World Aeronautical Charts

[Damien1989]

Was with an instructor today trying to find low level routes through valleys. Comparing my 16th edition to my instructors 11th edition (I think), there is a whole lot of unnecessary wavy detail which makes it so much harder to decipher valleys from other terrain. His was also made of a higher quality laminated like paper which he said had lasted him for years. I get maybe 6 or 7 navs in before my WACs are ripped and impossible to read down the folds. :ugh::ugh:
Just wondering how I might go about finding earlier editions of WAC charts for Australia?

[MakeItHappenCaptain]

The ones you are referring to were the cellosheen WAC charts (no longer in production, maybe airservices realised they made more money when people had to replace the plain paper ones more often?)

Same effect can be achieved with contact.

PS. CAR requirement is for you to have CURRENT documents.
http://www.airservices.gov.au/publications/current/sup/s9-h43.pdf

Although Airservices do need to get their arses into gear and update THIS list.....:ugh:

[MCKES]

Go and get you Wac laminated if your doing lots of training, Will last you throughout the whole lot and years to come. You have to find somewhere that will do the really thin laminate though. It is much better than contact. Then just get a set of OHT pens and use those to draw on it.

[Ex FSO GRIFFO]

I make my 'new' ones last a little longer by cutting off the excess, and folding them all in the same way as RNC's fold.
Then putting sticky tape - can I say Durex here(?) - on the folds on the reverse side.
That way, the paper does not tear along the fold, and its easier to work with....
And I'm a scrooge when it comes to spending $$'s on things we are FORCED to purchase to remain 'current'....Bah Humbug!!!:ugh::ugh:

Used to 'suggest' to students that they do likewise....saves a couple of $$'s.

[The Green Goblin]

hmmmm I still have all the good old cellosheen ones. I preffered the paper ones as they were far easier to mark with pencils however!

I worked out with the cellosheen ones that you could write on them with pen and then use an eraser and it would rub off ;)

Now I know you can't get them anymore I'll have to stop lending them out!

[Damien1989]

I am aware of the currency regs. However, we compared published heights of terrain and the difference was rarely greater than 50ft. For the sake of staying legal, if it came down to working out LSALTs etc I'd still have the current maps there. From a safety perspective surely it'd be better to have an easy to read map and have the eyes focused outside at 500ft agl in a valley rather than stuffing around trying to interpret some over-detailed garbage.

Thanks for the advice, will give the lamination a go.

[ForkTailedDrKiller]

What is it that you do with WACs that wears them out? Have you not heard of GPS?

Dr :8

[glekichi]

Not that WAC charts are any good for navigating at 500' anyway, but I guess in some places they are the only option.
The nz WAC charts have "should only be used for plannning and flight above 10,000'" written prominently on the front. They also have airspace marked on them. Not that friggin hard :ugh: Why do we lag so badly behind nz in areas like this?

[compressor stall]

If you're that low GeoScience Australia have all of Australia at 1:250k in raster format. Download and print your route...

[HarleyD]

I do the pretty much the same as Ex FSO Griffo does and have done for many years.

I cut all excess outside the actual map border (only just leaving the lat long refs on the very edge), except for the chart Number and name at the top LH. I then refold by making first fold vertical in (the new) middle with map face to face, then next folds vertical half way back so map bit now faces out. last fold horizontal, at midpoint of chart, to the back which leaves the LH top corner of the map out, with a tag with the map name poking up at the top. i then stick them in an ASA WAC folder three maps per pocket, staggered downwards so i can see all the names easily. I have almost all of Aus covered in a single folder.

The individual map is smaller and much more convenient to use.

I have never bothered to cover them as this is a wast of time i think. They are hard to write on in pencil, become bulky, more difficult to fold, and the contact shrinks and wrinkles. In standard form they easily last several years and in any case need revision regularly, maybe not every single edition of every map, though i do replace the capital cities fairly regularly. I also make what used to be called a 'Laverton special' from a melbourne and a hamilton where i overlap them, cut the excess off the middle, and stick them together with 'magic tape'. covers heaps of vic and all on the one map.

In any case they are mainly for planning and in flight back up and rarely come out of the folder, though i do keep them handy especially on remote sectors.

HD

The only time i have used a laminated map was when i was ferrying an ag plane in torrential rain and the map over my knees and legs stopped the water that was coming through the airvents in the cabin roof from soaking me completely.

HD

[HarleyD]

Just remembered another bit of info that can help with planning.

If your folks have an old 1970's Readers Digest Atlas of Australia, this completely covers all of Australia and PNG with 1:1,000,000 maps that are exact copies of the WAC's of the day. By the look of the ages of some posters, you better check your grand parents library I reckon.

I have one that i picked up at a flea market for a couple of bucks. It is my primary source of PNG Charts which can be very hard to find. I don't think PNG has changed that much since the 1970's, only a bit more primitive these days than it was then i suppose.

HD

[Ex FSO GRIFFO]

You have EXCELLENT TASTE, and a GREAT IDEA Mr 'Harley'......

Best Regards to a 'Fellow Flier'.....:ok::ok::p:p

I have met up with a few of the oldie 'students', and some actually still do this....for over *# years......"When you're on a good thing......you can finish it!!:ok:

p.s. Better check some of those older 'spot heights' of the PNG charts...don't wanna get any 'surprises' if ya go back one day....
I amended quite a few of mine - a loong time ago..

[harrowing]

World Aeronautical Chart becomes the acronym WAC.
So why do people say WAC chart, similarly with ATM machine and PIN number, to name just a few? :ugh:
Bowl of milk for me and off to jet blast. :=

[drpixie]

Damien does have a point.

At some stage, a few editions ago, they seem to have removed most of the terrain shading. The contour lines are still there, but the ridge/valley shading is much reduced.

It was easier to read the old ones - and plenty of people keep them. (After all, they do publish a list of changes, so you always annotate your old WAC and have current elevations, etc.)

[RatsoreA]

FTDK - Yeah, GPS is the bomb...

A friend of mine uses a Panasonic Toughbook with scanned and geo-referenced charts. No stupid folding maps, and for added benefit, the toughbook has built in GPS, which shows the posistion on the map.

And you can use it for any chart, VNC, WAC, VTC etc etc etc.

Maptrax used to sell them, now they don't, but if you have access to a giant scanner and some geo-reffing talents, it's the way to go!

[sisemen]

One of the things that we used to do in the RAF was to put contact (Fablon for ex-UKers) on the printed side, run over with a warmish iron and then soak in a bath of luke warm water for a while. Remove and then rub/strip off the paper from the back. It will leave the printed side firmly imprinted on the contact which can then folded in any way you like (even scrunched up like a handkerchief) and it won't come apart at the crease. It also has the added advantage of cutting down weight and lasts for ever.

Might take a bit of experimentation to determine the optimum soaking time.

It works :ok:

[Ex FSO GRIFFO]

Hey 'Dr.' , Mr 'R' et al.....

At $11 or so for a WAC vs a 'Coupla' grand for a decent GPS......that's a HEAP of WAC's....

map, ruler, eyeball mk1....compass etc....

I may 'sometimes' be tempo 'unsure' of my exact posn....but whilst there's fuel in dem tanks - I'm never 'lost'!!:ok:

Mind you, a GPS at night is LUVLY!!:p

[ForkTailedDrKiller]

Griffo, if you re-read my post, I was not suggesting that you abandon your WACs - just questioning why they would wear out so fast in the GPS era as they did in the "old" days when WACs were your lifeline.

I think the greatest advance that has occurred in my 37 yrs of flying is NEVER being in that no-mans land between position fixes, ie GPS, whether VFR or TSO129/146 IFR.

Dr :8

[Ex FSO GRIFFO]

Its OK Doc...

Was only kidden ya....the acft I fly mostly 'cause' I'm in a syndicate which owns it, has one of those 'newfangled thinga-me-jigs'...
I do know how to turn it on, but usually don't, 'cause I really don't know all its buttons as yet - and except for Night VFR, I'm more 'comfortable' doin' wot I've always done.....

But it IS nice to have 'it' confirm where you thinks you is ---you is!

And, re- 'when WACs were your lifeline'....
When I was flying around the Pilbara /Kimberley in dem good ole' days, never went anywhere without the Shell roadmap. (Late 60's early 70's)
True.
When I look back on some of my old WACs which I've saved for the hell of it, with the LACK of detail, dotted river courses, ephemeral lakes....(WTF?) its a wonder we found some of the MORE remote destinations....

But, we did. THAT's the AMAZING bit....we did.:ok:

Cheers....and may yr batteries NEVER go flat....
I know you've got several - I read yr posts. Keep up the good work...:ok::ok:

[ReverseFlight]

Another zero cost option from my initial IR instructor. Mark your charts pre-flight and then place them in large transparent cellophane bags recycled from your shopping trash. Works a treat. :ok:

[Atlas Shrugged]

I may 'sometimes' be tempo 'unsure' of my exact posn....but whilst there's fuel in dem tanks - I'm never 'lost'!!

Being lost is all in your head!

If you knew where you were 5 minutes ago, how can you possibly be lost?

[Ex FSO GRIFFO]

EXaccerrly!!!:ok:

I'm either 'here'...or 'there'.... or one third / half / one quarter between the 2....and at a G/S of..... = half an hour to lunch!

:eek:

[RatsoreA]

Gee Griffo, is that how Orville and Wilbur told you to do it?! :}

I must say, there are times when I just want to relax and enjoy the scenery, and the GPS and toughbook certainly reduce the workload signifigantly!

You should try switching it on and taking a look around sometime!!! :p :)