Flybe Recruitment

[airpasty]

Just spoke to HR at Flybe and they're looking to recruit in the new year. Has anyone been to an interview in the past? What sort of questions are asked?

[angelorange]

This info is a few years ago now but:

Essentially an interview with HR, Mgt and Fleet Mage/Chief Pilot on Q400 at HQ Exeter. Then to Woodford for BAE 146 SIM ride - std stuff - basic instrument pattern work.

They were offering around £24k FO with £18k bond (3 yr) at the time. Fast Track commands were offered to those with over 1500h Turbine but still had to start on FO terms.

[Love_joy]

The gist of the above post is correct, but i believe recent sim checks (albeit a year or so ago) were all completed on the Beech 1900D at Farnborough.

It's very possible that as all the sims are brought in-house at Exeter shortly future sim checks will be done at the new facility.

Flybe has a history of recruiting from all backgrounds, but does prefer the Integrated route. There is a stream of guys n gals on various Flybe schemes graduating in the near future and they will take first available spaces.

At present there some new entrants biding their time as CC whilst they wait for their turn, so all in all could be a while for someone not already on the books.

It is a great airline to get started with, and some very interesting flying, but the first few years on the FO scale can be tricky as you can expect to be based away from home.

[Deano777]

The company will probably empty their myriad of hold pools first before taking on Mr Layman but that won't stop them interviewing etc. Everything obviously depends on numbers required.
The sim check is on the B1900 or the Saab340 (I heard the Saab had left Flightsafety). The bond is 3 years reducing and £13,500.
The sim check is fairly straight forward. Check ppjn.com, that profile on there is what I did.
As for interview questions, well I wrote all mine down but I'm away till Friday. I'll post them when I get back.

D777

oh, and forget fast track command, that won't happen with 2/3 the F/O population almost ready for command. Also to be considered you need 1500hrs on Flybe aircraft.

[EK4457]

airpasty,

from your previous posts I gather that you are a Dash-8 F/O and so probably have some sort of inside information (I'm sure you'll correct me if not!).

I was just wondering how 'official' this news is. I personally know of several F/O's (and Captains) working for UK airlines who say that there are rough plans to recruit in some form next year. Is this more of the same, or is this a bit more concrete?

Also, as mentioned above, how will this recruitment fit in with the many fATPL and MPL hold pools they have hoarded over the last 3 years?

[Love_joy]

Flybe are, or at least used to be quite insistent on sending you for a Jet Orientation Course prior to joining, this pushes the bond up to approx. 18k, reducing linearly from final check over three years.

Will depend on your background however

[Deano777]

I joined in 07 and didn't have to do a JOC. I was one stop modular.

[EK4457]

May be a silly question, but why would you need to do a JOC in order to fly a turbo prop?

EK

[G SXTY]

Not really a silly question; the logic is that it helps bridge the gap between flying a Duchess / Seneca and a high performance turboprop. The Q400 will climb at 3,000fpm without breaking sweat - at low levels it's pretty much like a jet, only more of a handful. The JOC is also a tailored to Flybe calls and SOPs, which provides a good head start for the type rating course.

From memory it was introduced in late 2007 or very early 2008, which is why Deano was spared it.

[Lord Spandex Masher]

...The Q400 will climb at 3,000fpm without breaking sweat - at low levels it's pretty much like a jet, only more of a handful...

Yeah...briefly, if you're just airborne, not full, and or trading energy. For instance, I've seen a Q400 at over 7,000fpm, briefly, but I won't claim it'll do it without breaking a sweat! Unlike a jet it won't maintain such a climb rate for very long. Like a Duchess won't maintain 700fpm for very long.

More of a handful? No.

Like a jet? Not really. Jet being a generic term. 146 or A380?! It's unlike any of the three jet types that I've flown. What are you comparing it to?

The reason for the JOC, as has always been the case, is an introduction to airline operations in a fairly benign sim using airline SOP's.

[shaun ryder]

Has he ever flown a jet?

[G SXTY]

And, as sure as night follows day, cometh the inevitable Pprune willy measuring contest. :ugh::ugh::ugh:

You're more than welcome to your opinion – mine is based on my own observations, as well as those of colleagues who have flown everything from fast jets to 747s. I have yet to meet anyone who regards the Q400 as an easy aircraft to fly, irrespective of background or experience level.

Someone asked, quite reasonably, why undertake a Jet Orientation Course to fly a turboprop. My point was that the Dash is a bit of a step up from light aircraft, and in performance terms is closer to a jet airliner than a Duchess. I am aware that it can't climb as high or as fast as a 737, or indeed carry as many passengers, but then again, I wasn't giving an aeronautics lecture or playing Top Trumps of civil airliners.

Meanwhile, back at the question, there are several threads on the wannabes forums which are worth digging out. The information will be a couple of years old now, but I'd be surprised if the format has changed much since then.

