7% BA Pilot loss next 3 years

[RVR800]

My sources indicate that if the planned changes at Gatwick proceed then this will result in the loss of long haul BA pilot jobs from Gatwick

They will be lost by natural wastage and the
numbers total 235 pilots which equals 7%
of the workforce in BA

This cannot be good news for wannabees
can it ?- how will it affect DEP CEP entry
into BA ?

[left outer, right inner]

It won't affect BA selection very much at all I think. You said it yourself, natural wastage.

A far bigger problem BA have got at the moment is the future shortage of pilots as a result of retirement in the next 5-10 years. Don't please quote me but it could be in the order of 10% of captains retiring in this period of time! For this reason, at my aptitude tests on the 5th feb, we were all told that they hoped that we all passed the aptitude tests and got in to BA because they are somewhat 'desparate for pilots' (quote).

This then I think puts it into context. The recruitment for CEP and/or DEP will continue for the forseeable future.

This is my viewpoint on the matter, and I think it is reasonably accurate!

Cya, LORI

[foghorn]

Just to add to that, I have been doing a bit of jumpseating recently (with thanks to various excellent BA crews). On just about every crew I've had the priveledge of sitting in with there has been a DEP self-improver FO. This has been on the LHR-based 757/A320 fleets.

Not representative I know, but shows that there is hope for those of us who are silly enough to pay our way through to a licence!

Maybe any BA pilots lurking out there can comment?

[Mister Geezer]

RVR 800 I notice you said:

"result in the loss of long haul BA pilot jobs from Gatwick".

As far as I am aware BA long haul Flight Crew are effectively London based since they operate out of LHR and LGW.

So as BA downscale their LGW long haul ops and transfer some of them to LHR I would be very surprised if their numbers of long haul Flight Deck crew would change significantly.

IMHO anyway!!! :)

MG

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It's a limited RAS as you approach my dark area.......

[performance limited]

Hi guys,

my neighbour (757 767 Capt BA, recently ex 744) said on the 744 fleet there is a desperate shortage of crews which many hitting the 900h limit; surprising I thought.

My forms gone in today (DEP), hoping for long-haul, or failing that, anything.

[Pontius]

RVR800,

The reduction in longhaul routes from LGW doesn't really affect the price of fish. As has already been alluded, the aircraft are simply popping up the road to LHR where they (mostly) will continue as before. There is no intention to reduce the 747-400 or 777 flying, so the little bit of reduction will come form the 767.

It will not affect your application to join as a pilot. There are still 1000 pilots to go over the next 5 years (thanks to the bulge of pilots popping out of Hamble all those years ago). This is a fact you can hang your hat on and it will only be affected (mildly in my opinion) if BA ups the retirement age.

The latest figures put this year's recruitment at 120 TEPs and 80 DEPs....all subject to change, of course, but accurate today.


DEP,

Good luck with your application. Just so you know, there are NO new entrant pilots (DEP or TEP) going longhaul. All these slots are being filled internally. If you're a betting man, put your money on going Airbus, with an outside chance of 757 or even less of 737.


Chin chin,

Pontius



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You Ain't Seen Me - Right !!

[N2000]

Performance Limited

Your neighbour is spot on about the hours on the BA B744 fleet. This month they published a list showing around 320 pilots on the fleet who are in excess of 800 hours.

Many are very close to the limit, and quite a few have lost trips to keep them legal!

[RVR800]

Thankyou all for your comments..

The source of the data in the original post
was from BALPAs airwaves flyer

article entitled

'All change at Gatwick...'

I guess a lot of the talk of pilot numbers
is confused by the complex issue of merging
CFE pilots into BA? this subject is being discussed in another thread.

[BAB2B]

Pontius,

I'd put stronger odds on new crew into BA going on to the 737 fleets (-3/4/500). They are strong in numbers for a few years yet and I'd guess Flight Ops would want experienced BA crew building up hours on the A319s initially as the new hulls come online?? Short term obviously.

I can't see signifincant investment in 757/767 training with the number of retirals to DHL/QF.

Just a thought....

[TEMP0+TSRAGR]

FOGHORN - The split of CEP/DEP's in BA is I would say about 50/50.
I joined as a DEP last year in an intake of 10 DEP's, of which a large percentage had thrown away jet commands with the charters or smaller carriers to start with BA as a two stipper at the bottom of the seniority list.

This just shows how much even experienced crews value a job with BA .... you have to have worked for a 'lesser' airline to appreciate the difference ... the job at 35,000 feet is exactly the same BUT the lifetstyle issues with BA don't compare ... actually having a significant say in roster patterns, trips, AND having a roster that remains unchanged !!

Sorry I digress ! The point is it doesnt matter your background, BA is about to retire around 1000 pilots over the next 5 years, out of 3500 total, that places you well for future command prospects and career progression.

DEP/CEP's are all treated exactly the same once online, even though one might have 5000 hours and the other 200 !!!

Personally I enjoyed self improving, instructing, flying turbo props and regional jets, BUT it doesnt matter how you get in at the end off the day .....

If you are young enough and can get on the CEP scheme GO FOR IT ! Its the best in the industry ... no worries on funding yourself and living off bread and water (It makes me cringe when I hear CEP's moaning about their lot at BA, do they have any idea what others have done to get their licences ?).

The best of luck to you all .... it sure beats working for a living !!!!!!!

[This message has been edited by TEMP0+TSRAGR (edited 16 February 2001).]

[MJR]

Pontius, forgive my ignorance but what is Hamble.

cheers

MJR

[Windy]

MJR,

Hamble was a flight training school based on the Hampshire coast... they did all the BA training a few decades ago... A boom in recruitment at that time has meant that all the pilots recruited in that batch are now at retirement age. Hence the need for pilots.

[foghorn]

Good, I hope BA keep sucking pilots off the top, the trickle down effect will hopefully open up opportunities at the bottom for myself and other wannabes when we have our licences!

foggy

[RVR800]

Let the sun shine and the
Let the hold pool evaporate..

[foghorn]

RVR you're just too poetic, mate :) :) :)

[Pontius]

RVR,

It already has :) < 5 pilots in the pool at the moment who are qualified for the current round of DEP entries.

Pontius

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You Ain't Seen Me - Right !!

[BombBay]

http://www.pprune.org/ubb/NonCGI/eek.gifThis just goes to prove what an irresponsible airline BA are.
To lose 7% of your pilots is unacceptable rate, what do BA tell their mummies and daddies when they come to the airport to collect them?
Where do lost airline pilots go?
Probably to the same place as lost luggage :)

[BAB2B]

To lose 7% isn't an unacceptable rate, it's just how the manpower planning department of BA/BEA/BOAC worked at the time.

The fact is, the current management under the privatised BA is dealing with it proactively with an ab-initio scheme second to none in numbers (at 150-200 per year) and a direct entry scheme to match.

BA will never be short of pilots, and will always attract the highest quality pilots due to the fleet and route diversity.

BAB2B

[Spoonbill]

BAB2B - chill out me old fella - your knickers are twisted too tight :)

[BAB2B]

Sorry, it was late at night! Consider them untwisted.

Mind you, looking at that post again, doesn't make much sense really does it? What's the mummies and daddies bit all about? Someone's been on the wacky backy me thinks...