minimum transit times USA

[1DC]

I want to go to Orlando next April (Easter) with the family (7 of us) and the flight we would like to take only allows 1h 25m at Detroit to change aircraft.The flight is for sale but my travel agent says 1H 25m is not enough time to clear immigration and customs and make the next flight.Anyone have experience of Detroit and is she correct in her advice??
Appreciate a response..

[SwissRef]

I regularly transit through the US.

I can be through immigration, collected bags, through customs, rechecked bags and back through security within 30min (recent time at Newark).

BUT it has also taken me 3hours

And a friend took over 5 hours once the immigration person decided to be "real polite" with her.

I would say that you should allow 2-3 hours minimum. Your call, but it's too tight for me.

What you can do is book on the later one, and if you get through everything quickly, then before you re-check everything, ask if they can move you onto the earlier plane. If it is not full, and the later plane is full (or evening commuter flight), then they will do it for free normally as it gives them more seats to sell later.

[intortola]

Fully agree with SwissRef, last Saturday LHR-JFK-SJU i was at my new boarding gate approx 40 minutes after landing in JFK. This isnt always the case though i have also has times when it has taken 2+ hours and i have missed my onward connection.
As a side note, JFK was probably the quietest i have ever seen it in the AA terminal last Saturday.

[SeenItAll]

Agree with SwissRef's strategy. Going to Orlando via Detroit likely means you are on Delta/Northwest. This airline has about 6 nonstop flights per day between those points (and many more that would connect through Atlanta). While you would probably make the 1:25 connection, consider the consequences if you do not. Biggest concern would be the loads on the later flights if you missed your booked connection -- especially if it is close to Easter and have 7 passengers to be reaccommodated.

Note, too, that if your family is like mine, there is always someone who needs to stop at the restroom or look in at a gift shop when traversing an airline terminal. Unless you are very vicious in herding them, they will not move as fast as a single person might in running between flights.

Now if you are connecting in Detroit to a different airline (e.g., AirTran or Spirit) for your flight to Orlando, be much more cautious about any close connection. They have fewer frequencies, and if you are not booked on a single ticket, you might not be reaccommodated at all.

[1DC]

Thanks guys, i will take the advice and go via Atlanta. I thought perhaps Detroit might be quick because of limited International traffic but no point in tempting fate.......

[Hartington]

Actually, I suspect there are several warnings about Atlanta given how big the place is. However, this is specific to international arrivals.

Atlanta has a landside terminal and then a series of subsidary terminals linked together by an underground train. International arrivals use the terminal furthest away from the landside terminal. You arrive, get off your plane, go through immigration, pick up your bags, go through customs. So far so normal.

However, to get anywhere else you then have to get on the underground. It doesn't matter if you're catching another plane or trying to get into Atlanta you take the train. Now, the train is the same train that passengers coming from landside to the planes use. So, they go through security before boarding the train AND SO DO YOU.

OK, so you bought some duty free booze or perfume in London, or on the plane. You have to do something with it because it exceeds the amount of liquid you're allowed to take through security. Either you drink/use it NOW or you put it into your bag or you sacrifice it to security. If you're going into Atlanta you put the bottle in your checked bag which you then put on a conveyor which takes it to the landside terminal so you can pick it up (again) there and the risk of the bottle smashing on that ride is limited. If you're going on another flight you put the bottle in your checked baggage, give it back to the airline and hope that their baggage handlers at Atlanta and Orlando don't give your bag a rough ride.

Me, I wouldn't buy anything en route......

[Globaliser]

Atlanta has a landside terminal and then a series of subsidary terminals linked together by an underground train. International arrivals use the terminal furthest away from the landside terminal. You arrive, get off your plane, go through immigration, pick up your bags, go through customs. So far so normal.

However, to get anywhere else you then have to get on the underground. It doesn't matter if you're catching another plane or trying to get into Atlanta you take the train. Now, the train is the same train that passengers coming from landside to the planes use. So, they go through security before boarding the train AND SO DO YOU.This is the same at any connecting point in the US. If you're an international arrival, you clear immigration, collect bags and clear customs at the connecting point. Then you hand your checked bags back to the airline before going to your onward flight.

And then after you have handed your checked bags back, you must clear security. This happens at every US connecting point. It is not specific to Atlanta. If you've had access to your checked baggage, you are by definition no longer secure and you must be security screened again.