[Lord Spandex Masher]

Not willy waving at all because at no point have I said that anything I've flown is better than the dear Dash. Indeed, the dash does hold it's own in the domestic market, just. To compare the Dash to a jet is simply misinformation.

The Q400 isn't hard to fly, it's just different. The same way a 737 is different to a Concorde. Nothing more, nothing less.

[Finals19]

Chaps - enough posturing on the intricacies of flying and the stellar-like skills required to fly this and that...thread creep coming in here..

Back to the original subject - IF Flybe are looking to recruit in January, we need to establish whether this is for already graduated fATPL's from one stop modular / integrated, OR in fact for their cadet programs....if its for their cadet programs only (with a lead time of 1-2yrs?) then really this is no significant news.

If however its for fresh fATPL's, then thats excellent news. Hopefully it will mean they are going to empty their hold pools first, one of which I have patiently been swimming in for quite some time now...

:ok:

[bigjarv]

The dash has two jet engines on it, just the props are on the outside!

[EK4457]

I wondered how long it would take for someone to say that!

Back to the crux of the matter; is this rumoured recruitment just the emptying of current hold pools or a serious attempt to take on low hour guys and instructors?

EK

[Lord Spandex Masher]

May be a silly question, but why would you need to do a JOC in order to fly a turbo prop?

EK, the simple answer is that you don't. You don't even need to do a JOC to fly a 'jet'. Think of it as yet another revenue stream.

Flybe have, in the past, employed many many freshly qual'd CPL/IR bods straight out of flying school. I know some who only had a total time of about 150 hours - and they went straight on to the 146 before the Dash with no problems.

The name JOC is also a bit of a misnomer as there was a training academy that used to do a 'JOC' on a Kingair sim. The course is only an introduction to the way you operate an airliner with two crew, checklists and SOPs etc..

If you can fly a Duchess or a 172 then you can fly a Q400, it's very benign albeit with more complicated systems.

As far as recruitment goes Flybe will only take on the bare minimum of newbies, from any background. Whether that is to cover any potential expansion or because Frenchy may have had a whiff of many unhappy pilots who are planning to go elsewhere who knows!

[5 RINGS]

a captain who sadly recently retired from the company, and who was an ex Test Pilot would disgaree strongly with you...but I guess his opinion is not relevant to you...:ugh:

[Deano777]

It's only an aeroplane chaps, does it REALLY matter? :rolleyes:

[Lord Spandex Masher]

5 Rings, if it was really that difficult to fly then how do you explain all the 200 hour new guys that can fly it, and fly it well? Never mind opinions the proof is in the pudding, so to speak.

If you or G SXTY find it hard to fly then so be it, we all have our own limits and we won't hold it against you.

But maybe it's the ego-stroking 'greasers' that you yearn for, and that's more a factor of geometry and not skill or ease of flying isn't it.

[Lord Spandex Masher]

It's about Flybe recruiting. These people will be recruited to fly the Dash. It is important to give them correct information and not 'big up' the Dash.

It's not a jet*, it doesn't handle like a jet*, it hasn't got the performance of a jet*. It is an overpowered (when it's not full) turbo prop with similar performance to an ATR 72-600. You don't hear ATR pilots comparing their steed to a jet* do you?

Yes it's quirky, but so is everything else you'll ever fly. And yes a mishandled approach or engine failure will result in a bruised ego and a bruised 'plane whichever type you happen to be flying at the time - Jet* or turboprop, or glider, or Chipmunk, or 172, or Duchess, or hot air balloon.

And no, at the moment, I haven't got anything better to do. What would you suggest?

*Again, jet is a generic term, which one does it compare to?

[Lord Spandex Masher]

Wingowango, you must be an eternal optimist to think, or even suggest, that anyone being recruited onto the Dash now will be flying an Embraer "soon". More misinformation. Correct they won't give a f*** and the won't give a f*** if it climbs at 3000fpm or not?!

If you had bothered to read my posts you will see that I have already offered my opinion of the recruitment at Flybe.

Deano, the only nonsensical part of this thread is comparing a Dash to a 'jet'.

If you could suggest which 'jet' G sxty was alluding to we might be able to put this part of the conversation to bed.

And no, I still haven't got anything better to do.

[SolentFlyer]

Does the new requirement on the flybe website of a minimum of 90% average mark for the ATPL exams apply to experienced first officers?

[choppercopper 99]

SolentFlyer,

I would say the answer to your question is in the wording on the website.

Newly qualified pilots should have completed either an Integrated or Modular flying course at a recognised Flight Training Organisation (FTO). A minimum of 90% average at ground school stage of training is required. In addition to holding a valid UK CAA or JAR licence and medical on application First Officer candidates should also have completed a Multi Crew Co-operation course. Modular candidates should have completed training at a single FTO, not including basic PPL training or ATPL theory study and examination.

Your research done for you!

