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View Full Version : Qantas to Purchase and Grow WA Charter Operator


topend3
13th Dec 2010, 01:51
news now official...

Qantas to Purchase and Grow WA Charter OperatorSydney, 13 December 2010

Qantas will move into the Western Australian fly-in-fly-out (FIFO) resources air charter market, with agreement reached for the airline to purchase local operator Network Aviation.

Qantas Chief Executive Officer, Mr Alan Joyce, said the acquisition would provide a strong growth opportunity, new revenue stream and further diversification for the Qantas Group.

"The Qantas Group has a very strong presence in Western Australia, operating passenger services across metropolitan and regional centres and connecting the state to its broader domestic and international networks," Mr Joyce said.

"Mining company demand for FIFO air services to transport employees to and from remote sites within the state, however, cannot be met solely by Regular Passenger Transport (RPT) services.

"This is an important market, and a growth market, and Qantas will now become a key player in meeting the needs of the resources sector. This will significantly enhance the scope of what Qantas can offer the mining sector, bringing new competition to the marketplace.

"We have reached agreement with the owners of Network Aviation to purchase the business. It presents strong growth opportunities and we will immediately look at significantly growing its fleet and its operations."

Network Aviation operates a fleet of two 100-seat Fokker 100 aircraft and six 30-seat Embraer Brasilia EMB-120ER aircraft.

Subject to finalisation of the acquisition, Network Aviation will become a wholly-owned subsidiary of the Qantas Group.

Network Aviation will retain its current management, employees and operating structure, with the business to be aligned with Qantas' operations in terms of safety, regulatory, people, financial and commercial governance oversight, standards and processes.

"This is very much a strategic acquisition and an exciting growth opportunity for Qantas," Mr Joyce said.


Issued by Qantas Corporate Communication (5055)
Email: [email protected]

Mr. Hat
13th Dec 2010, 02:43
Skippers and Skywest are in more trouble than they can poke a stick at. The little operator that nobody paid attention to is now backed by the might of QF. (read they will crush anyone that gets in their way).

I suspect the NAA cost base would rival Alliances as well. If you thought J* conditions were bad go fly mining charter!

Great move by QF and co.

tiger19
13th Dec 2010, 03:06
maybe this is where they may have to stick the Jetstar cadets for a year or two

metrodashbrazconkie
13th Dec 2010, 03:35
Skippers and Skywest are in more trouble than they can poke a stick at

Specially if the latest Skippers EBA gets voted down, my source tells me that the next step might be industrial action. It may be real quiet over at WAs truly regional airline until something is agreed upon if that happens.:E

Normasars
13th Dec 2010, 04:15
Geee, I sure hope that the Network guys and gals have passed the BS P&S crap to be able to fly an aircraft safely from A to B. Come to think of it, the Impulse guys didn't do that either. Did someone say minimum requirements?

What a load of bollocks :rolleyes:

aulglarse
13th Dec 2010, 05:28
Smart move by QF, another seperate pilot group on board.:ugh: What's next for NAA? I bet C-Jets in the future to compete within/against the 'group' like Easterns & National Jet to name a few.:=

bubble.head
13th Dec 2010, 06:05
Divide and Conquer!

I have heard rumours that Qantaslink is looking at putting a few Q400s over there.

Mr. Hat
13th Dec 2010, 06:55
The new hanger fits an A320 does it not? 320's will be the next type.

Good training ground for cadets or foreign pilots (cavok 24/7).
Maintenance/spares/industrial back up/Jetstar
Multiple reasons why it'll be 320.

Maybe the Q400, who knows. Doesn't seem like anyone has piped up about the Geraldton route yet.

Either way the WA previous "heavy weights" let NAA in and the rest is history. A pretty sweet revenge for a certain GM. I'd have to say that this would have to be the biggest news in the FIFO sector in 10 years.

QF staff travel for the Network guys? Hmmm interesting times for Skippers I must say. Dare say NAA might be looking for a driver or three.

When is the RIO contract up again? Cost base cost base cost base....Good luck!

Lets see if GT will manage to avoid writing this one up!

fridge magnet
13th Dec 2010, 07:04
http://www.fwa.gov.au/documents/agreements/wpa/CAEN084663945.pdf

The rates of pay are blanked out. Anyone know what they are?

listentome
13th Dec 2010, 07:55
Interesting stuff, both the Strategic A320s and the Skywest A320 are maintained out of the Network hangar.

Could be more strategic than you think...

QF Flightboy
13th Dec 2010, 08:57
Interesting times ahead. Wonder what will happen to the B717 operation which is under contract to Cobham until 2012. If these aircraft were transferred to Network would the Tech and Cabin Crew likely to as well.

