View Full Version : Bucc Tanking a Tristar
Can anyone please supply a photo of this legendary event? There use to be one on the the wall at ETPS
Justanopinion
26th Feb 2011, 12:05
http://www.pprune.org/military-aircrew/362004-tanking-2.html
Check out this previous thread - you may get a lead from the replies last time round
Roland Pulfrew
26th Feb 2011, 13:48
Bish
I am pretty sure there used to be one in the 101 Sqn crewroom. But that was when they were south-side at BZN. It my have been lost or damaged with their continual north-side, south-side shuffling in recent years.
BEagle
26th Feb 2011, 16:29
Roly, that was an RNZAF A-4 refuelling the TriStar:
http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a341/nw969/A4TriStar.jpg
The same A-4 also refuelled the VC10K from which the photo was taken. There was also a VHS tape of the session, which the boss kept under lock and key and would never let it out of his sight.
One day he let us watch it with him, but was called away by his PA.....
The instant he left the crewroom, we quickly set up the squadron portable videorecorder, made a tape-to-tape transfer, then disconnected everything and were a picture of complete innocence by the time the boss came back - he never suspected a thing....:E
I managed to transfer the tape to DVD 7 years ago; so here is the view from the VC10K shortly before the deed was done:
http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a341/nw969/A4VC10K.jpg
Sorry, Jim! But you should really have known better than to have left the tape with us, even for just the few minutes you were out of the crewroom...:\
CAEBr
26th Feb 2011, 19:41
I don't have a print, but the photo is reproduced in Graham Pitchfork's excellent book "The Buccaneers"
foldingwings
27th Feb 2011, 10:33
I have the photo just scanned from the aforementioned excellent book and ready to upload but haven't the foggiest how to do that. When I try to insert it as an image associating it to a Picasa URL nothing appears in the Preview page!
Foldie:suspect:
foldingwings
27th Feb 2011, 18:03
Many thanks, airpolice, for your assistance.
Not the best quality image, I'm afraid, but scanned from the aforementioned excellent book by Graham Pitchfork.
Foldie:cool:
MightyGem
27th Feb 2011, 18:29
Fantastic photo
[wind up]Cough, photoshop, cough[/wind up]
45-25-25
27th Feb 2011, 18:29
Brilliant! :ok:
MightyGem
It's quite real and dates from before the days of Photoshop.
Extg3
27th Feb 2011, 19:35
Why is a Bucc refuelling the Tristar? :confused:
ZH875
27th Feb 2011, 19:37
Because it can.
Extg3
27th Feb 2011, 19:40
I walked into that I suppose. Anyone care to elaborate
Anyone care to elaborate Because it was there.... (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Mallory)
fantom
27th Feb 2011, 20:56
ORAC, I hereby award you this weeks' prize for wit.
Art Field
28th Feb 2011, 10:10
Not wit but in the spirit of the time which has, sadly, appear to have disappeared. Another instance to my knowledge was Sea Vixen to Valiant.
david parry
28th Feb 2011, 10:35
Thought you might like this Scimitar to Buccaneer http://usera.ImageCave.com/scouse/800_Sqdn_1964_-_1966_(25)(2).jpg
david parry
28th Feb 2011, 10:46
AF http://usera.ImageCave.com/scouse/Copyof899FRValiantpluggedin(1).jpg
Thud_and_Blunder
28th Feb 2011, 12:31
Gem, you might need to explain to the less-IT-savvy contributors the significance of putting stuff in square brackets with a forward slash. FWIW, I larfed.
BEagle, having seen another vid - is there any reason why the Tristar wasn't barrel-rolling while plugged-in?
foldingwings
28th Feb 2011, 13:23
MightyGem
[wind up]Cough, photoshop, cough[/wind up]
How dare you, Sir! Doubt my integrity, Sir!
We could do anything in my day!
Foldie:E
The Buccaneer was, is and always will be 'The Last of the Few' - check out the The Buccaneer Songbook for full lyrics!
MightyGem
28th Feb 2011, 19:16
MightyGem
It's quite real and dates from before the days of Photoshop.
:ugh: :ugh:
Alber Ratman
28th Feb 2011, 19:34
Did the Tristar report any problems with its number 2 engine, or was it turned down to flight idle? Doubt it was very happy with Spey jetwash...:E
Don't doubt the picture mind!:ok:
ian16th
28th Feb 2011, 20:05
david parry,
A Warning.
