Typhoon Question

[Thelma Viaduct]

If you were fortunate enough to fly a Typhoon as your day job, would each aircraft feel exactly like the last or do they have individual handling characteristics?

Same question for Tornado/Harrier.

Cheers :ok:

[jindabyne]

Bit like women PP. From the outside quite different, what with different colours and bits hanging down. Once in the cockpit however, they tend to 'feel' similar --------

[Easy Street]

Well, speaking for the Tornado, they all feel pretty much the same. In normal operation there is no direct "stick-to-control surface" linkage; a stability augmentation computer decides how to move the controls in response to the pilot's stick inputs. Since each aircraft's computer is identical, the control response is uniform across the fleet. There is a mechanical backup mode but we don't spend enough time using it to build a picture of each airframe's individual foibles!

There is an exception, though - one particular GR4 is known as "The Twitcher" and is slightly more sensitive in pitch than all the others. This can occasionally cause amusement when watching junior pilots attempt AAR in it. The engineers can't find anything wrong with the thing (SOP really).

Some of the jets are a bit bent due to their advanced age and require a bit of rudder now and then during high speed accelerations. I prefer to maintain the status of the pedals as "footrests" and go directly for the rudder trim, so it doesn't really count as a 'handling' characteristic for me! (awaiting the QFI incoming...)

Of far greater relevance to the handling is the external load. A few examples:

With the "big" external tanks the jet is twitchier in pitch than with the "small" ones
With wing-mounted ALARM it gets a bit skittish in all 3 axes as the Mach limit approaches
With a full (draggy) load of 12 Brimstone it feels heavier in pitch at slow speedsHope that's of interest to you. I would imagine that Typhoon's more modern flight control system would iron out handling differences caused by external stores, giving identical control response at all times; any Typhoon guys care to comment?

[Tankertrashnav]

Some of the jets are a bit bent due to their advanced age and require a bit of rudder now and then during high speed accelerations.


One of our Victors K1s had spent some time at Boscombe and had reputedly been rolled at some stage - it had certainly been thrown around a lot more than any of the others in the fleet. It too was a bit bent, and once settled down to straight and level flight would proceed in a very gentle, but discernible corkscrew. This was even noticeable down the back through the seat of your pants. Dont recall that it was bad enough to cause any problems to the receivers during AAR though.

[NutherA2]

a 'handling' characteristic

In the yawing plane, shouldn't it be a 'footling' problem? :)

[67Wing]

And then there are the groaners. At speeds well above the normal cruise of 420 kts there is a deafening low frequency buzzing noise with very light vibration. Usually starts at some random speed above 480 kts and only on some Tornado airframes. Changes pitch with AOA. Some jets have no groan and on some you can accelerate through it. On a few it just gets louder the faster you go. My impression was that it was something to do with airflow around the canopy. It was too loud to come from somewhere else like the intakes.

Rumour has it that the groan can disappear with a change of navigator ;)

Most squadrons keep a list of each aircraft's foibles. They were minor snags that had been investigated but were either not worth fixing or could not be fixed and had no safety implications. They varied from various electrical snags to top tips on how to get some aircraft through BITEs. There were also some significant differences in weapon system performance. Harmonisation was always an issue and some aircraft had a habit of bombing short or long resulting in different corrections for each airframe. Likewise, the back seat kit had a personality of its own. Not surprising with the complexity of the systems, especially mechanical IN platforms, radar etc. All this is GR1 stuff, I'm sure it's all fixed in the GR4.

[engineer(retard)]

ES and 67

I remeber one long term odd ball handling problem that turned out to be play in the pylon mounts, the difference in play was very minor to the eye.

regards

retard

[just another jocky]

...and some aircraft had a habit of bombing short or long...

Of course no-one goes dumb bombing any more. :E

[Thelma Viaduct]

Thanks, some good replies. :8

[glad rag]

Quote:
Some of the jets are a bit bent due to their advanced age and require a bit of rudder now and then during high speed accelerations.
One of our Victors K1s had spent some time at Boscombe and had reputedly been rolled at some stage - it had certainly been thrown around a lot more than any of the others in the fleet. It too was a bit bent, and once settled down to straight and level flight would proceed in a very gentle, but discernible corkscrew. This was even noticeable down the back through the seat of your pants. Dont recall that it was bad enough to cause any problems to the receivers during AAR though.

43 had a FG1 just like that. It was fine on all duties until APC, clean apart from the pod it would, like the Victor above, gently corkscrew away.

The QWI had another card in his hand with it :E.

[Dan Winterland]

I flew Victors and they were all different to handle, because they had been bespoke tailored in a barn by craftsmen, assissted by elves (allegedly!). And although the Victor was an extreme example of hand crafting aeroplanes, most conventionally controlled aircraft have variations. But with Fly By Wire types, they should be - and are generally all very similar. My current aircraft is a FBW airliner and there is no discernable difference in handling between the oldest in the fleet (18 years) and the youngest (3 months).

[Thelma Viaduct]

My current aircraft is a FBW airliner and there is no discernable difference in handling between the oldest in the fleet (18 years) and the youngest (3 months).

Are there more biscuit crumbs aboard the 18 year old???

[jindabyne]

Sadly, that is not the case the other way round - sorry guys, size does matter.

Bugg*r

[SixOfTheBest]

PP,

The Harrier, having 'direct' (albeit through PFCUs) stick to surface controls makes each ac subtly different. In addition, the slightly different engine installations (2 types of engine, installed performance of EVERY engine different to every other engine) can vary the grumbles the Peg may/may not make. Also, some ac are bent more than others and so have a tendency to perhaps depart earlier/more violently/less violently than others. The same querks can be applied across the whole ac to be honest. Some ac have been well behaved whilst the odd ac (rarely) seemed to have read Stephen King's 'Christine'!!

Short version:
Each one is different, slightly. All a joy to fly.

SoTB