Icarus2001
13th Dec 2010, 09:10
If these aircraft were transferred to Network... Right there is the opening line from their management next year when they renegotiate their EBA until the end of the B717 leases in 2017.

"If you don't take a pay cut we will lose the contract"

Section28- BE
13th Dec 2010, 10:02
Not that I do this any-more, but:

I reckon this move is the smartest thing I've (in my limited experience) seen a Commercial/National RPT Operator do since about 01/02 (well maybe 98/9 or there about's)- they now have (yes) another more or less "Greenfield" site and the ability to offer/leverage/value-add (hate those MBA terms) their 'Commercial' contract clients a 'Cradle to Destination' solution- check a bag from SA/the Pilbra, to where ever in the World you may imagine..........., and with the cost base to back it up- well done and best wishes to Lindsay and the Network family.

The stinking old Fokker at circa 10tns less MTOW than the 71 (the Circa- I'll leave to those that know...), in an ANC/Landing Charge sense - will lift 107 Y Class vrs 117Y for the Boeing (and I'm not disparaging of it, at all)- push him out over an hr and the fuel will come back to/or under 1.8tn/hr and it'll punch beyond 6.5nm/min, or better pending what you're doing and who's driving............

Well done all- reckon you will have some fun over the next couple of years, and I'll be looking forward to watching the action and your endeavours....

Best Rgds
28- BE

Mr. Hat
13th Dec 2010, 10:19
Wonder what will happen to the B717 operation

Mining charter - contract one day, unemployment office next.

Sort of like russian roulette with your career and mortgage.

Section28- BE
13th Dec 2010, 10:35
G'Day Hat

Pends where the advantage line is (in my opinion)- and I reckon the big QF might have found where the action is/was for the last 10yrs/or better, (I think they've seen it, but not understood it for a long time) and I don't think there's too far to go wrong (as they obviously know) in what they're prosecuting here.

Not that I'm saying it's blue sky dreaming for all employed in the operation, on-site/or related. The brass is in the whole.............

Do agree though- See you on the other thread
28- BE

Mr. Hat
13th Dec 2010, 11:19
IF you are sitting as a passenger. On the other side of the bullet proof door are pitiful conditions Cactus. Perth ain't cheap either!..and some of the property has gone backwards.

Mr. Hat
13th Dec 2010, 11:37
Spot on Cactus.

I'm keen to see if the pollies in the Senate can join the dots on people up the front making maccas wages and quality of applicants. Suspect not.

Anyway good move QF. Think they've pulled VB's (zero investment in mining) pants down on this one.

QFBUSBOY
13th Dec 2010, 11:45
Expect B717's to disappear from WA skies with Cobham now a competitor

QF Flightboy
13th Dec 2010, 12:48
Doubt the B717 will disappear from WA skies untill replaced by a new type eg-C series as QF own the Aircraft. Only leased and Managed by Cobham.
May replace the Fokker at Network tho. Guess time will tell.;)

Section28- BE
13th Dec 2010, 12:59
717's

as QF own the Aircraft. Only leased and Managed by Cobham.Think you may find the suckers are 'Leased' by QF actually- via/courtesy of Uncle Gerry's original arrangement that got transferred over a Steak and a Beer..... way back when- but I could be wrong. May have been the 'Great Escape' of 2001............... but maybe not.....

Section28- BE
13th Dec 2010, 13:11
Here's a few to be going on with, ex the Register;

Civil Aviation Safety Authority - B712 (http://www.casa.gov.au/WCMSWR/asp/casadata/regsearch/airsresults.asp?session=397332831&pc=PC_90127&pc=PC_90127&VHin=&modelin=717&Search=Search&framein=plane&manuin=boeing&netcat=y&regholdin=&regopin=&serialin=&num_results=10&offset=0)

Allco, Bavaria and

SHIRE AVIATION AUSTRALIA PTY LTD
Level 9 South
161 Collins Street
MELBOURNE VIC 3000
AUSTRALIA

Is that QF ????

flyingfox
13th Dec 2010, 15:40
I expect this will mean more undercutting of charter prices and lower pays all round. Well done Qantas... such cunning strategy. If you want to be a pilot... give up now and go to the mines. Aviation is becomming a subsistance career!

Mr. Hat
13th Dec 2010, 19:55
undercutting of charter prices

Some operators about to try some of their own medicine. Could their be a lower cost base than Networks in the world? Its a Joyce dream - pilots chucking bags, washing windows..

Genuine question - is the 717 still in production?

Capt Claret
13th Dec 2010, 20:56
Genuine question - is the 717 still in production?

