DHL tail strike

[jimini]

DHL bahrain 727 had a tail strike last week and everything was kept quiet. The Director of opps the the captain of the flight and the pilot flying of the leg.
according to sources the PF stalled the AC before touchdown, had flat spots on 3 tyres and hit the tailskid. after a quick preflight he decided to return back to bahrain presurised with the damages, which is against Boeing regulation.the FE tried to oppose to the decision but was quickly told to keep his mouth shut.
According to the flight opperation safety manager who by the way is a friend of the Director of opps, there was no tailstrike therefore there was no need to make an incident report.
can anyone coment on the incident

thanks

[MIDSEVEN]

I happen to know the director Safety. he is a dedicated professional and to even suggest that he would try to cover anything up is malicious in the extreme. Get real:=

[jimini]

your head is either deep in the s....t or you are so naive either way drinking beers in a bar with some one does not mean he is good in his job. the fact is that a week after the incident he came up with the most incredible story to cover this thing up. here it goes.

Gentlemen,

Following a recent suspected tailstrike incident at ORBD, I wish to raise awareness of the following NOTAMS and possible consequences:

A1863/10 - RWY 14/32 CLOSED. ALL CROSSING TAXIWAY INTERSECTIONS OPEN FOR AIRCRAFT TAXI. 17 SEP 04:00 2010UNTIL 15 DEC 04:00 2010. CREATED: 16 SEP 06:19 2010
A2113/10 - DIP LOCATED ON RWY 30 APPROXIMATELY 200FT SOUTH OF 7000 RDMBETWEEN TWY FOXTROT AND TWY DELTA. WIE UNTIL 28 JAN 23:59 2011. CREATED: 31OCT 16:07 2010
As detailed above there is a significant DIP, located between taxiways Fox and Delta.

If possible, avoid full length take offs on RWY 30 as the hump/depression will be impacted at high speed and may cause damage to the aircraft. A take off from F intersection will avoid this, thereby minimising the risk of aircraft damage.

Performance limits in the RTOW charts shall always be the deciding factor.



Best regards

suspected tailstrike he says ??????????

ask the FE and the FO:ugh:

[jimini]

by the way the tailskid is completely destroyed and the FE was not even allowed to write in the techlog about it :D

[sandman88]

Jimini:

I really think that you should check your "facts" before you open your mouth again and make a complete fool of yourself. Not only are your comments inaccurate in the extreme, but show a total lack of understanding, on your part of what actually occurred. Your comments would be amusing if they were not so stupid.

You evidently have a personal issue with the person mentioned in your post and hiding behind an anonymous forum like PPRUNE shows that you lack the backbone and "cajones" to address your issues, like a man, with the person/s concerned. Then again, your type lacks what it takes to act in any way except what you have so aptly demonstrated.

May I suggest that you stop acting like a snivelling, pouting little child and get some real facts before you humiliate yourself further.

By the way.. If you have difficulty understanding any of my comments above, I would be more than happy to translate into any language you feel more comfortable with.:=

[four engine jock]

This jimini guys seems like he has a personal thing for the DHL guy. Whats the bigg deal anyway. Tail-skid on the 727 is there for that anyway.

[hetfield]

Tail-skid on the 727 is there for that anyway.

Oh my God it's so long ago, but wasn't it that way if the little clip is gone it's a no go?

[SNS3Guppy]

according to sources the PF stalled the AC before touchdown, had flat spots on 3 tyres and hit the tailskid. after a quick preflight he decided to return back to bahrain presurised with the damages, which is against Boeing regulation.

Boeing makes regulation now? Really?

Your "location" is cited as "afganistan."

You spelled it wrong. An important first step in knowing where you are, is knowing how to spell where you are. Before launching personal attacks from behind your screen name here, perhaps you can learn to spell there...where ever you really are.

[four engine jock]

From the B727 Boeing QRH
TAILSTIKE ON TAKEOFF
CAUTION: IF A TAILSTRIKE OCCURS AND THE TAILSKID LIGHT ILLUMINATES,DO NOT PRESSURIZE AIRPLAND DUE TO POSSIBLE STRUCTUAL DAMAGE.

[Maurice Chavez]

Find it hard to imagine how one can "stall" a 727 on landing in the "normal" landing configuration. Tailstrikes on landing on the 727 are very rare and are usually caused by an improper flaring technique, IE floating down the runway and keep adjusting nose pitch up. A tailtrike will occur and might compress the cartridge, however, an inspection of the tailskid will allow you to fly out back to base, the inspection might even be done by your F/E if he's licensed as a 727 mechanic. Check MEL, DCDL as there might be fuel penalties, depending on the tailskid installed (electric or hydraulic). As 4engine Jock pointed out, the QRH calls for unpressurized if it occured on take off, NOT on landing, a tailstrike on landing calls for a maintenance inspection.