That said, some of my worst US immigration experiences have been at Atlanta. I think that the OP may have misinterpreted something said by SeenItAll as positive advice that he should connect at Atlanta. I don't think that's what SeenItAll meant.

[PaperTiger]

Definitely avoid Atlanta. In addition to the to-ing and fro-ing on the train, the ICE and TSA staff there are reputedly some of the most surly in the country.
(The only thing in its favour are airside smoking lounges :ok: )

KLM gives a minimum Detroit connection time Int-Dom of 1hr 15m (cf. Atlanta 1hr 20m) and as noted above, if it's a single itinerary - no airline change - they'll rebook you FOC if your inbound is delayed.

[Rollingthunder]

Hey here's an idea, instead of flying to the middle of the continent or Atlanta - FLY DIRECT!

[Hartington]

Globaliser, I think I didn't make myself clear. I agree that if you're connecting to a point in the USA you have to go through check-in, security etc again the critical point about Atlanta (and one or two other airports in the USA) is that it doesn't matter whether you are connecting or simply going to landside you have to go through security.

If you consider Chicago as an example of an alternative you go through immigration etc and, yes, as you exit customs you can re check your bags immediately if you choose to but at that point you are landside. If you chose to you can simply wander off into the USA you don't HAVE to get on another piece of equipment to do so. Yes, you then have to get transit from the international terminal to one of the domestic buildings but to do that you don't have to go through security - that happens in the domestic building. In Atlanta, as you exit customs your next step HAS to be security, no exceptions.

[Hartington]

You know what, I don't think I'd go via anywhere in the USA. 7 people, as others have said, is a lot of herding around. It will probably cost more and you may even need to travel to the airport the day before but I'd get to London and fly non-stop. Whatever the relative merits of BA and VS I suspect most people here would agree they are much better airlines than any of the US carriers and the hassle factor associated with changing at Detroit or Atlanta is eliminated.

I live in Somerset and went to Seattle this summer. I could have gone from Bristol via Newark on Continental but I went non stop on BA. Saved about 6 hours airport to airport, cost me more for the fare and because I went up the night before but it was a breeze (or as much of a breeze as any flying is these days).

[PaperTiger]

instead of flying to the middle of the continent or Atlanta - FLY DIRECT!OP says the flight via DTW is on sale. I don't know what the difference is, but for seven people I imagine it's a tidy sum.

Not everbody is flush :=

[1DC]

It is £1400 more expensive for us all to fly direct and seeing as the old man is giving the family a special holiday treat and picking up the tab he is opting for the cheapest way!!!

[MathFox]

It is possible to connect in Detroit in the 1h25m that the schedule allows you, (been there, done that) but as others pointed out, certainly not guaranteed. You're unlikely to have time for shopping or food, even if things go smooth on the day.

I'ld check how many later flights there are that day to get rebooked on, if you were to miss the connection. (Two to three hours on entry to the US gives you a good chance to make it; but no guarantee with all of the DHS :yuk: that's around.)

[wiggy]

Cripes, you can lose half an hour before you even leave the UK in the blink of an eye: ATC slot/baggage offload/etc etc....so then you're sat there chewing finger nails ( baggersup's point) then you've got the unforecast headwinds, followed by the queue at immigration ( and there's 7 of you to herd through).

In an ideal world you might just make it but I'd never plan a 1 hour 25 min transit anywhere - me thinks your travel agent is very sensible - but it's down to you - do you feel lucky :E

[Hartington]

That's GBP200 per person and I don't believe what I'm about to say will eat up all of that GBP1400.

The US carriers don't give certain things for free any more. Meals for one thing - if you want food you pay extra for it. They also charge for baggage. Now, I think that because you are an international passenger you'll get 1 bag per person free for the whole journey and free meals on the transatlantic flights (but check). But you will have to pay for meals on the domestics (if you want them) and if you check more than 7 bags you will pay for the extras. Are you going to want a drink on board? Do Delta charge for drinks? Do you want to watch a movie? Do Delta give you the headset free? Do Delta charge to provide a blanket and pillow (I kid you not) if you want one? Check what other extras you might have to pay for if you go via Detroit or Atlanta, add something for coffee and doughnuts at the change over point and then add that to the cheaper fare.