Nope. Only 156 produced. Boeing: History -- Products - Boeing 717 Commercial Transport (http://www.boeing.com/history/boeing/717.html)

Capn Bloggs
13th Dec 2010, 23:21
From Thew West this morning:

Qantas buys mine-flight network
GEOFFREY THOMAS, The West Australian December 14, 2010, 5:18 am

Qantas is about to enter the competitive fly-in, fly-out market after buying local operator Network Aviation.

The deal, flagged three months ago and announced yesterday, will dramatically change competition at Perth Airport, with Qantas using Network's established FIFO operation to fast-track its drive for a bigger slice of the WA market.

Network has two 100-seat Fokker 100 jets and six 30-seat Embraer Brasilias turboprops and the fleet will be expanded.

Airport insiders said yesterday Qantas was eyeing at least three Fokker 100s to add to the fleet.

The WA Government announced last month that Qantas would be allowed to operate on the Perth-Exmouth route.

The airline will also enter the Perth-Geraldton route, which is being deregulated.

Qantas will add planes to its WA QantasLink operation for those services.

Qantas chief executive Alan Joyce said the acquisition would provide Qantas Group with a new revenue stream and room for further diversification.

"This will significantly enhance the scope of what Qantas can offer the mining sector, bringing new competition to the marketplace," he said.

However, Qantas will find it tough going. Many key resource contracts are tied up for years with operators such as Skywest.

topend3
13th Dec 2010, 23:41
Come on GT, report the facts :

The WA Government announced last month that Qantas would be allowed to operate on the Perth-Exmouth route.

The WA Government hasn't announced anything of the sort...it's what we are expecting but it hasn't been announced...

Mr. Hat
14th Dec 2010, 00:03
Airport insiders said yesterday Qantas was eyeing at least three Fokker 100s to add to the fleet.

at all connected with this locked thread below?

http://www.pprune.org/dg-p-general-aviation-questions/436273-f100-endorsed-pilot-ferry-opportunity.html
DUXNUTS you there? Mention of 3 F100's in both..

Uncanny. Pretty quick fleet expansion if its true!! Might be a few F100 jobs going over at NAA...with QF staff travel?

Prediction: NAA F100 jobs will become highly sort after.
Quick commands for people with time on type to..
Next prediction is the ad in Fridays Australian/AFAP jobs.

However, Qantas will find it tough going. Many key resource contracts are tied up for years with operators such as Skywest.

GT you "journalist" you! Knows full well who butters his bread!

Somehow I suspect QF won't be finding it tough going. Being Australia's largest airline and having bought a company with one of the lowest cost bases. Pretty obvious outcome here!

hotnhigh
14th Dec 2010, 00:53
After current contracts are completed, new entitiy kept ticking over for "a rainy day."
It doesn't rain, it pours.
Jetstar WA blooms.

AussieAviator
14th Dec 2010, 01:37
Very interesting development this, as it appears that Qantas still have some buying to do. Alliance Airlines have been doing Qantas flying for some time now and has also been looking for a new partner, or total sale for the right price. They are the largest Fokker operator in the southern hemisphere, with a fleet of 21 F100's and 6 F50's. The new boss of Qantas understands very well how lucrative FIFO contracts can be, as the on carriage travel requirements are huge. My source in Perth, tells me that Alliance is on the verge of becoming a wholly owned subsidiary of Qantas. Between Alliance, Cobham, and now Network, Qantas would have an almost untouchable majority chunk of the Australian FIFO work, and for a relatively small outlay!

topend3
14th Dec 2010, 06:12
:= not entirely true as cobham's fifo operations (murrin, barrow etc) with the blue tail fleet operate independently of QF and separate to the crew and operating arrangements for the red-tail B717 fleet...

The Green Goblin
14th Dec 2010, 06:42
I believe Cobham are more interested in the Dash 8 and 146 operation than the RPT. They inherited the RPT from NJS when they bought the surveillance contract, which is in reality, what they were after.

Just quietly I think they would be happy to offload it and break the contract if given the opportunity. They can then devote the resources to the money making flying with guaranteed yield (why do you think QF are chasing the FIFO!). Expect more Fokkers! (Personally I much prefer flying in them to the 170/190 and 717)

GG

Mr. Hat
14th Dec 2010, 08:08
guaranteed yield

Yes indeedy and VB caught napping on that one...

