given the responsibility as the final arbiter of their fitness for duty. This is seen as the linchpin of the FRMS and the reason the last hole in the Swiss cheese will not line up i.e. any inherent failings in the FRMS will always be saved because the individual will be able to assess their fitness for duty without fear or favour. The problem here is that the individual may already be fatigued, may be offered financial inducements, may be worried about being denied advancement,etc is exactly NOT the person you want forced to make the fitness for duty call. Unless they are guaranteed that nothing will come back on them for making that call.
CASA have advised that in regards to the above that they are monitoring the situation closely and would like to know when regulations are broken. This is all very nice, but CASA refuse to regulate your ATCs work hours. Thus absolving themselves from investigating any breaches of regulations.
Yes Minister anyone????????

lestump
30th Apr 2011, 01:59
Calling all lawyers.
Roger Sir says: "The numbers are occasionally manipulated by standing you down early from a shift if you`re returning for a night shift. As little as 5 minutes from the end of your shift can see you drop below a trigger level and "hey presto" good to go for the night shift."

This seems to be manipulation of the FRMS to achieve a result significantly different to the purpose of the system. If, indeed, it is being done to endure airspace is kept open and consequently, bonuses are protected, then to this layperson it sounds a lot like conspiracy to defraud the taxpayer. Of course, I didn't go to university and I didn't study law, so maybe common sense doesn't apply to this. :rolleyes:

Nautilus Blue
30th Apr 2011, 02:52
The clincher in this whole system is that the controller (like the pilot) is given the responsibility as the final arbiter of their fitness for duty. This is seen as the linchpin of the FRMS and the reason the last hole in the Swiss cheese will not line up i.e. any inherent failings in the FRMS will always be saved because the individual will be able to assess their fitness for duty without fear or favour.
In ASA what that means is any fatigue issue is solely the fault of the controller. The FAID system is used to protect managers, its always "I approved the controller to work with excessive fatigue, as long as they felt themselves fit to do so." It usually doesn't even go that far. Last time I had to do a Prior Sleep/Wake assessment, it took the manager 15 minutes to manipulate to figures, running the model over and over until it came out "No Risk" :ugh:.
...robust fatigue management system that ensured controllers were rostered for duty in a way that minimised fatigue.
This would be the system that had maximum rostered FAID score of 80, which was changed to 80.4, because that rounds down, and allows a little more to be squeezed out of the workforce.

Ex FSO GRIFFO
30th Apr 2011, 05:42
Whatever happened to the para in AOI's which said something like.........

'Staff shall report for duty only if they are medically fit and in a condition to do so'....or words to that effect..??

Is it not an 'offence' to report for duty if medically or otherwise unfit...??:confused:

Cheers:ok:

Nautilus Blue
30th Apr 2011, 09:11
Ex FSO GRIFFO - very much so, the only credible fatigue management we have is "sick leave as required". However, if you do say NO
- your colleges may have to work the same traffic/airspace short handed and without breaks (airspace will not be closed, by ASA policy)
- you may be required to explain why you were fatigued to an internal kangaroo court (it cannot be because of rostering because ASA has a robust fatigue management policy)
- your line manager in his/her annual review may decide you won't be getting your pay increment
- your next level up manager may decide you can't be released to take up the position you won elsewhere in the foreseeable future
- you may be deemed to be taking too much sick leave, and be required to obtain doctors certificates for ALL sick leave
On the other hand, if you are already on the top pay band, aren't chasing promotion/transfer and haven't needed much sick leave, its a LOT easier :)

max1
30th Apr 2011, 09:28
Whatever happened to the para in AOI's

Oh AOIs, music to me old ears, Griffo.

What happened to the days when no-one questioned the Captains decision to carry extra fuel?

max1
1st May 2011, 06:53
Griffo,
You might be under the misapprehension that the super experienced SAAC/STAC is still in the room and considers themselves responsible for whatever happens in their FIR.
That if an ATC says I am not right to continue, I have had an incident and need to be stood down, I am ringing up not fit for duty, etc that the SAAC/STAC/ Centre Co-ord considers and also takes responsibility for that decision. If the SAAC/STAC considered that the controller was in the right they would back them.
Those days are gone. Woe betide any Mondays Expert who tried to intimidate those Supervisors. Woe betide any controller who tried to BS those Supervisors. They understood that sometimes people needed a mental health day, and also the that the controller is the final arbiter of their own fitness for duty.
It is now a sham.

kiwivol
2nd May 2011, 00:56
Taken from Civil Air Australia (http://www.civilair.asn.au/)

Night Shift Facts

Australia has 6 airports serviced by Air Traffic Control 24 hours a day.

Australia has 2 Major Air Traffic Control Centers that monitor 11% of the Worlds Airspace.

Australian Airspace is divided into 29 sectors for the night shift.