Now factor in the intangible which is the uncertainty and hassle associated with changing planes and just consider how much you might have to pay for an hotel should you need to spend a night en route. Personally I'd also factor in the (lack of) service on DL compared with BA and VS.

Then consider the consumer protection that is EUR-Lex - 32004R0261 - EN (http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=CELEX:32004R0261:EN:HTML).

Finally there's the elephant in the room; safety. I'm going to get roasted by some people for this but landing and takeoff are the most dangerous phases of flight. I like flying; I consider flying to be extremely safe; I have flown Delta with confidence. But, I do think about how many take offs and landings I'm going to have to make when I'm booking and I do my best to minimise them and I'm prepared to pay to do that.

Like I said, I doubt any of that adds up to GBP1400 but I believe the *real* difference is quite a lot less than GBP1400.

[cavortingcheetah]

You say that you intend this little venture into the impossible in April next year at Easter? Perhaps even over the Easter weekend? Further feasibility discussion seems a little pointless.

[1DC]

We are actually flying the week before Easter, under normal circumstances Mrs 1DC and i would never fly anywhere during the holiday season but on this occasion are governed by kids holidays. i prefer to arrive in Orlando via the domestic terminal which is why i am happy to change aircraft somewhere else in the U.S., preferably where their is little international traffic.£200 per head extra for a direct flight is correct, as far as i can see..

[cavortingcheetah]

The domestic arrival commends itself. I think that with Easter so late next year most US state schools will only close over the actual Easter weekend. Normal state school holidays will probably apply and that's usually a week or ten days over end March/early April, as I remember. But just think of all those religious people going on pilgrimages at the carousels and check in and all their divine ways of wasting time on their slow road to salvation. Good luck, it'll be an achievement if you make it. With a flock of seven you'll have been a real Good Shepherd.

[PaperTiger]

There are pilgrims to Orlando ?

:)

[dufc]

This connection can be done, we have done it a good number of times, but we have also missed it a few times.

Two adults and a grown up daughter - we can put up with the hassle that comes with problems arising. (Plat. status also gives some comfort...)

A party of seven? Mmmmm....not sure I would take the risk.

Is there not a later DTW-MCO flight you could select as part of the itinerary for a similar cost?

Good luck whatever you elect to do...

Jim

[SeenItAll]

Just to clear up some previous misunderstanding. My original post was not intended to recommend ATL as a point of connection over DTW. My mention of ATL was just to observe that in addition to 6 nonstops/day between DTW and MCO, there are also Delta flights that would reach MCO from DTW by connecting through ATL.

I cannot opine as to whether clearing U.S. customs through DTW is more efficient than ATL. In the end, it will depend on the vagaries of flight arrival times and staffing that particular day. So as other posters have agreed, the best way to achieve this itinerary in an economical and nonstressful fashion is to allow ample connecting time at either transfer airport. Thus, if your connection time through ATL is, say, 2:30 hrs versus 1:25 through Detroit, that is probably your best choice.

[cjhants]

some good advice for the OP above. have done the DTW connection many times, it is one of the easiest, but you need at least 2 hours to be safe. have done the last two trips via DFW to TPA. better connection times and far shorter lines for the car rental desks than MCO. depending on which side of orlando you are staying, the drive from tampa can be little different to that from MCO.

have been looking at the prices of these flights for a few weeks, and the suggestion of only £200 extra each seems way off, more like double, and could only get WT+ seats on way back - economy full. like you we normally travel in a group (6) and the indirect US airline prices are often half BA and VS for UK school holidays. if only money was no object!

have just booked LA for school easter holidays, just under £500 for direct flight. orlando is very busy at easter - expect to queue for restaurant seats.

[Smoketrails]

Ok, everybody has got me nervous now:eek:! Ms Smoketrails and I are doing DUS-ATL-TPA with DL in a couple of weeks, connection time will be 2 hours...

[PaperTiger]

Yeah, lot of doom and gloom being spread around here.

In the fairly unlikely possibility of your TATL flight being so late as to miss your connection, the airline will re-accommodate you. This is providing you are on a single itinerary (ticket) with one airline; it's nothing more than an inconvenience/minor annoyance.

If the connection isn't 'legal' - meets the stated minimum time - the airline can't sell you that itinerary in the first place.

Now if there's some kind of force majeur factor (volcanic ash, French strike etc.) then all bets are off, but that can happen anytime, anywhere - the US is no more prone than any other country.