TAC inop.
14th Dec 2010, 08:10
Norm' and Cactis...would you entertain the thought that these blokes get paid more than the Eastern state blokes already?
Well bend over ****knuckles, 'cause this market is a whole new ballgame, and in no way similar to the Impulse buy-out/sell-out of earlier
Mr Hat....yeah....you have been too right before, and again on the money, me thinks
( Paino, I'm still not smiling tho )

my oleo is extended
14th Dec 2010, 09:03
Yes indeedy and VB caught napping on that one...
Jb would have been aware of the possibilities in WA, problem is he has been too busy trying to fix the mess he inherited. Had he taken ownership of a reasonably clean and well structured outfit he may have considered the possibility of throwing a Daewoo or two out there even.
Fokkers and 717's are the perfect size workhorse for WA, QF Group know the benefits of the 717 particularly. DJ are out of the loop unless they shore up a synergy or buy somebody out like Alliance or Cobham, but as Mr Hat said, too late.

Mr. Hat
14th Dec 2010, 09:21
Cheers TAC just seems to fit the bill for QF doesn't it? I find the whole thing quite interesting. It could be a significant move for QF that could potentially monopolise the FIFO sector altogether.

Oleo, how VB has just sat and watched the mining boom come go and now come again makes me scratch my head. In the mean time the Q400 rakes massive coin in on the east coast left unchallenged by any competitor... truly amazing.

The golden cash cows (Alliance/Network/Cobham) are gone.

Very interesting.

neville_nobody
14th Dec 2010, 10:21
Cheers TAC just seems to fit the bill for QF doesn't it? I find the whole thing quite interesting. It could be a significant move for QF that could potentially monopolise the FIFO sector altogether.

I can guarantee that the major mining players will not let QF have a monopoly on the FIFO sector. Just like major airlines buy both airbus and boeing. The last thing anyone wants is a monopoly supplier.

Normasars
14th Dec 2010, 10:25
Hat,

Garbage!!!!!!!!!!

For Cobham
Gorgon project is worth @ 150 Mill and committed until 2017.
HWE committed for another 4 years
Murrin
Rio @ Brockman/Bulgeeda
Kambalda
etc etc.

To say that the "cash cows" are gone is utter crap. Esp WRT Cobham.

You will not find a more diversified, cost efficient and tightly run outfit.

Don't believe all the propaganda out there.

Mr. Hat
14th Dec 2010, 11:06
Yep meant to say

You will not find a more diversified, cost efficient and tightly run outfit.

diversified income.

Called spot on and garbage in one thread. My work is done:ok: Off to bed!

737 guru
17th Dec 2010, 16:09
Another advantage that they will get is a nice new hangar on the west coast to carry out 'A' checks and the like on the 737 fleet, saves rotating them back east for checks along with the hassles that go with it....

very strategic move by the red rat on all fronts and i'm sure that engineering will also be very happy.....

Mr. Hat
19th Dec 2010, 10:20
This one might throw a spanner in the works...!:}


Population Minister Tony Burke considers measures to reduce fly-in, fly-out workers | Perth Now (http://www.perthnow.com.au/business/news/population-minister-tony-burke-considers-measures-to-reduce-fly-in-fly-out-workers/story-e6frg2qu-1225972643311)

Employers urged to stop fly-in fly-out
Population spread out of kilter - Minister
Ban on city fringe estates being considered
A UNION leader wants tax concessions for giant miners to end the damaging practice of flying workers in and out of projects rather than setting them up in local housing.

Australian Workers' Union national secretary Paul Howes believes a lower regional rate in the fringe benefits tax (FBT) would encourage mining companies to provide accommodation for workers and their families.

The FBT is paid on employer-provided housing.

Reducing the use of fly-in, fly-out rosters would create regional centres, keep more of the income from mining in the local region, and be an incentive to sign on to work in labour starved projects, Mr Howes told news.com.au.

Thousands of workers operating Australia's biggest mining projects in Queensland and Western Australia fly in for shifts of up to, for example, 10 days straight, and then fly out to return home for a week before repeating the travel.



But Mr Howes said the system wasn't popular because it took workers away from their families for long periods.

There also are complaints that while the miners earn big salaries, they spend the money at home in Sydney, Melbourne or Perth and not locally where they work.

Population Minister Tony Burke has called fly-in, fly-out "possibly the best example of how the distribution of our population in Australia has become so far out of kilter".

"When fly-in, fly-out has effectively become the only option for many people wanting to work in those regions, it means we haven't planned the distribution of people across Australia well enough," Mr Burke said today, launching independent reports on population growth.

The Government will consider the problems with fly-in, fly-out operations as it prepares a response to the reports, scheduled for April.

Mr Burke said he also would be looking at the impact of a higher population growth on the liveability of cities which already have congestion problems.

There are fears that a fast-growing population would worsen problems in cities caused by congestion and lack of public facilities such as hospitals.

Mr Burke today acknowledged there were many city dwellers "who discovered they no longer had half an hour of daylight at the end of the day after a long commute home".

He called for improved urban design which moved people closer to their jobs, and upgraded transport systems.

