Maun, Botswana. The essential guide.

[lilflyboy262]

Hello to all.

I'm writing this out of sheer frustration from all the PM's I keep getting asking the same questions over and over again. :ugh:
All of which the information has already been posted on here through various threads. :ugh:
It makes you wonder on the commitment that a lot of people have to actually getting a job if they don't have the time to research something this simple. :ugh:
Maybe Csanad could make one for Namibia?

Perhaps if this could be made a stickey, it would be appreciated.
And forgive the spelling, I speant 3 hours writting this post after being baked in a GA8 all day!

Best time to visit Maun.
The hiring season does vary a little from year to year, but it is safe to say that it generally goes from November to Feburary. It does sometimes start a little early with one or two people being hired, also sometimes goes into March with the odd person being hired.
If you plan to come during this time, then there is a chance you will be hired. The outlook for hiring is always good. There will always be a need each year for people to be hired to replace the guys leaving.
So get on a plane and find out by turning up and asking the companies themselves.
Outside of this time frame, then your chances of being hired drop sharply.


Getting to Maun.
There are various ways of getting here, depending on how adventurous you are.
The most simple way is with Air Botswana leaving via Jo'burg. Expect this to add quite a large sum to the cost of your ticket as it is the most expensive airline route in the world per KM travelled.

There are also buses, or you can try to hitch hike your way there. But that will take you over a day. And can be a little bit dodgy in places.

Where to stay once in Maun.
There are a lot of places to stay at in Maun. Depending on your budget you can get anything from camp sites, to single room apartments.
The typical places to stay at would be Maun Rest Camp, The Old Bridge Backpackers, and Audi Camp.

Most of the pilots that come to Maun stay at Audi Camp. It has a large camp area, so finding space isn't really too much of a problem. They also offer pilots a special rate at 20 pula a night. (about 2 euros)
There is a large (for Botswana standards) swimming pool, a excellent bar, nice food from the bar, and a small library.
Internet is available, I think you have to prepay per MB used.
From last years (Early 2010) batch of pilots, there was a hell of a lot of parties there, and ended up being a really good place to stay at.

The Old Bridge Backpackers is a little bit closer to the main road, so it is easier to catch the local transport into town.
Campground sites start at around 45 pula, and the danger of flooding from the rain is quite low as the only low ground is towards the edges of the campground.
There is a good atmosphere around the bar there, with a lot of the pilots in town coming to water themselves there. Bar staff are great, great food, and also have free wireless internet.

Getting around in Maun.
The lodges are a long way out of town unfortunately. Around 10-15kms, so too far to walk when you are in 35-45 degree heat of the summer!!!
Getting to and from town to the campsites is not a difficult task. You have a number of cheap options there.
The first being the local combi van. If you are going from any of the lodges, you catch a van with a number 1 on the front. Usually has a red circle around the number. These cost 2.70 Pula to get to wherever you are going. Very very cheap! Just be prepared to be jammed inside like sardines! Also can get a bit smelly in the afternoon when you are sqwashed inside against sweaty people...

You can catch taxi's with 2 options. A special taxi exclusive for you, or a taxi which can make stops along the way.
A special taxi to your lodge shouldn't cost you anymore than 30 pula. But he will take you all the way to your doorstop.
The taxi that stops along the way costs around 3.50 pula. And he will stop and make pick ups along the way, will also only drop you outside the lodge on the road.

The last option. Find a South African pilot that is looking for work and has bought his car to Maun. Offer him a bit of petrol money and ride with him!

What to bring to Maun.
Maun offers everything that you will need in terms of toiletries, cooking, and personal supplies.

All you need to bring from home is something to sleep in (blankets, sleeping bags) and a Tent.
For the sleeping bags, it is warm at night during the summer months, usually around 15-25C, so you will not need a heavy sleeping bag. If in doubt, remember it is easier to warm up by wearing more clothes, than what it is to cool off!

For your tent. Get a tent that has a large lip on it between where the ground and where you step into the tent. Campgrounds are prone to flooding, and if you have chosen a poor spot, the tent will fill with water. So the higher the zip is off the ground, the more water can pool up before entering your tent.
To test if it is water resistant enough for Maun. Get your garden hose and turn it onto full blast. Then aim it at your tent. If it stands up to that, then it should cope with Maun.
When you set up your tent, make sure you survey the slope of the land, and DO NOT put it at the bottom of a slope, or in a hollow in the ground. You will end up swimming.
Bring a nice soft sleeping mat as well. If you really want to deck your tent out, you can buy single bed mattresses at some stores for around 250 pula. If your spending 3 months sleeping on the ground. Its worth it.

Make sure you bring with you, every piece of documentation that you can think of for your qualifications. All your high school certificates, any courses you have completed, any awards you have achieved. ANYTHING. It all will get sent away for your work and residence permits and the more the better. Africa tends to lap that stuff up!
In previous threads, it has been mentioned that you need to have a police clearance. That used to be the case, but is now no longer needed. But if you are in doubt. Get one just incase. It can't hurt to bring the extra paperwork. Better to have it and not use it, than to not have it and need it.
Bring your birth certificate.
Bring your logbook, and please have it summarised so you can easily point out your total hours, PIC time, Dual time and all the rest of it.
Also bring your valid ICAO pilots licence and your headset.
Then anything else that you may need for your survival away from home. The town is boring as hell, so make sure you bring enough to entertain you.

In terms of clothing. Summer time the temperatures will reach as high as 50C, averaging around 35-40C. Night time will get as low as 15-20C. So light clothing is ideal. For night time, make sure you bring some light, but long sleeved shirts, and some light but long trousers as well. Mosquitios love fresh meat to Africa, and its probably the best way combined with mosquitio repellent to avoid Malaria.

Visa's, work permits,residence permits.
When you arrive into Maun, apply for the full 90 days, and make sure that you apply as a tourist. Not seeking work.
You are able to apply for more days for a small fee after your 90 days have expired. But it is a bit of a hassle to go about it. Immigration will ask you way you need these days, so make sure you have made up a credible story, or have got yourself involved in some charity or church group who can vouch for you.

You may be asked to present a return ticket out of the country. So it is up to you on whether you decide to buy one or not. But most people get here and then travel out of the country via road from Kasane to Victoria falls or Livingston, so its up to you if you wish to lie and say that. Risk is yours!

Most countries get visa's on arrival, but if you belong to the poor sods who have to get a visa before you arrive at most countries, chances are you will have to get one for Botswana as well. And by the sounds of it, it isnt easy and they ask a lot of questions. So make sure you have all those answers ready for them!

Work & Residence permits will be looked after by the companies once you are hired. You will be asked to present things such as high school certificates, birth certificates, pilots licences and the like.
If you think you might need it, bring it.
Police clearances are no longer needed, but people tend to change their minds as often as the weather, so perhaps it would be better to bring one anyway.

Companies in Maun.
There are 9 companies operating in Maun with the following types of Aircraft. C172, C206, C207, C210, C208, GA8, BN2B

Companies are:-
Safari Air (C206 x4, GA8 x2, C208 x3)
Mack Air (C206 x5, C210 x1 (also uses 1 from Kasac), GA8 x5, C208 x3, C172 x1)
Major Blue (C206 x1, C208 x1, C172 x1, GA8 x1)
Kavango Air (C172 x3, C206 x2, GA8 x1, C208 x2)
Moremi Air (C206 x2, C210 x2, GA8 x1, BN2B x1, C208 x1, PAC750XL x1)
Delta Air (C206 x3, C210 x2, GA8 x2, BN2B x1)
Sefofane Airlines (C150 x1, C172 x1, C206 x8, C208 x6 )
Air Shakawe (C207 x2)
Fridge Air (C172 x2, C206 x3, GA8 x2, C208x2)

With Sefofane, you can also expect to be posted in either Zambia or Zimbabwe.

Requirements
At least ICAO lvl 4
Minimum of 200hrs for most companies, Sefo wants 300hrs.
Age is pretty much open. Average age seems to be between 20-25, but older is taken.
You do not have to have a type rating, but it is advantageous to have experience on the 200 series aircraft.

Not essential but highly advantageous would be to get either a grade 2 instructor rating or attend a safety officers course.

Pay and Roster
For pay, as a first year, you can expect anywhere between 9000-9500 pula per month. Some companies will make you pay up to half of your medical aid. It is very advantageous to get that.
Second year it goes up to around 12000-13000 pula.

Roster is a 6 day on, 1 day off affair, with the odd standby day thrown in there as well.
Maximum amount of hours that you can fly each month is 100. I have only hit that so far once with my company.
Average is about 80hrs a month.

Expect to be able to take leave from around November, through to about Feburary, with preference given to the senior guys over Christmas and New Years. There is a bit of a rush over that time frame as people tend to go on that "Special African Safari holiday"

Depending on which company you work for, you can overnight at the lodges up to 2-3 times a week in the busy season, do not be suprised if you spend a whole week away if you work for Sefofane.
I also believe that Moremei Air bases a pilot in Kasane for 3 months.

Cost of Living
For European standards, the cost of living here is very cheap, but just remember that you wont be on European pay for much longer!
Housing is around 1500-2000pula a month if you share with someone. That usually includes power and water. A full time maid is around 1000 pula a month. And you can get internet via a company called orange (the mobile provider) for around 400 pula a month with a 5gb cap. Don't need a phone line either.
Cellphones are cheap. Can buy simcards here and is cheap to call within the country. Once you start making international calls it begins to get a bit pricey. Better off using something like Skype for international calls.

Aircraft Maintence
Good. As you would expect in any other ICAO nation.

Medical/Vaccinations
You would be wise to get the follow vaccinations for here.

Hep A & B
Tetinus
Measels, Mumps, Rubella
Polio
Rabies
Meningitis

If you are going to travel onto other countries futher north, You may be required to get your Yellow Fever shot, and a cholera vaccination would be wise as well.

In terms of Malaria, it is a threat, but not such a great on in Maun. I suggest getting your hands on Doxy and bringing some with you. It can be used as prevention, but you can only take it constantly for three months. Doxy is also given as treatment, so its better to have it with you and treat it, if in the unlikely event, that you actually get it.

Medical facilities here are average. I suggest travel insurance that covers transfers to South Africa for treatment.

Water is ok to drink some days, and not others. So it is best to avoid taking the risk and to drink bottled water right from the start.

HIV/AIDS is a HUGE problem in Botswana with 1 in 5 of the local population having it. Some reports say that it is even higher than the figure quoted.
Remember boys, flies spread disease, so keep yours closed!
Don't be fooled by the tourist bus girls either. Remember they have travelled a long way through Africa by the time they reach Maun, and they have travelled through a lot of guys too.
Its better to just introduce yourself to Mrs Palmer and her 5 daughters and bring a nice selection of "Mature" videos on your laptop.

What companies look for
Each company has a idea of what they want from their pilots. And therefore look at each pilot that walk through to door to see if they will fit into their company. Hours do not really mean anything here as long as you have over 200.

Get to know the pilots in Maun, as they do have a big say in each company on who gets hired.
Go out and have a drink with them, go to Braai's with them, invite them to braai's of your own. But whatever you do, do not get ****faced drunk every night and act like a right knob. Don't go starting fights with people. News goes back to the cheif pilots and operations manager of what happened and you can kiss any hope of a job with the companies good-bye.

Do not be over zealous in your search for a job. There is a fine line between looking committed and just being annoying.
Keep popping in every few days and ask what the story is. And keep trying to get onto flights into the Delta every day. Try to go with the senior pilots and do your best to take in the surroundings rather than just treating it as a joy flight.

The general attire is casual. Coming in with pressed black pants, white shirt and black shoes is just going to be met with a odd look. Come in with nice, tidy, comfortable, non gangster or skater, clothes and all will be well.
Try to shave every once in a while as well.

And yes, if you have a ICAO CPL licence with 200hrs or more, you will stand a chance of being hired. If you have under 200, you will struggle. But its not impossible.
All the other ratings are unneeded as you will be flying single engine aircraft, VFR, in the day time.
Anything else will be looked after once you are hired.

Conditions of Maun
Maun is not the best place on earth to live. It does provide the basics to live a normalish western lifestyle. But things can be very backwards here to say the very least.
Expect to be frustrated by the constant power and water outages.
Expect to be grilled by 40+C heat.
Expect sand to fill every gap and creavas in your body.
Expect to be frustrated by red tape and the need for everyone to assert their authority.
Expect to be frustrated by the total lack of logic and foresight of this country.
Expect anything to go missing while your not looking.
Expect a certain low level of animosity or lack of respect towards the "white man".
Expect the houses to be of a different standard to the ones back home.

This place has its charms, but it also has its ugly side. It can only be what you make it. Don't expect the world or you will be disappointed and unhappy.
Whilst looking for a job, you will have the time of your life, but that lifestlye does chance once you get a job, and the view of this place begins to change once you are here for long enough.
Its only fair that you get warned.

Conditions at work
You will be flying very old but very well maintained aircraft. One or two compaines have new aircraft so its not all doom and gloom.
Most of the Aircraft have GPS built in, the ones that don't, the company provides handheld Garmin's. You are expected to be able to read a map and to know how to navigate by one should your GPS fail. Alternator failures are not uncommon here due to the belts snapping from the heat.
The flying is very challenging and needs to be treated with respect, as well as having the time of your life.
Very often you will be flying overweight. Very often you will be flying with your C of G well out of limits. And you will learn how to deal with it.
You will learn a lot about thunderstorms.
You will learn how to land with a tailwind as with tight turn arounds sometimes you just have to land convient to the parking bay.
Some strips are just purely one way strips and the only way in or out is with a tailwind!
It is hot, very hot, and you have to be aware of animals at all times.
The strips are short, and sometimes in poor condition. Often contaminated with water.
You will be flying with density altitudes of around 7000-9000ft and you will develop a very healthy respect to how the aircraft will preform each day.
So far my longest flight day was 6.3hrs with 18 take offs and landings. At each stop you have 10 minutes to unload, then load the aircraft again, get in, start up and go.
9-10hr days are common place, Don't be suprised if you work 12hr days 3 or 4 days in a row.
Forget what you were taught about flying at flight school. Playing with flap settings on take off and landing is essential.
There is a huge amount of turbulence here, and sick passengers with exploding sick bags are common place.
Again, its only fair that you know what you are getting yourself into!