[four engine jock]

RETRACTABLE TAIL SKID - INSPECTION/CHECK
EFFECTIVITY
727-200 Series
1. General
A. The tail skid is checked for tip wear and compression of energy absorber. The tail skid should
also be checked for structural integrity, security of mounting and bonding wires.
2. Check Tail Skid
A. Check indicator clip for security.
NOTE: When energy absorber has been crushed more than 3-1/2 inches (2-1/2 inches of ring
spring compression plus 1 inch of crushed cartridge), the indicator clip will have
sheared the rivets and indicate need for replacement of energy absorber cartridge.
See 32-71-71.
B. Check drag link door tip for security of mounting and wear.
(1) Tip must be replaced when its surface has worn to within 0.60 inch of the head of the
attach bolts. (Refer to 32-71-62.)
(2) Cracks or missing corners on the tip outboard of the attach bolts are permissible.
(3) Cracks radiating from the bolt holes require replacement of the tip.
C. Check uplock and downlock switches for freedom of movement.
D. Check tail skid drag link for security of mounting and bonding wire continuity.
E. Check tail skid structure for cracks, wear, and interference.
F. Check tail skid hydraulic actuator for security of mounting and hydraulic lines and connections
for leaks.
G. Check energy absorber inner and outer cylinders for binding and wrinkles.

[four engine jock]

12. Tail Skid
1) 727-200 Only
d) Following (c), the gear
handle is returned to UP and
the tail skid annunciator
extinguishes.
NOTE: Handle should remain UP until
necessary to lower gear.
NOTE: The tailskid must be extended and locked down for takeoff; in addition, the
crushable core must be installed and operable. There are two reasons for
these requirements:
1. The tailskid protects the tail section against damage from over-rotation.
2. Takeoff speeds are based on the airplane being geometry limited (i.e. the
airplane cannot be over-rotated).
Without the tailskid function the airplane would have to be re-certified using
higher takeoff speeds.

MAINTENANCE (M)
On all EXCEPT 727-200 AIRPLANES - Deactivate tail skid as follows:
1. If tailskid is fully extended:
A. Disconnect and tie back electrical connector.
B. Install bolt through ground lockpin in large cam, add washer and nut, then
secure with cotter pin.
2. If tail skid is not fully extended:
A. Remove the second fixed tread from the bottom of the fixed ventral stair,
directly above the actuator.
B. Disconnect and tie back electrical connector.
C. Remove tail skid actuator and extend tail skid fully.
D. Replace tread on fixed ventral stair.
E. Install bolt through ground lockpin hole in large cam, add washer and nut,
then secure with cotter pin.
3. Placard the tail skid position light, F/E's lower panel, "INOP-LOCKED
EXTENDED."
4. Placard near landing gear control handle on pilot's center panel, "TAIL SKID
On 727-200 AIRPLANES - deactivate tail skid as follows:
1. If tail skid is not fully extended, install landing gear downlock pins,
place landing gear control handle in the "OFF" position, then manually pull
tail skid down. (Cam follower roller will be on aft side of lower cam lobe
when tail skid is fully extended).
2. Remove screw attaching clip to outboard side of right-hand yoke and pivot clip
forward on lower bolt to provide clearance. Reinstall screw, washer and nut
in yoke.
3. Install bolt through tail skid downlock hole in right yoke from inboard side,
with two washers under head of bolt. Secure with washer, nut and cotter pin.
4. Push up on lower end of actuator piston. Yoke assembly stop should contact
bolt head restricting piston travel to approximately 3/16 inch. (The cam
follower roller must still be aft of the lower point of the cam lobe).
5. Place landing gear control handle, pilot's center panel, in the "DOWN"
position.
6. Remove landing gear downlock pins.
7. Placard the tail skid position light, F/E's lower panel, "INOP-LOCKED
EXTENDED."
8. Placard near the landing gear control handle on pilot's center panel, "TAIL
SKID INOP-LOCKED EXTENDED."
9. Inform dispatch.
INOP-LOCKED EXTENDED."
5. Inform dispatch.

[Main Wheel]

Jimini, Clearly you have an issue, or issues... If you have all the info, why you asking for comments.... ??? As you have't got the right picture, try to get it right before making a further fool of yourself... :=:=

[jimini]

all of the above is well put but this happened during the landing in orbd.
the FE is not certified to do any of the above.
by the aggresivity of the answer you must be one of his disciple scared for his job.
by the way how do you explain that nothing was written in the technical book.:D
how do you explain that we flew back pressurized??:=
by the way Afghanistan is a drop down menu
four engine thanks mate

[Mister.E]

''How do you explain that WE flew back pressurised''
So was you a part of this sham that you seem to condem so much:confused:

[SNS3Guppy]

by the way Afghanistan is a drop down menu

Ah. Well, that certainly explains your inability to think for yourself, then.

by the aggresivity of the answer you must be one of his disciple scared for his job.

