UAL Continental merger

[bearfoil]

So if UAL and Continental merge the net value is 3.6B? (Per Wall Street). For goodness sake, they had five billion to blow on Hotels and nice rental cars in the high value Eighties!! Howl the Wolf, put some dough back in the Pension Funds. Crooks.

[Spooky 2]

So very true but don't hold your breath. Cooks is not nearly the way to describe these guys.:mad:

[bearfoil]

Cooks? All that got cooked was the Books. So Congress says OK, but the upshot is SWA gets some gates in Joisey

bear

[411A]

Lorenzo saved Continental from bankruptcy (IE: going away)...so send Frank a check.
A BIG check.

NB.
Others will disagree, but facts are facts.

[DownIn3Green]

411...I agree...

How are the UAL ALPO pilots going to handle the merger, as CO has many folks who were "forgiven" by ALPO...and with CO the survivng carrier...you gotta believe there's going to be a lot of whining going on in the ranks...i.e. Look for "slow-downs" and "write-ups" (in the A/C log) by disgruntled jerks who lost their seniority, by KEPT THEIR JOBS...

[bearfoil]

I won't have it, I won't. I think UAL gets to stay on the Tail feathers, No?

Didn't there used to be a Dance called the "Continental"? Just sayin' Di3

[Spooky 2]

For some reason I suspect that if we knew 411A's real name we might find it on a certain list? :=

[bearfoil]

Besides Lorenzo's not such a bad guy, he gave me a quarter once. He saw the uniform and the empty coffee cup, and figured.......

[411A]

For some reason I suspect that if we knew 411A's real name we might find it on a certain list?
Unlikely, as I never worked for a larger 121 US air carrier.
Nice try, though...:}

[bearfoil]

411A

I've read your stuff, it's good. You also are more Grumpy than I am, so I can sneak in the door behind your Cashmere Duster. You strike me as a no nonsense independent by the book kind of guy. I like that. Corporate life got me down. Really, can we have a hint as to your Lockheed's Livery?

[Spooky 2]

411A was a Saudia guy. Never quite made it to the US majors, not that that is a blemish on your resume. Fly's for some 3rd world outfit today that would never pass muster under FAA or EASA rules.

Still think I can find his name on that special list that we all know about.

[bearfoil]

Do you mean the list whose name may not be spoken?

[poina]

I've been having a running p-ssing contest with 411, only because of the unbridled arrogance of his posts.
I can tell you about Saudia tho, I did 19 years and retired at 56 never having to work again, not bragging, it is what it is.
He says he did 10, left in 1990 when I came. On the tritanic at that time he would have been pulling some good cash. An example, from 1995-1999, on the A-300, I put in the bank $306,000.
Few make it past 5 years, few leave after 10. Skeleton's in the closet?

[Spooky 2]

I know a couple of guys who know hime from his Saudia days...I supsect. I'll ask them to put a name with a personality. Shouldn't be to hard to tag the guy with his DNA. :}

[411A]

An example, from 1995-1999, on the A-300, I put in the bank $306,000.

Is that all?

Oh, yes...I can see why, TCN salary scale.

[ndegepilot]

....if we knew 411A's real name....

Google is your friend, it took me less than 10 mins ;)

[stilton]

'Lorenzo saved Continental from bankruptcy' !!!!!!!!



Your love of Frank Lorenzo is well known 411a



However you cannot rewrite history. Lorenzo took Continental into bankruptcy.



Not because it was necessary but as a tactic to void and abrogate all union contracts. Not a problem under the anti labour Reagan administration.




Continental was saved by dedicated employees under the good management of Gordon Bethune after Lorenzo left the Airline in tatters.




411a, you really are an idiot :eek:

[411A]

Not because it was necessary but as a tactic to void and abrogate all union contracts.

The cancelation of those union contracts was necessary, as Continental, at that point in time, was in big trouble financially, and it was deemed proper by the Bankruptcy Court.
Those are the facts.
If you think otherwise...tell it to the Judge.:rolleyes:

The 'forgiven' ALPO guys will be a problem with the 'merger', no doubt.

[stilton]

Incorrect again, and, as usual 411a.


Texas Air could easily have floated an underwriting to keep Continental solvent while they worked on a long term strategic turnaround for the company.



