Aviation Sweatshop

[Check and Checker]

This sums up the state of our sorry industry. 2 articles in the same day. One of which praises pilots for their extraordinary professionalism under difficult circumstances, and the other tells the sorry tale of shoddy training, piss poor wages, and deteriorating conditions.

Young airline pilots get less than baggage handlers | The Australian (http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/aviation/young-airline-pilots-get-less-than-baggage-handlers/story-e6frg95x-1225964714554)

ATSB report cites role of pilots in landing A380 after engine blast knocked out key systems | The Australian (http://www.theaustralian.com.au/business/aviation/atsb-report-cites-role-of-pilots-in-landing-a380-after-engine-blast-knocked-out-key-systems/story-e6frg95x-1225965103553)

Lets not beat around the bush. When management looks at us, they see a bunch of slaves out in the field picking cotton. Just another group to be managed by PR, spin and spreadsheets. Just wringing another few points of productivity out of us, with complete detachment to the consequences of their fear based check and checking system.
A system designed to meet the minimum regulatory hurdles, at the absolute minimum cost.

And they are adept at getting us to fight against each other. We have a system that encourages the highest among us to rat on the lowest, rather than promoting training and discussion.

Maybe the AOA should spend some time trying to coerce the company into putting in places a decent training system.

[CXtreme]

Sad but true C & C. Have our colleagues on CX 270 not just demonstrated to the company they can rely on us, and believe me the company is P.R. ing it to the max.

Our fellow aviators pulling of " The miracle on the Hudson" showed the travelling public how important it is to have the "right stuff" at the front end, but allas, I am afraid they will negotiate with us with no more profesional respect then "them cotton picker's"

[FR8R H8R]

50k pounds will buy you a year or two max at Yale, so it would be tough to get that Suisse chalet on this plan.

As for the aviation sweat shop complaint, does anyone see the line of potential underpaid candidates running out anytime soon? It's called Shiny Jet Syndrome.
Look it up.

"I'd do that job for free..."

[Arfur Dent]

Quite amazing how we're all linked in the 'Same Team Same Dream' nonsense until it gets down to the nitty gritty. Then we get devisive - ie why do the 'HKG team' get a 13th month payment when the others thousands in the 'team' don't? Why are we constantly abused as a working group until we do something special like saving 300+ people from crashing into the hlls?
There are 23,000 people on the CX recruiting list apparently so the 'Dream Leaders' attitude is - If you don't like it - go elsewhere!!

[boxjockey]

Arfur,

Don't buy into the 23000 BS. Apparently they are having a hard time filling shortly upcoming cadet classes. It's all propaganda my friend.

box

[Iron Skillet]

Once again, at least for the pilots, those not based in HKG always get the 13th month, all of it, divided equally into their 12 months of pay. This is how the based pay rates were negotiated and adjusted a long time ago, and that's how it works.

The fact that it does not seem so is a different story.

[main_dog]

This is how the based pay rates were negotiated and adjusted a long time ago, and that's how it works.

Except, of course, that while this held true all those years ago, the erosion of the based salary's worth with inflation (generally worse on bases than in HKG), means that the monthly salary is now less than market in most base areas even if it "includes" the 13th month... in other words on most bases each month you get a fairly meagre salary with no chance of a 13th month "windfall".

Not that I envy the HKG guys in the arguably worse position of having to depend on the company's "generosity" every year.

Point is, WE ALL DESERVE A (LONG OVERDUE) SUBSTANTIAL PAYRISE.

[Iron Skillet]

I think it is time to stop using this belief in "the market" to compare our salaries and recent pay demands. There is no other market like Hong Kong, a city with virtually no source of qualified airline pilots with a very large international "career" airline, where the cost cost of living is so high, except arguably Dubai, but even they have an air force.

Seniority-based career airlines are not an open market for pilots: Choosing an airline to risk your career, time and future with is a big gamble not comparable to any other specialized profession that requires 10-20 years of such expensive training and lengthy experience requirements, in which you cannot simply change airlines when you want to take your experience elsewhere - because you have to start again at the bottom of the seniority list. That system has its pluses and minuses, but works both ways - at most airlines.