The Minister said he wanted to "avoid the continued creation of dormitory suburbs", which would of itself "have a massive impact on congestion".

"But let's not forget: When you have good urban planning, every local job is a car off the road," said Mr Burke.

"As long as you have situations where we have a long distance between where the jobs are and where the homes are, you necessarily put more pressure on people with traffic."

Mr Burke said there would be increasing development of "master planned communities" which would have affordable housing, parklands and "availability of local jobs".

"We always talk about it in terms of the time you spend in traffic. That's actually not the worst of it. The worst of it is the time you don't spend at home," he said.

The report of one panel, headed by Heather Ridout, CEO of the employer organisation the Australian Industry Group, said an increased population would provide the funding and the incentive to make cities more livable.

However, another panel, headed by former New South Wales Premier Bob Carr, said a growing population would put greater demands on transport systems and worsening congestion which was "lengthening working hours and unfavourably tilting the work/life balance".

The Government will not set immigration targets and the annual intake would be set with the Budget, said Mr Burke.

Risky business this FIFO stuff..

Capn Bloggs
19th Dec 2010, 12:18
Hypocrites. Labor brought in FBT in 1986 which made local towns uneconomic.

neville_nobody
19th Dec 2010, 12:56
You might be able to entice people to coastal towns but I would suggest you would be hard pressed to find 10 000+ people who want to live in Newman/Paraburdoo/Telfer etc permanently. 45+ Degree summers make it none the more inviting. Power bills, Housing etc would all have to be subsidised, and you would have to pay people alot of money to get them there in the first instance. It's not like you can knock off work and head to the beach when you're living in Newman. :} FIFO, whilst not ideal is probably the best of a bad choice really.
Not quite sure what the logic behind Tony Burke's thinking is here.

Capn Bloggs
19th Dec 2010, 13:13
Nev, it's been done before. That's why PBO, ZNE and Tom Price actually exist. Sure, hot in summer, but with today's technology, it'd just be like DRW but without the stinking humidity. Keep the single yobbos out with family subsidies. Oh hang on, that's why remote towns died in the first place. The economic rationalists wouldn't accept a bit of contra-economic practicality.

SOPS
19th Dec 2010, 14:20
I lived in Newman whhen it was a town and a community, FIFO has been the death of the North West.

4dogs
19th Dec 2010, 16:11
SOPS,

Unfortunately, FIFO was the product of demand for human capital far outstripping local supply and was the only practical incentive for a reluctant workforce. The people who designed it were not interested in social outcomes - they were interested only in profit. FIFO costs a fraction of fully-subsidised local infrastructure and there is no legal accountability for regional demise.

Unfortunately, it is the same economic mechanism that created the new "cadet" pilot schemes - there will not be too much accountability being accorded to the architects of those schemes down the track when the true costs are revealed.

Stay Alive

Mr. Hat
19th Dec 2010, 20:01
With the correct subsidies and facilities places like Tom Price and Newman do/can and will thrive.

Monopole
20th Dec 2010, 01:17
With the correct subsidies and facilities places like Tom Price and Newman do/can and will thrive.
Yes and even Telfer was once a little town. Not every body wants to live on the beach. I for one dont like the beech. I much prefer the fresh water and landscape the Pilbra and Kimberely have to offer. Its tust that they dont have the (aviation) jobs I am after.

Queensland is not as reliant on FIFO as WA and they have some very big towns based around mining.

VH-UFO
20th Dec 2010, 05:08
Go ask your good wife and kids if they would like to move to +45 heat, cyclones, away from families, flies, no amenities etc etc

And i suppose the good minister expects the mining companies to pay for all the upgrades and infrastructure at these towns to support the families.:ugh:

Companies are struggling these days to recruit people. Force people to live up here and half of them wont survive.

Nope, wont happen, never will.

neville_nobody
20th Dec 2010, 06:15
Cpt Bloggs the problem now is that you are looking at a much higher population than was envisaged for those towns. I doubt you can find the volume of people required who are willing to live in those areas permanently without starting up a whole immigration scheme.

Monopole
20th Dec 2010, 07:00
Go ask your good wife and kids if they would like to move to +45 heat, cyclones, away from families, flies, no amenities etc etc

VH-UFO, if your comment is directed at me, then all I can say is my wife enjoys the heat much more then I (yes 45 degree heat). Between us we have lived at Alice Springs, Mt Isa, Kunnus, Darwin, various parts of north and central QLD and my wife is born and (mainly) bred in Emerald. So heat, flies and isolation is nothing new to us. We dont have a single relative live near us anyway and the kids will just do what they are told. Granted, the last is much easier if they are not yet at school age.

It takes all tyes of people to make the world spin, and there will be a large number of families who will prefer to live in a regional centre if it means dad (or mum) comes home every night.