CC99

[flatliner]

Hi Guys

I had a search and couldn't find it .Could anybody tell me what a first year Dash 8 Captian would approximately take home monthly ?

[Desk-pilot]

I'm afraid I have no inside knowledge of future recruitment plans but I suspect with the market opening up and morale at a low ebb in Flybe at present due to the management attitude in recent pay negotiations it may not be too long until recruitment of F/O's becomes necessary.

Regarding the opportunity to rapidly progress to a jet then I'm afraid that the situation is unpredictable. The company line is that most of the 40 E175 firm orders will be deployed overseas and so will not improve the chances of current pilots moving to the jet. Others however suspect that the company's renewed enthusiasm for a single (turboprop level) payscale is due to their intention to replace Q400's with E175's on a one for one basis as leases come up on the former. Most people suspect that the truth will be in the middle somewhere.

For info F/O's who joined 3-4 years ago are just starting to get on the jet at less popular bases. For Captains you're probably looking at 10+ years for a jet command. Frankly you'll achieve a jet command quicker at BA than at Flybe as things stand!

Finally a word on performance. The Q400 doesn't offer jet performance by any means, but it is a huge step up in performance from a Seneca and posesses similar systems and avionics to a jet so that operating it is similar. Those who I respect and have flown both say the Q400 is more of a challenge than jets they've flown. This is due to:

It has some avionics quirks that can really trip you up
Its ice protection systems are totally manual
Its power levers are highly sensitive right where you don't want them to be and there is no autothrottle.
In an engine failure situation like all turboprops it has a whole extra set of levers to worry about/feather/do something useful with etc.

Couple that with the fact that it does have power by prop standards - we used to fly up to 270kts IAS down to around FL100 and we frequently climb out at 240kts. Perhaps the best analogy I can give is that if an Embraer 195 is an Audi R10, then a Dash 8 is a Caterham or TVR. The R10 is faster in a straight line but less of a challenge and arguably less rewarding for the aviator in you.

Desk-pilot

[Calmcavok]

£53,500 + £1.90/hr TAFB
This should increase when the current pay negotiations come to a conclusion, a 6.1% rise is being sought, I would hope that the settled figure won't be too far off that.

If you put in 4%+ pension contribution, company will add 12%, though think this is after a year or two service, their contribution is lower initially.

[flatliner]

Thanks cavok

I suppose that works out about 4000 pounds a after tax a month :eek:

[Calmcavok]

Google something like 'net salary calculator' that'll give you an accurate-ish answer, but should be in the order of £3100

[Burpbot]

"Dash 8 is a Caterham or TVR"

WHO ARE YOU KIDDING!!! I would liken it more to a shopping trolley! You know the one you always get with a wonkey wheel you cant steer straight!

But at the end of the day who gives a sh@t! Its a job it pays the bills(just) thats all the matters.

As for new hires, a constant stream of various types of cadets arrive from FTE or Oxford, as Flybe have invested money in these guys they get priority in the order of the hold pool. As the sooner they are been paid the sooner the company begings to re-coup its investment.

But once demand out strips the flow of cadets I would expect the hold pool to get shallow, and interviews will happen.

[Lord Spandex Masher]

Perhaps the best analogy I can give is that if an Embraer 195 is an Audi R10, then a Dash 8 is a Caterham or TVR. The R10 is faster in a straight line but less of a challenge and arguably less rewarding for the aviator in you.

Arguably that depends on each individual concerned. Why do most people want to fly the Embraer if it is less rewarding? You can't cite the extra 300 quid a month as great compensation either.

It has some avionics quirks that can really trip you up
Its ice protection systems are totally manual
Its power levers are highly sensitive right where you don't want them to be and there is no autothrottle.
In an engine failure situation like all turboprops it has a whole extra set of levers to worry about/feather/do something useful with etc.

Again, to which 'jet' are you comparing?

- Avionic quirks, every type will have these if you don't understand what you're putting in or why you're getting something out, a proper FMS has it's quirks and problems aswell.

- Manual ice protection, yes, you have to turn them on all on your own, but unlike some old turboprops your boots are split and cycle automatically as opposed to the full length boot which needs to be monitored and cycled manually, so not really totally manual are they? The 146 and the 737 have manual ice protection too, and they're jets.

- True, but you get used to it and autothrottle is sometimes as useful as not having it at all. Also a jet engine is less responsive when you need it to be more so, which would you rather have?

- What, two more levers are hard to cope with?! Levers which it doesn't need either, great idea that one! The C/L's also double as fuel cut off switches. So for an engine failure there are the same number of required actions as there are on the 195.

we used to fly up to 270kts IAS down to around FL100 and we frequently climb out at 240kts

Not using the correct profiles then, don't worry we all did it. Why, because the Dash is too slow to operate properly in todays air traffic environment. VMO exceedence ring any bells?

