View Full Version : Which makes which?

surely not
20th Aug 2010, 13:01
Having been a member on here for a few years now and read so many posts by Pilots who moan and whine at how unhappy they are with their lot I wondered whether:-

a) The job attracts those whose natural disposition is whinge and moan about everything?


b) The job turns normal well balanced people into whinging moaners incapable of leaving the profession to look for happiness elsewhere?

The Middle East section in particular is full of pilots from airlines from all over the region, in companies that pay comparitively well to other parts of the world, in an area where expansion not contraction is happening, yet they moan and whine on about their life.

The same is found on many other threads.

Is this unique or are there other jobs that do the same thing to the poor mortals who take them?

20th Aug 2010, 13:08
Just be glad it's not an architects' forum - then you'd hear some moaning.

Or a farmers' forum, or for cops, or teachers, or public servants, or tailors, or graphic artists, or journalists, or ...

20th Aug 2010, 13:19
Us aircraft engineers never had time to moan and groan.
Far too busy generally.

20th Aug 2010, 13:22
Chicken or egg? Could it be that 'whinging Poms' and others of similar disposition are masochistically drawn to a profession, and to locations like the ME, in which drinking is both discouraged (if they want to keep their licences) and entirely proscribed (in 'dry' countries)?

This double-whammy then gives them something to bitch about, QED.

20th Aug 2010, 13:28
I wondered whether:-

a) The job attracts those whose natural disposition is whinge and moan about everything?More like PPRuNe attracts those whose natural disposition is whinge and moan about everything. :oh:

surely not
20th Aug 2010, 13:29
603DX it appears that the flight deck whingers and moaners are not restricted by country of birth. There are many nationalities represented...............including Ozmates.

I only mentioned the Middle East forum because in other areas of the globe airlines are generally in trouble and redundancies can make anyone upset, whereas in the Middle East it is all growth generally and you would expect a level of contentment. Life here isn't too terrible

20th Aug 2010, 13:36
Have you ever heard a farmer saying he is happy with the weather?

Put another way: with any situation, those who are pleased are less pleased than those who are displeased are displeased.

20th Aug 2010, 13:37
Or maybe it has something to do with a certain adage I learned during my military career: "A soldier isn't happy if he isn't bitc*ing".

20th Aug 2010, 13:54
Us aircraft engineersDoes that mean you only work on aircraft that are unserviceable? :}



20th Aug 2010, 14:00
We only work on aircraft that are unserviceable.
Not much point in doing stuff to serviceable aircraft is there?
(Apart from routine check stuff, and the bits vandalised by the pax and cabin crew.)

20th Aug 2010, 14:05
Just be glad it's not an architects' forum - then you'd hear some moaning.

Or a farmers' forum, or for cops, or teachers, or public servants, or tailors, or graphic artists, or journalists, or ...

What about a forum for "Escorts" or "Call Girls"? Would there be a lot of moaning there and how much of it would just be there for effect?

Hat, coat, KY, etc........................

Krystal n chips
20th Aug 2010, 14:22
" Does that mean you only work on aircraft that are unserviceable?"

Madam Whirls.....very droll....;) :E we do actually work on serviceable aircraft however...invariably trying to find the source of a defect induced by the "erm, not sure about what this does, so I'll snag it just to be on the safe side as I couldn't be bothered reading the tech.notes on the type" brigade.....certain airlines I know had a propensity for this.....

I am sure though, this would not be the case in the private rotary world....now would it ?......:):E

Occupational whinging ?....try listening to a bunch of HGV drivers....incessant !

20th Aug 2010, 15:07
The difference between a truck driver and a puppy dog is that the puppy eventually grows up and quits whining.

20th Aug 2010, 15:55

Would those be hormones, then?

20th Aug 2010, 15:58
Do you mean the moaning is the "hormone" or the hormones cause the moaning?

Ancient Observer
20th Aug 2010, 16:01
Most ex-pats moan most of the time. I think that they feel guilty that they are so overpaid, and they let their guilt out by moaning, (amongst other things).
............and, yup, I've been an ex-pat.
That accounts for the Middle East thread.

As for other pilots, think of any group that "works" (on a fully automated plane?) for a maximum of 850 hours, and even then is forbidden to do anything outside SOP s and beancounters' rules....................They have a lot of time in the rest of the year to think up good moaning topics.

Loose rivets
20th Aug 2010, 18:10
It's all to do with expectations. Life's expectations, that's the nub of the matter. To an outside observer, I would have appeared to be leading the life of Riely, but I was never happy. Just never quite found my niche. Moments of joy came from the most unlikely happenings, like seeing a smile on someone's face when you'd given them a hand. Making an old car go, rather than having a posh new one. (and you can trust me on that one.) Just putting a true value on a walk along the beach.

Flying was going to be so exciting. In fact, it was at first, but then someone realized that aviation needed to make a profit. Someone else realized that SOPs made for safer flying. SOPs Same Old Procedures, day in, day out. DON'T SAY ONE WORD WRONG OR WE'LL FRY YOU. Not a thinking person's cup of tea. Well is it?

Would you want to stay in the cockpit for an extra five hours - just so you could discover something so intriguing that you'd rather drill a hole in your eye rather than leave without the answer? Thought not. Mind you, it doesn't happen very often in a lab, and almost never on the modern flight-deck. Same old procedures.

Mind you again...I did fly with a bloke like that. Off Barcelona and he says: "Tell them I'm going visual." He just fell out of the sky in a Dan 1-11 and went low level all round Majoca's lumpy bits. Nothing was ever said...apart from my protestations, but nobody gave a hoot about those.

Perhaps he was board. Perhaps we should all do things like that. It would save a fortune in ATC costs...could sent the lot of them home.

When I was flying, I was fine...for the takeoff and landing. The rest was a pain. Hotels were anathema, drinking for summit' to do was bad for my brain and my bits. Horrible.

I got great joy and not a little money from electronics, it could have been wonderful - if I'd not been missing flying so much. There's no hope for people like me, and my guess is that I'm not so far from the norm as I used to think. Work is boring, when you don't have the free will to be creative.

Pugilistic Animus
20th Aug 2010, 19:01
I've learned that every human being has quite a boring life...rich or poor partiers club goer or hermits/bookworms...there only a limited amount of things to do in life; work, satisfy libidinal instincts and play....there's not much else to do,..but it seems to many everybody is 'doing something' well not true...unhappiness comes from not thinking you need to be 'doing something' until you realize that ----don't nobody do nothing:}:ouch:

surely not
21st Aug 2010, 07:28
In total agreement with Loose Rivets, SOP's are making life extremely boring and potentially less safe.

Initially the people who follow the agreed SOP understand what the actions and reasons for the SOP are, they have experienced the Non standard and appreciate why an SOP is a good idea. After only a few years fresh people come to the job and follow the SOP because they are trained that 'it has to be followed', but they don't get the reasons why the SOP exists explained to them, so the learning experience that brought the SOP into existence is lost. Put them into a situation outside of the SOP and they have nothing to fall back on to help them and are less competent because of it.

Judging from the replies it seems it is the job that turns people into moaning whingers, and probably because there isn't enough to occupy the mind due to the standard daily routine?