Cpt Bloggs the problem now is that you are looking at a much higher population than was envisaged for those towns. I doubt you can find the volume of people required who are willing to live in those areas permanently without starting up a whole immigration scheme. Neville, your population argument may very well be true. But not even WAs capitol city is set up and prepared for the population growth that has/is happening. You dont have to look any further then the roads, public transport and water supply to see it. And lets not even go down the path of professional services such as Doctors, dentist ect.

Im not suggesting to can FIFO completely. Sh!t, my and my wifes livelyhood rely on it. But maybe entice some of the workers to live locally and FIFO the others. Kalgoolie, Mt Isa Gladstone, Newcastle amongst others are examples of big towns that are centred around the rescource industry with locally employed workers.

sleeve of wizard
20th Dec 2010, 07:36
It has all been tried before, what happens when the gold/silver/iron ore runs out? The mine closes down, the town dies then every body has to move anyways. FIFO is a more economical for all concerned.

YPJT
20th Dec 2010, 08:00
What about BHP's investment in Ravensthorp? Many a CEO will be gun shy after that little disaster. I have to agree with Sleeve of Wizard. Towns like PBO, NWN, KTA, PHD etc have a mix of people who live in and love the town and those who prefer the FIFO lifestyle. The current mix seems to attract sufficient numbers of people. Forcing it one way or the other I think would cause more problems than it solves.

One positive aspect of less FIFO though is that it would clean the Q Club of much of the bogan factor.

Mr. Hat
20th Dec 2010, 09:26
It has all been tried before, what happens when the gold/silver/iron ore runs out?

NAA Skippers Cobham Alliance Maroomba and Sky West would be gone/reduced/retrenched to in that case...

Capn Bloggs
20th Dec 2010, 11:02
Oh come on Mr Hat! BHP has taken 50 years to chew thru half of Mt Whaleback. Only another 50 years to go. The is so much iron ore in the Pilbara that the aforementioned outfits will be flying Fokker 350s, Embraer 500s and Boeing 7-13-7s before it all runs out. :ok:

Captain Nomad
20th Dec 2010, 13:34
Maybe the gummint can consider forcing the hand of land release issues. There is a lottery for it in Hedland. There is huge demand but the prices get skyrocketed by the fact that there is always less on offer than what is demanded. C'mon folks, look at the amount of open land around Hedland! How can there possibly be a shortage?! It is entirely manufactured for the benefit of those who can profit from the completely outrageous housing/land related prices.

The trouble with a lot of these places now is that the real cost of living prices are allowed to go so high (pure money grabbing greed spiral) that it ensures the only people who can afford to live there are mine related high income/FIFO types - average folks just can't afford to live in those conditions. It further dooms the town to a somewhat disfunctional FIFO style of town.

What goes up must go down... Sometime the resources boom won't be a boom no more. One has to wonder what regional WA will look like when that time comes...

Mr. Hat
20th Dec 2010, 21:22
My point exakkery Bloggsy.

Mr. Hat
29th Dec 2010, 08:45
Strong words from Allan Joyce about the QF purchase of Network and future intentions from The Australian's Steve Creedy article this morning.

Seems the man is in no two minds about the FIFO sector. A Strategic master move by the White Kangaroo. "Strategic" being the operative word.. he did mention defence contracts...


Qantas to extend fly-in operations | The Australian (http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/qantas-to-extend-fly-in-operations/story-e6frg8zx-1225977450822)

Steve Creedy From: The Australian December 29, 2010 12:00AM

QANTAS is seeking new Fokker 100 aircraft to boost its Perth-based fly-in, fly-out operation and has warned rivals it is planning expansion.

The airline paid about $30 million for Network Aviation this month and sees it as a strategic addition to its portfolio of businesses.

It intends to take the business beyond Western Australia and is looking at potential growth opportunities such as defence charters.

Central to this will be the expansion of Network's fleet of two 100-seat Fokker 100 jet aircraft and six 30-seat Embraer turboprops.

"We're actively looking at a large number of aircraft," Qantas chief executive Alan Joyce said. "We didn't buy Network just to keep it the same size; we bought that with the potential to grow that massively over the next few years."

Mr Joyce said Qantas had attempted to get into charter work in its own right but the aircraft in its fleet were too expensive to be left sitting around waiting for charter opportunities.

He said Network was a good venture for Qantas because of its presence in Western Australia and its infrastructure at Perth's congested airport.

He said the F100s were the aircraft of choice for the FIFO market and were operated by Alliance Airlines and Skywest.

"They're aircraft the fly-in/fly-out market is actually used to," he said. "There are plenty of aircraft available out there and the aircraft have a low capital cost. So when you're talking about low utilisation the business model makes sense."

