SF Airlines

[stealthone]

Has anyone heard of SF Airlines? It looks like a new start up in Shenzen.

[Time Traveller]

Yes - I got an unsolicited email. (I dont know how they got my details)

I have to say, it stirred my interested. Impressive pay for a 757 Capt. The details were well written in English, and informative, which is a good sign. Its just the endless documents needed to apply - so it will probably fall in the "can't be bothered" catgory for me.

[celco]

[email protected]

Here you go, the mans name is Alex Liu........... Good Luck:ok:

[highflyer321757]

Any information on the current working conditions at SF Airlines?

Any info at all?

Thanks!

HF

[Bolshevik]

Any idea what the mins are? i have a recruitment email from them and still no info. Just dont want to waste my time.

[thornycactus]

I have met Mr. Liu about 3 months ago at Shenzhen.

He told me there will be a recruitment soon. True enough, they are looking for pilots at late November last year.

For co-piloting position, minimum 2500 hrs is a must (no type rated required). Preference given to Mandarin speakers.

Job application date closing on end March 2011.

Hope that helps. :)

[takamasa]

i am a hong kong citizen with about 1000 hours and i know they are looking for cadet pilots as well

Since i already have the license required, do you think they will consider me as they don't need to sponsor me the training overseas.

[GoForIt]

Is there anyone here who can give first hand (or even second hand) knowledge about working for this company?

[Joker72]

http://www.pprune.org/south-asia-far-east/448018-sf-express-airlines.html

[hhorta]

For those of you who are interested in Cadette or FO positions, they don't hire FOs (foreign) anymore. For Captain positions they are hiring. However,
for those of you who like the East and understand the culture, maybe you'll survive okay in China, it's actually more pleasant than other places I've lived at. That is if you've been elsewhere in the world and are used to different cultures and ways.
However, for the spoiled and demanding, it's not the place. Don't expect it to be like home, and you can't change it, so either you go with the pace or you stay home, if you bring negativity with you, then that's what you'll take with you, so if you can't change the situation here, you could at least adjust your attitude and make the best of it, or like I said, stay home.
I can't say it's the best contract, but go ahead and look around, different contracts fit different people's needs. If you don't mind slow progress and red tape, you may just have fun sometimes if you look for stuff to do while waiting around for the 'paperwork and CAAC changes that occur often.
So stop being cry babies or crying before you get spanked, anywhere you go is gonna have advantages and disadvantages. It's just a matter of what you are willing to trade for it. Remember, life is what YOU make of it.

[hongkongfooey]

Yeh, if your a spoilt little brat and expect outrageous things like : clean air, adherence to contract conditions, not being docked 1000rmb for taxiing 2kts too fast, and living amongst civilised people.................you are going to the wrong place :yuk:

[ptinios]

Hi Guys, I have an interview date on May the 9th with Sim on the 10th can anyone give me a heads up on what to expect... I have read all the comments.. Good bad and Ugly.. I have had my fair share of all, but from were I stand this contract does look good monetarily as well as for commuting conditions.
Any comments are welcomed and appreciated.

Cheers

[Asia Expat]

Good luck on the interview... Only about 1 in 10 make it through the sim eval. If that goes well you will be dealing with extremely disorganized people (they have actually turned it into an art form). Be prepared to spend allot of your own money and good luck getting it back.

[ptinios]

Thanks...

I guess I'll have to start running multiple unrelated failure scenarios through my head.. I've heard Chinese carriers like to do that.. Why!! only God knows.

Any idea what they are looking for, asking in the interview.

[Pozzo]

How was the interview process, did you eventually go for the SF inteview, because im also looking at it

Cheers

[G.S. Willy]

Contact Smile aviation.
I did, and they immediatley came back with a good info package, all my questions were answered promptly and in good English.

[Didacts and Narpets]

Is it me or is a lot of the contract reimbursements?

The ticket salary isnt enough to commute, if you so choose, on.

