manxcat
15th Jun 2010, 10:57
OAA.com - Oxford Aviation Academy (http://www.oaa.com/pages/training_courses/ab_initio/flybe.php)
Applications open on 16th June 2010. Good luck to all those that apply as this still promises to be a good option in light of the current recruitment situation.
Two differences I can see from the same Flybe scheme run with FTE is that OAA exclude PPLs with over 60 hours TT from applying and require those that have already passed the ATPL theory to re-sit the exams again. FTE stipulate you have to attend the ground school again but not sit the exams.
Can anyone shed any light on why there's a difference in eligibility/course requirements between FTE and OAA when the courses offer the same qualification for the same airline?
Can I apply for the scheme if I already have extensive flying experience?To qualify for consideration under the scheme, you must be able to show that you have no more that 60 hours of previous flying experience as a pilot or student pilot.
I have already completed some or all of the JAA ATPL theory exams. Am I eligible to apply?
You may apply conditionally, but you must complete the course in its entirety, including retaking the ground school and all 14 JAA examinations. This will require approval from the aviation authority under which you originally took the JAA exams and it is your responsibility to obtain that approval in writing, preferably before Stage 2, and in all cases before you could be considered for Stage 3 interview.
The Cat. :cool:
Otto Throttle
15th Jun 2010, 19:16
I would strongly advise anyone thinking of trying to pull the wool over anybody else's eyes (whether OAA or Flybe) not to do so. As soon as you get busted - and you will get busted - kiss any place goodbye.
And seeing as the Flybe recruitment manager has a memory that would shame an elephant, I wouldn't fancy your chances of walking in through the door as a regular pilot either. With questionable integrity, Flybe wouldn't touch you with a bargepole.
Put1992
15th Jun 2010, 22:15
Of course - anyone with more than 60hrs would be daft to admit it!
Copies of logbooks were asked for during my assesment stages, it would be a waste of time to yourself, and them, to either alter your hours (which just wont add up) or to pretend you haven't flown any hours.
Cheers,
Put
Adios
18th Jun 2010, 20:30
Oxford have never had a 60 hours max rule for any other scheme; it's not in their interest to limit the number of applicants. Perhaps FTE simply eliminated any applicants who had more than 60 hours without publishing the rule. Considering the advice given above to "omit" the facts on the job application, maybe FTE was smarter about catching them out. No rule published means there's no perceived need to fudge. They still end up in the reject pile, but nobody slags FTE on for enforcing what is probably Flybe's rule.
Reverserbucket
18th Jun 2010, 21:16
Oxford have never had a 60 hours max rule for any other scheme
True although I seem to recall that BA used to limit the hours they would accept for entry to the sponsored pilot training scheme as 50? Perhaps it's a Flybe limitation.
Unless there's a stipulation under MPL that limits the number of 'real' hours you can have? I mean 60 hours is more than you actually do on the course right? :}
Adios
19th Jun 2010, 08:49
RB,
It is a Flybe rule; that was the point of my post. MPL includes various amounts of hours in aircraft, 85 at Oxford and a similar number at FTE.
There are no such limits for MPL, but since the whole point is to train students in pairs, which you can't do in an aircraft, there's no point in overdoing the non-simulated hours. Such a syllabus does exist; it's called a CPL/IR!
206Fan
24th Jun 2010, 23:57
What are the key characteristics of the new scheme?
The new OAA/Flybe MPL provides high quality, airline focused training. The overall scheme combines the following key features:
Initial selection by OAA and Flybe
Substantial financial contribution by Flybe toward training costs
Provision of OAA Skills Protection Plan throughout Phases 1-3
Bespoke ‘Flybe’ Jet Operational Conversion training on CRJ-200 simulator
Q400 Type training at Flybe
Foundation Degree in Air Transport ManagementWhat are the entry requirements for the Scheme?
If you wish to apply for the scheme, then you must fulfil all the criteria detailed below:
You must be qualified for University entrance in your country of residence. Click here for more details. (http://www.oaa.com/flybe/cadet_programme/edu_popup.html)
You must have both mathematics and science qualifications at a grade equivalent to C or better in the UK GCSE grading system.
You must be proficient in English.
Your date of birth must have been no later than 30th September 1992.
You must have EU or UK citizenship or indefinite leave to remain in the UK by the application closing date.
You must possess or be capable of obtaining a JAR-FCL3 Class 1 Medical Certificate by 10th October 2010.How does the Scheme work?
Applicants must first undertake a joint OAA/Flybe selection process held at Oxford and Exeter, England. We will use a three stage selection process based on OAA’s existing and internationally recognised Skills Assessment process. Those jointly selected by OAA and Flybe will then join the MPL course starting at the end of November this year. Your theoretical training will all be undertaken at Oxford and initial flight training is planned for Melbourne, Australia, before returning to Oxford to undertake jet simulator training. The advanced (Q400) phases of your course will be completed in our Stockholm training facility and with Flybe at Exeter. Employment with Flybe is conditional on your achieving and maintaining satisfactory standards as you progress through the course and the airline still being in a position to employ you at that stage (this is a standard clause in all airline sponsored or mentored courses)
What are the financial benefits?
The scheme provides for significant financial benefits. Essentially, OAA and Flybe will provide:
A conditional offer of employment with Flybe as a First Officer on the Q400 fleet with standard salary and benefits.
On completion of training, Flybe will contribute £19,800 plus VAT toward the cost of OAA training and will fund the Q400 Type Rating (Phase 4) subject to a three year training bond
A bespoke secured loan from a London bank to help with initial fees will be available to UK residents. Applicants will need to meet standard credit requirements (it is recommended that you be able to contribute at least £10,000 towards the training costs).
Flybe will pay assessment costs for all selected studentsAfter taking up employment with Flybe, pilots can expect to start on the basic Q400 salary which, for 2012, is expected to be set at over £26,000. Flybe reviews employee remuneration annually, so there could be a further salary increase prior to graduates from this scheme joining the airline. All normal supplementary payments, for example sector pay, will also be paid as part of the standard Flybe pilot salary package and this typically totals approximately £3,000 per annum. Pilots will be required to repay the Flybe contribution to their training costs with the new scheme via a post-tax salary deduction over the first 5 years of employment at an agreed rate, probably of around £330 per month.
What will happen if Flybe cannot employ me?
Flybe will confirm no later than the date on which you complete theoretical training (4th June 2011) whether they anticipate being able to employ you on completion of your Oxford training (March 2012). In the very unlikely event they are unable to offer provisional employment at that stage, OAA will convert your training to a standard APPFO course and will assist you to obtain employment with an alternative airline on training completion. There will be no extra cost to you should this occur, but you will not, of course, receive any further financial contribution from Flybe toward your training costs.
How much will the course cost?
Total training cost for the OAA provided phases (1-3) will be £71,000 including CAA examination and license issue fees. On training completion, Flybe’s contribution will offset the initial expenditure by £19,800 + VAT and they will also fully fund the Q400 Type (Phase 4) and Line Training. Student’s must therefore initially fund the cost of phases 1-3 from personal resources or the bespoke loan, as well as funding their meals plus accommodation during the Oxford and Melbourne based phases of training. For non-UK resident applicants, OAA will endeavour to advise you of loan options with various European banks. Students are, of course, also free to secure their own loan in their country of residence, or to self-fund. Options can be discussed in more detail during the advanced stages of selection.
When will Flybe make their financial contribution toward my MPL training course?
Flybe anticipate that they will pay their contribution toward your training costs on completion of the last OAA delivered phase (Phase 3) but, in certain circumstances, this payment may be brought forward to coincide with completion of ground training. For now, however, you should assume that payment will be made on course completion- , i.e. in March 2012, and to make your financial plans on that basis
Will I be required to occupy OAA accommodation during the course?
Flybe have requested that the cadets reside in OAA provided accommodation throughout their training with OAA in order to build team work and mutual support through what is a challenging training environment.
I have already passed the APP FO Skills Assessment and applied for the standard BBVA Professional Studies Loan. Should I continue my loan application?
You should continue your existing loan application concurrently with the OAA/Flybe selection process, which will ensure your course commencement, is not delayed unnecessarily if you are not selected by Flybe for the MPL course.
Will the OAA Skills Protection Plan (SPP) guarantee apply to the OAA/Flybe Scheme?
Due to the very high standards required to be selected for the scheme, failure is deemed highly unlikely, but OAA will apply the Skills Protection Plan guarantees to all selected students. The guarantee effectively covers financial risk up to the end of Phase 3 should OAA and Flybe terminate the student’s training due to lack of aptitude.
Must I already possess a JAR-FCL3 Class 1 Medical to apply?
No, but you must be able to obtain one at least 6 weeks before the commencement of the course. Details on how to obtain the medical certificate will be provided later to all applicants who reach Stage 3 of the selection process.
Why are the educational criteria for the scheme set higher than for self-sponsored APPFO students?
Airline recruitment of a self-sponsored student generally occurs only after completion of training, meaning that the student bears the risk of not achieving good results on the course. For the Flybe scheme, the airline shares the financial and training risk because selection is made before the start of ab-initio training without a training record to review. Understandably, Flybe are seeking high quality candidates. By setting higher than normal criteria, we can ensure that applications are limited only to those whose academic background indicates that they are very unlikely to experience any difficulties in achieving the highest standard of performance in training.
Maths and Physics are the two subjects most relevant to pilot training. However, OAA’s experience is that other rigorous science based subjects are also good indicators that an applicant is likely to perform well on the course, and we do not wish to be overly restrictive. So if you have at least the equivalent to UK A-level (or higher) in mathematics and one of the following science based subjects; biology, chemistry, geography, geology, aeronautical or nautical science, or other non social science topic, then assuming you meet the other criteria, you may feel free to apply.
UK Higher National Diplomas, BTecs and NVQs are often considered equivalent to A-levels, but you must furnish documentation of this from the awarding body. University degrees are obviously more than acceptable.
I did not go to a school in the English educational system. How can I determine if I possess the equivalent of A-levels?
Click here for the equivalent non-UK qualifications (http://www.oaa.com/flybe/cadet_programme/edu_popup.html)
The Irish Leaving Certificate and Scottish Highers are equivalent to A-levels. A-levels are required for University entrance in the UK, so if you have an educational background that would qualify you for University entrance, you are likely to have acceptable equivalents, but they must still include Maths and Science for this particular scheme. We use UCAS Guidelines to determine eligibility.
Can I apply based on predicted grades?
Yes, but you must have the final grade reports at least two months before starting the MPL course, i.e. in September, and failure to achieve the predicted grade could result in the withdrawal of any conditional offer.
How good does my English need to be for me to apply?
Although we do not list specific English academic or proficiency requirements, those who are not fluent in English may experience difficulties with the aptitude testing because it is conducted entirely in English.
If I do not meet the educational criteria for this cadet programme, does this mean I should not consider entering professional flight training as a self-sponsored student?
No. A great number of students with lower educational qualifications have successfully completed an OAA training course. If you are in any doubt as to your academic background, the best indicator of whether or not you could succeed as a self-sponsored student would be to attend a skills and aptitude assessment at any major Flight Training Organisation (FTO) of your choice. If you pass, this means the FTO thinks you would be likely to succeed.
Is previous flight training experience or a PPL required?
No. Whilst PPL experience can sometimes be a useful indicator of an applicant’s interest in flying, we do understand that many applicants may not have had the means or opportunity to take flying lessons and the course reflects this fact.
Can I apply for the scheme if I already have extensive flying experience?
To qualify for consideration under the scheme, you must be able to show that you have no more than 60 hours of previous flying experience as a pilot or student pilot.
I unsuccessfully applied for a previous Flybe programme at another FTO. Am I eligible to apply for the OAA/Flybe MPL scheme?
If it has been more than one year since your previous Flybe application and provided that you meet all the stated criteria for this specific competition, you may apply for this scheme so long as you did not fail the previous selection process at the Flybe final interview stage; however, you will be required to participate in all stages of OAA’s selection process.
You are not eligible to apply for this scheme if you have undertaken any selection programme for a Flybe supported scheme during the last 12 months
I unsuccessfully applied for previous OAA airline programmes. Am I eligible to apply for the OAA/Flybe MPL scheme?
You may apply for the Flybe scheme provided that you meet all the stated criteria for this specific competition and that you have never failed any portion of OAA’s Skills Assessment. If you reached Day 2 of Stage 2 of the selection process for a previous OAA cadet scheme, but were not chosen for advancement to Stage 3, you may apply.
I have already passed the APP First Officer skills assessment. May I apply and, if so, will I have to retake the assessment?
You may apply provided that you meet the specific criteria for this scheme, that you unconditionally passed OAA Skills Assessment at your first attempt within the last 6 months (i.e. post 31st Dec 2009), and that you have not registered for a confirmed course place prior to the training commencement date for this MPL course. If your previous assessment was after 30th November 2009, , you will not have to undertake assessment again, nor will you be permitted to do so in hopes of achieving better scores. You must, however, still complete the on-line application within the published timescale.
Notes:
Candidates who did not successfully complete APPFO Skills Assessment at their first attempt are not eligible to apply for this scheme.
OAA students already undertaking training courses are not eligible to apply for this scheme.I am enrolled in a cadet programme with another FTO but am interested in applying for this new scheme. Am I eligible to apply?
No. Oxford Aviation Academy works very hard to maintain good relationships with other FTOs and with all airlines, whether or not they have currently or recently hired our graduates. We will not consider applications from airline cadets at other FTOs.
I already have a CPL/IR or ATPL for airplanes. Am I eligible to apply?
No. This scheme is designed to identify cadets for an ab-initio training programme that must be completed in its entirety. As already outlined, individuals who already have more than 60 hours qualifying flight time may not apply, a restriction which automatically rules out those who already hold ratings or qualifications above PPL level.
I have already completed some or all of the JAA ATPL theory exams. Am I eligible to apply?
You may apply conditionally, but you must complete the course in its entirety, including retaking the ground school and all 14 JAA examinations. This will require approval from the aviation authority under which you originally took the JAA exams and it is your responsibility to obtain that approval in writing, preferably before Stage 2, and in all cases before you could be considered for Stage 3 interview.
How do I apply?
The first step in the selection process is to see if you match the profile above, but particularly the educational, flying experience and citizenship requirements. If you believe you fit the profile, then you need to complete and submit the on-line application form.
Please note that applications to be considered for the programme are only possible through the OAA web site. You cannot apply direct to Flybe; neither can you use mail or fax.
When must I apply?
Your application must be transmitted to us no later than 23:59 hrs British Summer Time on Sunday 27th June.
What happens after I submit my application?
You will automatically receive a web browser based confirmation that your application has been successfully received. In the unlikely event that you receive an error message, you should print a copy to allow us to validate your timely application attempt and then contact us on the number given at the bottom of this FAQ. Once your application posts to our database, you will subsequently receive a separate automatic e-mail providing further guidance on ‘what happens next?’ Receipt of this email is your proof that we received your application, so please keep a copy. The following, 3-Stage selection process will apply:
Stage 1 - OAA assessors will review all applications based upon the facts you have provided and the views you have expressed in response to the set ‘essay’ questions. You will be advised no later than 1800 hrs on Monday 5th July whether or not you have been successful in going forward to Stage 2.
Stage 2 – Unless you have recently completed the APPFO Skills Assessment (as detailed above) successful applicants who pass Stage 1 screening will be invited to attend the next stage of OAA Selection, which will take place at Oxford Airport during the 2 weeks commencing Monday 2nd August; OAA will notify you of the exact date on which you should attend. All candidates will complete the computer-based testing process used for all APPFO applicants. Should you reach the requisite standard, you will be invited to spend a second day at Oxford, during which you will go on to complete team exercises and interviews with OAA assessors. If you passed the standard OAA skills assessment on your first attempt since 30th November 2009, you will not need to attend Stage 2 and will be considered for advancement to Stage 3 based on your previous assessment results.
Stage 3 - The final step in the selection process will be an interview with Flybe’s own assessment team. You will be notified no later than 1800 hrs on Monday 23rd August whether you have been fortunate enough to be recommended by OAA for interview. Stage 3 will be at Exeter, probably during the week starting 13th September 2010, but this will be confirmed closer to the date.What criteria will be used to determine who is accepted to Stage 2 of the selection process?
A team of assessors will review all applications to ensure they meet the published criteria. The next step will be to review your answers to the set questions, and from these to select those we judge should go through to Stage 2. It will be clear from this that the quality of your answers to the set ‘essay’ questions is important. We strongly recommend that you take due time and care in framing your responses.
There is no advantage to be gained in this competition by submitting an ‘instant’ application. You would be well advised to review carefully all the information you have entered in the application and to ensure that all requested detail has been provided. Where applicable, you should exercise care to ensure that you stay within notified character limits; if you exceed the limit, then the assessors will not be able to read the additional material. Conversely, very brief essay answers are unlikely to be sufficient. You should remember that the information you provide is the key to whether or not you will be successful in reaching successive stages of the competition. It is up to you to convince the assessment team that you have the qualities sought, and the application form is a critical element in the process; please take appropriate care and check carefully for grammatical and spelling errors before you press send; remember, this is a competition, and careless errors will count against you.
We also suggest that you save a copy of your answers before pasting them into the online application in case you lose your Internet connection before you complete and submit the application.
The guidance for this scheme indicates that Stage 2 of the selection is a two-day process. If I am not selected to attend the second day, would this indicate that I should give up my aspirations to become an airline pilot?
No. Because the competition is likely to be tough, it is probable that a number of applicants of good quality, and who would therefore be quite capable of succeeding in ATPL training, may still not reach the advanced stages of selection.
The standard APPFO Skills Assessment includes a flight simulator check. Why is this not required for the OAA/Flybe scheme?
The role of a simulator check in the APP FO assessment is to corroborate the results of the computer based tests. Since the number of training places associated with the OAA/Flybe scheme is limited, we can be confident that all successful applicants will have achieved high grade scores on the computer based tests, so a corroborating simulator check is not therefore deemed necessary.
APPFO students go through a Skills and Aptitude Assessment, while you refer to the process for getting accepted onto this scheme as a selection process. What is the difference between the two?
Selection is a competitive process, for which we set higher than normal application standard in terms of academic achievement. Even then, we know that a large number of applicants will be competing for a finite number of places; this is clearly the case for the OAA/Flybe scheme; hence the term `Selection’. Applicants for the standard APP FO course, on the other hand, are not in competition with each other. In this latter process, we set an assessment standard, and if a prospective student reaches that standard, then we are able to offer a place on the APPFO course. Thus, failure to win a place in the OAA MPL scheme certainly does not indicate that you are unlikely to succeed if you apply to become a self-sponsored APPFO student.
How will I be advised of my progress?
On completion of each stage of the selection process, OAA will advise all applicants by email whether they have been successful or unsuccessful. The former group will then be advised of arrangements for the next stage. All applicants who reach Stage 2 should be prepared to spend a maximum of 2 days at Oxford Airport.
What are my chances of success?
At this stage, it is too early to say. Obviously, we are looking for high calibre, well motivated individuals. The number of places available is limited, so inevitably not all of those who meet the selection requirements will become a beneficiary of the programme, but that should not stop you applying.
If I am successful, will my training progress at Oxford be monitored?
During all stages of training, progress will be monitored by both Flybe and OAA. Airline support could be withdrawn in the event that such progress is judged unsatisfactory.
How much will it cost me to apply?
There is no initial application fee. In the event you are invited to attend for Stage 2, a standard assessment fee of £195 will apply. Flybe will reimburse those eventually selected for the scheme.
Should you be unsuccessful in your Flybe application, but then wish to apply to be considered as a self-sponsored student, you will not need to pay any additional fee to complete the standard OAA Skills Assessment process.
Can you provide me with a summary of all relevant dates for the scheme?
A table showing all planned dates is shown below. Note that all dates are for planning purposes only and could be changed by OAA or Flybe at any stage. Final arrangements will be notified to those candidates concerned.
Opening date for applications - Wednesday 16th June
Closing date for applications - Sunday 27th June
Notification of Stage 2 selection - Monday 5th July
Stage 2 selection dates - Monday 2nd – Friday 13th August
Notification of Stage 3 selection - Monday 23rd August
Stage 3 interviews - Monday 13th September (tbc)
Notification of results - Monday 20th September
MPL course enrolment - Monday 22nd November (tbc)
Course Completes - March 2012
What do I do if I have any further queries?
Once you have thoroughly read the above there are several ways to obtain additional information about the programme as follows:
Browse the OAA web site for additional information about the MPL Course - click here (http://www.oaa.com/pages/training_courses/ab_initio/mpl.php)
Order the OAA Skills Directory to learn more about what we do (The MPL course section begins on page 69 in the Skills Directory).
Post questions or read those posted by others in the @sk Oxford Forum (http://ask.oxfordaviation.net/) (This is the preferred method for questions as others gain the benefit of reading your queries and OAA’s responses).
If you still have unanswered questions, call an OAA Training Advisor on 01865-840352
nevergiveup35
5th Jul 2010, 19:58
I`m just wandering guys,what happens if I will get into the "best" 6 onto stage 4,and my loan will be refused?Because all I can see is,everyone keep encouraging you,but they don`t really mention about the case,when even if you`ve got the skills,there are only a few pounds on your bank account,don`t own anything at all...Can you make it happen?
Otto Throttle
7th Jul 2010, 10:49
Simple. You won't make it to the Flybe interview. It is a pre-requisite for all applicants recommended by the FTO to Flybe that they have finance in place. Doesn't always happen that way, but at least that is the stipulation.