CFI renewal issue

[Squawk7777]

Hiya folks,

I am planning to renew my CFI online with Gleim. I have done it before and was pretty happy with them. The only issue I am facing now is that I am currently not in the US and I won't be before the expiration date of my CFI. If I remember correctly the completion certificate that you get at the end of the successful course has to be notarized. Does the FAA accept foreign notarization? I could drive to the nearest US embassy but that is about a 5 hour drive. Has anyone else encountered this problem? :ooh:

7 7 7 7

[MarkerInbound]

Never have done Gleim, always Jepp. The Jepp form allows a "U.S. Armed Forces Commanding Officer" to sign off the paperwork if that situation applies to you. Otherwise I'd call OKC, if the CFI expires it's a pain to get back, you have to go through a CFI ride again.

[Panama Jack]

I do the renewal through American Flyers, and the setup is similar to the Gleim or Jeppesen. As MarkerInbound mentioned, your Commanding Officer if you are serving in the military is another option.

Otherwise, they will not accept a foreign notary. The only way I could see that a foreign notary might be acceptable is through a chain authentication-- after your foreign notary puts his stamp, you will need to take it to the Department of Foreign Affairs of the country you are living in that they authenitcate the notary's stamp. Then you will need to send it to the US Embassy so that they authenticate the Department of Foreign Affairs stamp. This takes time, money, and at the end you will still need to go through the US Embassy (and the FAA may decide it is not acceptable).

If you are in a bigger country, maybe they have a US Consulate closer to where you live?

[slaphapy]

I have been using the Jepp program for the last 10yrs and the only thing I do different, when I am out of the US, is go to the local US Embassy and pay the 55.0US fee (I would guess the fee may vary between each Embassy) and show them a passport, to get the "proof of identity" form notarized by the Embassy counselor staff.

[IndAir967]

Am facing an similar situation now, Indian National working in an Middle East Carrier. Expiry date is less than 2 months and am currently doing the Jepp online renewal. My question is if its true that FAA does not accept an Indian Notary Attestation ??

[Squawk7777]

Quick update: I called several FSDOs, first FRA, then the int'l NY FSDO and finally OKC. Regarding foreign notarization, I got a verbal OK! I will also try to get a written verification by email. In case the foreign notarization gets refused, I will have to go to a US embassy.

@IA967, I'd call OKC. If you need their number, PM me.

[yanafrica]

You can do it in any American Embassy.
30 ,50 $ or free

[LEONIDA]

that they accepted a foreign notar , I was in U.K. , and I did not have to take the local notar paperwork to the embassy, I sent everything to American Flyer , anyway now I always go to the local embassy , it is cheaper.

[Squawk7777]

I called Gleim today and they said that a foreign notary is accepted. Now who wants to my online classes? :E

Thanks for your replies. :ok:

[Squawk7777]

Quick update: I had the ingenious idea to look up the possibilities in the relevant section of 8900.1 (http://fsims.faa.gov/PICDetail.aspx?docId=A6018EF51590B0008525734F0076665F). Under 5-504 it states the following:

D. Procedures for Processing a Flight Instructor Certification Renewal Via U.S.*Mail. Flight instructor renewal applicants are now able to renew their flight instructor certificates on a personal computer workstation and complete an approved flight instructor refresher clinic (FIRC) over the Internet. Some flight instructor renewal applicants have inquired about being able to mail in the required documents to renew their flight instructor certificates. The Certification and General Operations Branch, AFS‑810, has approved procedures that will allow a flight instructor renewal applicant whose flight instructor certificate has not expired (meaning the flight instructor has satisfactorily accomplished the flight instructor renewal requirements and has submitted an application prior to the expiration date of his or her flight instructor certificate) to renew his/her flight instructor certificate by sending the application and superseded flight instructor certificate to his or her jurisdictional FSDO via the mail delivery. The procedural requirements that must be followed to accomplish the flight instructor renewal requirements via the mail delivery service are as follows:

1. The flight instructor renewal applicant is required to submit an original completed FAA Form*8710‑1.

2. The flight instructor renewal applicant must submit his or her permanent flight instructor certificate.

3. The flight instructor renewal applicant must submit a copy of his or her identification that contains a picture of the applicant (driver’s license, military ID card, etc.). That copy of the applicant’s identification document must be notarized by a notary public.

4. If the flight instructor renewal applicant is renewing on the basis of satisfactory completion of a FIRC (i.e., §*61.197(a)(2)(iii)), the applicant will be required to submit a copy of his or her graduation certificate.