These sectors are monitored by 46 Air Traffic Controllers in 12 different facilities.

Australia as of 30 June 2010 has 959 Air Traffic Controllers.(source 2010 AirservicesAustralia Annual Report).

The night shift for most sectors is between 10 pm and 6 am.

4.8% (46 of 959) Air Traffic Controllers are rostered on for 33% of the day (8 of 24 hours).

13 of 29 sectors are staffed by a single Air Traffic Controller.

5 of the 13 work alone for up to 7 hours. 8 of the 13 work in the Major Centers alongside other Air Traffic Controllers.

To provide for two person night shifts would require 13 of the remaining 913 Air Traffic Controllers rostered for the night shift.

Two person night shifts will provide for greater safety and allow for better fatigue management.

Blockla
2nd May 2011, 08:44
4.8% (46 of 959) Air Traffic Controllers are rostered on for 33% of the day (8 of 24 hours). What does that mean?5 of the 13 work alone for up to 7 hours. 8 of the 13 work in the Major Centers alongside other Air Traffic Controllers.perhaps this is clearer:

5 of the 13 work alone for up to 7 hours and will not see another person for the majority of that time unless a cleaner or technician also is working that night. 8 of the 13 work alone in the Major Centers alongside other Air Traffic Controllers but have no break relief provisions and go to the toilet get coffee etc. in quiet periods...

bankrunner
2nd May 2011, 10:45
The federal government organisation I work for has shift workers who look after our datacentre, and fix anything that breaks overnight.

The shifties are NEVER, EVER rostered on alone, despite the fact they don't really have a lot to do during the night, and the job they do isn't even safety critical. This arrangement exists for OH&S reasons, on the grounds that if one of them were to have a heart attack or the like, nobody would be around to raise help for up to 12 hours until the day shift showed up.

I find it a bit concerning that air traffic controllers do get rostered on alone.

max1
5th May 2011, 12:06
The federal government organisation I work for has shift workers who look after our datacentre, and fix anything that breaks overnight.

This arrangement exists for OH&S reasons, on the grounds that if one of them were to have a heart attack or the like, nobody would be around to raise help for up to 12 hours until the day shift showed up.

What is being said here?

We have one organisation that looks after 1's and 0's in computers and monitors systems overnight. It puts two people on overnight, not because two people are required to consistently interact and control the system, but because they are concerned with the health of their employees.

We have another organisation that is entrusted, through Federal Legislation, to have 'fit for duty' employees who are required to intervene and correct situations that have, in every situation hundreds of lives involved ,that are expected to work in stand-alone environments with no provision for relief for 7-8 hours overnight.
Is your Mum, Dad, Grandparents, Kids, etc a binary 1 or a 0?????
Google Skyguide
Then ask your local MP, why does ASA deliver a multi million dollar return to the Federal Government and bonuses to managers when it doesn't have enough controllers to do what it is required to do by Federal Legislation?
You may also ask how does ASA reconcile bonuses (at risk components, haha) against profits in a safety based environment, and good luck in getting an answer to that one.

general disaray
19th Aug 2011, 18:08
What if the single controller becomes I'll? Has a heart attack, stroke or some other debilitating illness with little or no notice? What if they just need a toilet break

The main idea with controlling is separation assurance, or put simply make sure the aircraft a separated in a manor that if you dropped dead on the job, they wouldn't hit.
As for the going to the toilet, you time it so that there are no planes due for departure or landing grab the hand held radio and run down to the loo. Luckily I have never had to do this.
As for ASA's fatigue management, it's a great system. The precious managers go home to bed (this is in direct reference to the tower in which I used to work I cannot speak for the rest of ASA), and in the tower you have 2 people on shift. The first person goes down to the break out room (he/she will have usually have done the morning shift) pulls out the fold out couch and sleeps for a few hours. Then at a pre-agreed time he/she gets up and takes over from the other controller who then goes down to occupy the warm spot left on the couch. He/She gets up prior to the morning shift rocking up and you have 2 fatigue managed controllers.

fmcinop
19th Aug 2011, 19:12
Not all toilet breaks can be taken at a time that is 'convenient' to your employer or the job at hand. There are times when you just got to go and there is no waiting for a time when there are not departures.
As for the comments on controllers becoming incapacitated whilst on the job and working solo, the concern was not really for the airspace they are controlling but for the controller themselves. Ie immediate and urgent medical attention. If you are there by yourself it may be some time before someone in another location works out that your on the floor out cold and requiring medical attention. Then with modern security measures, how does medical help actually get to you at 2am when you are locked inside by yourself?

eocvictim
20th Aug 2011, 05:42
Not all toilet breaks can be taken at a time that is 'convenient' to your employer or the job at hand. There are times when you just got to go and there is no waiting for a time when there are not departures.

Wrong cross section of the public to be preaching this too.