I agree with everything else you've said though;) Especially the TVR bit as they have a similar reliability history!

[bigjarv]

Spandex! You are a moron!!!!! I mean that in a loving way! The dash is a boll@x aeroplane designed by a 2 year old ergonomics student!! Where shall we put the switches? Well, we'll put one here cause it looks good and we'll put one here cause they will never find it and we will put one here that actually literally does nothing (those who fly it know what it is!!) and then we'll put a whole bunch of warning lights here cause they will never be able to work out what has gone wrong and we will make them come on in such a combination that they won't have any idea what to do and THEN we will give them an emergency checklist that regularly makes you do the wrong thing..... Awesome!

I flew a jet (beautiful machine to operate also with foibles but still great) and now I fly the dash. It is rubbish!! I love it too cause you really have to fly it (about the only thing that is similar to a piston) but seriously you sit in the ground school for it thinking.... Is this machine for real?! There was also a lot of... "but WHY does it do that! That's ridiculous! Who would design something like that!"! I assume you flew the dash before you flew a jet (when you knew no better). If it was the other way round you too would be saying it is (and I choose my words carefully) and "interesting" plane to fly! I can only assume you have forgotten!

I call you a loving moron cause you associate the dash to a twin 4-6 seat piston!! What are you on about?!?!?! That is ridiculous!! Funny too!! I mean there are 70 seats of inertia difference between them to start with ("if you can fly a Duchess or a Seneca you can fly a dash" mmmmmmnnnnnnaaaahhhhhh... cause the Duchess had loads of glass cockpit stuff!) and the real difference between them is you can reliably land a duchess well where as it is total pot luck on the dash!! I'm obviously very good but for the usual pilot its hard!!!

As has been said before, the dash is like an Austin Allegro built on a Friday afternoon. I prefer the TVR analogy thou! It's a hard aeroplane to fly because it makes no sense and it's more like a jet (and actually has two FADEC controlled jet engines) than a piston, mark my words!

I too have nothing better to do cause I'm always tech!

[bigjarv]

Oh and for a serious response, Deskpilot is spot on!

For the sake of the thread I have no idea what is going on recruitment wise. I don't think anyone one does. I just wanted to call spandex a moron for being and argumentative jet jockey trying to prove..... what point exactly?!?!

[Chief Brody]

Im always bemused to witness individuals who by the very nature of their jobs should have pragmatism, logic and common sense in spades.

I mean really guys and gals what would Dr Freud say - think about it, as pilots were all borderline obsessed with size and propulsion. Its funny stuff when you get down to it.

Ive flown the dash and the way I describe it as a bit of a sod to hand-fly but very satisfying when operated well - because of the shear number of potential trip-ups built into it. When you do a 6 sector day (like we did out of Belfast in 07) in winter and walk away from the day ASR free you feel good about yourself.

I now fly the mini bus and imho its significantly less stressful environment to spend the day in:

No trimming
No aileron during efato
AP at 100 ft
Autoland in cat 3a conditions on one engine in a 20 crosswind
Alternate gear lowering takes about 5 seconds and can be done with a cup of tea in the other hand
You can fly HDG and VS or Track and Flight Path Vector - meaning on NPAs you can track perfectly with no lateral corrections and fly a perfect slope angle, again on one engine! - love it
Electronic checklist which self appears
Can quite literally be flown with two fingers from setting TO power
Seat reclines to an old style club class recline angle and you can put your feet up onto the foot rests

But all that said, give me a 6 month secondment back onto the headache with wings and Id bite your arm off - but not on Flybe wages, which are utter pooh. When I worked there I was on 29k - after loans, bills, food and uni payback crap I had about 120 quid a month for moi. Now I can actually make do on that - but throw into the equation the car not passing its MOT or the washing machine throwing a wobbly and life becomes tighter than a scotsman at a pay toilet. But hey you're an airline pilot right - major bragging rights to all the ladies in the bar, sadly not actually - youre brassic and a few rounds of drinks later and your 120 leftover moola is gone...

Anyway about flybe recruitment.........

CB

[proceeding outbound]

Just before we get back on topic.............

I have never flown the Q400 (thankfully by the sounds of it) but how did it ever get certified if its that difficult and dangerous? Imagine if the press get hold of this thread!

Back to recruitment - only one way to find out - apply. I'm sure all applications will only be considered through the website.

Bigjarv, are you enjoying the cold crew meals? I do miss those days in SOU on the barbie jet. Remember your accent when you read the checklist!!!!!
Regards
eagle(blind in one)eye:ok:

[bigjarv]

Hmmmm! Who could you be?!?!? And how do you know its me?! Intriguing!! Yeah the only reason the press cant touch us is cause we are all underpaid heros that fly it and save the day everyday! And we have the biggest props in the business!!!

You win chief!!!!

[bigjarv]

Ahhhhh! I have worked it out! Is that you hawkeye! I'm actually laughing about that now! My girlfriend thinks I'm mental just giggling here! Awesome! Yeah good times! How are ya?! Switching to PM!

[Wear the Fox Hat]

My girlfriend thinks I'm mental just giggling here!

BigJarv I'm just surprised you have a girlfriend, well one that breathes anyway! :O

[bigjarv]

Me too!!!!!

[Lord Spandex Masher]

Cheers for the big bite big jarv!

Just some points:

I assume you flew the dash before you flew a jet (when you knew no better)

No, the other way around in fact.

you associate the dash to a twin 4-6 seat piston!! What are you on about?!?!?! That is ridiculous!! Funny too!! I mean there are 70 seats of inertia difference between them to start with

As there are between a Dash and a 'jet' but hey, lets not use the same yardstick!

cause the Duchess had loads of glass cockpit stuff

What difference does that make? You can still, I hope, control an aircraft with reference to a 'real' or a glass AH can't you?!

the real difference between them is you can reliably land a duchess well where as it is total pot luck on the dash

Ah ha, the real crux of the matter. This is what I've been trying to get you Dash pilots to admit to for ages! So thanks. But a rough landing does not a bad aircraft make. Like I said it's to do with the design and not the ease with which you can fly it. I gave up trying to land it smoothly and just landed it properly instead!

Oh and for a serious response

Boring!

trying to prove..... what point exactly?!?!

None, none at all, just killing time having a robust discussion!

Chief,
No trimming
No aileron during efato
AP at 100 ft
Autoland in cat 3a conditions on one engine in a 20 crosswind

Not really flying then! More akin to being dragged around the sky by a robot.;)

Im always bemused to witness individuals who by the very nature of their jobs should have pragmatism, logic and common sense in spades.

Freud would say...umm...the devil makes work for idle hands:E

Yours,

L. Moron.

[bigjarv]

No, the other way around in fact.

Moron!


As there are between a Dash and a 'jet' but hey, lets not use the same yardstick!

Moron


What difference does that make? You can still, I hope, control an aircraft with reference to a 'real' or a glass AH can't you?!

Moron


Boring!


Moron


None, none at all, just killing time having a robust discussion!


Moron!!!!!

[Lord Spandex Masher]

You can do better than that.

[bigjarv]

I know!!!!

[Calmcavok]

BALPA quoted recently that Flybe don't utilise ~70% of it's standby cover. Crazy. Are you all on on AS or home SBY?!

[Coffin Corner]

Both CalmCavok

[Burpbot]

Ah im sure many will be inspired to join flybe after reading the above posts :rolleyes:

[assymetricdrift]

It's a fantastic thread creep...

However, really nothing here is relevant to the original discussion - and it did turn into a discussion about the merits of having something that will go for longer, higher and faster than something we can get up 4 times a day (something I believe the 195 guys don't know too much about!)

In order to bring it back on topic though...

There must be quite significant holding pools in the company still at the moment? I ran into a few new guys a couple of days ago and they said that there were 12 new starters on their course alone... So where is everybody going??? I didn't think that there were that many leavers so far??

[Coffin Corner]

There aren't that many leaving mate, it's to fill holes in the far reaching places that nobody wants to go, i.e. IOM - BHD - GCI - JER etc etc. A couple have gone to EDI, and a few are off round the network to cover retirements and the commands that have been granted this year (about 13 so I was told)

[assymetricdrift]

Yeah, I wasn't too sure - it just seemed that suddenly over the course of the last 6 months, everybody pretty much got the bases they wanted. I know I did and I can name at least 10 more beneath me on seniority who are coming here too from this bidding alone... and I'm quite junior too!

However, whichever way you look at it, I don't think that we will be recruiting too much for the next year. Those hold pools have had a healthy couple of years to swell up and I would be surprised if those don't meet the crew requirement for this year.

We shall see though - I might be totally up the wrong tree

[Lord Spandex Masher]

and it did turn into a discussion about the merits of having something that will go for longer, higher and faster

Not the merits, or lack thereof, of anything. Just fact, as opposed to the continuous self aggrandizing you normally hear from a Q400 pilot.

than something we can get up 4 times a day

Of course, when they aren't ground gripping until the engineers turn up with some Bombardier Viagra.

something I believe the 195 guys don't know too much about!)

Another old chestnut well and truly roasted. Notwithstanding the fact that the 195 guys spent years doing what you are now before doing what they do now. Don't worry, if you spend as long at Flybe as they have you'll achieve what they have.

Do you think that bitter delusional turbo prop pilots are what potential recruits want to end up flying with?

[assymetricdrift]

I don't give a rats arse about the 195 vs the Q400 debate. I cannot give a flaming toss into the bowels of hell. I've got many bigger and larger things to worry about in my life than what you think of the Q400 pilots/ what the Q400 pilots think about the 195 pilots.