The site where you have stored your picture of the Valiant refueling from the Sea Vixen has been flagged as not trustworthy by the Web of Trust software that I use.
I worked on XD858 many times during my 4+ years on 214 and I remember the original photo being pinned up on the notice board. There were 'balloons' quickly stuck on it saying things like 'Don't suck too hard!' :ok:
GreenKnight121
1st Mar 2011, 06:46
I've always preferred multiple plug-ins...
Scimitar trying to plug into A-3 Skywarrior plugged into A-4 Skyhawk plugged into Sea Vixen... observed by voyeuristic F-8 Crusader:
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b336/Bager1968/Aircraft/NATODaisy2.jpg
F-100, F-101, & RB-66 plugged into KB-50 at the same time:
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b336/Bager1968/Aircraft/B-50F-100F-101B-66.jpg
sycamore
1st Mar 2011, 13:03
The AD-6 Skyraider was also used as an effective tanker..got photos of it refuelling Scimitar,Crusader,Skyray, Demon...
Schiller
1st Mar 2011, 16:57
When the Scimitar's full, he goes up to the front... You could stay up for ever like that.
passpartout
1st Mar 2011, 20:22
:ok:
Perpetual motion machine!
Passpartout (sic)
Or if you could get enough of them to fly in a big circle, MC Escher would have loved it!
http://www.mcescher.com/Gallery/recogn-bmp/LW435.jpg
:ok:
forget
2nd Mar 2011, 10:44
When the Scimitar's full, he goes up to the front... You could stay up for ever like that.
That is funny. OK - it's immediately ridiculous so why did I think twice. Strange.
TheChitterneFlyer
2nd Mar 2011, 12:53
I can corroborate the Buccaneer vs the Tristar event... I was in the Tristar (ZD950)!!!!! The date was the 7th of July 1988.
The occasion was the (RAF) retirement of one of our TPs (Sqn Ldr Robin Tydeman) and that after completing the planned flight trial (and Air Test) we'd arranged for the Buccaneer to arrive on-scene for a dry contact. We subsequently delivered the aircraft back to Cambridge for further modifications.
The only issue was that the bow-wave, created by the Tristar, was forcing the Buccaneer to climb.
Happy days...
...and photo taken from a.....????? Just to tidy up loose ends.
Art Field
2nd Mar 2011, 13:18
Well I was in the Valiant, 16 April 1962. Tiny Matthews did the dirty deed. Was it really 39 years ago! No idea who took the photo.
cats_five
2nd Mar 2011, 14:39
Try 49 years ago. No wonder it feels longer than 39 years. :ok:
foldingwings
2nd Mar 2011, 18:04
Algy,
...and photo taken from a.....????? Just to tidy up loose ends.
According to GRP's 'The Buccaneer' the photo is 'MOD/Crown Copyright' so I guess it was from another Buccaneer!
What!!! MOD/Crown Copyright!!!! Aah Buggar!!!!!
Foldie:sad:
Art Field
2nd Mar 2011, 19:51
Thanks catsfive, I am now at an age where 10 years either way do'nt seem to matter. I got over 1100 prods in my time but just watching that one was the most frightening.
TheChitterneFlyer
2nd Mar 2011, 22:22
...and photo taken from a.....????? Just to tidy up loose ends.
The "chase aircraft" was a RAF Hawk... the photographer remains an existing employee of QinetiQ (formerly DERA) at Boscombe Down.
Despite the copyright... I do have a copy of the photo!
http://i854.photobucket.com/albums/ab107/cortonflyer/Tankerduo.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
TheChitterneFlyer
2nd Mar 2011, 22:27
Not a digital image...http://i854.photobucket.com/albums/ab107/cortonflyer/Tankerduo.jpg
foldingwings
3rd Mar 2011, 06:57
airpolice,
I was only teasing, you didn't need to remove it. There are plenty of copies of it around. GRP had permission to publish and, as long as you credit it, so do you/I.
Foldie:ok:
Tankertrashnav
3rd Mar 2011, 09:13
Just occurred to me - when jet a/c are being refuelled from a piston engined tanker (see Greenknight's pic of the KB50) I assume the receivers are then flying on Avgas (or equivalent). Was this a problem?
BEagle
3rd Mar 2011, 09:32
Well, the Shacklebomber MR3phase3 used Avgas in its auxiliary Viper turbojets.... But perhaps there were specific tanks for the receiver's fuel - as (I think) in the KC-135Q used to refuel the SR-71A?
On the subject of multiple refuelling:
http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a341/nw969/ConvairTradewind.jpg
Convair Tradewind refuelling 4 Grumman Cougars. The Tradewind had turboprop engines, so at least fuel type was one less worry!
Senior Pilot
3rd Mar 2011, 09:50
On the subject of multiple refuelling: I wonder what the HMMWV's get from the transfer ;)
http://i981.photobucket.com/albums/ae298/NashDobler/AIR_CH-53s_Refueling_w_2_HMMWVs_Underslung_lg.jpg
Thanks for all the feedback, supplied photos suitably saved.
Dengue_Dude
3rd Mar 2011, 11:35
Rumour was this was used by the medical branch:
Proof, if it were required that the military actually DID employ both FJ and truckie pilots who were suffering from Alzheimers . . .
haltonapp
3rd Mar 2011, 13:47
I can remember transferring fifty tonnes to a tristar from a VC10, we could definitely feel its bow wave, and watching the number two engine intake "sunset" as the fuel transferred was impressive, all done at 280kts. Happy days!
Dengue_Dude
3rd Mar 2011, 16:16
That's funny P, because I was given a bollocking one afternoon are coming back from said ARA.
We refuelled a VC10 which was a nice shade of green on my screen.
One of our Flight Commanders, newly promoted and a trifle keen said ' what kind of VC10 was it, to which I answered 'ours'.
He said we didn't have the authority to refuel the (first) VC10 Mk1K, as it was not cleared in the RtoS. To which I replied, I presume the VC10 skipper knew that. The nice Mr Ted H got a bollocking too, but rather difficult to blame us I thought.
I mean, it was silent procedures and this aircraft approached from underneath, never coming up alongside. We gave it about 75k and popped off back to BZZ - it was Friday, so a good move.
As you say, happy days.
Was the Bucc a wet contact? If so it probably managed to pass enough juice to run the APU for half an hour ;o)
TheChitterneFlyer
3rd Mar 2011, 16:24
Was the Bucc a wet contact? If so it probably managed to pass enough juice to run the APU for half an hour ;o)
Nah, besides which, we might have sucked the whole Bucc into our probe!
BEagle
3rd Mar 2011, 16:35
The RtoS thing could sometimes be used to one's advantage....
Way back, we were having rather a dull day in the old RA7 in a nice 'pre-owned' VC10K3 watching with interest whilst some golden-gloved Boscombe TP did various test points of a K3-to-K3 AAR trial. Then up popped a Boscombe Bucc.
"Could you give him some fuel?" enquired the Boscombe TP....:cool:
"Well now. This, as you know, is a K3. Whilst the K2 is indeed cleared for the Bucc, regrettably the paperwork clearing the K3 is still languishing in a certain trials organisation's out-tray. So, awfully sorry, but we'll have to say no!"
Shortly afterwards, as if by magic, the VC10K3 RtoS was amended to include the Bucc!
Mind you, back during my brief time on the F-4, we had our annual joust against the KC-135. But on the day in question, a KC-10 was sent instead - it was quite a new beast in those days. So we all prodded the thing and found it remarkably easy - much easier than the awful KC-135 BDA and easier than the Victor. During lunch, the Boss popped into the crewroom looking rather amused. "Chaps, someone important has just found out that the F-4 RtoS doesn't include receiving from the KC-10. He said no-one else is to prod it, but was rather cross when I told him that we'd all had a go and the first blokes are just off to have another go!"
"Are you - or we - in the dwang, Boss?"
"No, fortunately. I've been told I have to go and give Boscombe an account of our unofficial prodding trial though. But OC Ops has been given a right bollocking for not knowing that the RtoS didn't include the KC-10! Poor old Forbes, what a pisser!"
Dan Winterland
3rd Mar 2011, 17:10
''But perhaps there were specific tanks for the receiver's fuel - as (I think) in the KC-135Q used to refuel the SR-71A?''
You are correct. Completely separate tanks for the JP7 the SR71 used. The KC135Q's J57s wouldn't run on it.
http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb73/dbchippy/A2A020.jpg
I once participated in a very unofficial and very un-cleared prod against a Bucc from a Victor. We were in the friday afternoon ''lets get rid of it ASAP to get to happy hour'' bootleg mode when a Bucc agreed to take 2K. He then offered it back. A quick look rearwards courtesy of the wing mirrors showed he was trailing a hose. We just had to do it - but it wasn't easy!