Are they getting 767s?

And anything else.

Thank you.

[inbluskyz]

Yes, they are getting 76's.

[Didacts and Narpets]

The whole contract is a dirty trick. Save the receipt and we may reimburse you of course if we go broke so do you! If you lose the receipt, oh well! Sign a lease and we can't pay you, too bad!

I honestly do not trust this company at all. If they need to always reimburse you then it's a trick.

Too bad as I would love to fly the 757/767 around Asia.

[kwaiyai]

They told me cos I flew a while back in Malaysia I cant apply. I was told before Malaysian License is no no but now even though I am not Malaysian and using a different License the fact I was there is also a no no. @didacts I heard that, for me would have been great to go to a 73 or 75.

[7Q Off]

Any idea about rosters?

[Capt Phillips]

Hi guys! I have info that the roster is one day trip at most, go-and-back ones. Some few layovers, for 737 small airports operations and for 757 bigger ones !

[donpizmeov2]

How many connecting flight for EU from SZX? Where do you go for a better connection HKG CAN or PEK?

[Gottabefun]

Anybody currently on contract with SF who can/will shed a light on the atmosphere in the company, life in Shenzhen, breakdown of salary, roster, commuting to Europe etc.?
Feel free to PM.

[alkor]

same here...

cheers,

[paholainen]

Got some info from a contact working there. 737 guys fly out monday back saturday, positioning flights at start and end of duty. Work pattern changes a lot from early/late /night. 757 fly mostly return flights to Shenzhen, home more than 4 nights a week. They also work less, due to no positioning. Pay is the same for 737/757. They only need 737 pilots atm, due to too many applicants on 757. Too bad as I was interested in 757.

[Trash8mofo]

Paholainen is correct re roaster. You will get your contractual days off blocked off 6 months in advance, the rest of the non-blocked off schedule comes out every Friday evening for the next week. The schedulers do try their very best to accommodate your work requests, but not always perfect which is understandable.

Re reimbursement: yes there are many and they are to the pilots advantage. Note that the portion of monthly income above 80k rmb is taxed at 45%. All these reimbursements and agency pays are designed to keep more money in the pilots pocket (legally). After all is said and done, you get to keep about 70-75% of your gross.

Generally speaking, the positive far outweighs the negative and i find SF do try hard to make the pilots life better.

[WYOMINGPILOT]

WOW, they tax your pay at 25-45%!!!! Almost every other carrier in China pays all Chinese taxes due so the pilot pays Zero tax on his income. This is a SERIOUS flaw in the SF contract if this is true. Not only do you fly mostly nights but you pay a HUGE tax.

[Trash8mofo]

The after tax is what counts. And personally I'm glad they have proper documentations of the tax I paid to China so I can get my US tax credits. I take nights over ATC delays.

[WYOMINGPILOT]

I agree the After tax is what counts. Most Chinese airlines pay 15-25% tax for you and also provide you with documentation of the tax which was paid on your behalf which you can use to file as a foreign tax credit. The point is SF is forcing you to pay this tax yourself thus lower after tax income. I have seen some horriffic flow control very late at night from Shenzhen. The point being flying nights doesn't insulate you from flow control in China.

[USMCProbe]

Chinese tax is progressive like a lot of countries. It is a lot more than 15-25 pct for what pilots make. I think my tax cert showed high 30% range for what i made.

[WYOMINGPILOT]

The higher the airline pays in tax on your behalf the better off you are as you take the tax receipt they paid and use it as a foreign tax credit on your own taxes. The Chinese however are even better liars to their (IRS) Tax division than anybody I know. In my case not all income was reported to the Chinese so the effective tax rate is usually in the 15-25% tax range. I am not a Chinese tax expert but I am very familiar with Chinese under the table dealings. The point being this tax is spelled out in most Chinese airlines contracts it will be paid FOR YOU to the chinese tax division you are responsible to your own individual country if any is due. SF it would seem is passing this responsibility on to its pilots to pay.

