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SoundBarrier
5th Aug 2010, 02:14
Have a look at this (http://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=10663623)article.

So the scientists have taken the DNA from a 5300 year old man, Oetzi. Frstly, how did they know his name, did he have a wallet with a mammoth drivers licence in it, or a weapons license (bow and arrow only, concealed knife not permitted)? I digress, lets say the scientists dig though a gazilion DNA samples and found YOU to be the descendant of Oetzi.

Would you say, "Right, this is emotional and now that we have the body, and for the family to move on, we should cremate him and spread his ashes over the Arctic."
Would you perform a eulogy?
Would you claim rights over the body?
Legally would you have rights over the body?
If you have rights to the body, what would you do with it?

Frankly, these are important questions that need answering.

birrddog
5th Aug 2010, 02:29
First off, I'd want to know if it was Maverick who killed him.

Caboclo
5th Aug 2010, 03:03
If I had rights to the body, I'd jolly well flog the old bird to the first museum which came calling.

Um... lifting...
5th Aug 2010, 03:14
No, no, no... you have to start a bidding war to do it properly.

I gather it was an auto accident... they got his name off the registration.

http://grandrants.files.wordpress.com/2009/06/fred-flintstone-barney-rubble-car.jpg?w=210&h=162

Ogre
5th Aug 2010, 04:01
If it was proved to be a relative of mine it would only confirm what my wive has been telling me for years.....:suspect:

Loose rivets
5th Aug 2010, 04:06
As a descendant of Pete Bogg*, I'm sure that it's important to find ones family tree.

Pete was found in a Peat bog. He was well preserved, showing a beard with more than a little red/ginger hair dispersed in the growth.


Grandad!!!!!!!!!!:\

lomapaseo
5th Aug 2010, 04:26
If you have rights to the body, what would you do with it?


For sure I would par boil first to kill any living organisms then I would filet it discarding the leathery skin.

The bigger chunks would still be adequate for a good chowder.

For the head I would mount this face first against an inside door. Then when some visitor would enquire I would suggest that it was just a friend and he was just leaving.

tony draper
5th Aug 2010, 09:10
Is that the froze bloke who had been X rayed half a gazzilion times poked and prodded by 50 scientists every day for five years subjected evey forensic test known to man underwent twenty autopsies and it was the lady who made the tea that noticed something the collective archeological academia of the entire western world had had failed to notice, the chap had been shot and killed with a arrow?
Or this it a different froze bloke.:rolleyes:

crippen
5th Aug 2010, 10:33
Initially, it was thought he froze to death in a blizzard. But CT scans have revealed his body contained a flint-headed arrow that entered through his shoulder, stopping close to his left lung but rupturing the key blood vessel carrying blood from his heart to his left arm. Oetzi was murdered.Five millennia on, iceman surrenders DNA secrets - World - NZ Herald News (http://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=10663623)

mustpost
5th Aug 2010, 11:16
What music would you play at the funeral?:}

alisoncc
5th Aug 2010, 11:19
The TV series "Waking the Dead" have taken it on as one of the many crimes that they anticipate solving in the next series. Mind you this is a "really really" cold case.

tony draper
5th Aug 2010, 11:26
Many of the preserved bog bodies found have definitely been foully done to death,head bashed in, throat cut garroted and drowned, they didn't piss about with lethal injections in the neolithic.
:uhoh:

Ancient Observer
5th Aug 2010, 11:31
It wasn't a flint headed arrow.
It was a faulty tazer.

G-CPTN
5th Aug 2010, 11:59
Much has been written over the years about Ítzi (there was international wrangling over where he was found as well as conjecture over the cause of death as well as the 'finders fee'). Most of it is summarised here:-

Ítzi the Iceman - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%96tzi_the_Iceman)

tony draper
5th Aug 2010, 12:01
I think the arrow in the back settled the question of his nationality,he was Italian.
:rolleyes:

Bruce Wayne
5th Aug 2010, 12:45
I think the arrow in the back settled the question of his nationality,he was Italian


and also that his last words were not "Hey Ya'all watch this!"

wings folded
5th Aug 2010, 13:25
If I remember correctly, concerning Pete the Bog bloke, a no doubt well intentioned Anglican vicar thought that he should have a decent Christian burial.

The ritual would have puzzled old Pete, one imagines.

wings folded
5th Aug 2010, 19:10
But CT scans have revealed his body contained a flint-headed arrow that entered through his shoulder, stopping close to his left lung but rupturing the key blood vessel carrying blood from his heart to his left arm. Oetzi was murdered.


A hasty judgement, that.

He could have stood downwind from an especially tasty looking yeti or moose or whatever they had roaming around at the time, and copped a stray arrow from a rather crap hunter who missed his target.

G-CPTN
5th Aug 2010, 19:20
Or he might have shot at a pterodactyl that was flying overhead and then copped his own arrow when it returned to Earth when he missed . . .