If you have anymore questions, please go back and read through this again as there is a good chance I have already said it.
If you feel that it is a really pressing and needed question then ask it and I will try to help you out. But before asking, please just think over it and go... What would the logical answer be?

If you think you might need it, bring it.
If you hold a CPL then yes, you will have a chance of a job.

I managed to get a job here without knowing a single thing about this place. I'm sure you can too! Otherwise if just getting here is too much of a struggle for you, then perhaps Africa isn't for you.

[Dupre]

Awesome thread bro - surely this can be made a sticky! Just one update as you put question marks... Sefo has 1xC172, 8xC206, 6xC208B, 1xPAC750XL. And they might post you to Zambia for a season, but not Zimbabwe - only Zim citizens can work there. The Sefo Zambia fleet is 1xC206, 2xC210, 1xC208B.

Great work :ok:

[cavortingcheetah]

It's not often someone takes the time to put so much useful information at the disposal of anyone. Definitely a candidate for the sticky award of the week. I for one salute you, for what it's worth, for taking the trouble to write the guide book.
What you need up there is one of these?

Florida Police Bust Brothel-on-Wheels - Local News | News Articles | National News | US News - FOXNews.com (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,371821,00.html)

I'll add the following comment. I wouldn't be at all surprised tomorrow to read on this same thread, some silly post from some lazy wallah asking for information on where to find a job in Maun. The lack of initiative and self reliance demonstrated by some wannabees in their inability to undertake basic research is quite astounding. It just goes to show that there are fewer dedicated flyers out there than there used to be. I guess that's why the Airbus was invented, for spoon fed feeders?
Perhaps it might be helpful to know which camps had long drops, squats or self cleaning toilets though and can you buy two ply in the shop on the corner in Maun?

With respect to the quick and the dead who served.
11.11.10.

[Dupre]

Awesome thread bro - surely this can be made a sticky! Just one update as you put question marks... Sefo has 1xC172, 8xC206, 6xC208B, 1xPAC750XL. And they might post you to Zambia for a season, but not Zimbabwe - only Zim citizens can work there. The Sefo Zambia fleet is 1xC206, 2xC210, 1xC208B.

Great work :ok:

[morgan32]

Hi,
What about GPS, do you think a hand held gps is a good thing to bring or are the aircraft equipped already?
Thanks again for all the informations you have spoon fed us ...
I look forward to meet you in a month.
Best regards.

[CCUaviator]

Great thread bro.... Super nice.

Cheers:ok:

[Csanad007]

Great stuff man! If I can get myself together I'll write one for Nam as well :)

[lilflyboy262]

Yeah I realised that I missed a few sefo aircraft as I walked along the flight line this morning. Can't remember the 8th C206 though. I got AIV, ANT, BOK, BEE, JKL, JET and KDU. I think they have a C150 as well.

Haven't seen the 750 in a while, I think the lease might have ended for the season. That or I have just got used to the eye-sore that the aircraft is, and it just blends in with the other tails.

I think one of the sefo girls ended up spending a few days down in Zim this year, thats why I said it. Possibly was still flying the Zambo plane so thats how they got away with it.

[Dangriga]

Very usefull post lilflyboy 262! Thanks for the information. So .... a nice mature selection in the laptop .... jeje :) I ´ll be there in January!

[cavortingcheetah]

This link provides some further helpful information nearly all of which has been covered in the previous post.

Criminal Penalties (http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_1467.html)

While you all salivate salaciosuly about the filthy pictures you are going to import into Botswana for your own maturbatory usage, either individually or collectively, this is from the Botswana Tourist Board customs help link:

(The importation of, among other things, the following goods into Botswana is completely prohibited. It is illegal to be found in possession of prohibited goods and may result in seizure and prosecution. These include:

Narcotic, habit-forming drugs and related substances in any form.
Military firearms, ammunition and explosives
Indecent and obscene material such as pornographic books, magazines, films, videos, DVDs and software
Restricted Goods)

I expect it's true to say that you'll be deported if you are discovered making too much in the way of deep throated noises. Of course, any pilot who wishes to get rid of the competition and avail himself of the subsequent shortage of flyers in Maun only has to make an anonymous telephone call which will no doubt lead to a denudification of all the camps and perform a public service in increasing the number of cleansed computers available for the school children of Maun.

[Dangriga]

just kidding man...

[Dupre]

Hey bro, the other C206 is OWL. Yep I guess you can count the C150 too - PUP - though it's only with the flight school.

I could be wrong but I think they own the PAC750 outright - bought it when vumbura (the biggest wilderness camp) was half underwater and they couldn't get vans in... now it's subsided there's no point using it as it's smaller and more expensive than a van. I'm sure they'll use it again when they're busy.

cheers :)

[Steekvlieg]

Are any of the companies operating fling-wings in Maun?

[lilflyboy262]

Helicopter Horizons operates 2 B206's
Sefofane also operates 2 B206's
Mack Air has a EC130 (Sex on blades)

[tu144]

Wow thanks a lot. This and the other threads really should be stickied in the training section or somewhere.

[tu144]

How long you've been working there?

[morgan32]

Hi,
How do you manage for money ?
International or local bank?
thx

[major_tom]

wow, really appreciate this flyboy - been trying to calculate clear answers from what other posts have done but this sums it up perfectly :ok: I only have 150hrs atm, but hopefully if i can make it to 300 will be hitting the road
cheers

[Cpt.Oates]

Hey mate, thanks for an awesome post, this covers so much, it was a great read. I'm a Pilot from NZ, a friend and I are heading over in Dec 2010 we both have around 400 hours with Instructor ratings.
I have one question about what you do with funds? How difficult is it to open a bank account in Maun, or do you open a bank account or just use your international one?
Do you know how expensive cars are to buy (like a cheap, pretty average car) or is it not worth owning a car?

[Cardinal Puff]

How do you manage for money ?

Money? We still use coloured beads. Just carry them around on a bit of string.

[cavortingcheetah]

Is it possible that no one has had the wit to Google up a map of the dusty weed patch known as Maun, rivalled only by Hotazel for the vibrancy of its night life?

http://www.jacanaent.com/Maps/MaunMap.jpg

You will notice banks abounding from this excellent street guide. Be warned though, a noon day walk from one end of town to the other at this time of year can be rather more exhausting than the distances estimated from the map would indicate. Camels can be rented by the hour outside the Bothabelo Hospital on Mathiba Street. They have to be returned by sunset because after dark these ungulates are used to transport the bodies of the dead to the mortuary.

[big buddah]

Very often you will be flying overweight. Very often you will be flying with your C of G well out of limits. And you will learn how to deal with it.

Pretty unprofessional to be saying this stuff!
Not a very macho thing to be doing as well, you're setting some young folk up for disaster.
Ever wondered why African aviation has an extremely dim view in the eyes of the rest of the world? Who are working hard to get rid of this.

[lilflyboy262]

Perhaps thats why I am trying to get out of here.
Don't try to class me into the group of Macho pilots that are doing it. I am preparing people that are arriving here what to expect.
Unfortunately that first job is so hard to get, and most young guys coming here when asked to jump, will ask how high.
If you don't want to fly then they will show you the door. There is pleanty more fresh meat waiting to fill your seat.

[flying free.LEVC]

Is it so dangerous flying in the limits? I am a spanish student pilot and if situation keeps like this for the next 3-4 years, I will go to Namibia, Botswana or Uganda to find a job flying.

Aviation accidents often occur over there? I mean flying C206 and this kind of planes with tourists...

[lilflyboy262]

Around 1 a year. Last 3 have been non fatal. Last fatal one was someone doing wingovers at low level.
I'd rather fly in africa than indonesia.

[flying free.LEVC]

Thanks for the answer lilflyboy. So do you consider aircraft maintenance is safe in Maun¿?

Here in Spain for example, most of fatal accidents in cessnas or piper are fault of the pilot, mos of them flying low and slow.

[flying free.LEVC]

Great¡ I found the answer in another post...:ok:

If you are worried about the flying here, it is safe, the maintence is fine. Most of the fatals here have happened from cowboys or poor decision making.

[Cardinal Puff]

The decision to fly overweight or into marginal conditions among them.

[NielZAR]

Thanks for the post lilflyboy262 (http://www.pprune.org/members/296525-lilflyboy262). Great info http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/thumbs.gif. Looks like there are lots of people going up, see you all there:)

[lilflyboy262]

The marginal conditions is the poor decision making.
Overweight I made a point of pointing out.

[dzs7417]

Thanks so much for the guide. I've been lurking and looking at Maun info here for a while, and this is a good summation.

I'll be there right around the turn of the new year, the only two questions I have at the moment are:

1. After getting to Maun, how much money would be needed to survive ~3 months jobless?

2. I see a lot of mentions of hopping on flights as an observer, how do I do this day-to-day?

Spose I should introduce myself, name's Fitz, 20 years old, ~300 hrs, C-SEL and MEL and Instructor- MEL. Finishing up school at Western Michigan University. Hope to see some of you down there around 2011.

[Cardinal Puff]

Nope. Marginal conditions would be IMC on the limits. Penetrating it at all or while not rated or current would be a poor decision.

[tu144]

lilflyboy how long did it take for you to get a job there?

[lilflyboy262]

2 and a half weeks. I was very very lucky though.

[Kash360]

How many pilots are looking at coming to Maun this year? Seems like the count will be 50+. Thats alot of tents at Audi mate. Can't wait to meet all the new potential at the Bon.

[darkroomsource]

I'll be getting there about the first of February.
Hopefully the permit situation is sorted by then.

Had a thought. Is there anything that people there can't get from the US that they want/need? Maybe as bribes for the on-line pilots? ;) Maybe something that the locals might pay dearly for?

I'm going in to renew my medical this month. I have not found any information about the medical requirements for Botswana or Namibia, other than you have to have one, I'm wondering if a 2nd class medical is sufficient. Can anyone answer that for me?

I'm also getting a flight review done in the next few weeks, and I was wondering how important 206 time really is. I have almost 200 of my 270 hours in Cessnas, 27 in 182s, 50 high performance, and 50 retract. The only 206 I can find within 800km is USD 300 / hour plus USD 50 for the instructor, whereas I can rent a 172 for my review for less than USD 100 and USD 40 for the instructor. (I know, I know, the number of hours is not as important as the attitude and ability, however I'm trying to get a feel for whether I should do 1.5 hours in a 206, or 5 in a 172 to "freshen" up before coming, been out of work for a while so I haven't flown in over a year)

And lastly, if anyone has a plane they want ferried from the US to southern Africa, please let me know, and if we can get insurance sorted, you could get the plane ferried for the cost of the fuel... (this is kind of a pipe-dream, since I've not flown across the pond, and combined with not flying in the past year, it'd probably be difficult to get insured for the trip, but hey, you never know)

Does anyone have any info on getting back and forth between Windhoek and Maun? It seems to me that there's a possibility that the timing is such that one should go back and forth between the two, but I'm not sure. Do you have to speak German to work at all the operators in Swakopmund and Windhoek? or just some of them?
I mean, if there are possible jobs in all three towns / cities, why not have one of us sit in each city with a phone and call the rest when the jobs open up...? or has someone already thought of this?

How many of the 30 that are there now are going to be there for another two months? How many will go home if they don't get work during that time?

I am looking forward to exploring southern Africa, as much as I can. And meeting any/all pilots who want to have a chat and maybe a drink. I'd love to hear your stories and learn whatever I can.

[Csanad007]

Kash my man!!!!! It's a pity I cannot make it to Maun for a couple of beers with you!

darkroom: there are some combis between Maun and Whoek, quite cheap (50 US for a ride). But ask for them in Maun.
There are 2 companies keen on German in Namibia (Bush Bird and Wings Over, thou WO also hires non German speakers), the others are okay with English. Also it seems that Desert Air in Whoek prefers afrikaans speaking people.

good luck

[darkroomsource]

@Csanad007
Thanks! Again!
Do you know whether a 1st class medical is required? or is a 2nd ok?

[lilflyboy262]

You will have to get a Class 1 medical done once they start to convert your licence. Doesn't matter if you have one or not with your current licence.
If you haven't flown in a year, I suggest doing a few flights before you come over. I had no time in 200 class aircraft. First time I had even sat in one was on my check ride.

[darkroomsource]

Thanks, one more time, LilFlyBoy.
I think I owe you 4 or 5 beers now.
Hopefully not all at once.

Look forward to meeting you face-to-face.

[lilflyboy262]

4 or 5 beers? sounds like a light night....

See you in maun!

[MartinCh]

DRS,
although not essential (from what I read, only), it'd be more competitive having 5 hours or so on it, I'd say.
Portland area doesn't sound 800km away from Silverton.
Just a thought. It's in their charter department (obviously not used as big C152 or C172) but I'd give them a call for quote. Easy.
The only 206 I can find within 800km is USD 300 / hour plus USD 50 for the instructor

What about Hillsboro Aviation and C206H?
(http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=d&source=s_d&saddr=Hillsboro,+OR,+USA&daddr=Silverton,+ORegon&hl=en&geocode=Fc6ftgId_VKr-Cl55bxWXwWVVDGG7TNqhv8pfQ%3BFUG5rgIdVnqu-CnH5B3Be-C_VDFJg0YuWj1l9A&mra=ls&sll=45.005121,-122.783146&sspn=0.058259,0.110378&g=Silverton,+ORegon&ie=UTF8&t=h&z=9)

[darkroomsource]

I'd sent them an email and left a phone message some time ago, since their site says it's charter only. They've finally got back to me and want USD 375 per hour for the plane. The next closest is in Everett, which is about 200 miles (320 km) as the crow flies, and it's USD 350/hr, then the next one is more than 800 km away.

I normally rent a 172 for USD 96 wet, and the instructor is 40. I was thinking about getting my flight review in the 206, however I haven't flown in over a year, so it will probably be 2 or 3 hours, plus 1 or 2 ground, or USD 800 at Hillsboro. For that much I can fly 6 hours in the 172 with an instructor and renew my IR as well, and maybe even take a fun trip somewhere.

That was why I was asking if the 206 was more important than being current. And I think the answer I got back was that it would be better for me to be comfortable flying, rather than have 1 or 2 hours in a 206. I certainly can't afford 5 hours at $375 per hour.

I have flown for many years, and have had the occasional hiatus during that time, and I know that I get back in the saddle in about 2 hours of flying. And I'd need probably 3 hours IR to be comfortable again - although I would not want to go to minimums after just that much refresher. I know that the IR isn't important in Maun, but apparently one or two of the operators in Namibia are interested in the IR.

Honestly, if I had the money to do 5 hours in the 206, I think I'd rather do a few more hours in a 310, and finish my MEL instead.

By the way,

Any one there have an update? Are there a "bunch" of pilots expected to leave in January? What about over in Windhoek? I haven't decided whether to go to Maun or Namibia first.... How about the permit situation?

[ragdragger]

I had 60 hours 206 time when I showed up in Maun and no one cared in the slightest. I ended up with a job but it had nothing to do with my 206 experience. Don't waste your money.

[MartinCh]

DRS, then that's no-brainer. I didn't catch you stating you're not current. Easy choice then. I may do bit of 206 flying in Washington State or elsewhere in the US, but if, it'd be for float rating, next summer or in 2012. Two birds with one stone. 206 time, SES rating and possibly, later on MES, but that's bit hefty, at 450-500 bucks an hour dual.

All the best with job search. If you somehow don't get a gig, I'll get you a beer or two sometime next summer. I'll be mostly in McMinnville, doing some fixed and heli flying, so long the plans don't change. Or a ride in Robinson 22. I'd be interested to talk about your experiences etc.

EDIT: Guys here mentioned Wings Over Africa. They've got handful of Cessna Twins. I guess if it's them preferring IR jocks due to insurance/added bonus skills.

[captainsuperstorm]

Very often you will be flying overweight. Very often you will be flying with your C of G well out of limits. And you will learn how to deal with it.

and you are proud of this????

aviation in africa, bunch of criminals ,yes.!
I can not believe that some professional pilots with CAA license, go down there to break rules. I would like you send me names of guys who fly overweighted, and outside limits, so we can take their license away!

How desperate are you? this is pathetic!:yuk:

[Exascot]

Captain SS. I agree totally. I cringed when I read this. Unfortunately as a passenger I once experienced this. It was a marginal T/O on a long runway. Did I report it to the company or the authorities? No. Why? I am still not quite sure. Anyway that pilot is no longer with the company. So, until the next time…

[lilflyboy262]

Captain Superstorm
At no point did I say I was proud of this. And if you weren't so trigger fingered you would see that I have already had this arguement.
It is a unique situation here where you don't have the facilities to weigh and measure every person that sits on your aircraft. You have 6 different types of aircraft operating over 7 different companies, out into the bush.

The first time you meet the passengers is at the plane door, and I would love for you to do a weight and balance at each stop and be able to move the amount of people around each day that you get tasked with, while staying within daylight and duty hours.

You only get a generic weight of passengers and a generic weight for baggage.

Im not going to start dragging this thread down into a arguement as I have taken a lot of time to get this information online and don't want it going to waste from a holy than thou person.

[luangwablondes]

So which Maun charter airline is the safest to fly with?

[Boomerang1]

I too experienced as a passenger an overweight TO out a small dirt strip in the Delta area. It was a 206 fully loaded with 6 passengers and lots of baggage in the belly compartment. The aircraft was unable to get airborne without the stall warning going off intermittently. What really bothered me was that the stall warning continued to sound during the initial climb. I noticed that the oil temp and cyl. head temps were at redline for the entire climb. The outside temp on TO was 40C.

I felt really stupid not asking the pilot to show me the weight and balance calculation prior to getting on the aircraft. This is not the way to fly a charter aircraft. The operators must just love getting inexperienced pilots so that they will continue to operate in a stupid unprofessional manner.

When I confronted the pilot after landing about the high engine temps, his response was that the engine was fresh out of overhaul and running hot was normal for this engine.

I also reported this to the tour operator and they said that the pilot should have left the baggage behind.

As a experienced pilot I will never again be a passive passenger on a light aircraft.

[cavortingcheetah]

Some very general and rough figures for a C206? No take off graphs or anything sophisticated.

AEW = 987 kgs.
MTOW. =1,632 kgs.
Available = 645kgs.

6 x pax (5+1)@ 70kgs = 420kgs.
6x bags @ 10kgs=60kgs.
Total pax and baggage.= 480kgs.

Available for fuel = 165kgs@ 0.72 kg/litre = +/-60 US gallons?

70kgs for a pax and only 10kgs for bags? Of course it's too low but a nominal weight value is just that.

Stall warning? Function of TAS and thus temperature and air density.
So long as aircraft flown at POH recommended IAS there should be no prejudice.
EGT high? To be expected on engine after overhaul because Mixture should be enrichened to slightly over rich for first 50 or so flights.

Mathematics is not a strong point and it's obvious I know nothing about 206s but I'm sure that some of the swamp rats up in the delta do.

(lilflyboy262..this is your essential guide so I'm more than happy to delete this if you'd like.)

[Boomerang1]

An aircraft only stalls when the wings critical angle of attack is exceeded. This has nothing to do with TAS. If you fly an aircraft that is overgross weight then the angle of attach must be increased to produce enough lift to get that extra weight off the ground. This works up until you reach the critical angle of attack.

To climb with that extra weight the pilot had to use a slower airspeed than normal climb speed. This is what is causing the engine to overheat.

Your right about all the standard numbers you stated as being incorrect.

[lilflyboy262]

Don't forget to add that the wing and tailplane is usually contaminated with mud from the strips during the summer season with higher than 40c OAT.

Hence why my company now only flies with 4 pax instead of 5.

With all this jumping up and down though, I ask you one question. When was the last accident here that was caused by being overweight?
As far as I can recall. All the accidents have been from general mechanical failure that you will find in GA all around the world with the exception of a few pilot errors.

[ragdragger]

Moremi crashed a 206 2 years or so ago. If I remember right the pilot said he got caught in a downdraft after an aborted landing at either Delta or Ntswe due to a nearby thunderstorm. He was carrying 5 pax and baggage plus an infant on a lap which probably made fighting that downdraft a lot more difficult.

[cavortingcheetah]

In 2008 near Ntsu with a New Zealand pilot at the controls. Apparently he was flying past Ntsu on a diversion when he was caught in a microburst.
In May 2001 a Moremi 206 crashed near Maun killing three New Zealanders and the South African pilot. That was the first fatal accident in the Delta for about six years.

Here's a little information from the manufacturer about the Stationair or C206 just in case anyone has forgotten how essential it is to keep a sort of mark one eyeball on the weights. It's astonishing really that the 206 is still in production. Cessna's typical 206 with Garmin kit, costs =$533,400 and a Stateside cost per hour to run a new machine of $162

Ramp Weight 3,614 lb (1,639 kg)
Takeoff Weight 3,600 lb (1,633 kg)
Landing Weight 3,600 lb (1,633 kg)
Zero Fuel Weight N/A lb (N/A kg) N/A lb (N/A kg)
Usable Fuel Capacity 522 lb (237 kg)
Typically-Equipped Empty Weight 2,241 lb (1,017 kg)
Useful Load 1,373 lb (623 kg)
Maximum Payload 1,359 lb (616 kg)
Full-Fuel Payload 851 lb (386 kg)

There's also a Turbo Stationair.

[nyathi]

Interesting reading, but allow me to make on or two comments/statemants!

Yes, ALL the companies in Maun work on a generic W&B program and weights stipulated in our SOP and OPS Manuals.

BUT, it is still up to the pilot in command to make that judgement call to say, yes this is ALL GOOD or No you cant make this flight with these weight. Certainly in our company you are NEVER allowed to fly overweight! You do so, its at your own risk, should something go wrong, well, then face the music!

But, I'm not saying that over weight flying doesnt happen over here! Some companies turn a blind eye :eek:! Is it right.......HELL NO! :mad: :=

So, doesnt matter when you first see your pax and their ten tonnes of luggage, its your responsibility to make the right judgement call whether you can or cant fly with that weight!

[ragdragger]

The excuses about flying overweight in Maun always sound lame to me, and the problem isn't picking up a few overweight passengers or oversized bags, it is trying to squeeze 5 pax and their bags in a C206. If you see a 206 leave Maun with 5 pax and luggage it is almost certainly overweight. It has been long enough now that I dont remember the exact numbers but I knew how many standard pax and bags I could carry with a given fuel load and be legal. Even four pax is well over in some of the 206s i you have a lot of legs and are carrying a sensible reserve of fuel. At least when I was there all of the companies, even the ones that restricted 206s to 4 pax, knowingly dispatched aircraft that were grossly overweight. At least part of the reason young pilots with fresh comms are considered most desirable in Botswana is that the companies know that pilots working their first job are easiest to intimidate into flying aircraft loaded past their legal limits. To my knowledge no one has ever been fired in Maun for refusing to fly heavy, so I dont really understand why people still insist on doing it.

[lilflyboy262]

I believe the 2001 was a wingover at low level on a scenic flight.
The 2008 was a microburst on landing. Was low and slow. Everyone survived. Only a broken back or two.

[FaFa]

Dear lilflyboy262

Thank you very much for your golden points.
I got my CPL/IR (Frozen ATP) from SACAA about 4 months ago and now i'm living in Iran but i don't have any motivation to stay here and look for job here so i decided to looking for a job in Africa and started with Tanzania because friend of mine was working there as a chief pilot but he left a company and backed to Iran and told me there is no chance to find a job in Tanzania anymore.

I wanna travel and visit manu but i think there is risk to spending a lots of money there then couldn't find a job.

But i'll hit the road and come there.if anyone gonna to go there in next 3 weeks please inbox me.

Regards

[EladElap]

now i'm living in Iran but i don't have any motivation to stay here and look for job

Maun is definitely not for you then boet. You need to be tenacious, relentless, and highly motivated to score one of only a few jobs that may come up in Maun.

[FaFa]

I lived in SA around 2 years and i know i can adopt myself with Manu or other african countries situations.In Iran,just we can start and fly as a first officer in our airlines,there is no any general aviation and etc.As you know,getting into a airline is not easy and we have to find some contact people.I like to fly with light aeroplanes and bush flying to fly thorugh the jungles,dessert.:ok:

[Exascot]

fly thorugh the jungles,dessert

I must say that this kind of flying sounds like a pretty sticky sort of operation:rolleyes:

[darkroomsource]

Thank you very much for your golden points.
I got my CPL/IR (Frozen ATP) from SACAA about 4 months ago and now i'm living in Iran but i don't have any motivation to stay here and look for job here so i decided to looking for a job in Africa and started with Tanzania because friend of mine was working there as a chief pilot but he left a company and backed to Iran and told me there is no chance to find a job in Tanzania anymore.

I wanna travel and visit manu but i think there is risk to spending a lots of money there then couldn't find a job.

But i'll hit the road and come there.if anyone gonna to go there in next 3 weeks please inbox me.

Regards
I hear the best opportunities are in Iran right now.

[Csanad007]

Well, there's a new low timer paradise called Manu? Go for 'em boys!

[Harilal]

I second that and FaFa would be kind enough to give us more details of manu:sad:. I also would suggest FaFa to try searching for jobs in Jordan, i saw a report in BBC saying that there is going to be a huge requirement in jordan, I have some Malaysian friends studying at the ayla academy h t t p://w w w.aylaaviation.com/. may be you will find something in jordan.... good luck

[cavortingcheetah]

The thread seems to have slowed down a little which is a shame.
Wonder if the same can be said for the tourist trade?
Just saw a quote for a six night trip for two in Namibia. Excluding international air fares the price was SAR 85,000. That's quite a lot of €s! Expect the prices are not much different in the delta as Thompson's Holidays offer two nights ex JNB at Stanley's, Baines' or Chief's at around SAR 22,000 or around about €1,200 a night. So is business booming up there? There surely aren't too many repeats?

[avio_atul02]

Hi mates, i am planning for some bush pilot job hunt in maun,botswana this coming may 2011 and as i also searched many threads:ugh: regarding this matter and found there are around 14-15 guys already hired:ok: by the operators this season up there.so i m curious:confused: to know how about going there in may season with below stated resume:O

total time= 300 hrs
intrument time=44 hrs
multi engine time=38 hrs
recently i got rated on cessna caravan 208 and cessna 206 from panam academy,USA
Other rating=C-152,172 and multi BE-55
i really appreciate if smbdy will help me regarding this:)

[Propellerpilot]

Go there yourself and find out. The only useful rating you have is the C206, you might be lucky to get onto the C208 after completing 1,5-2 years service.

[lilflyboy262]

Avio. Read the thread.

Prop~ I'm on the van after 10 months.

[avio_badal]

hmm seems interesting, why dont you endorse more ratings on your license ?? like islander, c152, piper navajo etc. so that once you go "you are through" !!!

[cavortingcheetah]

Don't confuse the poor chap. The only people flying C152s and BNIIs are probably the BDF. As for the Navajo, well I used to have a sister in law who was one - honest Injun Mr Moderator - so I feel reasonably qualified to say that they are not particularly useful things on which to be overly familiar these days.

[avio_atul02]

@proppilot-yeah mate i will be heading to maun this season to try my luck if i can be that lucky to find out job with 1 of the operators with my cessna 206 rating in my pocket.:O
Also just curious to know about those guys sitting there since 6-8 months in search of being hired and waiting for the good time to come i mean whats the problem with them aren't they rated on 206 or they are lacking in somewhat with flying hours or some other reason?:confused:

@Lilflyboy-what about the operators can't they recruit u directly for having an advantage of being rated on van.i mean indirectly after and year or so company will spend money on u for providing rating on van but in othercase if they have a choice to select readymade van pilot will operators not prefer of hiring him?or you mean to say they are seeking van pilots with 1000 hrs xperience?

[cavortingcheetah]

(you mean to say they are seeking van pilots with 1000 hrs xperience?)

