Another crew shortage?!?

[Flaps10]

I see that we are increasing our frequency Oz, NZ, Canada and France to "pre 2008" levels starting Oct 31. My last three sectors all had captains acting as relief FO's. If we don't have enough crews now, what are they going to do to crew the extra sectors this fall?

I liked our previous DFO's letter to the AOA regarding the hiring of DEFO's. "We have no plans of hiring any DEFO's in the coming months".

:ugh::ugh::ugh:

How many SO's can our training system handle per month? Better starting pumping JFO's out soon!

Always behind the 8ball...

[SloppyJoe]

I assume that the system can handle the same if not more JFO upgrades than initial FO training. If they start taking DEFO's when some guys have been waiting well over 4 years for a JFO course then it is outrageous. Why should we suffer due to the companies short sighted training, why were they not getting ahead of the game when times were slow. I remember reading not that long ago that the plan was to have SOs doing no more than 3 years before an upgrade.

[FO4EVA]

I assume that the system can handle the same if not more JFO upgrades than initial FO training

DEFO training: 25 sectors, JFO upgrade, 40 plus I think????? While they're still normal revenue sectors, I guess there's a limited number of STC's.....

[Cavallier]

Hong Kong based F/O on the b744 and did 89 Hours last month, 99 hours this month, lots of missed calls on G days............I think they are very short. Thinking about it I did a long haul last month with three Captains and me.

The Cav:cool:

[RookieRookie]

100+ hours rostered. =D

[Ex Douglas Driver]

DEFO training: 25 sectors, JFO upgrade, 40 plus I think?????

Which just shows how short sighted the FOP management is. What logic is being applied to require double the number of training sectors, especially for experienced SOs - many of whom joined 4+ years previous already meeting the DEFO experience requirements? They were very quick to complain about the lack of training sectors and the "requirement" to hire DEFOs instead, but made no attempt to work smarter and review the syllabus and speed up the upgrade process for those already in the system.

[kenfoggo]

Rostered Hours.

If you are contracted to fly 84 hours per month, does one have to operate 84 plus?

Can one not get to 84 hours and say, that is it ; I have fulfilled my contractual obligation and I do not wish to fly anymore , thank you?

[joebanana]

Can one not get to 84 hours and say, that is it ; I have fulfilled my contractual obligation and I do not wish to fly anymore , thank you?

I suppose you could, but then I guess you wouldn't be flying any more this month, and the next etc...:rolleyes:

[Giuseppe Giovanni]

We are only short for the time being....

I'm betting that the Company is presently deliberately running the operation short, knowing that when the new FTL's are released later this year, the manning levels will fit once more.

Something about 3 man ULH etc. and all of the other nice things which are bound to make up the framework of the working document.

[Fr8t M8te]

I reckon Geegee is spot on the money.

Don't be too quick to answer the phone guys and gals

[bm330]

Can one not get to 84 hours and say, that is it ; I have fulfilled my contractual obligation and I do not wish to fly anymore , thank you?


I believe Cathay would refer to it as "industrial action"

[The Wraith]

3 Man to Europe coming and even LA. Man, I'm glad we have the AOA fighting our corner. Useless P...ks.:ok:

[Bob Hawke]

So Wraith, what do you suggest, you going to go and do it for everyone? Who else is there!

[Mr. Bloggs]

With 3 man ULH the limit is now 13 hours. Will that change with the new AFTL’s? :confused:How many hours before discretion has to be used?:rolleyes:

[Ex Douglas Driver]

more like "it was changed to a compulsory 40 sectors so that subsequent salary costs were reduced"

[bubble.head]

Good time to apply for Cathay? Maybe they'll start up DE again.

[The Wraith]

Bob, let's face it, whilst the AOA is all there is, they sell us down the river at every turn. Please don't start here trying to tell me different. Most people I think would agree.:ugh:

[crwjerk]

Bloggs..... I don't think anybody in their right mind would ever use discretion again, as this already unsafe 3 man situation has been allowed to happen.

[jed_thrust]

That's right - it's totally unsafe.

And the crew that diverted in Oz yesterday (or the day before) certainly knew where to draw the safety line!:ok:

[moosp]

I finally had time to follow Silber's advice and read the Tech Log cover to cover. Dave Newberry and Glen Sycamore produced two excellent articles on CAD371 and Fatigue Management Systems. They should be more widely published.

It's all stuff we should know, to understand how the best efforts of HKALPA and the AOA backed up with scientific evidence are rejected by CAD bureaucrats. In some cases this is caused by a post colonial affection to the old ways, and a constant referral back to how the CAA UK is doing it. (I have seen this slavish referral to CAA with disturbing effect on airworthiness issues, but that is another story.)

Yes, read it and weep. The AOA representatives to the Flight Time Limitations Working Group appear to have done their best, but it is very difficult to argue to a closed mind.

This is why the company are not worried about paying vast overtime for the next few months. The crew productivity per ATK is going to go ballistic when the new FTLs come in.