Skystar320
29th Dec 2010, 09:27
so I wonder who will stop the shiny new aircraft en route to Network Aviation? :}

vigi-one
29th Dec 2010, 20:24
Word has it that Alliance now in QF's sights on the East Coast.

Going Nowhere
29th Dec 2010, 20:49
Anyone at Eastern or Sunnies still convinced they'll be flying the Jets and not Network/Alliance? :E

Skynews
29th Dec 2010, 21:20
My condolences to the staff at Network.
Your once pleasent work place and conditions have gone.....".................


Give it twelve months and we will be raiding about another QF organization that has one unhappy group of employees. Dteriaying conditions year after year.

If you think your in for a winfall out of this purchase, reread all the QF threads on here.

Good luck

Going Nowhere
29th Dec 2010, 21:26
Or speak to anyone at Eastern/Sunnies about how well the 'take over' went! :*

Mr. Hat
29th Dec 2010, 22:45
Yeah going nowhere have a mate that has bet everything on the "single isle jet".

Skynews interesting you say that. Out of bordem the other night I counted from the top how many threads were QF group related from the top. I reached 5 in a row. Know people that worked there that left and would not return under any circumstances. They felt very strongly about this. Amazing given QF mainline conditions are superior to all.

As for Network and WA well you'll see more quick F100 commands happen at NAA in the next 12-18 months than you can poke a stick at. And might I mention they are now THE most stable powerful operator on the West Coast. No longer the risky and poorer cousin they now hold all the power. (uncle Joyce says so)

Skynews
29th Dec 2010, 22:55
Quick commands for sure.

Then we have to ask who gets them, what happens to the conditions?
You can bet money they are not going up, never again will they go up.
Then, after a year or so the reality sets in, bing part of QF sucks and that the good times at Network have gone.

Big brother will be watching and questioning every move you make until life is almost unbearable, cost cutting will be an expectation even or a bones of the arse company, it certainly will not get better.

bubble.head
29th Dec 2010, 22:56
Anyone at Eastern or Sunnies still convinced they'll be flying the Jets and not Network/Alliance? http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/evil.gif

A red jet with white tail I believe.

Mr. Hat
29th Dec 2010, 23:15
Then we have to ask who gets them,

NAA Fo's with time on type probably the starting point. Then Sky West and Alliance Fo's that want career progression, real staff travel and QF backing. ($250 to london anyone?). Maybe some PNG guys.

Having said that Alliance have had some quick commands.

The bit I wonder about is this. AJ says "massively expand the fleet". Which contracts is he eyeing off? Which are coming up for tender. Anyone in the know?

Vigi-one have heard the rumour about a QF Alliance deal but have heard its just that :rumour.

Skynews
30th Dec 2010, 00:10
Sky west pilots moving to Network for career progression, yeah right onto what?
Sky west already have F100's and A320 so where is the progression.
Ask the current QF subsidiaries what sort of career progression is available.
As for staff travel the latest agreements have staff travel discounts a 50% replacing the old 90 %. Considering the possibility of not having available seats, and discount airfares with other carriers, big deal. Keep it.
Now what will these guys be offered if anything?

cone zone
30th Dec 2010, 00:11
B717's maybe????

tourismman
30th Dec 2010, 00:14
The article states below,

It intends to take the business beyond Western Australia and is looking at potential growth opportunities such as defence charters.

So i would assume Network will operate in QLD and perhaps Sth Australia for the Fly In Fly out market, as well as doing defence charters out of TSV,DRW ??

Mr. Hat
30th Dec 2010, 00:21
Sky west pilots moving to Network for career progression, yeah right onto what?

Just said it was a possibility for FO quick commands. Seem to have hit a bit of a raw nerve there.. hmm.

I guess Network becoming the dominant carrier in WA is going to become a bitter pill to swallow for some. Good on them I say! I like seeing the under dog have a win :ok:. If you look at their story it is a pretty impressive one.

Sky west already have F100's and A320 so where is the progression.

Right to Left seat F100. Jet command and a pay rise rather than sitting and waiting gathering out of production FO time. A320? You're right they should wait around for a slot on that :ugh:.

As for staff travel 90/50 or whatever you cant beat the white rat network (pardon the pun)! They (QF AJ) deserve a bagging on some things but credit where credit is due. Some of their employee benefits have got to be better than some of the two bit mining charter operators!

teggun
30th Dec 2010, 00:35
Whats the pay and conditions of an F100 Captain at Network?

Skynews
30th Dec 2010, 01:49
Hat, no raw nerve, doesn't have any affect on me, I just think there may be rose coloured glasses. Some of the smaller operations like network, are simply better tO work for.