Dear heavens above, Jesus wept and Hail Mary Mother or Grace - one would certainly hope so!
Still, an aeroplane is a flying machine for all that and one man in a 206 is just as potentially lethal as another in a 208. Suppose it must all depend upon attitude and experience? Unknown quantities with no time at all to write home about suddenly roaring around the skies in a multi million PT6 driven ego machines might give even the looniest Maun operator pause for reflection. Some flyers up in the swamps seem quite adept at crashing and crunching even the simplest of flying machines. Sure, the conditions can be challenging for the newly initiated aviator so why burden him or his opinionations with something as complex to fly as a single engined aircraft that can go from splashdown to crashdown faster than a reticulated giraffe can pickpocket Selous' baccy pouch. After all, there is a CAA lurking around up there somewhere and there could be an insurance company with a flight time minimum requirement and there might be a passenger or two who knows full well that a piffly wiffly van rating doesn't make a van pilot. Isn't what they really need in Maun a decent Italian ice cream shop staffed by a couple of topless girls of melting morality having about them perhaps even a little something of the Neapolitan flavor?

[lilflyboy262]

Basically what CC said haha. Although I would just settle for a McDonalds and KFC.
Would be hard to get work permits as topless waitresses due to there being a large amount of local women that could do this work.

You need 1000hrs total time to begin flying on the van for most operators as a insurance requirement.
Sure it looks good on your CV but when you haven't touched a van in over a year, chances are you will need to do some refresher training and you need to do a C of T on a turbine aircraft every 6 months anyhow!
So chances are they will spend the same amount of money on either person.
And there is a hell of a difference between landing a van in the bush and landing it on a 2000m tar runway.

Atul02~ You need to do a flight test in each aircraft every 12 months, and a test in a piston, turbine, and multi every 6 months to keep your validation valid. There are no 152's in town, only a few 172's. BN2B are only operatered by 2 companies (even then it is only 1 each) or the BDF (Botswana defence force).
They are the only twins in town, everything else is single time so multi ratings count for jack.

[Ankit Kotecha]

wow.
nice work lilflyboy.

so no use hitting that continent this year, as the season passed already.
need to wait until the next season begin, i.e. by the year end.

[ragdragger]

And there is a hell of a difference between landing a van in the bush and landing it on a 2000m tar runway.

Really? Maybe on some bush strips, but the ones in the Okavango are all around 1000m by now aren't they? Anyone half competent should be able to bring a full caravan to a stop within 600m or so without really trying too hard, just watch out for elephants. In Botswana you are definitely flying in the bush, but I don't really think any of the strips there require much in the way of "bush flying" skills to get into or out of.

[darkroomsource]

and, of course, jumping or lifting the wing to clear puddles, but that's something we all do on a nice flat asphault strip, right? Keep the power on to clear be able to "fly" over the puddle?

[lilflyboy262]

I truely hope your taking the piss ragdragger?


@Darkroom, actually keeping the power on is the best way to go through the puddles, its on landing where you have issues, not the take off....

[ragdragger]

I only worked one year in Maun, so maybe I missed something, but I didn't think the flying was all that tough and I'm certainly no master bush pilot. It is a hard job, fast turn arounds, hot weather, long hours etc. But most of those strips are plenty long, the Mopane trees are nice and short, and there is no terrain for as far as the eye can see in any direction. Bush Flying Lite. It's not like people are hanging on the prop, crossing the fence at 65 in the van hoping to nail the threshold, you aren't landing on gravel bars or glaciers, just dirt runways. Fact is if a 250 hr pilot can master flying in bots after 50 hrs of poor quality instruction to the point where he is trusted to fly paying passengers it can't really be all that bad.
It is the most fun I've ever had in airplanes, I dig all the low level flying, and the 5 minute legs and the wildlife and I highly recommend the experience. It's a great first job. But don't try to big it up into something it's not.

[cavortingcheetah]

Hardly worth the salary by all accounts then?

[billyballo]

hello i'am planning to go in Maun to find a job around October November, anybody know the situation there?, i heard some time ago that the Botswana governament was not more able to issue the work permit for foreigners pilot!!! is this true?? i hope not
anyway, anybody is planning to go there in November

[Ankit Kotecha]

Yes I think the Namibian govt. just announced that they wont be issuing work permits to under 2000TT pilots. But no idea about Botswana.

I am thinking to go to Botswana. I have real low time. In fact I was thinking to go in March. But then I came to know that the hiring season passed by.

I am thinking to go there around sept. if there are any chances of any kind of flying job now, I am even ready to hit that continent now.

Botswana and such other countries in africa are the only places where low time pilots like me can get a flying job. so thats my only option

[darkroomsource]

I wasn't trying to say that it is bush flying by any means, but what I was saying is that it is not landing on a flat paved surface.

I know pilots in the US who have never landed on grass or gravel.
I've seen many who have only ever landed no-flaps or power off for their check-ride - who rely on the machinery - and would be in deep trouble if they were in situations I've heard from some of my friends here.

Example, a guy's been grounded for 6 months because no visa, gets his visa, 3 circuits to be "qualified", carries 5 pax to a sand / gravel strip, complete electrical failure, 25 knot 90 degree cross wind, large puddle (it's all flooding here right now), the strip is about 10 m wide (30 feet) with soft sand on either side. Sure it's long, and it's not landing on a sand bar in a river, but it's certainly not landing at Van Nuys on 16R.

Another example, a guy picks up a plane after an engine rebuild, 5500 foot elevation, surrounded by mountains, that day it's 11,500 density altitude. Engine failure at about 1000 AGL. Sure it can happen anywhere, and this runway was paved, but there are only a few places where you get 10K density altitude every day.

And third, the runway in Swakopmund is paved. But it's full of potholes, so you can't use it, period. But planes fly in and out all the time (C210's), not on the runway, but on the soft sand along side (Swakop is surrounded by sand dunes - think Sahara Dessert)

Can a young pilot (in hours, not necessarily years) handle it? Of course, or it would not have been done this way for the past 30 years. We all get this kind of training, but very few pilots normally handle this.

Is it bush flying? No.

Is it harder than "normal" flying? Maybe. But it does require skills that are not utilized by the "normal" pilot on a regular basis.

[Exascot]

Having just come back from 3 weeks in the bush there you guys need to start to think about getting floatplane ratings :hmm:

[lilflyboy262]

I would love to get floats. In fact a lot of the planes here are ex float planes.
But I would need to have someone hang off the floats mid flight to wash them before I can touch down in the next river due to government regs.
Im quite sure that would affect my planes performance :{

[Exascot]

Actually my comment was light hearted given the number of strips flooded at the moment, and the situation is not going to get any better for a number of years. However, seriously then, is this an option? If you are serious about the government regs how about fitting the floats and having a jury rigged spray system to disinfect them between areas? Only an idea. With companies having to uses land, water or rotary options for transporting guests at the moment at some camps this is hitting their bottom line. Prices will go up next year and all stakeholders will be affected. A air charter company that can offer an alternative option will have a significant competitive advantage in the market even given the lower payload for floatplanes.

[ragdragger]

Another example, a guy picks up a plane after an engine rebuild, 5500 foot elevation, surrounded by mountains, that day it's 11,500 density altitude. Engine failure at about 1000 AGL. Sure it can happen anywhere, and this runway was paved, but there are only a few places where you get 10K density altitude every day.

That is a very impressive story, especially when you consider that in order to have 11,500 ft density altitude at a 5,500 ft elevation runway the outside temperature needs to be in the neighborhood of 60 deg C. Must have been uncomfortable! I'm not sure how many places get 10K ft density altitude every day but I reckon not many of them are at 5,500 ft as it would require the temps to be consistently in the mid 40s C. So I can't imagine where where this heroic pilot is doing his flying, but I'm glad I'm not him.

[lilflyboy262]

I am being serious about the regulations, but unfortunately something like what you have suggested will take years to come into effect due to red tape and having to trial them. These huge floods that have come in the past few years havent been seen since the 1950's so noone was really prepared for them.
The other issues are the depth of the water, most of which is not very deep at all, but enough to cause the runways to close.
The large angry creatures called hippos that would not even hesitate to try and turn over a 206 or 172 on floats.
Also the passengers that are flown are not all fit and agile, in fact, a good 25% would be either overweight, old or just plain not agile enough to be able to navigate a transfer onto a boat. It is very difficult to build and maintain the wharfs big enough that will be need to reach out to the lagoons.
You idea is a very logical one, and that is something that is frowned upon this side of the world. The more illogical, the better!
The easiest solution at the moment is to build new runways on islands that will not flood and boat the passengers across to their camps.

Ragdragger, You have forgotten the high pressures, high humidities and high temps (I've flown in 49C) that are experienced here. While I haven't had a density alt as high as 11'500, I have had one at 9'300 out of Maun. An overloaded 206 out of there chewed up a lot of runway!

The runways here range from 600m to 1000m so I am presuming that your experience here is with Sefofane? All of their runways are 1000m and usually in good conditions with good approaches.

In the wet, the calcrete at a few of the runways becomes very very slick. Its not unusual to see aircraft coming into the parking bay sideways, even at very slow speeds, or watching the pilots and passengers slipping over as they try to walk around! Its almost the same as landing on ice!

I can name a large number of examples that can show that its not as easy as you are making it out to be. But at the same time, I do agree with you that it is not the extreme end of things, such as what you will find in some strips like in Papua New Guinea. I wouldn't go as far as saying bush flying lite, but a different variation in the types that you can come across. This sort of work is perfect for setting you up with contract charter operators.

You can teach a lot of things to a pilot after 50hrs. You can teach a pilot to become a instructor, a night rating, a aerobatics rating, multi rating and a IFR rating all in that time.
You can even gain a private pilots licence in that time.
50hrs of flying in the delta is very intensive and you can expect to make up to 100-120 landings. Which is more than enough to be shown the in's and out's of bush flying and the techniques that you will be more than likely to come across.
As for the instruction that you recieved in flying here, well.... that varies from company to company. I can say that mine was pretty top notch and from guys who have been in the industry for a long time, and have 5 figures in the logbook.

But back to the original comment. Yes. A van is much harder to land here than at a 2000m tar runway.
Weights, Runway contamination and conditions, Weather, Size and length of runways, Animals and Birds are all things that most pilots would never have encountered before.
Some of the guys I have met here have never landed on a nice prepared grass runway before, let alone a grass bush runway.

[ragdragger]

Yes I did fly with Sefo and I agree, their strips are bit nicer. But I also landed at many of the other strips out there. Are there really still 600m meter strips? I only remember one when I was there, and I had thought it was extended. Are you flying vans into 600 m strips? And I certainly have not forgotten about the heat or the mud. I know how fun saturated calcrete can be, it is the rainy season here and I have to land caravans on the stuff regularly.

It's just going to come down to difference of opinion. I started in Maun as a relatively experienced pilot with a fair amount of C206 time, and I didn't find the transition particularly difficult. To me getting accustomed to rough or muddy runway surfaces is more about common sense and good aircraft control than any kind of special technique The hard part for me was learning to find my way around that featureless swamp with the GPS off, and understanding what the f$%# those controllers were saying. I think what makes difficult bush strips difficult is the environment around them. Obstacles, terrain and weather, usually all at the same time, and there just wasn't any of that in Bots.

As far as landing at bush strips in Bots being more difficult than on paved strips I'm sure thats true if you are talking about day VFR flying. But most van pilots where I'm from are flying freight which means plenty of single pilot, night IFR, frequently in bad weather and icing conditions. So touching down on the tarmac might be easy but the circling approach at night and at minimums in order to get to that tarmac to me seems a lot more challenging than dodging puddles on a dirt runway. Anyone who is good at that type of flying wouldn't struggle too much in Maun I don't think, but I'm not sure that the opposite is true.

Density Altitude...
What are you guys smoking when you come up with these crazy density altitude figures? You have never experienced 9,300 ft density altitude in botswana because until global warming gets a lot worse it is physically impossible. The 49C day you mentioned would have meant the density altitude was around 7,500 ft on the ground in Maun. In order to get a 9,300 DA at a 3,100 ft ele. runway and standard pressure the temperature needs to be almost 70C with and thats not going to happen. The rule of thumb is that DA increases around 120 ft for every degree C over standard so 10 degrees warmer than standard temp means an increase in DA of approximately 1200 ft. Probably a bit less in bots because as you mentioned there is usually high pressure which reduces DA.

[lilflyboy262]

Density altitude is Pressure altitude adjusted for temperature.

I know I had a density altitude of 9'300ft as when I loaded the QNH and the temperature into the GPS, it spits out the Density Alt.

That also doesnt include the humidity in the figure as for the most part, the difference it makes is negligible.

[ragdragger]

In order to get that density altitude at 3100' and 49C the QNH would have to be about 0950. So either you happened to be in the eye of a hurricane when you made that measurement, or your GPS was wrong, or you interpreted it incorrectly. At a QNH of 1013 and a dew point of 15 the temperature needed to get 9,300 feet is 66C, equally unlikely. I'm not making this up just to be a dick, you can plug the numbers into an E6B or you can use one of the many online density altitude calculators and you will come up with the same results.

[cavortingcheetah]

But you shouldn't have loaded in the QNH? You need to use pressure altitude not pressure height for a density altitude calculation? Set 1013.25/29.92 on altimeter subscale, read pressure altitude corrected to standard pressure, enter that figure and the temperature into the computer. Anyway, the old whizz wheel, Jeppesen CSG-8A-which needed to be oiled it's that old, tells that for a density altitude of 9,300ft, you'd need a pressure altitude of 5,500ft and a temperature of +49c.(As near as metal whizz wheels can get)
Anyway again, it matters not too much. Isn't the challenge involved in flying out of Maun exactly what it always was? Survival in the face of disregard for every thought and intention behind a POH, sacrificed on the altar of the certain knowledge that if you don't take the risks someone else will be prepared to endanger life and limb in the service of employment?
eg: (An overloaded 206 out of there chewed up a lot of runway.)
(In the wet the calcrete becomes very slick.)
Slick would logically be the same as ice in terms of runway performance take off and landing graphs and limitations? How much runway does a fully loaded Caravan need on an icy surface at 3,000ft pa on a warm Maun day of +40c which gives a density altitude of about 6,500ft.
Glad to see it's just as dangerous, as argumentative and as fun as it always was.

[ragdragger]

But you shouldn't have loaded in the QNH? You need to use pressure altitude not pressure height for a density altitude calculation?

I have no idea what you mean by pressure height. There are a few ways to figure out pressure alt. If you are in the airplane you just set 1013 in the kohlsman and read PA on the altimeter. If you aren't in the airplane you can figure it out if you know the true altitude MSL, and the QNH. If the QNH is lower than 1013 your pressure alt will be higher than your true altitude and vice versa. So it is true that you need a pressure altitude of 5,500 at 49C in order to get 9,300 density altitude, but if you are sitting in an airplane at a 3,100 ft MSL runway and your altimeter reads 5,500 ft. with a setting of 1013 the current QNH would have to be about 0960.

[cavortingcheetah]

A trifle tricky sometimes then if you're using QFE?

Simplicity itself from Australia the land that gave you CS Hames and what are probably still the finest one volume technical manuals to the PPL and the CPL.

This is from Balloon at Brisbane.

https://www.brisbanehotairballooning.com.au/faqs/exam-help/133-pressure-density-height.html

No more on altimeters though. It's far too much of a wind up and probably totally irrelevant, or at the least ignored, in swamp flying.

[ragdragger]

Not too tricky.
According to that site it's the same sh*t different words.
pressure altitude = pressure height
density altitude = density height
all referenced to the international standard atmosphere 1013 hP or 29.92 hg
you say qfe we say field elevation
the math is the same

[darkroomsource]

That is a very impressive story, especially when you consider that in order to have 11,500 ft density altitude at a 5,500 ft elevation runway the outside temperature needs to be in the neighborhood of 60 deg C. Must have been uncomfortable! I'm not sure how many places get 10K ft density altitude every day but I reckon not many of them are at 5,500 ft as it would require the temps to be consistently in the mid 40s C. So I can't imagine where where this heroic pilot is doing his flying, but I'm glad I'm not him.
OOPS. 9,500 not 11,500. My bad.
And WHK has had a few 40's recently.

[cavortingcheetah]

(you say qfe we say field elevation)
You might get killed that way. QFE is the subscale setting that will ensure that your altimeter reads 0 at the appointed reference point. It is by no means the same as QNH. QFE does not work so well at high elevation airports or even medium elevation airfields such as HTKJ. It was beloved of the British air force and certain British airlines. It contributed a small extra cockpit workload especially in a go around situation, beloved of examiners when the candidate forgot to set QNH from QFE on the missed approach. That was an auto fail as far as the UK CAA were concerned.

[Exascot]

Out of interest, is there internet at the camp? Ridiculous question but oh well..

There is WIFI at Old Bridge Backpackers not sure about Audi but I would guess so. There is also WIFI at the airport. The whole system is extremely slow and often down.

[kfrae]

Hi all, I'm just wondering if there are many female pilots in Namibia or Botswana? Im from Australia and looking for a low time job for the next season and still need to do some research, but would like to know if there are many female pilots around?

[Exascot]

I'm just wondering if there are many female pilots in Namibia or Botswana?

Here's one: Our Pilots (http://www.mackair.co.bw/pages_crew/esitile.htm)

I'm sure there are more.

[lilflyboy262]

In Maun there is 5, with one more to be hired soon.
2 have just recently left, one quit after getting fed up with being posted in Zambia, the other had to be let go after a problem with work permits.

Basically every girl that has turned up since I have been here has been hired with the exception of 1.

[Csanad007]

I see more and more here in Nam as well. Actually it seems that if a girl shows up then she's got almost 100% chance to get hired.

[EladElap]

Yes... more and more when the girl is a nam citizen and a great pilot to boot... get over yourself mate...

[Csanad007]

nice one EE! kfrae is presumabely a lady and my answer just wanted to encourage her.

[kfrae]

Thanks for the replies! I might just be making my way over there at the end of the year. and yes I am indeed a female.

[scalci]

I would love to fly in Bots... I am an CPL at Lanseria, and just cant find work at all :( very sad in South Africa...

[lilflyboy262]

Updated the fleet numbers.

[ernguru]

I'm going to be busing it from Joburg to Gabs soon en-route to Maun. Only problem is the bus arrives in Gaborone in the evening then I have to wait until the next day to carry on the journey. Does anyone know of a cheap place to stay in Gaborone for the night
Thanks

[luangwablondes]

Why not take the Mahube Express (http://www.maunselfdrive4x4.com/miscellaneous.htm).

[avio_atul02]

So,when you guys heading to maun for coming hiring season?:O

[ctgullwing]

Think i'm heading there in September if i don't find work by then.

[avio_atul02]

Yeah mate will be hdg there in nxt 3-4 months will try my luck out there:ok:

[Sandy pilot]

Hi Atul,
Even I am planning to go in a couple of months.
I too stay in Delhi would you like to go along?
PM me.

[lilflyboy262]

Fleet updated

[Exascot]

Expand please Lilfly :confused:

[lilflyboy262]

I just updated the aircraft fleet numbers in Maun

[Sandy pilot]

Where is the updated list??

[Larscho]

On the first original post

[Vuka Nkuzi]

Hand me my assegai!
The one with this at the end of it.
Last edited by lilflyboy262; 1st Aug 2011 at 13:31.

[bump]

From what I have read so far on this post is just irritating. You guys should spend more time in the pubs and enjoy your flying like we all used to do years ago. Half the sh$t you guys are talking about is pointless and not to mention very boring. Get out there in the Delta and have some fun. QFE QNH - who cares!!!

[Vuka Nkuzi]

QNH. QFE (?)
I agree! Just slap it in to a mountain.

[Wings23]

What Mountain?

[lilflyboy262]

Theres that one small one by Savuti!!!

[bump]

Absolutely right wings23. There is nothing to hit bar a camp HF aerial. Sounds like our Pal Vuka might be polishing more than his airplane!!! I hope it wasn't him they were referring to in the Ngami Tmes as the last of the great donkey tapper!! How's Delta Air getting on? Great company!!

[Pinante]

Last year I finaly acomplish the dream of becoming a pilot. I’ve a CPL (ATPL frozen) SEP and MEP with IR and a little more than 220TT.

I always wanted to fly in Africa and I’ve been following up diferent sites/blogs about Maun. I was planing on going there in January 2012 to try to get a job, but I read that nowadays it’s difficult for a non national of Botswana, with low hours, to get a job there. I’m not a rich guy so I had to get some loans to finish my training. To go there I'll have to quit my job. It's going to be an adventure and a huge economical effort.

Please give me your opinion, should I go there in January?

Thank you for your time.

[Richar]

I've heard of Maun being described as a "drinking town with a safari problem." Are there sporting facilities in town? Cricket, tennis, rugby, squash or even road running clubs?

[Pinante]

I found this in my research about Maun "http://www.mysc.gov.bw/dsr/index.php/sports-facilities". I'll go to Maun in January to try my luck. Portuguese speaking pilots have any advantage there?

[lilflyboy262]

Its been in the guiness book of world records for highest booze consumption per capita..... twice.

There is action cricket (indoor cricket played outdoors on a tennis court) once a week for a few months down at the local sports club. There is a squash court there as well.
They used to have a cricket field but thats under water now.
Rugby? Its a bit hard to play it on sand but there is a set of sticks down at the local high school. Pleanty of soccer goals around as well.
Theres a gym with a few classes run each day which is pretty popular.

Most of the guys are happy to do sport or exercise if someone can be bothered to organise it.

[Richar]

Thanks for the info!

[Redsteel]

Bump - We doing just fine ;)

Lilflyboy, im going to put a touch team together soon, let me know if your keen to join us.

[cavortingcheetah]

Seven a side onanastics is pretty popular in the winter months. During the summer there is quite an active pistol shooting group. Usually meets before brunch on Sundays. Drive out to the NNE on the Lekawane Drift road until you come to the second or third pull over place on the left hand side. There's a large tree there which gives some decent shade. You can park underneath and walk five paces or so due north. There's a large leafed plant there with a yellow ribbon around it. If you relieve yourself on it, scoring a direct hit, a rare act of marksmanship given the alcohol consumption and the heat waves, it'll grow for you. It's really thrilling to watch. Then you can drive back to town.

[brisdude]

Good man!

You have made the first step by intending to go, here is the big step, do it.:cool:

It has been a long time since I was involved there but my advice would be forget Jan and go before xmas, set up camp (save money - to live there for three months is cheaper then going a few weeks with savings in Euro/North America/Aus/NZ etc) though make sure you budget yourself, make yourself known to those that matter and go for it, just be nice and approachable without being annoying, counts for anyones first job regardless of where they are.

Others here are more up to speed though (take what I say honestly with a grain of salt, what worked a while ago is different to now).

You said your older so if anything sell yourself better than others, despite what people may think charter operators know what pilots look for in them just as much as what they look for in pilots.

Remember bad names spread so be good but otherwise have fun and go for it.

If you will actually take the step - go for it!

It's one thing to be interested and another to do it, I'm keen to help out on this threat but the best move you can make is to do it.

BD.

PS dont ever tell anyone your PPRUNE name nor mention it. Just advice :ok:

[BPTVUK]

RDF Television are making a documentary series about pilots flying in Africa. We will be mainly based in Botswana. We know that each year a handful of pilots head out to Botswana hoping to get a job, we’re trying to track down anyone who is planning on heading to Botswana this year, or is thinking about it.

We’re going to be filming in Maun, mainly, from October 2011 until probably March 2012. We want to find anyone who is in the uk now, who is planning to go out there.

If this is you or if you know someone who is doing this, please contact message/call me from the details below or message me your contact details.

Kind regards,

Bush Pilot Team
[email protected]
0117 970 7697

[Pinante]

Thanks for the tips

[Exascot]

Some advice please. When we get to Maun in Novemeber we need to buy a motor. Our house is 6km off road so advice is a Rav4 and to buy it in Gabs as it hopefully will not have been flogged around off road as most of the ones in Maun have. Also better choice.

The question: Any advantage in arriving with hard cash (GBP/Euro) and doing a cash deal in these currencies? I know that in many African countries this is the best way but I have never bought anything substantial in Bots.

Many thanks, will buy a beer in Nov for the most sensible answer :ok:

[cavortingcheetah]

Without doubt a Toyota. If the Rav gives you the range you want for its tank capacity and fits all other aspects then it is a good choice. As for the means of payment I cannot comment specifically locally but if you want or need a warranty, either manufacturer or extended, you'll probably need to go through the main dealer. Make sure you don't buy a second hand vehicle that's been imported from the SA coast. That used to be a means of laundering cars with rust problems. Your biggest danger of traveling with cash is that you'll get killed for it and that would be more likely to happen in transit perhaps through JNB or indeed as soon as anyone knows you'll come back tomorrow with the cash. For that timely warning I claim a crate of long life alcohol free beer please.

[Exascot]

CC, many thanks especially for the SA tip. Well aware of the security aspect. I have had to carry considerable sums of cash around Africa before and probably been lucky! Yes and thanks also for the 'back tomorrow with the cash' tip. I am going to have to get myself into a completely different mind set when we live there. We will be there for 6 months during which time the key to our house here will be in the bowl by the door and the car open with the keys in the ignition. :ok:

[cavortingcheetah]

I know a man at the traffic light at Hyde Park Jnb, who'll get me an AK 47 and a thousand rounds for $300. I enjoyed Gaberone and the locals are fine. It's the ex pats you've got to watch out for. They all drink too much, drive and the women fancy themselves as bush types.

[Exascot]

women fancy themselves as bush types

What Kate Bush? Golly that ages me :{

[cavortingcheetah]

Would it make you feel any better if I said that I went to Southern Meths in Dallas and graduated with Laura?

[josemarb]

Hello guys, I'm thinking in going down to Maun at the end of January.
Can I ask you for a couple of stupid question?

How much you paid for the return tickets from Europe to Johannesburgh?
Wich airlines are the cheapest?

And also, do I need the english proficiency level on my licence?

The cheapest I've found is Ethiopian Airlines from Milano but I can't book the tickets yet for the dates I want.

[Exascot]

How much you paid for the return tickets from Europe to Johannesburgh?
Which airlines are the cheapest?

I haven't checked for you but have you looked at Emirates? They are the cheapest from Athens. About 500€ return. You may have to go from Rome.

Your next problem cost wise is JNB-Maun. This is expensive. If you can stand it there is a luxury bus run which is a 1/10 the cost of flying.

[darkroomsource]

honestly, what difference does it make what price someone got for an airline ticket? I mean, if you try an hour later, you'll get different prices most days. And depending on what airports you choose to go from/to, you can get different prices. Whatever price you see, that's what you can get AT THAT INSTANT if someone else doesn't press "I'll take it" before you do.

And as for the trip from Johannesburg to Maun, if you're actually thinking that the bus is something you have to be able to "stand", you're not going to be happy in Maun. Read a bit, Maun is not like most any city you've ever been to. Transportation in Africa - even Africa for beginners - is not like it is in Europe. There are some parts of Asia where it's similar, but for the rest of the world, it's quite unique. Even central america has "luxury" taxi's and combi's and mini-buses and buses compared to Africa. Learn to hitch-hike and ride in the back with the cow.

Don't trust the water - anywhere. And ask your doctor about Hepatitis E - it's only in Botswana.

If you still want to come, then by all means do so, and have the time of your life, and good luck finding work.

[Exascot]

if you try an hour later, you'll get different prices most days

Not with Emirates and they are usually the cheapest from Athens at least. We have already booked with them for November. A delay will just make availability more difficult - no price difference.

Let me put it this way, I would not go by bus but I was pointing out that this is a much cheaper option and acceptable.

Only trying to help.

And, yes Josemarb all the best in finding a job - it is fantastic flying, a great country and mainly delightful people.

'Doomroomsourse' (sic) is trying to prepare you for Africa it can be a culture shock. I have worked (flying) in over half of the countries on the continent. Bots is the best - in my view.

[darkroomsource]

Yes, I'm not trying to discourage, just prepare you. I took, the bus from JHB to WHK, but when I went from Maun to JHB (after having been there for a while) I hitch hiked. Nothing like sleeping in a tent in the Kalahari, wondering if you'll get a ride the next day, or where you'll find water. But after having pushed taxi's out of the way in order to get from one place to the next, or been the only one on the bus with tools (trusty leatherman) to fix a broken hose on the engine... and and and, you look at "le metro" differently.