5. If the flight instructor renewal applicant is renewing on the basis of §*61.197(a)(2)(i) or (ii), the applicant must provide copies of the records that substantiate the training of “…*at least five students for a practical test for a certificate or rating and at least 80*percent of those students passed that test on the first attempt,” or having served as a “…*company check pilot, chief flight instructor, company check airman, or flight instructor in a part*121 or part*135 operation, or in a position involving the regular evaluation of pilots.” Those records must be notarized by a notary public.

6. The jurisdictional FSDO will then process the application file and issue the flight instructor renewal applicant a temporary airman certificate. The FSDO will then process the applicant’s file and temporary airman certificate to the FAA Airmen Certification Branch, AFS‑760, P.O.*Box*25082, Oklahoma*City,*OK*73125. The FSDO need not have a signed temporary airman certificate by the flight instructor renewal applicant in order to submit the applicant’s file to AFS‑760.

7. Per §*61.3(d)(1) (i.e., “or other documentation acceptable*to the Administrator”), the flight instructor renewal applicant may use the original of his or her FIRC graduation certificate and a copy of the superseded flight instructor certificate until the applicant’s permanent flight instructor certificate arrives. Or the flight instructor renewal applicant may use a copy of his or her FAA Form*8710‑1, Airman Certificate and/or Rating Application, and a copy of the superseded flight instructor certificate until the applicant’s permanent flight instructor certificate arrives.

[Whiteknight68]

I did it with American Flyers and went to the nearest US Embassy for the notarized document. No problem at all.:ok:

['I' in the sky]

I live in Spain nad have used Gleim sveral times.
It is true that definitions of notaries vary widely but somewhere in the requirements for this, it states the document can be witnessed by a US consular official so I use our nearesr US consul office, cost about 40 euros.

[NGFellow]

Spoke to American Flyers. The notary has to be a U.S, notary and so you would need to go to the US Embassy. Cost is a whopping $50!

[Squawk7777]

Wrong. For information like this, call the FAA. I called OKC and they confirmed that a foreign notary is accepted.

[captchopper]

Hey guys. Need some help here. I have completed the FIRC and got the graduation certificate, would be getting the Notary signature from US consulate tomorrow morning. As i am India i.e outside the US, which FSDO should I be then sending all the documents for my CFI renewal??

Thanks!

[flyingswiss]

I called the FAA too they said US Consulate/Embassy.....

[MarkerInbound]

Hey guys. Need some help here. I have completed the FIRC and got the graduation certificate, would be getting the Notary signature from US consulate tomorrow morning. As i am India i.e outside the US, which FSDO should I be then sending all the documents for my CFI renewal??



As the paper is processed in OKC, I'd call the Airman Certification Branch and check, but you might be able to send it straight to them.

Airmen Certification: Contact the Airmen Certification Branch (http://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/airmen_certification/contact_airmen_certification/)

If not, they could tell you which offices see a lot of foreign paperwork and might be a bit more familiar with the process.

[Squawk7777]

I don't understand why you all make it so complicated with the US public notary. As previously mentioned, I have used a public notary where I live in Europe and the FAA accepted it (called the "Tech people" in OKC - whatever that means). Then I followed the steps as per 8900 and mailed it to my FSDO. I assume if you do not have one in the US you can either use the NY IFO or OKC (FRA doesn't handle airmen matters; it all gets forwarded to the NY IFO).

[Squawk7777]

So what you were able to do is good on you but not what most folks have been told.

I'll contact the FAA to see if they can give me a written confirmation that a foreign notary is accept by OKC. I already have my new CFI and knowing the FAA there must be an internal rule/guidance about foreign documentation and notaries.

I'll keep this updated.

[MarkerInbound]

And that'll take what, six months or so?

[captainsuperstorm]

Dear CFIs,

I don't know about you, but I have renewed my cfi for over 10 years, and 5 times with American Flyer, and they have accepted any non US notarized signatures so far.
I think there is a grey law in the FAA system. Don't tell, don't ask!
Would be nice to have a clear answer from the FAA but I worry they enforce this law(requiring a US stamp) which make problematic for some of us to drive(or to fly) to a US embassy, US embassies are not in all countries.


I will make it clear:

go to FSDO, FAA,...
go to US embassy
go to a foreign notary if not in the States
go to a US army, air force, whatever...

if not in the burger country ,get your paper done, and send them REGISTERED with your notarized stamp to American flyer( they have an assistance program which cost 50$), and they will process your cfi ticket in 2 weeks and send you back your temporary CFI.

done it for 20 bucks by a european notaire, did that many time, no problem...
plus 50 $ for american flyer.

total cost 70$ plus stamp for 2 years CFI.
35$ a year.