My point with the 50% travel is that that's all some of the new employee groups get. 50% off the full economy rate and standby to boot. I.e. Similar price to a definite seat ticket via the Internet. There is no benefit in that anymore.

I wish all the network guys well. I hope it works out, BUT if the rest of Qantas is an indication, they are in for some heart ache.

Mr. Hat
30th Dec 2010, 02:17
Fair enough Skynews. I've heard different things about QF staff travel from different people so I'm not sure what the deal is. Someone from Jetstar told me that pilots and family there qualified for business class from day one. Who knows, perhaps each has EBA differences.

My other point was that I expect to see some ads in the Australian for Direct Entry COmmands in the next 18 months or so for NAA on the F100. And surely some FO's with F100 time might take it. What would be very interesting is if the rumour about QF and Alliance is true.

Icarus2001
30th Dec 2010, 02:33
I guess Network becoming the dominant carrier in WA is going to become a bitter pill to swallow for some. Wow, Qantas buy the company and you already have them as the dominant operator in the next five minutes.

IF that happens it would take many years. Just look at the size of Skippers, Cobham and Skywest. Network do not have a huge apron although there is some room for expansion. Unless they gravel kit the F100 (is it available) they will not steal Skippers work. Cobham have a gravel kit on one 146 already and I hear are planning more. Skywest have a solid and part protected network. So Network do have their work cut out.

B717's maybe???? Unlikely as the idea is to keep one jet type for the cost saving. The F100 is on the AOC and in operation, spares, engineers, manuals all in place. Just buy more! The added benefit is it keeps both the Network and Qantalink (Cobham) pilot groups worried about losing the work. A great trick at EBA time. The 717 will stay RPT with the Network F100s doing FIFO and probably some OS work.

Skynews
30th Dec 2010, 02:34
Yeh, I think its only new CC that are on 50% but be assured that's just the tip of the iceberg. I suggest, don't know, that any new group such as Network, will be offered the same poxy deal. Only time will tell.

flightfocus
30th Dec 2010, 03:41
I suspect you are going to see an expansion of engineering that will handle QF737. Obviously not going to replace Melb maint base, but give them some much needed options in the west.

PH airport is a dogs breakfast. Probably a good move by QF as they will have somewhere else to park their fleet o/night. The 600 lane is full almost every night. Increasingly you will see at least 3 or 4 B767's in addition to the 10 odd B737's.

With them already having the B717 deal with Cobham I think there is more to this than just fleet and services.

mootyman
17th Feb 2011, 09:31
Qantas announces fleet expansion, boosts Network | Australian Aviation Magazine (http://australianaviation.com.au/2011/02/qantas-announces-fleet-expansion-boosts-network/)

Yep thats an expansion

beechie
18th Jul 2011, 07:00
6 months on whats the gossip?

Is Cobham still going to run the 717s? Contract going to be renewed for 2012?

Network going to be the biggest FIFO operator in Perth?

Network to take all of Cobhams work?

Improved terms and conditions for pilots or will we all be fighting to keep bread on the table?:(

topend3
28th Jul 2011, 02:52
---------------------------
Davin joins Qantas to head charter operations
Item by australianaviation.com.au at 11:55 am, Wednesday July 27 2011


Hugh Davin
Qantas has appointed experienced industry veteran Hugh Davin to the new position of head of charter business to oversee the airline’s expansion into the charter and fly-in/fly-out markets.

Davin was most recently managing director of Skywest, responsible for the Perth based airline’s successful charter and FIFO operations serving the WA resources industry. He joined Skywest in 2007 from National Jet (now Cobham) where he was head of WA and NT operations.

“Mr Davin brings to Qantas an unparalleled depth of knowledge of one of Australia’s fastest growing aviation markets. We welcome him to our team to help us grow our charter and fly-in/fly-out business,” Qantas group executive commercial, Rob Gurney said.

Davin’s appointment follows Qantas’s acquisition of Perth based charter operator Network Aviation last year, which Qantas is expanding with the purchase of 10 additional Fokker 100 jets.

Davin, who reports to Narendra Kumar, executive general manager Qantas regional airlines, started in his new position on July 25, and is based in Perth.

harrowing
28th Jul 2011, 13:20
As promised and just in the nick of time!

Capn Bloggs
28th Jul 2011, 14:54
Qantas has appointed experienced industry veteran Hugh Davin
I thought he had a spring in his step a couple of months ago! http://www.smilies.our-local.co.uk/index_files/dancingguy.gif

SOPS
28th Jul 2011, 15:01
Perhaps Emirates will buy the lot:}

Tainlovestofly
4th Oct 2011, 10:25
*bumpity bump bump*