But Lorenzo would not listen, his chosen CEO at the time Stephen Wolf was doing his best to renegotiate a new legal contract with the Pilots and Mechanics without circumventing the law.



Instead of listening to him Lorenzo fired him (as he did every CEO that came after him) and took CAL into bankruptcy using the courts to void contracts he did not have the backbone to renegotiate himself.




Lorenzo almost destroyed Continental Airlines. The employees saved it under the later, inspired management of Gordon Bethune.



This was after Frank had convinced SAS to invest in the Airline, boosting the stock over the short term allowing him to cash out at a huge personal profit declaring bankruptcy again before finally leaving.



SAS lost their entire investment (ask them what they think of Lorenzo)



The reality is he took the Airline into Bankruptcy twice in a Decade just to further his own personal goals.



He was the worst Airline manager in the history of the business and the only one that has been banned for life by congress from having any aviation management position again.




I suspect you are a scab yourself 411a and were unable to obtain any other employment with a reputable Airline.



You are certainly ignorant enough to be one.

[411A]

Sorry, stilton, the bankruptcy court judge simply did not agree with your alledged scenario.
And then we have ALPO, promptly walking out, leaving Lorenzo free to do what he wanted.
ALPO shoots itself in the foot so many times, the entire lower leg is missing.
If this weren't bad enough, many who stayed were 'welcomed' back into the ALPO fold, thus ensuring disharmony for ever more.
What a farce ALPO has become.

[stilton]

The farce is your rewritten and ridiculous version of history 411a.



I have not met many professional Pilots that, even to this day support Frank Lorenzo who did more damage to the Airline industry than any other single individual.



You are one of the few exceptions, and a big part of the problem, then and now.



Your views lead inescapably to the conclusion you were one of 'Franks boys'
yourself.



By the way. what is your status with ALPA ?

[411A]

By the way. what is your status with ALPA ?


Never a member, ever.
Also, never worked for an ALPO carrier.

By the way, IF it had not been for Lorenzo and his timely financing, Continental would have been...gone.
As in, gone forever more.

Gordo was OK, however, IF Lorenzo had not been successful, good 'ole Gordo would have had nothing to work with...IE: a complete failure.

Was Lorenzo an SOB?
Yup, sure was....a successful SOB.

Continental is alive today solely by Lorenzo's efferts....like it or not, thems the facts.
I suspect you don't.
OK with me.:E

[stilton]

You are not a member because ALPA would not let you join.



Lorenzo did not 'save Continental' he trashed it and left it on life support for someone else to pick up the pieces.



If your version of being successful is great personal financial gain at the expense of all others then Lorenzo was the epitome of success.



Continental survived and thrived despite lorenzo and his destructive 'management'



Thousands of dedicated employees, competently led made sure it did.



I know, I was there.




Thems the facts 411a,




You are still an idiot :E

[411A]

You are still an idiot
I can still see through your charade, stilton.

I know, I was there.

That gives it away.
IF you were there, prior to Lorenzo, and remained, then you were definitely one of the striking pilots who....'went back', in defiance of said strike.
And, one of the 'forgiven'.

If in a glass ALPO house, don't throw stones.:E

[stilton]

No 'charade' here.



And no, I was not hired during the strike. I started with Continental in 1987.



Your particular Glass House is very transparent 411a :=

[411A]

I started with Continental in 1987.

If so (according to you, anyway) then you would have no first hand knowledge about what went on prior to Lorenzo, and further, would therefore have absolutely no idea about the precarious financial position Continental found itself in, after Six passed away.

In other words, stilton, you are full of ALPO baloney, as that is all you have to offer.
No surprise there.:rolleyes:

[stilton]

Unfortunately, Lorenzo was still very much in charge when I was hired. I worked with Pilots that crossed and those that did not. I was intimately involved with the post strike 'wreckage'




The Airline that Lorenzo ran then was in a terrible state, low morale, pay, benefits had all been slashed by your hero 411a.



I certainly had a lot more first hand knowledge of the situation than you did 411a, or did I ?




With your views and obvious admiration of Frank it seems more and more likely you were one of his 'boys'



It would explain a lot about you, and your career since then..