[LivPT]

I have an interview with SF next month. Can anyone there give me some advice and or info on conditions, pay, cockpit relations etc?
feel free to PM me
thanks

[intake]

Anyone completed the class 1 medical for SF recently? What is the max BMI that is acceptable ? Can anyone PM as I have a few questions. Cheers Intake

[manson73]

So ultimately, How many days off do you truly get a month? I know it says 6 blocked, does that mean you're working 24 nights a month? That's kinda tough to have a family no?

And, i'm a bit confused with the taxes, ultimately, what are you getting paid per month? (year). it is true it's 350K?

I've seen some of their 737's on the ramp, and wow, they look beatup.

[Moving]

Anybody currently on contract with SF who can/will shed a light on the atmosphere in the company, life in Shenzhen, breakdown of salary, roster, commuting to Europe etc.?
Feel free to PM.

[testpanel]

Just received an interesting email from an agency regarding SF Airlines...

Anybody currently on contract with SF who can/will shed a light on the atmosphere in the company, life in Shenzhen, breakdown of salary, roster, commuting to Europe etc.?
Feel free to PM

Any1 willing/able to give some insides?

Currently flying 75 and 76 as Captain.

Thanks!!

[FlyinColo]

What kind of flight times/ equipment are you guys getting called back with for the 757?

[pilotxaq]

Came across SF airlines in job searches. Almost looks too good to be true for 75/76. Saw the comments above. Is anyone able to say the current status/mood of the company and what the flight deck environment is like? Are they flying both 75 and 76? Also what is it like living in Shenzen, current rostering/tax issues etc.

Would really appreciate the info!

[bbq1166]

Came across SF airlines in job searches. Almost looks too good to be true for 75/76. Saw the comments above. Is anyone able to say the current status/mood of the company and what the flight deck environment is like? Are they flying both 75 and 76? Also what is it like living in Shenzen, current rostering/tax issues etc.

Would really appreciate the info!
SF is one of the major delivery services companies in China. I would say probably the best one. They're operating 737OGs, 757s and soon 767s. I heard the pay is pretty good according to my former colleagues who left to join SF. Downside is that nearly all their flights are late night flights. Most of their pilots are formerly from other major Chinese airlines, and their new F/O cadets are trained overseas. So I guess communication in the cockpit shouldn't be much of an issue. Shenzhen is one of the most developed Chinese cities. Might be a little crowded but living standard can be quite good. You can also go to Hong Kong from Shenzhen very easily.

Hope this is helpful!

[pilotxaq]

bbq1166;

Thank you @bbq1166, much appreciated! That is some helpful info, always good to hear from someone closer to the actual area. Yes the salaries do look good, have to wonder if there are any gotchas. I'm all the way on the other side of the world, never been to China, and not many friends I can ask. I'll factor all this into my decision-making. Thanks again!

[777747]

Can you do back to back days off at SF? What are the actual days off/on.
What is the management or training department options and pay?
What are line pilots taking home after tax?
Would you recommend commuting or bringing your family to Shenzen?

Thanks.

[krautland]

SF is not an upstart, it is the UPS or FedEx of China. They are everywhere, they are massive. You see them flying every night.

As for taxes in China: net is what counts. They may ask you for a rental receipt, which lowers your taxes and you can buy that from real estate agents for 4%. All no sweat.

Source: westerner, live in China.

[pilotxaq]

Quick question for anyone: A guy from a recruitment agency in China is asking me if the FAA can validate my total time and PIC hours. I have never heard of such a request, any CAA normally validates the licence, and indicates if there is any suspension or revocation, accidents or incidents, but never hours. A call to the FAA Airmen Records section also got the same answer.

I know your logbook is normally stamped by your current/last company as verification. Is there something I'm missing? Has anyone gotten the FAA to track their individual flight hours for verification of the CAAC request?