[1DC]

Well folks thank you for all of the advice, the final decision is that we will transit through Detroit but allow extra time and take a later flight to Orlando. I note that the flight from Heathrow had a 40 minute delay today so that would put paid to a 1h 25m transit time!!
Many thanks...

[MathFox]

Now you've made the sane decision; I can recommend a bowl of noodle soup in the Japanese restaurant.

[1DC]

Looking forward to my bowl of noodle soup!!

[SeenItAll]

1DC: definitely the right choice. Note that you will be collecting your baggage to clear customs and immigration in Detroit. Therefore, if your flight arrives into Detroit early, when you reach the Delta counter to recheck your bags on to Orlando, you will have the opportunity to inquire as whether there is space available on the earlier connecting flight, and if so, possibly get rebooked on to this connection.

[1DC]

SeenitAll..

Many thanks, i was wondering if I would have an opportunity to request the earlier flight when we rechecked. I wasn't sure whether it would be a desk or just a baggage drop..

regards..

[jackieofalltrades]

Many thanks, i was wondering if I would have an opportunity to request the earlier flight when we rechecked. I wasn't sure whether it would be a desk or just a baggage drop..


In DTW you don't get to the Delta ticket desks until back in the terminal. ie after you have re-checked your bags and cleared security again.
Once you've collected your bags from the carousel and cleared customs you proceed straight to one of 3 conveyor belts where your checked baggage is placed.
I've flown through DTW many times, it's a great airport, and I've never missed a connection there. Even some as tight as 40 mins. I've tried to get on to earlier connecting flights in the past, but have been denied as I had checked luggage. But it's not to worry, there is a lot to do and see in DTW, so you won't be bored waiting for your flight.

[Ace Rimmer]

OK bit late But I'd have suggest US via Charlotte now there's a quiet transit airport...

[Globaliser]

Globaliser, I think I didn't make myself clear. I agree that if you're connecting to a point in the USA you have to go through check-in, security etc again the critical point about Atlanta (and one or two other airports in the USA) is that it doesn't matter whether you are connecting or simply going to landside you have to go through security.Sorry to have misunderstood. I think I was reading your post in the context of an OP about a connecting itinerary.

[1DC]

Just to finish this post off and for the benefit of those who were kind enough to advise.
We took our journey the week before Easter and arrived at Detroit about 40 minutes late, i assumed with that delay the people trying to connect with the early flight to Orlando would miss it but i was wrong.
Delta people were waiting at the door on leaving the aircraft and asking Orlando passengers to proceed quickly to security and immigration, at immigration Orlando passengers were being fast tracked through the crew aisle and then after baggage rushed to their flight. I was surprised about the fast tracking but immigration wasn't very busy at the time.Because we were on the later flight we took our time and i doubt if we would have got through customs and immigration in time to make the earlier flight without the offered help.
Quite a few people were trying to make the connection and with all flights being oversold it would have been hard for anyone missing the flight to be accommodated.

[TightSlot]

Thanks for letting us know


:ok:

[Large fries]

First time post, any advice appreciated.
We are going to Orlando in Sept. 2011. We checked various flight options, direct flights with BA or Virgin was very expensive, they also charge a lot to select seats. Having used American Airlines several times and found them to be better than BA we have decided to fly LHR-ORD-MCO using AA, this gives us 5 hours in ORD but we can do immigration and customs during this time, have a meal and then at MCO simply collect bags and leave as this will be a domestic flight. The flight leaves LHR at 7.45am and this is earlier than direct Orlando flights from LGW and so will arrive at MCO only an hour or so later than a direct flight would. We allocated seats for all legs of the flight without charge, I know they charge for alcohol on AA flights but for us this won't apply at 7.45am!. The total cost saving for 2 people is about £400. Or return is MIA-LHR direct, flight timings similar to BA. Any comments or advice on transit at ORD would be appreciated.
Thanks.

[intortola]

You are correct, they do charge for drinks in main cabin, AA now do not take any actual cash, they only accept debit or crdit cards, please be aware of this. Have seen people unable to buy sandwiches etc on domestic flights as they have no cards. On the domestic routes in main cabin you even have to pay for the headsets with a credit card, think it is $2, but they are then yours to keep.