Is it really indicative of the morale of this company that every thread that we have on here turns into some great argument?

For christs sake - this is a thread about recruitment for the airline.

Now... can this please get back on topic? Or failing that... locked?

Thank you

[Lord Spandex Masher]

So don't perpetuate it then. Easy.

By the way this is a discussion, we are allowed to discuss and present our points of view and opinions. We don't need to get heated dear boy. A discussion will run it's course and may produce fresh discussion on a different subject matter. You can't tell anyone what they may or may not discuss.

[bigjarv]

Such a moron!

[airpasty]

Gosh, I cant believe my original thread was about recruitment at FlyBE

Well just to get us back on topic, I phoned HR at Exeter again yesterday to ask some more questions, I told them about my hours on the dash (just shy of 3000) and told them that I'd like an Exeter base if possible, she said that Exeter is fine so long as I'm willing to wait in the pool for a vacancy. She said I'd be starting on just shy of £30K and that direct entry command is unlikely. In fact people who already have a command and that are in or going to be in the holding pool will be asked to join as an F/O. She also said that I should check the website from now until Christmas as they're looking at opening pilot vacancies soon.

I forgot to ask when they actually start paying you i.e join date or FLC.

And as to those of you who keep comparing the dash to cars/jets and arguing about it e.t.c. e.t.c..... well, how much time have you got on your hands? perhaps it's time to find another hobby. I fly the dash 300 and it's got some of the 400 oddities (so has the 100 and 200). Well it's a plane deal with it, cant see the sense in getting worked up about it.

[VFE]

Hear hear Airpasty.

Their online application allows updating (seems I hadn't updated my details for some time!). Does anyone know whether this is something that is likely to be observed at HR HQ, or does one ideally need to follow up these changes directly? Obviously, one wouldn'yt wish to cause a nuisance but if these old applications fester in the recesses of their databanks I would like to know!

Cheers,

VFE.

[Lord Spandex Masher]

She said I'd be starting on just shy of £30K

Airpasty, did you ask what her definition of "just shy" was?

Sorry about your thread, I just think it's important to publish accurate information.

[GusHoneybun]

I forgot to ask when they actually start paying you i.e join date or FLC.

They started paying me a full salary from day 1.


I doubt we'll see the need for DE commands at flybe for a very long time. About two thirds of the dash FO's and nearly all of the Jet FO's have the required hours for (q400) command. Joining flybe now and you'll be joining at the bottom of this very long queue for upgrade.
However, the company are currently ramping up training for command upgrades. The problem is that this training stops short of sending the FO's off to the SIM for LHS checks and training. There are about 20'ish guys in this position at the moment. The reasoning is that if there is a max exodus of skippers (like the birmingham 28), then these guys are 3-4 weeks away from being released to the line as Captains. Of course these psuedo-skippers are still on FO pay.

Flybe's recruitment model works simply as Captains leave - replace with expensive (year 4-5) FO - replace expensive FO with cheap cadet FO. Which, works out cheaper as you have replaced one expensive captain with a cheap year 1 captain, and also replaced an expensive FO with a year 0 FO.
This will continue until some link in the chain is broken.

[proceeding outbound]

So just a phone call to HR and they (she) offer you a job and the base you want as well, no interview or sim check?????? You must be related to uncle Jim:E

That's not how things worked when I was at Flybe!

[Serenity]

they`ll tell you all you want to hear.
They promised me the earth, just what i wanted to hear and several years later still waiting for any of it to come true, - static market granted!!

if you want a particular base, command or seat on a 195 then be prepared for a long wait, and as someone else said, join the back of a very long que with everyone else already there!!

All good flying in the mean time, a fun and interesting place to be, but management have a habit of leaving all in the dark and waiting while they move in mysterious ways!!

and dont count on rushing onto a 175 either!!!

[Otto Throttle]

Ooooo, I can see a lot of applications mysteriously being 'lost' in the system if our Flight Ops Recruitment Manager is referred to as working in HR once more. Bad wannabees...............bad wannabees! :}

And we can have as many 'experienced' FOs as you like ready for upgrade, but if the TRI/TRE skips leave the company and none of the genuine experienced skips want the job (a bit like '04/'05) then you will definitely be looking at DEC provided the have the requisite qualifications and experience. I believe dear old Liz may have a small surplus of just such people in the very near future.

Hmmmm......wonder what might happen here.......:hmm:

[six-sixty]

Pasty, unless things have changed a lot, as far as I am aware you'll be paid from your join date. For now, flybe are still a proper company. I'm not sure about flight duty allowance for groundschool or initial sim etc, that might have changed to some kind of per diem. Good luck.

[Deano777]

airpasty

If you think you'll start on anything near £30k think again, you'll start on Year 1 F/O salary which is about £25k
If you think you'll get an Exeter base any time soon think again, you'll be swimming in the pool for a fair while. Exeter is losing a Dash for the winter, and is not regaining it for the summer, this leaves them at least 33% over crewed.
If you haven't got any command time in your 3,000hrs on the Dash then forget a DEC, infact, forget a DEC anyway. I can't see many, if any TREs leaving as Otto alludes to. Even if we did lose a few can you really see current Dash captains turning down full jet salary and not accepting the job? I can't. Also the training dept. is slightly over crewed. All the ex bacon TRI/Es were made to do the job because they were getting paid the money after the "merger". Anyway, the talk of TRI/Es leaving is irrelevant, if they do leave then you won't be hiring DECs to take on those roles unless they have TRI/E on their licenses.
GusHoneyBun's last paragraph sums it up very nicely.

You get paid salary from day 1, expenses are paid during any (initial) training, can't remember about the FDP during training.

D777

p.s. I'm not sure the 300 has any Q400 "oddities", more like the Q400 has 300 oddities, because good ol' Mr Bombardier decided it was a clever idea to make it a common type :ugh:

[turbowhat]

Rumour around the network, all command upgrades have been suspended, some folk who have completed there command ground school have been told to jump back in the right hand seat!
:{

[tunawholesalers]

Air Pasty

If youre planning on leaving a command in ASW to join here as an FO, then take my advice - dont do it!!

You'll wait a fair while for an EXT base to start with just as an FO.
You'll wait years and years for a command here....theres one plane down in EXT and a queue of SFOs waiting for commands here aswell as the captains who left EXT to get a command and are now waiting to get back.
DECs are a none starter for years to come.
Q400&300 arent massively different other a few odd things and perf!

I did the same and, whilst i dont regret it, it might not be such a great move nowadays!

The biggest benefit you will get if you did do it is job security. Pay wise, i started on £30k with a 1 yr bond but i doubt you could haggle for that now. I dont earn much less than ASW capts with my fdp.

One thing i will say is - life is ALOT stricter and harder in Flybe than it is in ASW!

Good luck anyway.....both have got great crew to work with!

[Deano777]

tuna

There's now 2 Dash 8s in EXT, they had 3 in the summer but have now lost one permanently :ok:

[choppercopper 99]

Air Pasty,

Ignore Deano777, he is a grumpy bugger sometimes.;)

I Joined the company a couple of years a go. 2 FO's on my TR course (same date of joining) started on pay scale year 2, which is £29677. I understand they jumped to that scale as they had X amount of hours on an aircraft type over X amount of Kg MTOW. So not every new joiner starts on year 1 pay point.

In support of Deano777, I do find it very hard to believe there are seats to fill at EXT!!! There are quite a few FO's around the network that I know of that want to relocate to EXT. However as always us pilots are never aware of the big picture, who knows what they have planned!

As regards to FDP while training. If I remember correctly you don't get any. However the company will pay £15 per a day for your dinner which you claim back. Flybe do start paying 100% of your basic salary from day 1 though.

I will not get involved with the silly argument about how easy / hard the Q400 is to fly. I like it and thats that! Hope this helps?

Regards to my friend Deano777:ok:

Choppercopper 99:)

[tunawholesalers]

Deano,

Correct.....it was badly written on my behalf! Ut should have read - EXT is one plane down!

It was only last yr there was 4 q400 here! Never mind!!

Exeter Till I Die!!!

[Finals19]

Hmm...something doesn't add up here? We're coming into winter, by all accounts a quieter period, company reducing aircraft allocation to certain bases (e.g EXT) and yet they're about to recruit? Where are all these vacancies coming from...I didn't think the exodus had happened (yet).

I assume (and hope) if this is true that they are about to empty out their hold pools....I've become an olympic swimmer since my interview and sim check ages ago :ok:

[Deano777]

Me? Grumpy? :E

[EK4457]

I'd be very disappointed if that's all they're up to next year.

[Deano777]

Don't get too excited, they run these courses annually.

[Love_joy]

Back to recruitment....

Managed a little update over the last week from the guys in that area. As is well publicised at the moment, the MPL guys are edging closer to line flying.

Another batch of new entrants to the company have started, 5 or so, they have come from one of the many hold pools of newly qualified... I do not know how many are still swimming.

Unfortunatly, some very recent command upgrades have been put on hold. Probably a combination of some uncertainty over the winter program, or just generic rethinking. A shame for those guys, but I'm sure they'll be rescheduled in the very near future.

Gaps on the 195 have opened up as FO's realised commands on the Dash this summer, these are being back filled by Q4 FO's, and thus the gaps at the very bottom.

Flybe are very pragmatic, and do realise we will loose a lot of crews as the bigger boys continue recruiting, recent loses have been to the sandpit etc... Expect to see reasonable movement from the various hold pools in the new year.

[airpasty]

I heard a few days ago that lots of people are leaving Flybe for bigger and better things. HR Says no recruitment until the end of the year but maybe before. Some say the holding pool is full and some say nearly empty...