Aggresivity?

You're not doing yourself any favors here by continuing to post.

If you're a part of the operation in question, you're very stupid for continuing to post.

If you're not a part of that operation, then you're perhaps sticking your nose where it doesn't belong.

What exactly is your agenda, here?

how do you explain that we flew back pressurized??


When you say "we flew back," the import is that you were on board. Given that you're condemning the captain, and you've cited the flight engineer as the third person, are you going to back away from identifying yourself as the first officer on that flight, before you get yourself sued, fired, or damage your reputation far enough that it haunts you for years to come?

No employer is engendered to a pilot who takes his rants to a public web forum; particularly in the manner you've chosen. If you get yourself fired (as you've virtually called yourself out on this one), how do you think it will look to future employers that you did so based on your badmouthing your boss openly on a web board.

It's one thing to invoke an example of something that has happened, anonymously, to make a point or serve a point you are making. That's not what you're doing here. You're openly attacking your company management.

Moreover, if you're flying into Balad, what are you doing based in Afghanistan? You're based in Afghanistan flying four engine airplanes, while serving as the first officer on a 727 flying out of Bahrain? You've really overstepped yourself by any reasonable degree, let's not add confusion and falsification to the mix too.

[Main Wheel]

Well put Guppy... I know both the Captain and F/O in question... unlikely to be them posting... not hard to work out who's left... :ugh:
Not sure what the agenda is, but clearly has one.. Ashes to ashes... Oh silly me, thats crcket... not..

[sandman88]

Jimini

Once again you have demonstrated both a lack of intelligence and a serious deficiency of backbone!

Not only do you continue spouting drivel, but now you make a pathetically weak attempt to cover your tracks by "inadvertently" implying that you were on board the aircraft in question. In one of your above rants you say;" ask the FE and FO", well I did.. The answer I got just served to confirm that you are not only a coward, but a malicious, rather stupid, uninformed coward.

Nothing you say or do will alter the fact that you are neck-deep in the brown, smelly stuff. These forums are not as anonymous as you might like to think. I'd shut up and skulk away if I were you... Mate.

[jimini]

things are moving in there i hope

[mtogw]

Jimini.. you must have a different drop down menu to me....

[four engine jock]

This is really getting out of hand!!!
I don’t get the whole thing.
Is this guy (Jimini) trying to settle a score with someone?
I still don’t see the big deal of the Tailskid.

[Maurice Chavez]

Neither do I.....

[jimini]

the big deal is the fact that it was hidden.
why should i fly a plane the maybe has a crack in the fuselage and could break in flight :ugh::cool:

[SNS3Guppy]

You're not content to attend the hanging. You've got to put on the noose and try it for size, don't you?

Without any further effort to be subtle, for your own good and your own protection, shut your mouth. No longer tapdancing or attempting to back away, you're asserting that you were on the flight, clearly identifying and calling yourself out.

Can you really be this blatantly stupid? Not enough oxygen at altitude, or what? What is your problem, here? What do you hope to accomplish? Are you truly idiotic enough to believe that anyone here can or will march into the offices of your company and save the day for you, or change the world? Does further embarrassing yourself, and dragging your dirty laundry here into public do anything at all for you?

In the beginning, you were an unfortunate. You've turned yourself into an unfortunate idiot. At this stage, you may be well beyond salvation. Give it up, already.

At most places, given how far you've gone, you'd be very lucky to have a job. Can you truly be so naive or stupid that you don't recognize this? If you can't tolerate what you assert has happened, then move on. It's best for you, and clearly best for everyone else.

why should i fly a plane the maybe has a crack in the fuselage and could break in flight

You shouldn't. You shouldn't be in an airplane at all. Do us all a favor and go find a job picking up wet towels at a spa, and stay as far away from the airport, the 727, and "afganistan" as you can.

You're still spelling it wrong.

[four engine jock]

I totaly agree with SNS3Guppy!!
This guy is looking for trouble.

[exoticas aburrido]

Jimini,

You really are a prize :mad:! Was the skid replaced? If so I will presume the required inspections were carried out? If not I suggest you talk to your maintenance team to remove any fears of "a crack in the fuselage and could break in flight".

I have operated with both the first officer and captain and know for a fact that what you are saying is bull:mad:! Total professionals both of them. May I suggest you take your petty personal grudges to the car park and leave this forum to more serious matters.

[ALI BABACA]

I need to agree with Jimmi in parts!
When the aircraft arrived bahrain the mechanic found the tail strike and called the captain to show him the damage.
The BIG GUY tried to scare the mechanic saying " Are you :mad: saying to me i did this tail strike?
After a lot of bla bla the BIG GUY called the technical director,his buddy as well,always drinking and playing golf together to do "something" about this tail strike.
His buddy just called the mechanics and the order was "just replace" the tail cartridge,no inspection is required,due lack of man power,no airplanes and bla bla bla.
You can check on the TLB and the maint TRAX system you can not find anything,but i can tell you! the CRACK is there,you can not see by naked eyes but only by an inspection called NDT.
The NDT manager tried to put the aircraft in the hangar to do the inspection but the buddy didn't allowed and i don't know what's happen after that but the NDT manager resigned.:D
The funny part was the Mister expert chief flight engineer asking every single mechanic how to do an inspection.The best answer was "Mister expert are you FAA A&P right? Please throw away your license and stay away from the maintenance department,just do what have you been paying for "FLICKING SWITCHES"http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/eek.gif

[Maurice Chavez]

You need to agree with Jimmi as you probably are Jimmi.....You know the crack is there, but no NDT check was done, so how do you know the crack is there....Assumptions assumptions.....

[ElectricWhale]

NEVER ignore a tailstrike. Could be serious structural/pressure vessel damage!

[four engine jock]

Hey Maurice Chavez,
I agree. I think this guy is now talking to himself.
That’s what the tail skid is supposed to do.
I am sure they have checked and confirm that all is ok for her to fly.

[MALLY]

Hi Maurice Chavez,
Sure appears that Jimini and Ali Babaca are the same guys??

[sandman88]

Of course "they" are the same person.. He has to talk to himself as nobody else cares what the cretin says or thinks.

Apologies to Billy Shakespeare, but... "An a*&%hole by any other name, is still an a*&%hole..."

Get over it little boy.

[Montrealguy]

The suddenness and viciousness of some of the replies here are very surprising, borderline threatening even. I smell a fish. Much more outrageous statements are often made in this forum without provoking any such reactions from readers. But no worries, the truth will come out, it almost always does.

[custard guts]

Yes I agree, some of the posts belong in the 'play ground' and must be from people who are trying to deflect attention away from the incident.

Gentlemen, either grow up or shut up.........

[slowto280]

words of wisdom (at the very least, common sense/decency). As you may or may not know, the 'original' post was removed for some reason. I do agree however, the manner in which this was brought to light was perhaps semi-unacceptable (we don't want to get feelings hurt here @ pprune, do we now?).

As Montreal has said - most likely, the truth will in fact come out (for those who have an interest). :ok:

Hey, pretty cool how pprune auto corrects it's own name............

[CIAS]

I worked at BAH AVI years ago prior to the B727 operation. It was professionally managed, safe, efficient, people had respect for each other even if we didn't always agree and was fun both outside and during work. Very sad to see it degenerate into this public mess.

[four engine jock]

CIAS. Your so right. But then we all know that one bad apple will destroy the whole bunch!!!

[Muntu]

Where there are spaRKS THERE IS FIRE...

[Maurice Chavez]

Yes I agree, some of the posts belong in the 'play ground' and must be from people who are trying to deflect attention away from the incident.

Gentlemen, either grow up or shut up.........
I suppose that comment was directed towards me and others describing how a tailskid strike is a non event.... I don't work for DHL, so don't know the people involved, what I do know little of, with a few thousand hours on type, that this whole tailskid strike is a non event, and it appears to me that the original poster has not have an idea of what he/she is talking about. But then again, what do I know...

[NigelTFL]

Give it a rest u boys:ugh: Mr Boeing has been there and done that:D

For those of you that can not read ,There are some photies in Handling The Big Jets.
plates 1/2/6/7 and plate 11:ok:

[jimini]

i really like where this is going.
at least there is some interest.:D
we will keep fly these junk and hope for the best .
ali babaca is the man:D:D:D:D:D

[SNS3Guppy]

You're not aware of the "edit" feature, are you?

Looks like you might need to lay off the sauce, too. Tone down the language, calm down, wait until you're sober to post, go a little more slowly, type in English, and you'll come across much better. Good grief.

[Shell Management]

Good advice there SNS3.

[four engine jock]

Never thought that a Tail Strike could cause so much commotion!!!!!

[Sam Crow]

It probably didn't

[HAWK21M]

Looks like a post to settle scores.....
Wouldn't Maintenance know things :)

[Wickerbill]

Christ! We are not still talking about this??...