[brisdude]

Sorry but info to get to Bots is very, VERY available, though if you do not want to try a forum then look to tourist sites can help you get there, honestly though if you worry about getting there then you should look elsewhere.

Remember you aren't a tourist, so you cannot afford to be too fussy, take what your given and suck it up. Guys have been fired for wanting AirCon/Double bed etc just roll with what your given. Be polite and nice to those that work there.

Enjoy.

Related; I like to give advice to people going where I have been but it DOES take a degree of self reliance. If that is not for you - look elsewhere.:ok:

[Exascot]

I had to find this for a friend and it wasn't easy. Their poster is a little way down this page: Maun Self Drive 4x4 Miscellaneous Page of Essential Information - Maun Self Drive 4x4 (http://www.maunselfdrive4x4.com/miscellaneous.htm)

[CharlieVictorSierra]

@ lilflyboy

Hows the number of job hunters in Maun so far? Are you guys expecting as many (if not more) than last season? The permit saga will prove to be an ever interesting fight as usual :ugh:

Don't worry I wont be one of them (I was and never again will be), just interested ;)

[darkroomsource]

Note that the bus runs twice a week in each direction.
Honestly, you'll have much more fun if you take a combi to Gaberone, then a bus from there to Maun, and it will cost 1/3 of the bus from Jo'berg to Maun.

[Exascot]

.....it will cost 1/3 of the bus from Jo'berg to Maun.

How cheap can you get it's a 1/10 of the airfare?

Do you have to travel with chickens on your lap and a donkey sitting next to you? - No comments about my wife please :E She is very attractive (have to put that in because we share this computer :O

Excuse my ignorance vot is a 'combi'?

[klasvaakie]

I think I might actually have an original question about going to Maun to find a job. It's basically about my fiancee. Can she come with me. The thought of two years (I plan to stay for at least two years) living in two different countries is not what we would call ideal. I know that she wont be allowed to work (or so I have heard from people who have worked in Botswana), but will she be allowed to stay?

If this question has been answered, please excuse me because I have searched and found nothing.

[CharlieVictorSierra]

I stand to be corrected and maybe lilflyboy can confirm my thoughts.

Your fiancee can be granted the same 90 days on entering Botswana so she can most likely be with you for the duration of your job hunting should you want her to be.

Provided you do land a job and sort your work permits out she can come live by you. She will have to apply for a residence permit as a dependant on you. The rest is in the paperwork and holding your breath. :hmm:

I am not sure if its required that you be married though...that will need to be confirmed. But there are a few pilots there with their girls :)

I must warn you though that its risky business taking the love of your life to Maun...good luck with that :E The guys there act like they havent seen a decent woman in years, which they probably havent. She will get ALOT of attention.

Best of luck man :)

[klasvaakie]

lol, the attention I can deal with. I wonder if they can deal with her though. She will drive them crazy and then laugh at them squirming when she leaves with me :p. At least she will have some entertainment :)

[CharlieVictorSierra]

:D I like your optimism, it was just a warning not to trust anybody when it comes to that! Should you get a job, you will be flying most of the day leaving your fiancee to her own devices! It has happened before :mad: But that is a conversation for another time...im sure he thought exactly the same thing you did.

Good luck man ;)

[klasvaakie]

I will post a photo if you can organise me a job for next year? I will be coming next year November onwards (Hope I can still get a job then, what with the stuff I have been reading that expats may not be allowed to go fly there with low hours anymore). lol. Anyways, I am used to her getting loads of attention. And thanks for the warning :). I will get her a steel chastity belt and lock her up every day when I go flying and take it off when I get back. Will let her know to start working on her bladder control.

[Exascot]

Any chance of you posting a photo old boy :ok:

[CharlieVictorSierra]

Klas at this stage i reccommend you do not under any circumstances reveal your real name or information about yourself on this thread! il bet there are a few silent Maun pilots reading this with a sparkle in their beady little eyes ha ha ha ha :cool:

No objections to a photo though...it gets very lonely out here especially when my girlfriend is back in S.A. ;) And no I do not work in Maun although I am there rather often.

[Pinante]

Hello, I'm planning on going to Maun in January but I still have some questions that I can't get answer for.

1 - If I stay in Audi Camp and eat, drink and live a "normal" life for someone without a job (saving, saving, saiving...) how much do you think I'm going to spend per month? Should I take €uros? Are the exchange rate fair?

2 -I read that to get a job in Maun all certificates are important (high school, graduation, criminal record,...) but I'll have to translate everything to english, so I wonder if that translation has to be recognized by the embassy or something?

Thanks for any help

[klasvaakie]

lol, but if I load a photo of her, they will know who she is and then when she gets there, eish, all I can say is EISH!!! :p

Anyways, I was just joking about the job. I am trying to get through my ppl and com as fast as I can, but when I have it I would rather get a job on my own, not through my fiancee's merrit's :p

[darkroomsource]

@Exascot
How cheap? The last trip I made from Maun all the way to Jo'berg was free.
A combi is a Volkswagen Minibus with 15 passengers (sometimes there's 20 or more) including luggage on your lap (unless you get a "local bus" which, if going long distances will have a trailer for luggage)
And I never had to have chickens on my lap, but I did see some people who had them on their laps once.

@Pinante and EVERYONE ELSE
DON'T BRING EUROS OR DOLLARS OR ANY OTHER CURRENCY, except for the small amount you will need to get to where you are going.
There are ATM's everywhere (OK, not in the middle of the Kalahari, but that's not where you're starting) and they don't charge anywhere near as much as the Bureau de Change does. I found that if I went to the Bank and used my ATM to withdraw from my US account, I got charged a total of USD 5.00 MAXIMUM to make the withdrawal, and I got the EXACT exchange rate for that day. When I figured out how much money I could have saved by not bringing cash, I cried... literally... it was HUNDREDS of US dollars.
DO CHECK with your bank to make sure that you can make a withdrawal from the ATM's in whatever country you are going to.

Translating documents, according to my recollection of what I read on the CAA websites for Namibia, Botswana, Zambia, Tanzania, Malawi, and Kenya, the translations must be done and certified by someone recognized by the CAA (not the embassy) for the "pilot" documents, and by the immigration department for the non-pilot documents - some documents are required by BOTH the CAA and immigration and might, theoretically, have to be translated twice.

[lilflyboy262]

I can already feel the boys stirring ;)
You do have to be really careful with your girl. Its the major cause of friction between the hunters and the pilots in this town.
Last year one pilot lost his wife to another pilot... it happens.

Unfortunately (my girlfriend is in the business of getting permits issued.), she cannot apply on your permit as a dependant.
I think there is something along the lines of you having to get something signed in SA declaring that she is your dependant there.
Aldo, you will probably need to write a supporting letter here declaring that she is going to be your dependant here.

Im pretty sure your girl will be able to find work, nearly everyone does. Leaving her at home, bored and alone, while your away on overnights is not a smart idea.

[Pinante]

Wonderful news!!! I wasn't to happy with the ideia of taking to much cash with me. How much do you think I'm going to spend per month? I read that I'll probably have to repeat my medical exams there, how much will that cost me? Regarding my aviation documents, I only have my licence with everything attached to it (SEP, MEP/IR, MCC, ICAO english) and my medical certificate class 1. Both of them are translated. Thanks for your reply

[darkroomsource]

How much do you want to spend per month?
You can live there in a tent for so little it hurts to think about it. Or you can live in a dorm or private room and drink and party and eat out every day.
In a tent for most of the time, you can go on as little as maybe USD 1000 per month and not have to worry about how much you drink or eat. I've seen guys do it for USD 500 a month, and I've seen guys have a hard time with USD 2000 per month. Realize that it's MORE expensive to live there IN A TENT temporarily in a "camp" than it is to live there in a room/apartment/house after you get hired, and you will live (almost comfortably) on USD 1000 per month once you're hired. So, don't rely on USD 500 a month, you'll run out of money... but you can do it if you are VERY VERY VERY VERY VERY tight with your money - but then you won't be able to buy anyone a drink and you will be known as a skinflint.

You won't be paying for medicals, or exams, or conversions, or anything like that UNLESS you're hired, so don't worry about how much that will cost. Burn that bridge when you get to it.

You must be prepared to stay for more than 3 months though, even though you will only get a visa for 3 months, you'll be paying to live there (or in a neighboring country while you wait) for more than 3 months - that's the way it's been for just about everyone hired in Bots and Nam for the past few years. Some have even gone back home for a few months waiting on visas.

[Exascot]

DRS 'combi' thanks for that :eek: I think I will fly again :ok:

Thank you also for the info on getting cash. I will ditch the money belt.

[darkroomsource]

DRS 'combi' thanks for that I think I will fly again
I take it then that you are planning on buying a car when you get to Maun? Cuz combi's are about the only way to get around, unless you pay for a taxi, which is a toyota celica with 4 passengers plus the driver... and not in much better condition than the combi's (actually, some were in worse condition) - of course you can get a taxi for yourself, if you pay the fare of the empty seats...

[Exascot]

planning on buying a car

Yes indeed. That is one of the cash problems. I can't get enough out of an ATM for that. I can't open a bank account before I get there and transfer money from the UK or Greece so I am going to have to arrive with cash. We need a car as soon as we arrive. Our rented house (shack) is 15km to the south.

We have always found taxis in Maun to be fairly reasonable prices compared to here or the UK actually. Not that you want to use one all the time, no matter how entertaining it is!

[CharlieVictorSierra]

;) best of luck with your training klaas!!

lilflyboy hows the situation in Maun by the way? Any job seekers yet? :hmm:

[lilflyboy262]

Theres two in town that I know of. One has been here for about 5 months and is about to go home unfortunately :(
The other has been here for perhaps a month.

[Pinante]

Thanks once again darkroomsource. It'll be difficult for me to stay there for 3 months without work, but we'll see.
This is getting more and more interesting, now we even have girls in the equation...

[cavortingcheetah]

If I were setting out to write a chick lit I'd set the scene in a wild rambunctious desert town, surrounded by savage animals and venomously dangerous waters.
I'd throw in dust storms, dangerous employment, alcohol and kept women left alone in their boudoirs all day with nought to do but preen and cut their toe nails. I'd have a recipe cooking for steamy sex in the swamps that would give even Louise Mensch a pause in her efforts to clean the Augean Stables. Of course, in order to complete the triangles, someone has to get killed. A green mamba in the magnetoes, great snakes on a plane, or just a scorpion strapped to the rudder pedals. All you'd need would be the padre on a pony searching for the long lost corpse of his sister, last seen being eaten by an enormous crocodile. Mind you though, if one drove in a lux van full of working girls up from the southern cess pit, there's a fortune to be made. If Pilansberg has been closed then there's even some hoti toti nearer to hand temporarily at least unemployed. An explosive environment into which to introduce women of any disposition let alone left alone ones. Chastity belts have holes in them, human rights law demands this and most locks would provide no difficulty for a picker of enthusiasm. Besides, sexual infidelity is infinitely enterprising in its originality. Yep! Sounds like there might be some fun, games and excitement going on up in the Boon Docks this summer. There's even a television company looking to make a documentary about who sleeps with whom, or what, while Willy is away flying. They've been advertising for business on Wrinkled Plum's pages. Is this the opportunity for Big Brother to come to Maun? The TV company seems gaudy enough for it to be so. Just pop an ad of a solicitous nature in the Sandton Chronicle and frustrated house wives in silken knickers will be wending their way north for a few days of Midnight in Maun, having told their banker husbands in Johannesburg that they're off to London for a podiatric seminar or some such nonsense. Bringing your adored one to Maun is like playing Russian Roulette. The trigger will get pulled and the trick is, will she? And the answer to that question is, yes she will, it just depends on the spin that others put into their cylinders.

[darkroomsource]

@Exascot
I'm really getting confused by the things you are saying...
On the one hand you're concerned about costs, trying to save money on every little thing it seems, and then on the other hand you're concerned about anything that might be anywhere near "ruffing it". And now, when I go back to see the message to which I'm referring, they've been removed...
What are you really up to?

[Exascot]

DRS,

I have not removed any postings and I don't think any were controversial so I don't think the mods did, I don't understand.

No we are not going to 'rough it' but at the same time I am not going to give money to banks etc in bad exchange rates and transfer charges.

I will PM you about who we are.

[darkroomsource]

no problems. I was just finding myself a bit confused...
hakuna matitiso, kila kitu ni sawa

[Exascot]

For the public record DRS and I have sorted out the confusion. As can be seen from my details I am a retired military and airline pilot now a tour operator working in Greece and Botswana. Also a management consultant in Aviation and eco-tourism. So guys, no threat in the job seeking market but here to help if I can. Good luck to all who are looking for a job this summer. :ok:

[evernesky]

Awesome thread! I have broken my head for 20 months on how to make it to maun or any other place.. I have 227 hours ICAO CPL . Could you kindly help me out .... I can make it to Maun by the end of this year as my license has to be renewed... hoping to hear from you sir... my email is [email protected] ..

[darkroomsource]

@evernesky
Absolute classic post my friend, we are all in stitches...
thanks for the laugh...
sounds like you found this great thread BUT DIDN'T BOTHER TO READ IT
go back to page one and start again.
Do not pass Go, do not collect $200.

[Sam Rutherford]

RDF Television are making a documentary series for UKTV’s channel Dave about the men and women flying small planes in southern Africa. We’ll be following the lives of these courageous pilots as they ferry passengers and cargo around the Okavango Delta and Kalahari Desert, and as they try to live a normal life in a part of the world which is anything but!

Young pilots head to Botswana from all over the world to take on possibly the toughest job they’ll ever do. This is real hands and feet flying and pilots here have to contend with wildlife on the airstrips, rapidly changing weather, and tough, busy schedules as they quickly clock up flying hours in some of the most amazing scenery in the world.

The only way to get a job in Botswana is to turn up and try your luck. You can’t apply for jobs by email or phone, you have to roll up to have a chance. Each year a huge crowd of pilots from every corner of the globe camp out in the hope that this year they might just land the dream job of becoming a bush pilot.