[obgraham]

Fries:
Have made 2 international arrivals at ORD in the past year. You'll likely arrive at the International Terminal, which is some distance from the other domestic terminals.
After exiting Customs, there is a spot to recheck your baggage for ongoing flights. Then straight out, you look for the sign/escalator for the inter-terminal train, and take that to your next terminal. There you have to re-clear security and get your cavity search. Food/drink opportunity at International Terminal, and before security at the others is limited.
Transfer times are extremely variable. One trip it was 45 minutes after gate arrival, the other was 2:30. Lots of places for the delays to add up: taxiing forever, no open gate, aisle cloggers at deplaning, long lines at Immigration (if you arrive with 6-7 other flights), and the train platform was so jammed it required 3 arrivals to board.
You should be fine, but you will likely use a lot of your transfer time.

[cjhants]

have done this trip several times with United. ORD is in my opinion crowded and shabby, but if you don`t mind this, and you are saving plenty on your fare, it`s an OK option. If you have not yet booked, US via PHL is pretty good, as is Delta via DTW.

direct is always preferable, but if like me you have had to travel to MCO in school holidays, with 4 kids, it is the only affordable option.

[4mastacker]

I'd be grateful for some advice. My daughter will be transiting through Miami International in a few weeks on her return to UK. She will be flying in from Honduras, and has two hours at Miami between scheduled arrival and departure times. She is flying on AA on both flights. Is two hours long enough to make the connection? - bearing in mind such things as baggage claim, clearing US Customs, etc. Any tips on making her passage through Miami as smooth as possible would be appreciated. She is currently doing scientific research somewhere in Honduras and is regularly away from internet connections at the moment - I'm due to contact her next week so I would be grateful for some early replies. Many thanks.

[intortola]

I transited through MIA again last week and took approx 1 hour from getting of first flight to being at gate for connection. Immigration moved quite quickly and baggage delivery was fast, although this is not always the case at MIA. 2 hours should be plenty but there are AA staff in the immigration hall so if she is tight on time speak to them, i have seen them move people up in the immigration line. She will have to collect bags and then drop it with AA again after customs and then go through security. The "skytrain" that moves you between gates is quick and efficient and saves a long walk.

[cavortingcheetah]

Not really familiar with Miami but would have thought that two hours would be a satisfactory minimum. It's only a tiny possible percentage point but I always try to sit as far forward in the aircraft on a US inbound and I go like smoke between the gate and immigration. The other people on the same flight are just another blob to clog the gates before me if I don't get there ahead of them. Three hundred Hondurans, although it's unlikely the flight consists entirely of Hispanics, could take a little longer for US immigration to process than, for instance, the same number of Poms.

[paulc]

I am doing LHR - ORD - GRB (green bay) this weekend on United. I have just under 3 hours in Chicago to make the connection, however the United 747 flight from LHR has been consistantly late departing or even cancelled! and I am concerned that a) I will miss my connection and b) my bag not making the connection.

[robtheblade]

I think MIA is never easy to transit and always allow a good couple of hours. Last time I had almost three hours to make my flight and missed it.

[4mastacker]

Hi guys,

Thanks for all your advice which I passed on to my daughter. Unfortunately, it was all to no avail. Her flight's departure was delayed at SAP and arrived at MIA just after her UK-bound flight got airborne. She is spending a little extra, unplanned time at MIA before getting on another flight.

As a matter of pure interest, does anyone know why AA942 was delayed at SAP yesterday (11Aug)? It appeared to arrive on time but departure seemed to be delayed right from thereon.

4ma

[4mastacker]

Not content with an overnight stay at MIA, daughter got re-routed via BOS and found that a certain airline had a penchant for being late whichever flight she was booked on. Her re-booked flight was already running late when MIA was closed because of bad weather. Consequently she missed her connection at BOS and had to be re-booked on yet another flight. This re-booked, re-booked flight was late leaving the gate, but got airborne...just.. had an engine prob on take-off and made a rapid return to the ground where a further delay ensued. She eventually arrived in the UK some 3 and a half days after starting her journey having worked out that if she has to fly via the US again, then she needs to allow some 4 - 6 hours between flights to allow for flight delays and TSA :ugh:antics. She had no complaints about the customer service from this particular airline, but its operating performance means it wont be getting a Xmas card this year.

I noticed that there was no mention in the local press of her flight's emergency landing back at BOS, so I assume that engine failures during take-off are fairly commonplace and not news worthy.:eek: