CityJet Cadet Scheme 2010

[Fox_one]

CityJet Mentored Cadet Pilot Program 2010

CityJet are proud to announce Climb High, our Cadet Pilot training program. We are currently seeking highly motivated candidates to become cadet pilots in our organisation.

CityJet | Cadet Pilot Training Programme (http://www.cityjet.com/dyn/pages/about-us/careers/cadet-pilot-training-programme.shtml)


Closing date for applications is Aug 8th 2010. Good luck.

[dusty crop]

Does anybody know the criteria cityjet have for you to adhere to during training so that you continue to be part of their mentored scheme...

There was some mention of ninety per cent passes on atpl exams and no partials on flight tests etc...

Might be tricky if you were half way through and informed you were not "upto standard"

I have been told that all students will have to keep "their part of the bargain"

Anyone any ideas?

There are far too many frozen atpl s out there now with 200 hours,broke and miserable!

[The flying bob]

Well, I trained with CTC mate and few guys here were presumably sponsored by Cityjet..... What a joke.
First of all, none of them has ever heard of Cityjet n 12 MONTHS.....Not a word, not an email, not a phone call, nothing...
One of the guy has been kicked out whilst training for some performance issues I presume, but he never heard anything from Cityjet. CTC simply told him, in between 2 lectures that his sponsorship was over. He never had a chance to hear from Cityjet!!!!
And finally (the best:ugh::ugh:) when they finally all completed the training, they have all been told that things were over and that no position would be available before 2012 at the earliest!!!! Mate, they are all in the holding pool swiming with me.

My point of view : If you want to be a pilot do it, if you think FTE is the right school for you, go for it but do not rely on Cityjet, they are absolute liars.

Now you may hear some success story from other.... I guess you'll listen to the one that conforts you in your decision, I can't blame you for doing so, I did the exact same thing:rolleyes::rolleyes:.

Hope you won't regret it, good luck

[Bombs Away]

emmm...

Think I'll pass :ok:

[FANS]

They've only managed to secure a few grand off the list price for nearly a £1 million contract.

Are they the worst negotiators ever?

Or do they get a kick-back from the FTO?

[Superpilot]

As the poster above says be very careful. CityJet and FTE are not really interested in giving you a job at the end. Your training will take 18 months to complete. By then CityJet may have a totally different outlook and not even be recruiting any more. These wacky deals are conjured up by recruitment chiefs who have no moral backbone and are only interested in making their little margin from customers they send to FTE.

With over 3,000 qualified 250 hour frozen ATPL holders in Europe looking for a job, CityJet are again living on another planet.

Same ****, year in, year out. Nothing ever changes.

[FANS]

superpilot sums it up nicely, and explains why there are such "mentoring" schemes around despite the 1000s of CPL/IR holders. Complete joke, but still watch people roll-up.

[Fox_one]

Although mentored schemes aren't perfect I think they do at least give you a foot in the door at an airline, which in my experience is the hardest task once you finish training.

There are of course no guarantees but that’s life. If you really want to become a pilot, have weighed up the risk of it going wrong and are looking at the self sponsored route then this is a good option IN MY OPINION.

[FANS]

If you're determined to go integrated in the current economic climate, it's a good option.

If I could afford to loose £80k, I'd definitely apply.

[dusty crop]

Thanks guys but.....
I have no intention of gambling 90 k and giving up work etc for a year.
I have read a lot of the postings on here from the periphery for the last two years..i think www has done incredible work telling things as they are...he has saved quite a few wannabes from spending a fortune...
he lost the plot for a while when he started a new thread about things picking up though!!!!........ my god! things picking up in ireland..what a joke...all the senior economists say it will be maybe 2018 before we have a return to growth...read david macwilliams article in todays independant...
the taxpayer has to put in 20 billion (maybe 30) into a small bank called anglo irish....imagine that....the government has to cut 3 billion in the next budget....all this will have a knock on efffect to the economy...
if anyone thinks this will not affect air travel....they are deluded.
Padraig o ceideigh of aer arann was on tv on saturday night and he said that things were "very tough"..
Cityjet are advertising now for candidates for the mentored scheme...i cannot understand why they would do this with people in a hold pool for 2 years...if a am wrong i am sure someone will correct me....i have a friend in the aer arann pool for a long time as well.
A suggestion to the senior moderators and experienced pilots on here from a humble wannabe....take an online poll of all the qualified pilots with less than 300 hours and ask how many of them are working?? and ask those "lurking" on the outside to register and vote....perhaps its been done before?? apologies if so.
A wannabe came to my house a few months ago looking for atpl folders..i sent him off to read www s posts here...he had been in oxford the week before at an open day... he soon changed his mind.
Anybody spending 90 k now on a career should inform themselves before making life changing decisions....some of us on here missed the boat because we were not qualified during the boom times....so be it...recriminations and regrets are never healthy.
I will continue with the modular...i dont believe age is a factor for anyone now and it is also against the law to be agest...modular and integrated all do the same exams...
So.. Well done to pprune and w.w.w for making wannabes keep an open mind...even though some of the posters here are over the top!!
There are lots of good guys out there willing to share knowledge and help others...pincipally eoin o malley who did a blog on his training with ptc..im sure he will get there in the end...
sorry to go off thread a little but it was nt that far off!
Best of luck to all..
cheers..

[Addemannen]

What about the finance, do I really need to have all money covered before I apply, if so how much will that be?

[Bombs Away]

emm Yes you do have to have provide the full amount yourself and I believe it's about 80,000 sterling (100,000 euro give or take) at the moment. Good luck getting that :}

[jez d]

With over 3,000 qualified 250 hour frozen ATPL holders in Europe looking for a job

Superpilot, can you tell me where you got this figure from please.

I don't disbelieve you, just curious as to your source.

Regards, jez

[the ace of spades]

has anyone heard anything back from fte or cityjet yet??
:ok:

[kingofkabul]

After sending in the application you should be sent a list of questions to answer. I have sent these answers off, but as applications do not close until august 8th I do not expect to hear back until after then. The following two stages are to held in Dublin, each stage is 1 day long according to WX.

Good luck to all who apply!

[eomni]

Does anyone have any constructive arguments on the issue? ('constructive' being the operative work)

I mean what exactly did happen with the pull-out from CityJet with CTC a few years back? Did it happen as some posters on pprune would have you believe?

Is this, pure and simply put, a money-making scheme on the part of both FTE and CJ? I mean obviously CJ are getting some sort of contract or financial 'kick-back' as it were, as well as FTE getting a guaranteed intake of trainees, so are they simply doing this for their own gain, or does anyone believe they are seriously interested in hiring the graduates? I find it hard to imagine they're doing this for the shear hell of it, although stranger things have happened.

Are CJ hiring at the minute? Do they have a hold-pool at the minute? Is it likely that even though they themselves are running the scheme, and presumably have predicted their intake need in 2012, you could automatically be put into a hold-pool? The mere thought beggars belief, but once again, stranger things have happened.

I'm struggling to find current financial / business reports for CJ to see how they're actually doing so that's where I'm a little stumped.

[kingofkabul]

As a private company the accounts they file are a bit limited, but for 2009/10 total losses increased from €16m to €64m, this is on a base of €293m revenue. yield dropped by 18%, and the operating loss - which is of most interest, was €55m. On The balance sheet its net assets are €158m, and it owes €130m to airfrance. The assets are quite high as it owns over half of the rj85s, and only leases 12 of them I think.

Overall that's not a good result, but that's to be expected given it's exposure to the city.

As for the comments on airlines running these schemes to make money, i would have thought that's a bit far fetched. It wouldn't make that much money for an airline, if any considering the costs of running a recruitment process. the problem is that with nearly a 2 year lapse between deciding to set up a cadet scheme and pilots making it onto the line the world may have changed. Typically, Airlines are pretty bad at making recruitment judgements.

[Yahweh]

From a mate who works for them, Out of the previous cadet class not one was actually taken. 2 or 3 were put in a hold pool and the rest were basically let go with minimum notice.

If your applying for this scheme just go in with your eyes wide open cause there are definitely no guarantee's with this one :uhoh:

[eomni]

But this is what I can't understand:

Why in hell would they bother running this course?