We’re looking for any pilots currently in the UK who are planning on heading to Botswana this year... if you’re thinking of going this year, or early next year, please drop us a line on 0117 970 7697 or email us: [email protected] (https://red002.mail.emea.microsoftonline.com/owa/redir.aspx?C=8150df63c2754a79b319e3e92a142777&URL=mailto%3abushpilots%40rdftelevision.com)

[Pinante]

darkroomsource (http://www.pprune.org/members/343623-darkroomsource)
Some things are international!!! Monopoly at its best ... Always good to remember!

[ctgullwing]

So anyone going soon..? Im driving up on the 19th going via Windhoek

[lilflyboy262]

1 guy just been hired. 1 more newbie in town making a total of 2 people

[Exascot]

RDF Television are making a documentary series for UKTV’s channel Dave about the men and women flying small planes in southern Africa. We’ll be following the lives of these courageous pilots as they ferry passengers and cargo around the Okavango Delta and Kalahari Desert, and as they try to live a normal life in a part of the world which is anything but!

Young pilots head to Botswana from all over the world to take on possibly the toughest job they’ll ever do. This is real hands and feet flying and pilots here have to contend with wildlife on the airstrips, rapidly changing weather, and tough, busy schedules as they quickly clock up flying hours in some of the most amazing scenery in the world.

The only way to get a job in Botswana is to turn up and try your luck. You can’t apply for jobs by email or phone, you have to roll up to have a chance. Each year a huge crowd of pilots from every corner of the globe camp out in the hope that this year they might just land the dream job of becoming a bush pilot.

We’re looking for any pilots currently in the UK who are planning on heading to Botswana this year... if you’re thinking of going this year, or early next year, please drop us a line on 0117 970 7697 or email us: [email protected]

They are so keen to make this documentary they couldn't be bothered to answer my e-mails. Is this going to be another 'Botswana Bound'? :ugh: Probably.

[likair]

Hello there,

Will a pilot working in Africa flying aircrafts, be able to log hours on a JAA licence? Also, would this hours account to unfreeze an JAR ATPL?

I believe most of the aircrafts operated in Africa for Bush flying are categorized as single Pilot operated. If you're sitting on the RHS, would that be loggable under JAA, or you have to be actually flying the AC on the LHS?

THanks a lot for your info!!

[lilflyboy262]

We dont fly right hand seat in botswana.

[darkroomsource]

@lilflyboy262
You know, I have 2 kids, 4 step kids, 6 foster kids, 4 grand-kids... I thought I was patient, but you, my friend, "patience of Job".
At what point will you just begin to respond "RTFM"? The Manual, which by the way, you wrote, that is an accumulation of all the knowledge and experience ever documented on the subject, in one concise place...

[morgan32]

When he has find something else to do ...

[lilflyboy262]

Or somewhere else to go ;)

Might not be around long enough to collect this years round of beers!

[Exascot]

They are so keen to make this documentary they couldn't be bothered to answer my e-mails. Is this going to be another 'Botswana Bound'? Probably.

Just to put the record straight the producer, Nick Head, has now been in contact with me. I know the excellent reputation of this TV company which is why I was surprised that I didn't receive a reply. As some of you may know he has just returned to the UK from Maun where as we all know the internet connection is hit and miss at the best of times.

With the assistance of all you guys I am sure that this will be an excellent series. Just don't be filmed partying again ;)

I am looking forward to getting back there in 6 weeks :ok:

I just hope they have caught or shot all those escaped crocs from the farm just 4 km away from our house on the river :eek:

[lilflyboy262]

Last I heard about escaped crocs was a few years back.

Had something to do with a drunken cricket team taking them from the croc farm.
A few of the crocs died, a few lived, and a few escaped.

One of the cricketers woke up with a bite on his shoulder.

[Exascot]

Was he still fit to fly?

It's in the Ngami Times so it must be true ;)

The Ngami Times (http://www.ngamitimes.com/index.html)

[cessna_driver]

Hey All

My very first post!! ....well, after 8 years behind a desk saving and at 29, finally got my SA CPL/IR... Been on the CPL scene now for 3 months and iv'e watched most of my fellow class mates from flight school pass through Namibia and Bots over the years with great interest and a burning desire to fly in the bush. most of them have moved onto bigger things now.

But non the less, massive amounts of reading, both on Avcom, Pprune, ******** and facebooking for advice covered all my questions that ive had for the last couple of years.

lilflyboy262 - great job with the initial coloumn to this thread, I take my hat off to you.....:D

from all the research and contacting people, it "seems" that Namibia is more strict on the work visa and granting interviews to local citizens than what Bots is.... if anyone could kindly comment on this id appreciate it... it just seems that way from my side. Had a chat to a couple of guys over in Nam, and it is a very real threat... the companies that responded to my mails made it very clear that foreign CV's will be filed for 6 months until the pool of locals dry up, interviews till then will not be granted. which is fair enough. - this was 2 days ago.

Anyway, im going to make the big trip at the end of October, and try and stick it out as long as i financially can. CPT-WHK-MAUN.

just one quick question to anyone that can shed some light on this.
I plan to take intercape bus from CPT-WHK. will one have to travel by bus back into SA, then on to JHB to Gabs to eventually get into maun... or is there a direct bus/train from WHK to Maun.. tried looking at trains as well but i cannot find updated schedules, intervals and pricing.

Im so psyched for the end of year season, and i really hope to meet most of you in the camps over a few beers. :ok:

Cheers.

[lilflyboy262]

The is no direct anything from Windhoek to Maun other than Air Namibia.

The way to get via bus is catching the Bus that runs from Windhoek to Gabs, After crossing the border, you hitch hike to Ghanzi, and then catch the bus that goes from Gabs to Maun via Ghanzi.
If that seems too much of an effort. Go all the way to Gabs, then catch the Maun bus from there.
Best way is to stay at the backpackers and try and catch a ride with people who are going this way.
There are small local buses but I have lost the contact numbers. They run from Windhoek to Zimbabwe and pass through Maun. Last I heard they were around 400 rand to get to Maun.

If I was you, I would head via Maun first. The hiring in Namibia kicks off towards the start of the year, while Maun is towards the end of the year.

[cessna_driver]

Thanks for the advice lilflyboy262.
Will route to both WHK and Maun.

[CaptZeloZelo]

Just curious as to what the work visa status is like these days in Botswana,.. still on lockdown or have they re-opened their doors for business (expat pilots)

[cessna_driver]

Hey Chaps,
Is there anyone in Maun at the moment that could
let us know what the current situation is regarding outlook for
work leading up to the new season? any cracks developing, or rumours at this early stage?

Phoned CAA this morning, requesting a letter of clearance/confirmation
that im not a fraudulent CP. They send it via email and cc the Botswana DCA... im still waiting for the email.

safe skies.

[CharlieVictorSierra]

AAAAAAARRRRRRRRGGGGHHHHHHH!!! :{ :{ :{

Please please PLEASE read this thread from page 1 to page 11! And then please read the thread Maun season 2010 - 2011 from page 1 to 11! And then read it again...there is no reasonable question that has not being answered by lilflyboy! The guy is even giving you updates on the hiring situation! Would you like to be spoonfed and offered a job and a cosy little house on the river??

THEN...NOBODY KNOWS if/when/how/why people will get hired! One thing is for certain, if you dont go you have 0% chance! THAT is the only certainty...unless of course you have a ridiculous amount of hours etc. Enough about cracks or what is happening or how will the hiring go! That is by far the most frustrating question a person can ask on this topic! You must have realised that Maun is not Europe and there are no rules as to when/who/how/why people are hired. :ugh: Surely this is the last time this has to be pointed out....if you looking for reassurance well sorry there is none! (we are all big people now)


@ DARKROOMSOURCE I feel your pain and I cant help but give my opinion on this matter!

Go, dont go but either way I dont think you will regret making the trip even if you dont get a job! It is a great time and you meet some great people and learn to be independant and do things for yourself...for once! It gives an unshielded view on REALITY! Something most fresh comm (including myself) had no idea about...

I wish everybody the best of luck but please stop posting stupid repetitive questions.:rolleyes:

[CharlieVictorSierra]

@ Cessna driver...that post is not aimed specifically at you! No hard feelings!

BTW are you not jumping the gun a bit with regards to getting clearance and sending it to CAAB?? (not DCA anymore) Maybe lilflyboy can advise but that does'nt sound like a very smart thing to do. They wont even accept that clearance. If/when you do get a job here they will personally email SACAA for one. I tried that and they refused saying they will get the clearance themselves. You'll wait a long time for a reply...:) I know you excited but just focus on the important things for now...

[Exascot]

Would you like to be spoonfed and offered a job and a cosy little house on the river??

Yes please. And if you really look around it is possible for the latter.

Secured this for 2,200 Pula a month - the crocs are free.

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/32684975/House.JPG

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/32684975/Garden.JPG

[cessna_driver]

@ Charlie Victor Sierra

No hard feelings taken at all. I should have re-phrased some of what i said as not to piss a few people off. My appologies...

I dont neccessarily think its a bad thing to have as much docs as possible, like lilflyboy said... if you have it, bring it. Anyway, after begging like a dog for 5 days, the SACAA eventually sent it to me.

will PM you when i arrive next week, would like to meet you.

Regards

[CharlieVictorSierra]

Exascot great spot you have there:D And thats a steal man...il definately give you a call if i ever need to do some house hunting!

@cessna driver no worries man ;) Unfortunately im not based in Maun at the moment but your still welcome to PM me. Lilflyboy is the guy you need to meet!

Good luck man....

[Exascot]

Just for the record, it is VERY difficult to rent in Maun. We spent a week going all around looking for something like the above. A flat in town (expensive) is possible but then it has to be a 12 month contract. Found our 'shack' through a local friend.

[CharlieVictorSierra]

Ha ha im not looking and wont ever be looking in Maun ;) Out of interest, any problems with crime? when i was there it seemed out of hand!! :eek:

[Exascot]

One of the advantages of this location is that it is 20 kms out of town without a village nearby. It is also set in a compound surrounded by a fence. There are two other houses there and dogs. However we will not be complacent. Closest place is the Royal Tree Lodge - more to nick there ;)

[ImaginedByGod]

[I]Okay I have a couple of questions on the living situation.


1). Would a larger tent be advised? And what about lugging it from home (the US in this case)?

2). If staying in a tent, would one need to be cautious about leaving the documents and valuables (i.e. laptop, wallet, logbook, etc.) in the tent? Are there services that offer safes and such?

Since staying in a tent seems to be the most economic route, for most of us, it will probably be the way to go.

3). There was also a quote from someone (a few pages back i think) about it roughly costing $1000 USD a month to live, if living in a tent. That number seems pretty high to me. Reading elsewhere, i saw that for food it would cost around $10 USD per day. With the low cost of housing, about $3 per day or $90/month, it doesn't make much sense, buying beers included as to why the price is so high. Maybe prices have gone up...? This would make more sense if you were @ Back Packers under the dorm option (Budget Accommodation, B&B and Camping in Maun, Okavango, Botswana (http://www.maun-backpackers.com/accommodation.htm)).


Thanks guys for all the help!

[Exascot]

I will let the guys more in the know to answer your main points. However we are in the travel business and survey camps and hotels then publish full consultancy reports (confidential). We highly recommend Backpackers indeed we hope to stay there for a couple of weeks next month whilst we get our house ready (if they would answer our e-mails!) However the one weakness is their dorms. There is also a block of four rooms available with beds. This block does not look appealing. They are not en-suite. We did not have a chance to look inside (occupied) but judging by the outside they are very basic. You would be much better off in a tent. Great bar set right on the river, fantastic atmosphere. One down side is that it is a long walk to the road to hitch a lift if you don't have transport.

[ImaginedByGod]

I guess the morning walk would be a good way of making friends with the weather ;). But how far is far anyways?

Thanks for the quick reply!

[lilflyboy262]

None of your tents have ensuites either...

Are you really asking what size tent you should bring? Please tell me thats a joke. You don't live in the damn thing, just sleep in it.

As for the valuables, take it with you. If you don't want to do that, leave it in the office of the camp you are staying at. Simple as that.

[ImaginedByGod]

If you figure being there for 6 months without much else, a good tent wouldn't be a bad investment. And as far as leaving my valuables up front, I had no idea they offered such services. Fantastic!

Thanks

[darkroomsource]

Tent:
get a GOOD one... a WATERPROOF one... on that will LAST in the HOT SUN and POURING RAIN...
To get an idea of how much sun, imagine that it's the middle of the Sahara Desert, and it's 120F or 45C, and you're in the direct sunlight, for 6 solid months... any waterproofing you have on it WILL go, the fabric will FADE and be eaten by the heat...
THEN there's the rain, think about taking a hose from the local fire department and pointing it at the tent - that's the force I saw on occasion there...
I saw tents literally have their poles broken in the down pour (after the tent had been used for several months).
But, I'd do it in a tent again, no problem.

Someone questioned USD 1000 per month, well, having done it, I can tell you that that's not easy if you drink beer... ha ha Sure, everything seems cheap, and you might be able to get away with less, but honestly, plan on MORE, things always seem to happen, and you always want more than you have.

[ImaginedByGod]

Thanks doom for the detailed reply.

think about taking a hose from the local fire department and pointing it at the tent

I imagined something like this:
Funny Firemen playing soccer - YouTube

except replace the firemen with lions & hippos. . but keep the uniforms. and the ball with a tent. that'd make the trip pretty interesting haha.

I'll plan for around $1000 per month then.

[flying nut]

Hi, this is my first post on pprune so please be gentle with me. I'm making plans to come out to Maun next month, but I was wondering about the quality of the maintenance out there? Are the aircraft maintained to the same standard that I could expect in Canada (I've also done some flying in England). Im particulalry concerned due to the harsh conditions that the aircraft operate in. Have there been many problems or accidents caused by poor maintenance?

On a slightly different subject, I noticed that a British company is making a TV programme about flying in Maun. I previously considered working in TV so I was intrigued by this. What are people's thoughts on it and what do the operators think about it? Are they already there and if so are the filming particular individuals or are they sticking to one of the operators? I would maybe like to be included in that if they are also filming non-British people (though my Mom's family is from England so I am part British at least).

[ImaginedByGod]

Aircraft Maintence
Good. As you would expect in any other ICAO nation.

on the first page

[cessna_driver]

Im certainly no expert on Maun.... but the amount of business the companies in Maun
have during peak season will indicate that their aircraft are well maintained.

As lilflyboy262 mentioned earlier, its as good as any other ICAO country.
Heres the website:
NORTHERN AIR MAINTENANCE (http://www.namaintenance.com/)

Safe Travels

[TheDKG]

Just recently started my Pilot training in NZ, and i found a TV series on the internet (seems to be self filmed) about a Pilot flying for Sefofane/ Wilderness Air, great to watch! Just shorts 'episodes' about his experiences at sefofane in botswana and also another short series about him in zambia.

It was called 'Botswana Bound', and from memory i think the site it was on was called NBCToday.

I was pretty entertaining if you are interested in flying in Botswana.

Thanks so much lilflyboy, this is a fantastic thread.

[Exascot]

I was pretty entertaining if you are interested in flying in Botswana. :mad:

I think that we can hope for a far better more realistic and professional production from RDF Television West who are in theatre at the moment. Botswana Bound was the most dreadful misguided amateur documentary that has ever been screened on the subject. It portrayed the highly skilled pilots who work in this very difficult environment in completely the wrong light. Many clients in this market are very nervous about flying in small aircraft this idiot with his cavalier attitude was detrimental to the Safari business.

[cavortingcheetah]

Another one of these coming up then?

Arizona to whitewash Painted Desert - Greg Correll - Open Salon (http://open.salon.com/blog/greg_correll/2010/05/12/arizona_to_whitewash_painted_desert)

[PilotInPink]

Thanks for a great thread Lilflyboy! Just about all of the info I need to go and live the African Dream.

I just have one question, what are the toilet and shower facitilties really like at Audi camp? Various internet reviews I've read rate them from 'the worst in southern Africa' to 'famously spottless'. Do I need to mentally prepare for the worst?

[zappalin]

Before you worry too much about the toilets PilotInPink, I did read this on another forum recently...
Guys Some advice for anyone heading to Maun. The best place to stay in Maun is no longer Audi Camp. They charge P47 a night and are over 11km away from the airport, they have stopped the pilot special.
I was staying at Sedia Hotel in the campsite for P40 a night this also gives you free electricity and wireless internet. If you want you also have access to the bar, restaurant, pool tables and the huge swimming pool. It is also only about 4.5km away from the airport.

Can anyone 'in country' confirm this? Maybe the guys at Audi Camp just didn't like him... :E

[cavortingcheetah]

If you follow the logical route for hotel research and google Trip Adviser you can find the Sedia reviewed there in all its glory.

[zappalin]

Cheers cavortingcheetah, I have seen some of the places the 'aspirants' will most likely be at, and they really shouldn't be worried about the quality/cleanliness side of things, much better than my current conditions - I'm crashing out in a dusty storeroom with no insulation or electricity for a few weeks, and it's COLD where I am!

But do you know if the pilot discount at Audi Camp no longer applies? If so I guess this would affect everyone's planning a fair bit!

[cavortingcheetah]

Not a clue I'm afraid. Haven't been up there for quite a while.

[darkroomsource]

I just have one question, what are the toilet and shower facitilties really like at Audi camp? Various internet reviews I've read rate them from 'the worst in southern Africa' to 'famously spottless'. Do I need to mentally prepare for the worst?

Most "camp" toilets in Botswana are flush toilets, but open air.

But seriously, if you're worried about toilets at the camps stay home... You won't be happy...


On another note... I just saw that Mack Air (Maun) and WestAir (Nam) are both listing 1000 hours as the minimum... have the governments made a decision requiring 1000 hours for all expats? or are they just saying that they won't take resumes (CVs) via the internet without 1000 hours? Anyone know?

[206DOG]

Re toilets Audi camp.... mate you'll most likely have the ****s anyway for the first couple of weeks in maun so probably won't be too concerned about how flash the loos are! just as long as you get there...:E

Sedia Hotel also has the fabled pink caravan stop by once or twice a year.... if you are lucky enough to hit the jackpot!;)

[PilotInPink]

Not worried about the toilets (spent plenty of time camping with long-drops) just wanted to know what to expect.

I read something about open-air communal showers and I was picturing a shower-head attatched to a post out in the open :}.... THAT is not my cup of tea.

Flushing toilets, regardless of quality, give me hope. :)

[cavortingcheetah]

It's not the snakes at the bottom of the long drop that are the problem. They don't much like excrement and tend to just try to climb up the wall. It's the African bull frog that's the very real danger.
He lives at the bottom of the drop.

http://www.rollinghillswildlife.com/African-Bull-Frog,-Bubba.gif

It has very sharp teeth and is violently and voraciously carnivorous. It is highly aggressive, weighs up to two kilos and can jump like a Jack Rabbit. It's always hungry and always wants to get to the food source. Shooting them between your own legs as they are on the jump has led to some serious accidents which have provided the bully frog, from time to time, with more delicious food than it thought it would sink it's teeth into on reaching the pink, or blacksource provider.
All long drops in Africa must be considered to have snakes and Pyxicephalus adspersus in them. You can tell which is coming for you because the African Bullfrog makes a sticky slurpy noise as he unsticks himself from the mounds of dung in which he lives and stirs himself into an anal upward trajectoried rabid rectal rocket. Watch out too for crocodiles waiting patiently just out of lanter range.

[darkroomsource]

black mamba for breakfast anyone?

[ernguru]

Zappalin, I can confirm that the pilot special NO LONGER APPLIES. Did you miss that sentence that I wrote in Avcom. There are already about 7 guys camping at Sedia. From my time in Maun the +++++ for staying there far outweigh Audi.
1. PRICE (P40 as opposed to P47 per night) If you're planning on staying long term then the P40 may also be reduced at the managers discretion
2. Distance to airport (taxi fares are cheaper so PRICE again) If you travel from Audi to the airport before 8am then you pay P3.90 if you travel after that time then it's a double charge due to the distance, 12km instead of 4.5km
3. Free Electricity
4. Free Wireless
5. Close to the the main pilot hangout on Friday night SPORTSBAR (walking distance)
6. Walking distance to Old Bridge backpackers

If anyone wants more info they can pm me

[ernguru]

Guys and Girls

Another very huge extremely important thing which has been mentioned in one of the Maun pages is when you enter the country and you fill in that little piece of paper asking why you are here and how long you want to stay. Whatever you do,
:ugh: :ugh::ugh:DO NOT PUT DOWN THAT YOU ARE LOOKING FOR WORK.:ugh::ugh::ugh:

Also the maximum time that they will give you is 90 days so request 90 days. When they have stamped your passport make sure that you see how long they have given you. I have just had to give some guys advice who thought that they had 90 days only to find that they had 25 and 30 days respectfully. Stress that you have a job in your respective country and that you are starting a trip around Botswana starting in Maun and The Delta. Don't carry cv's, references etc that will give it away that you are looking for work. A good idea might be to have a letter on company headed paper say from a parents work saying that you have leave owed to you and that you have been granted a 3 month holiday.

[cavortingcheetah]

(Don't carry cv's, references etc that will give it away that you are looking for work.)

Isn't that incitement to conspire to make a false declaration to this authority?

Republic of Botswana - Government portal (http://www.gov.bw/en/Ministries--Authorities/Ministries/Ministry-of-Labour--Home-Affairs-MLHA/Department--Units/Department-of-Immigration-and-Citizenship/)

Just a completely idle thought really.

(A good idea might be to have a letter on company headed paper say from a parents work saying that you have leave owed to you and that you have been granted a 3 month holiday.)

Incitement to carry false or forged documentation for the purpose of obtaining entry for an illegal purpose?

All good speculative fun until you get caught out I suppose? Wonder if anyone from this office ever reads these pages.

http://www.laws.gov.bw/VOLUME%204/CHAPTER%2023-02%20INTELLIGENCE%20AND%20SECURITY%20SERVICE.pdf

Probably not I suppose.

[brisdude]

A great thread with a guy who is willing to give everyone his time so don't be too fussy.

I like checking out the state of affairs where I worked but honestly a few things to end this rant,

"I am worried about the toilets" - Bad luck you will be in Africa.

"I am worried my bed isn't comfy enough" - Read above.

"How do I get there? What do I do? How do I sort out my life?" - Well you manage to use the Internet to get here didn't you (part III speak to someone else).

"Will people like me, will I get on with pilots & bosses?" - Maybe don't go?

To sum up the "livability" (ie - non passport, cost etc) concerns people have - WORKER & PARASITE - YouTube

[darkroomsource]

cc you are feisty today aren't you?
However you do make a very valid point...
I wonder if any of the people within immigration take that into account when you apply for work visa / temporary work permit... hmmmm... I know they've overlooked it for the past 40 odd years, but if they wanted to be harsh, they might be able to reject based upon that...

However, when I went, I went with the purpose of having a nice vacation, and if, by chance I were to be offered a job, then I would consider it and go through the process to receive the correct validations and permit. (at least, that's what I told myself when the immigration official asked me why I was entering the country)

as to carrying resumes (cvs), why bother, there are internet cafes everywhere, you can print any number of copies at any time, and it's not expensive to do so. But what about the other documents, diplomas, degrees, licenses, etc. You have to carry them, and if you get searched and they ask, what are you going to tell them (by the way, I was searched twice while transiting between countries, so don't carry any contraband of any kind - including pornography).

I'm just wondering though, since the companies have started documenting 1000 hours minimum on their web sites, if this requirement has been established for this year (both in Nam and Bots), due to the discussions that have been going on in both governments since last year.

[ImaginedByGod]

It looks as though sefofane still only requires 250 hrs.

[darkroomsource]

if you're looking at the sefofane website... ha ha

[ImaginedByGod]

I'm just wondering though, since the companies have started documenting 1000 hours minimum on their web sites

isn't that what you were talking about?

[Airmet]

Just curious, what's the average age of the pilots that go there ??
I'm in my early 40's and I am very interested in going there but thought I might be a little to old for this, do they care???
Flying is relatively new to me, and I had only one flying job and have 900 hr's.
Also, looks like most people are camping, do you bring all that stuff with you or buy it there.
Getting there, planing on flying to Johannesburg and take a bus or inexpensive airfare, are there any other options, I will be coming from the US.
Thanks, :ok:

[darkroomsource]

and WHAT is sefofane?

[ernguru]

CC, Are you having a bad day?

""Isn't that incitement to conspire to make a false declaration to this authority?""

It obviously is but isn't coming here looking for work doing the same (illegal)?

""Incitement to carry false or forged documentation for the purpose of obtaining entry for an illegal purpose?

All good speculative fun until you get caught out I suppose? Wonder if anyone from this office ever reads these pages. ""

Getting caught carrying paperwork showing that you are going to be actively looking for work is also illegal, if you are offered a job and they need references, school/University results etc there is a DHL office about 10 minutes walk from the airport. What I'm saying is that you don't have to carry anything that makes it look like you are going to be looking for work.

What I have posted is just some useful advice to helpfully make it a bit smoother and easier for the guys coming here. Also to save the guys some money as I'm sure that not everyone is rolling in cash.
I got a lot of useful information off of pprune, useful info peppered with useless smart arse comments. :E

[buskilzboeing]

Good luck finding a cheap flight from Johannesburg.. Air Botswana are useless and charge a fortune. the toilets at Sedia are fine except for the skid marks that are always present:} and when the idiots arrive in their stupid caravans and empty their "excrement containers" from their stupid caravans into the sedia toilets. lovely fragrance...

[brisdude]

I might need to tell the producers of the "Bold and the Beautiful" to get involved! Things are getting interesting...:D

Or was that "Young and the Restless"?:p

[Contact Approach]

Darkroomsource,

Hi, are you suggesting Wilderness Air (Sefofane) don't regularly update their website?

[darkroomsource]

Darkroomsource,

Hi, are you suggesting Wilderness Air (Sefofane) don't regularly update their website?



Yes and No, they changed their name and web site, last year, have not seen any changes to the site since, but then...

However, Sefofane is no longer, so if someone is quoting the sefofane web site, then WHAT are they quoting?

[Contact Approach]

Duly noted.

[ImaginedByGod]

Employment Opportunities (http://www.sefofane.com/employment.html)

[MetalGear]

I'll be there on the 31st and I'll most likely be at the old bridge backpackers. See you all then.

[Exascot]

It is a few years since I operated a C206. Just doing a little bit of swotting up. Do you ace bush pilots have any comments on the below. Agreements or disagreements. I appreciate that different companies have different SOPs. This could be a worthwhile discussion for those heading down there for jobs.

www.associatedpilots.com/documents/C-206_operating_notes.pdf

[Solid Rust Twotter]

Elevation around there is 4000' odd IIRC, so leaning for taxi to prevent plugs fouling may not be a bad idea. Be aware of a possible rich cut if reducing power at altitude. Apart from that most places should have SOPs regarding this stuff and a bit of line training is the norm before releasing pilots to fly on their own.

[reino_com]

Hi guys how many pilots are there currently in Maun looking for work +- ?

[tatenda12]

hello friends ..
i heared that some foreign company is going to open a flying training and charter company in maun?? has anyone heard of it?? heard that they have got clearances to bring c172 airplanes .... ??:confused:

[tatenda12]

ohhh really?? then its a good chance ... how many pilots are there?

[Exascot]

... how many pilots are there?

We hope to be leaning on the bar at Backpackers by Wednesday 9th Nov approx 16.00. So that's another two :E

I bet none of you guys have a trip that starts off with 9 hours on a ship though, starting the day after tomorrow and only getting there after over a week. :eek:

[scarrymike]

In response to comments requested on the 206 information.

A few comments. Instead of holding power on landing I like to think of it as holding RPM's. All of my 206 time came from flying a jump plane so I was always within glide of the airport (except on the up wind). I was told never to go to idle unless I had the airport made. Also - according to my friend who crashed a 206 - never turn the aux pump on to change tanks. Its not a f-ing Piper. The aux pump is for starting and restarting if you run a tank dry.
OK - one more thing. When empty and I mean nothing but the pilot and the pads for the sky divers and ten gallons of fuel - never land with full flaps - max 15 degrees.

I would imagine that the delta pilots have their own tricks.