Sidewinders on the Nimrod

[Shaggy Sheep Driver]

I've done the usual Google search but been unable to come up with a picture of the Sidewinder installation on a Nimrod MR2. I have a Copy of the book 'Avro One' which shows an MR2 with what appears to be two missile rails per side, each rail mounted each side of the weapons pylon under each wing.

Can anyone point me at a picture of (preferably) a close up of the missiles on the wing, or a close up of the rails installed on the pylon?

We have an MR2 at Manchester Viewing Park and looking at the pylon it's not obvious how the rails were fitted to it.

[ZH875]

have a look here (http://www.globalaviationresource.com/reports/2010/nimrod/images/21.jpg)

[Shaggy Sheep Driver]

Ta 875. That confirms '2 per side'.

[VP8]

searched NIMROD FITTED WITH SIDEWINDERS :}

Found on google in 0.52 seconds About 747 results

1st piccy

http://cdn-www.airliners.net/aviation-photos/photos/7/6/8/0811867.jpg

4th
http://www.targetlock.org.uk/nimrod/nimrod-sidewinder.jpg

[dixi188]

How many Sidewinders were fired by Nimrods during the Falklands war?

[Shaggy Sheep Driver]

searched NIMROD FITTED WITH SIDEWINDERS

Found on google in 0.52 seconds About 747 results

1st piccy

http://cdn-www.airliners.net/aviatio.../8/0811867.jpg

4th
http://www.targetlock.org.uk/nimrod/...sidewinder.jpg

Yeah, I did that. I can see why you posted pics 1 and 4 - of the hundreds of returns from that search those are the only two that actually show recognisable Sidewinders on the Nimrod.

What I'm really looking for is a close-up showing how the rails were attached to the weapons pylons.

[norwich]

SSD. This is probably of no help at all ? but are these the points where the weapons rail would be fitted to ???

Keith.

http://i261.photobucket.com/albums/ii58/keithnewsome/DSC_0021-10.jpg

[Proplinerman]

"How many Sidewinders were fired by Nimrods during the Falklands war?"

None: I know that because I have just come back from a talk given tonight to The Aviation Society Manchester by "Robby" Robinson, BAe's chief test pilot at the time the Sidewinders were fitted-an amazing achievement in a very short time.

I haven't checked photos on Google links, but he showed us a photo of an actual test firing-amazing! I have his email address if you want it-send me a PM.

[Double Zero]

There was a story - mind, I was told this by a Nimrod pilot - of an exercise where a couple of heroes in Tornado's forgot about this and shot over a Nimrod , with the Nimrod pilot saying " Fox One" or whatever is relevant twice, theoretically Nimrod 2, Tornados 0...

[teeteringhead]

And there was certainly a Squadron "zap" at the time (don't know which sqn) with something like "World's Biggest Fighter"*and a cartoon of an aggressive looking Nimrod.....

[philrigger]

;)

How many Sidewinders were fired by Nimrods during the Falklands war?

None! But some may have been fitted TO Nimrods.
(So I have been told by ex 51 guys).

[Yellow Sun]

(So I have been told by ex 51 guys).

The Nimrod R was not modified to carry the Sidewinder, only the MR2.

YS

[VP8]

Sorry Shaggy:}

I should have read it better!!

I'll have a dig through some of my Falkland pics IIRC we had a couple there:ok:

VEEPS

[ZeBedie]

Realistically, would a Nimrod be able to defend itself if attacked by a Mirage, or was this just a ploy to make the crews feel more confident?

[Shaggy Sheep Driver]

Cheers Veeps!

SSD

[TEEEJ]

ZeBedie wrote

Realistically, would a Nimrod be able to defend itself if attacked by a Mirage, or was this just a ploy to make the crews feel more confident?

It was certainly better than having nothing. I would imagine that some of the MR2s were very much out on their own and operating close to Argentina?

There was also the possibility that they would encounter Argentine patrol aircraft such as the reconnaissance Boeing 707s.

TJ

[Yellow Sun]

Realistically, would a Nimrod be able to defend itself if attacked by a Mirage, or was this just a ploy to make the crews feel more confident?

You didn't go hanging drag on aircraft just to make people feel better. The primary purpose of the Sidewinder fit was self defence. Its presence in theatre might have had some deterrent effect upon the Argentinian 707 but the chances of getting a shot off would have been minimal, for a start the 707 was faster than the Nimrod.

Crews received fighter affiliation training before deployment, they realised that they could probably hold off a singleton for a couple of passes at least, provided that they were alerted to his approach. A pair would have been much more difficult. However the interceptor would have been a long way from home, marginal on fuel and aware that overshooting the target would result in a couple of Sidewinders chasing him, might make him a bit more circumspect.

Arranging the fighter affiliation training could be quite a challenge, because whilst 18 Gp was "at war", the front line stations of 11 Gp were "at peace". One morning, having been allocated an aircraft for 2 crews to carry out fighter affiliation training the following afternoon, I set about trying to find some "playmates". On phoning one squadron and being told that they could not help, I replied that I would contact the other squadron on the same station. "Don't bother" I was told, "there's no flying after lunch tomorrow, we've got an AOC's parade rehearsal".

YS

[PilatusP]

Its only useful as self defense if they can get a tone to fire it. That would have been extremely unlikely against a fighter or the 707 as mentioned prevously. I think this was a bit of wishful thinking tbh. The fighter would be able to dictate the fight. I'm open to correction, but I don't think any of the Nimrods were even operating near the task force, never mind Argentina.

[Yellow Sun]

Its only useful as self defense if they can get a tone to fire it. That would have been extremely unlikely against a fighter or the 707 as mentioned prevously. I think this was a bit of wishful thinking tbh. The fighter would be able to dictate the fight. I'm open to correction, but I don't think any of the Nimrods were even operating near the task force, never mind Argentina.

It's only useful in any circumstances if you can get a tone to fire it. The interceptor is only able to dictate the fight if the target is unalerted and he has sufficient fuel and weapons to conclude the engagement. Once you provide the target aircraft with some form of self defence you straightaway constrain the interceptor.

During Corporate Nimrods undertook a wide variety of tasks some of which took them towards the coast of Argentina. A significant number of sorties were tasked with Direct Support (DS) to the task force, although I somewhat doubt that the OTC employed them on Airplan 4, sectors 1 & 2 20/60. There is plenty of published information about the tasking, try Price or Freedman.

YS

[Neptunus Rex]

There was also the possibility that they would encounter Argentine patrol aircraft such as the reconnaissance Boeing 707s. A Nimrod (Comet 5 GT) shooting down a B707 would have settled a few old scores!

As for speed, the Nimrod had far superior turning ability, which is far more important if the 707 came anywhere close.

The prime object was achieved. The Sidewinder threat allowed the Nimrods to go about their tasks unimpeded.

[bvcu]

seem to recall being told at the time that there would have been no 'tone' as it was not 'fully' integrated. saw the film of the firing at the time which proved it was feasible to launch , so believe it was a detterant which probably worked. only hearsay as was looking after the photochase a/c for the trials.

[Yellow Sun]

seem to recall being told at the time that there would have been no 'tone' as it was not 'fully' integrated

There was an audio signal, "tone" is a generic term.

YS

[motleytwo]

I can fill in a few answers.
I was on XV229 12 may 1982 southbound to patrol off Argentine coast when we spotted 707 going right to left. Co pilot wanted to chase but advised him that 707 was faster than us.
On 9 Jul we were back in UK doing fighter affiliation with 2 Phantoms one of which decided to do a singleton run. as he approached from behind us the Cap who was the Nimrod Display pilot hung the beast round and got behind the Phantom who had overshot and we definitely all heard the Growl from the seeker head. We then went back to Ascension in XV234 and brought her back from ascension 19 aug complet with nose art as per Airfix kit.
ex 201/1
p.s anyone have a sidewinder pylon spare as we want one for XV250 at Elvington - got a sidewinder but need the mounting

[GQ2]

It's getting to the stage where there are more RAF a/c in museums than in service....:eek: Maybe it'd have been better to let RSB fail, we'd have still had an airforce and there'd have been a few less wealthy bankers.:rolleyes:

[thing]

Just as an aside to this we did a feasability study at Binbrook during the mid 80's to see if we could fit the sidewinder to the Frightning. We couldn't but as I remember if it worked there was going to be a four missile fit, two per side vertically mounted where the RT/Firestreak pylons were. The Firestreak had quite a good PK bearing in mind it was a rear attack only missile, the RT was, shall we say, less effective.

[reynoldsno1]

At dusk we approached a small Mediterranean island in a MR1 (that dates me...), where a Phantom detachment had arrived and asked for some ops against intruders. At 200ft we picked up the first signs of an AI radar, dropped flaps, u/c and down to 50ft on the rad alt and started a slow, gentle weave. The fighters couldn't get a lock on after that, and told us later that they were very uncomfortable at that height over the sea in reducing vis ...