First of all, they can get the fATPL candidates fresh out of FTE any day of the year as there are surely plenty about.

Secondly, if they're doing it for the mentoring aspect, what is the point when they are frequently putting their cadets in a hold pool, and chances are they will with this new FTE batch they're sending in!

It's beyond belief!

[Vin Diesel]

Didn't Cityjet also run a scheme through 43 Air School in South Africa in recent years, in association with Sigmar? I wonder how many of those graduates ultimately flew the line with CityJet given the way the economy has been in recent years. I'd love to know the numbers.

I think that modern day Cadet Schemes have one major advantage. IF the 'mentoring' airline is doing well when you graduate then you're top of the queue to get onto the line.

But, if things aren't doing so well with that operator, then you're no better off than your fellow coursemates who self sponsored their training, and possibly, many thousands of pounds or euros worse off than those who hold the same licence via the modular route.

[Smell the Coffee]

Only advantage I can see is the ab-initio candidate that has decided that Integrated best suits their needs - if you were on the verge of selecting FTE as your training provider in any case, I guess this mentoring offer means you at least get a discount off the course price!

[the ace of spades]

has anyone been called to the next phase or heard anything

[kingofkabul]

Nothing yet, would be very surprised if we haven't anything by end of next week though!

[ShadowFive]

Bugger, who else got one of these in their email today?

Dear Candidate,

Thank you very much for your interest in the recent FTE/Cityjet pilot training scheme selection process.

We regret that on this occasion we are unable to progress your application to Phase 3. As we are sure you appreciate, this opportunity is a very popular one, and there are only a limited number of places available.

This does not necessarily mean that you would be unable to undertake the training for an Airline Transport Pilot’s License. If you would like to find out more information on how to achieve this without an airline scheme, please fill in our online application form and then contact us at [email protected]. We would be delighted to explain the assessment process, which we carry out prior to you making any commitment.

In the meantime, we wish you well in your flying aspirations, and we look forward to hearing from you in the future.

Kind Regards

[nickyboy007]

I got the same.

[kingofkabul]

Also got the same email. Makes me wonder what they are looking for, thought my application was fairly strong (straight As in maths and science subjects, semi-relevant degree at a good university, relevant work experience, a few hours flying experience, team work and leadership experience etc...)

Oh well, cityjet isn't going to be the only
opportunity out there, the industry is still a mess and it may take a bit more time for more of these opportunities to emerge. I can imagine this scheme got a lot of solid applications, and so competition was tough. We just need to stay patient, work on that back-up plan, and keep an eye out for future ways-in to this industry.

Good luck to everyone in their pursuits!

[RJS1987]

So with the current situation with lending or lack of it! How are people financing these cadet courses? I am sure there are some fortunate people who can afford to pay 100k just for the experiance but for the maority I am sure this is not the case, so how are people managing to go on these courses?

[AlexShorrock]

I've yet to receive an e-mail. I wonder whether that is good news or bad news...

[Exina]

Hey all,

I got through to Stage 3...

I received my email on the 18th, although went straight into my junk so didn't get it 'til the day after! Maybe check all your folders if you haven't got anything! :ok:

[PAPI-74]

Be very careful what you sign for.

[OutsideCAS]

@ Alex......if you have to pay for this scheme and haven't received an 'e' mail - well, i'd say that's good news !

[Smell the Coffee]

What UK schemes do you NOT need to pay for these days? Very few .... if you're from the UK and you wish to pursue flying professionally you WILL have to spend a large sum of money with NO guarantee of a job.

You could try for the CX CPP but the chances are slim of course.

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but no UK-based airline is currently offering full sponsorship from zero to frozen ATPL.

The choices are thus

1/ Join the armed forces (as long as you're under 23 if you want to be a pilot and have perfect eyesight)

2/ Pay a lot of money and go modular from zero to frozen ATPL (no job guarantees)

3/ Pay even more money and go Integrated (no job guarantees and ability to pay £1,000 per month for 10 years if you get a loan).

4/ Cityjet mentored scheme - Number 3/ applies. Slight chance Cityjet may employ you, but significant chance they may decide they can't/won't (has happened already, if other posts on here are to be taken at face value)

5/ Forget flying professionally, enjoy the PPL and get a job with better prospects.

If you're determined to fly and have the money to go integrated, and you're able to afford the worst case scenario of no employment after the Cityjet scheme (because neither Cityjet nor anyone else need pilots/want you) then the Cityjet scheme MAY be worth trying for.

The benefit is a slightly cheaper course cost and a slight chance of getting a job with Cityjet at the end.

[Exina]

Smell the Coffee;
100% agree.

I have a place with OAA too (with no definate job offers, just the training) so if there is a teeny tiny chance I might get an opportunity to fly with City Jet at the end, then bonus.

I understand the competition will be tough, but at the very least get some experience out of the process.

[Cityhopefull]

Hi All,

I presume everybody who was lucky enough to get through to phase 3 is watching this thread like hawks so i figured this would be the best way to contact you all! Has anyone heard back from FTE/Cityjet whether they were/weren't successful in phase 3?

[Newgen Jock]

Confirmed.:{
Cityjet has, though, gone out of their way to find many of the Candidates "Office Jobs" within the Company, thereby showing unusual (in this day & age) commitment to their selected candidates. Credit to them for that, hopefully things will pick up sometime.:D:D:D
They have also supported them in additional ways I won't discuss here.:ok:

Good luck to all.............
Newgen

[ESMS]

Got an e-mail saying I was successful at phase 3, really excited about it!

I remember they said that there was 30 of us at phase 3 and 6 would be chosen in the end. I wonder how many who passed on to phase 4.:bored:

[Cityhopefull]

Congrats ESMS, I got through too! I'm very curious to know how many are through too! Good luck in the interview!

[Exina]

I'm still waiting for an email; therefore I presume I was unsuccessful at Stage 3. :(

Good luck to those who go through to Stage 4 and beyond! :)

[hopefull pilot]

hi i was lucky enough for phase 3 still didnt get an answer yet about phase 4:bored: any ideas ?? next couple of days maybe ?? :hmm:

[ESMS]

Of course it bothers you.. But I have yet to meet someone who goes into pilot training simply because he want a job. This is a passion we all share and it's not risk free of course but you only live once. Atleast thats the way I see it.

In my case I've already been offered second officer employment by two airlines even before starting at FTE. So the possibility to fly for Cityjet is a great opportunity that you shouldn't overlook.

[Bonbia]

I believe that the final selection process is happening this week.

But to be honest we have a backlog with Cadet placement on TR courses. Atm any we have left 7 up til yesterday are all working at office jobs in Ops/Finance and Commercial.

To be honest I dont hold out much hope of them doing any training within the next 8 months as were putting up to 8 F/Os on part time or re placement to another operator.

3 RJ85s being parked up from October.

Bon

[dusty crop]

Esms...
Your quote of being offered "second officer employment by two airlines "before you have even attended fte...
You must be a budding Howard hughes..you are only 18 and offered two positions already...:D

Where do these guys come from??????

[The flying bob]

I'm afraid some of you here will deeply regret their choice in 18 months time. Don't you understand some airlines have deals with some FTOs to attract more newbees into their nets. By giving you the illusion you are different and better than dozen of other guys, they push you into immense amount of debt so thei business is preserved.

I can tell for sure that NONE of the CTC sponsored guys were offered a job by Cityjet, worst than that they didn't even try to get them a job within the company for the time being... And we're talking about 5 guys whom Cityjet promised the best deal ever (hell the deal was good, 104 000 EUR paid back towards the first 7 years of employment).

But who can blame you guys, you are just young and full of dream and you believe today that things WILL be different for you. I know I made the same mistake few years ago.
Good luck, you'll need it with Cityjet, the worst airline I've ever seen and heard of, even worst than Ryanair in my mind.

[ESMS]

That was after I was accepted at FTE and those offers came through contacts in the industry.
That being said, it's not like they knocked on my door and asked me to join them. You need to make an absolute commitment in this industry. Something a lot of aspiring pilots out there seem to have missed.

[Bombs Away]

So did anyone get accepted on to this?