Really want to fly for them so can anyone shed some light on whats really going on please?:ugh:

[six-sixty]

My guess is about 70% of the pilot workforce are utterly desperate to leave, but no real meaningful doors open right now for people masses of Q400 hours, either seat. The only guys getting jobs right now are those with jet hours, but with the number resigning seemingly on the up, will hopefully in time give other escapees the currency they need to get out, and obviously make space on the Q400 fleet.

Bear in mind though relations between the pilots and management are currently in the gutter, there are anecdotal threats of redundancies and hull disposals. We don't yet know if there is substance to this or if it would be retribution for everyone standing up and saying they've had enough of being treated with contempt for years. Judging by your name though you may well be one of the tiny number of people for whom Flybe might be a step up. Best of luck.

[HidekiTojo]

So far I know of a dozen that have left to Gulfair, at least one to Lingus, one to Jet2, one to a 747 operator.

Anyone have any other info?

There will certainly be no redundancies thats just speculation/evil rumour.

[dingbat2407]

I had been told that they would be opening up the online application again and recruiting by the end of the month (I was told this in March), still no sign of this happening. Its so frustrating because I would jump at the chance to work for Flybe.

[Shadow Walker]

you and "airpasty" sound like managenment .................."would love to work for flybe " this is getting pathetic !!!!

[flyingcamel]

I would suggest that until the dust settles on the 'pay and scheduling' talks with ACAS, the company won't know how much is in the coffers. Consequently they wont know how many new pilots they can afford (if any,) and likewise with any shiny new hairyplanes.

With a confirmed order of 35 Embraers to be delivered ca 4-5 a year, I doubt we'll see all of those airframes as there doesn't seem to be much in the way of any plan yet as far as I can see.

Like the man said, doom and gloom................

:{:=

[Otto Throttle]

Things may change in the not-too-distant future. This week's Flight International has a recruitment advert for non-rated pilots at Fly Dubai. Plenty of Flybe pilots in both seats meeting the minimum requirements for FOs at least.

[dingbat2407]

I don't think its pathetic, I have been looking for an airline job for a while now whilst struggling to build my hours in a job which only gives me a few per month. I know many people within flybe, most love the job and don't want to leave, that is why I would jump at the chance to work for Flybe!!! By the way I am not management and have no affiliation with Flybe whatsoever, I am mearly expressing an opinion seconded by many out there looking for their first break in to the airline world.

[PPRuNeUser0178]

Slightly off topic, but I have heard through the grapevine that TRSS may be on the way back at EasyJet in the next 12 months or so.

I should imagine if that were to be the case then the likes of Flybe, Eastern, BMI regional etc may stand to loose a few in that direction.

[adverse-bump]

How is this thread different to the one you started in October?

[Snigs]

Most of the E175's will end up in Europe flying for an autonomous company (maybe "Flybe Europe"), and will most probably be crewed locally. Apparently there is a "big" announcement due soon!

[Whispering Giant]

And how often have we heard that before - every 6 month's we hear there's rumour of some Big announcment, but nothing ever comes of it...

:hmm::hmm::hmm::hmm:

[adverse-bump]

How long before the announcement that they are taking dec with no command experience at there most popular base?

[six-sixty]

er, about a million years? Bit of a strange comment that.

And local EU pilots on the continent? Yeah, cuddly employee friendly flybe are just gonna love continental employment laws.

[Lord Spandex Masher]

...again!.......

[BUGS/BEARINGS/BOXES]

I reckon some 'stronger' link with either AF/KLM or IAG is on the cards. Anyone else?

Oh and airpasty......HR stay out of Pilot recruitment at BE, thank god! It is a flt ops driven procedure, conforming to the usual do's and dont's of HR HR-ness. One must mind one's Ps and Qs now.

As more pilots aspire to greater things............more sprogs will be required to be judged by the cabin crew.....for tea making skills.

[Coffin Corner]

AF/KLM?

Finnair. Will we need to recruit? Probably.

[Burpbot]

Redundancy my arse! 20 new joiners in the training system right now!!!! Although hear the mass exodus has begun in bhd so may be some external new hires soon.

[assymetricdrift]

I have a sneaky... we might be about to buy out someone unexpected. Someone in Finland... Finnair is too obvious... I reckon that airline we lost out to in the deal... Finncom was it?

[Coffin Corner]

Well we won't be buying out Finnair as you say ad, but something in Finland is happening. Whether it involves current crew or not remains to be seen.

I also hear alot of jet drivers have resigned in the last week or two with more to come.

[flyingcamel]

If the exodus really has started (it seems all the low payers and poor treaters are having one!) then it's about time!

Bloody typical that we get another ash cloud right in the middle of our ACAS 'conciliation' talks.

It's all a conspiracy!

[ThePilot007]

what do they mean by 90%? Do they mean in the examination?