Bruce Wayne
5th Aug 2010, 20:45
or it could have back fired.

hat, loincloth, door...

sitigeltfel
5th Aug 2010, 20:50
At what point will someone say "That's enough prodding, scanning and probing. Lets give the poor guy the dignity of a decent burial"?

con-pilot
5th Aug 2010, 20:53
At what point will someone say "That's enough prodding, scanning and probing. Lets give the poor guy the dignity of a decent burial"?

Maybe he's enjoying all that prodding, scanning and probing? There are people around that like that type of stuff you know.

Not me, but I do read books. :p

wings folded
5th Aug 2010, 21:29
Maybe he's enjoying all that prodding, scanning and probing? There are people around that like that type of stuff you know.



I am sure you are right, but after being dead for a rather long time, is there all that much you can enjoy?

All the books I have read are of no real help on that aspect.

tony draper
5th Aug 2010, 21:47
Didn't Time Team run a similar exercise? took the DNA of some cove they dug up buried 500 years ago took DNA from the local populous and found a direct ancestor,some locals had some of he chaps stuff but the bloke they found they reckoned must have been in a direct line.
:)

G-CPTN
5th Aug 2010, 21:54
I wondered about Ítzi's ancestors - which side of the border were they from? (and was there such a thing as a border in Ítzi's time?).
It's possible that he had no descendants - or that his line died out . . .

tony draper
5th Aug 2010, 21:58
I believe there was indeed a dispute betwixt the Swiss and the Italians over who had juristiction over the poor buggah.
The first X ray showed he had no gold teeth so the Swiss said the Italians could have him.
:rolleyes:

G-CPTN
5th Aug 2010, 22:32
Analysis of pollen and dust grains and the isotopic composition of his tooth enamel indicate that he spent his childhood near the present village of Feldthurns (Velturno), north of Bolzano / Bozen, but later went to live in valleys about 50 kilometres further north.
Velturno (http://wikimapia.org/#lat=46.670054&lon=11.6000175&z=10&l=0&m=h)

Where he was found (50kms north west of Velturno):-
Ítzi found here (http://wikimapia.org/#lat=46.7793737&lon=10.8403301&z=10&l=0&m=h)

tony draper
5th Aug 2010, 22:46
yer amazingly they can tell where you spent your formative years by analyzing the lead isotopes in yer tooth enamel,perhaps they could offer this service to asylum seekers who refuse to be forthcoming as to where they actually hail from.
:rolleyes:

crippen
6th Aug 2010, 02:35
Or even the odd American President!:}

Ned Parsnip
6th Aug 2010, 05:15
I believe there was indeed a dispute betwixt the Swiss and the Italians over who had juristiction over the poor buggah.



It was actually Austria v Italy MrD.

And the former had custody of him for the first 7 yrs or so before handing him over.

Gas Bags
6th Aug 2010, 05:54
He looks like an old fossill I used to work with!!!

sitigeltfel
6th Aug 2010, 06:33
It was actually Austria v Italy MrD.

And the former had custody of him for the first 7 yrs or so before handing him over.

The Austrians were reluctant to hand him over, using the border ambiguity as an excuse, when their real concern was the competence of the Italian scientists. The area he was found in was pretty hostile weatherwise and a team of cartographers settled the dispute by doing an accurate mapping exercise.

Ned Parsnip
6th Aug 2010, 07:33
It will be interesting to see if the Curse of the Iceman (http://www.dw-world.de/dw/article/0,,1765550,00.html)extends into the Intertubes and falls upon any Ppruners.

That a 63-year-old man should die of natural causes would normally raise few eyebrows. But when that man was a scientist connected to the discovery of a 5,300-year-old frozen corpse known as Oetzi the Iceman -- and the seventh such person to die within a year -- talk about a curse is inevitable.

US-born molecular archaeologist Tom Loy was found dead in his Brisbane home ........as he was finalizing a book about Oetzi....

The director of the University of Queensland's archaeological sciences laboratories had suffered from a blood-related condition for about 12 years, members of his family told the paper. The condition was diagnosed shortly after he became involved with the Iceman.



The rumor of the curse began .....when the German tourist who discovered the mummy, Helmut Simon, 67, fell to his death during a freak blizzard while hiking near the same spot where he saw Oetzi through the ice.

Within an hour of Simon's funeral, the head of the mountain rescue team that was assigned to find him, Dieter Warnecke, 45, died of a heart attack.

Then in April, archaeologist Konrad Spindler, 55, who first inspected the prehistoric corpse, died of complications from multiple sclerosis.

The head of the forensic team examining Oetzi, Rainer Henn, 64, died in a car crash on the way to give a lecture about the iceman.

The mountaineer who led Henn to the Iceman's body, Kurt Fritz, 52, died in an avalanche, the only one of his party to be hit.

And the man who filmed Oetzi's removal from his icy mountain grave, celebrated Austrian journalist Rainer Hoelzl, 47, died of a brain tumor.
:eek:

Fareastdriver
6th Aug 2010, 07:50
We're All Doomed!!!!!!!!!

crippen
6th Aug 2010, 07:55
All of PPRuNe??
Most users ever online was 11,419, 1st June 2009 at 13:46.


Or just Jet Blast?:hmm: