Who would pay if employment is guaranteed?

[A.B.I.]

Hi guys, I came along a website and the operator offers type rating, line training with employment at the end.

I know most of you folks do not want to pay for anything. But with the current market situation and more airlines moving to the pay your traiing scheme, I just wanted to know.

Would you pay for your training and have a 4 year contract including a commercial type rating waiting for you?

Lets talk

[FlyingStone]

I for one would - assuming you have a SIGNED contract and not a promised one and if type is perspective (B737/A320) and not some regional/turboprop crap (CRJ,ATR,...) :)

[riciardi]

website operator type rating line training contract guaranteed scam

[A.B.I.]

nice one stone.... I was thinking so as well.
Ric, i was not asking if scam or not, just asking if someone would do it.

[A320Dreamer]

What's the website if I may ask?

[BigNumber]

Interesting... very interesting.

So, hypothetically; if I was P1 on a Biz Jet and was charged with the autonomous recruitment for my new P2 would you guy's pay me a finders fee. Dowry if you prefer.

Assuming that there was a permanent contract of employment, salary and pension included in the deal.

[kuryus]

yeap, I would do it. IF I had the money for it, but I'm broke as never before.
I am interested in knowing what website it is anyway. You never know... :ugh:

[fly_antonov]

Sign up immediately. That is the luck of your life!
Don' t tell other people about it or you will be shadowed by competition.

Go for it.

[A.B.I.]

Thanks guys,
I got the contract but its limited to 6 years. However the line training is not on jet but on turbopropo or c-208. once completed the company pays for jet rating and employs me for 6 years. They sponsor 50 % of the training costs and I am wondering after doing my (f) ATPL, now I have to pay again.

But (by the way), there is no recruitment fee.:)

So just wondering how many would do it.

[Viraaj Shah]

Yes, I would. Though it looks like a scam, if the company is reliable and there is a contract, I wouldn't mind paying for it. Though I'd feel guilty for spending that much again, thinking of long term, I would.

[A.B.I.]

just my point. I feel bad spending much money again, even when it seems cheaper than most other line training prices I have seen.

No, but the company seems to be clean. They had a couple of bumps at first, but gave a statement to it. I guess I will do it afterall. Thanks guys.

[alphaadrian]

Whats the deal if the company goes bankrupt half way thru ur "training"? Refund? haha!...silly question!:ok:

[dwshimoda]

and not some regional/turboprop crap (CRJ,ATR,...)

Utter drivel coming out of the mouth of a naive wannabee. With an attitude like that, I suspect you will continue to be a wannabee for a while.

[FlyingStone]

@dwshimoda: I didn't mean to say that regional/turboprop airliners are crap. But if I were to pay my own type rating, it probably wouldn't be for CRJ (or turboprop), but for something more competitive, something that allows me to build up in the world in the future (A320/B737). And as said, I would only do it with signed contract in my pocket...

[BigNumber]

Indeed; far more sensible to invest in P2F Line Training on a ubiquotous type such as A320 / 737.

It would be crazy to build 500 hours+ on a type with a few less applicants for each vacant position.

The CRJ is rather 'lower deck' and any TP would be simply socially unacceptable. Who would possibly want to fly such a aircraft? Not me!

[CathayBrat]

Who would possibly want to fly such a aircraft? Not me!


Me, me, me all the newbie’s should be shouting. Surely any job at the moment is better than trying to keep your head above water in some stagnant holding pool, with all the other newbie’s happy and willing to stand on your head and hold you down. All newbie’s should have to do the old fashioned route of flying, single piston, twin piston, then small turbine. It teaches you to fly, simple as that. Many of my friends in the left seat despair at the quality they get lumped with, from these P2F people, who know how to use the radio and programme the computer. News flash, these break, so then what are you going to do? Oh, its ok, the captain can do it. Yup, he can, because he knows how to fly, more than likely he came up the old route.
So what is the fascination to fly the shiny cigar tube? Prestige? Nope, that’s pretty much gone. Money? Nope, MOL and his ilk have removed that. Excitement? A to B 6 times a day, auto pilot all the way. Yawn. Now I am not knocking guys who do this, it probably suits them and they enjoy it. I did it, was bored out of my tiny pilot mind, so left and returned to the Dark place south of the Med. And if its so wonderful in the tube, why do we get 100’s of cv’s from tube movers, with 1000’s of hrs in the left seat. Probably the same reason I moved back here.
Prestige. Yup, we respect our pilots professional qualifications, experience and knowledge, they are not just another pilot. We trust them to make their own decisions, we don’t second guess them, and they work hard, but that comes on to the 2nd point. Money. As a pilot here you will be earning more than a co-jo in RYR or sleazy jet, and its all command time, there is no tax and cost of living is very low. Housing, uniform, meals and beer (at the end of the day of course) are all provided as well. And due to the nature of some of the places we go to, bonus’s are good.
Excitement. We fly a wide variety of planes here, from a single engine aerobatic to large multi turbine’s. And each crew fly’s them all. I have lost count of how many types I have on my various licenses, but can go from the big twin turbine to the small aero in the same day. And every day is different. Tourist flight in the morning, cargo at lunchtime, with a divert for a medi-vac before back home for beer and crumpet.
So that’s my penny’s worth, am sure I will now get flamed by all the bitter newbie’s still swimming in a pool somewhere who still think the cigar tube is the be all to end all, but how do they know? Have they tried anything else? All comments happily received, but remember, if you are a bitter newbie, before you try to flame me, I’m flying, you are not.
Cheers

[kuryus]

CathayBrat, I do not disagree with you, but even those jobs you talk about, they don't show up anywhere to newbies. At least I haven't found any, because I would definitly apply for it immediatly.
One of the best things about flying is doing different things every day. And I believe that the experience you talk about of flying different aircraft constantly should be wonderfull and the best school ever.
But again, where are those jobs for newbies... No where to be found.

[lander66]

FlyingStone-I for one would - assuming you have a SIGNED contract and not a promised one and if type is perspective (B737/A320) and not some regional/turboprop crap (CRJ,ATR,...)

FlyingStone- I didn't mean to say that regional/turboprop airliners are crap.

Well that is what you said. If I had the offer of paying for a type rating on a regional jet/turboprop with a guarunteed job at the end, I would grab it with both hands and skip around for days (in the unlikely event that I could afford it)...

Personally I am glad that there are "wannabes" who don't really want to fly, they just want to cruise around living a "glamorous" lifestyle flying jets aged 22. It means that there are more jobs for the rest of us who are prepared to go anywhere and fly anything.

[socrates]

Be very careful.

There was a scheme advertised all over this website a year or 2 ago by some company offering A320 type ratings, line training and jobs on completion. If I remember correctly it was done via easyjet and the advert read along the lines that once you had completed the scheme they had partner airlines waiting to sign you up as a fully paid FO on full benefits and salary.

Suffice to say it was all bullsh1t.

Even if its in the contract I would get some confirmation from the company you'd be employed by rather than rely on your contract. Should you decide to commit, whatever the contract states, you may end up coming unstuck.

[BigNumber]

Okay; so going back to my post #6

Hypothetically; What is the answer?

How much 'Dowry' could I expect ( in addition to the candidate paying their TR )?

[alphaadrian]

In the event that a company goes bankrupt, remember that the only use of that contract is to roll it up and wipe your ass with it!! As indeed I found out when, many years back, the FTO that I had chosen for my training went down the pan taking 2k of my hard earned cash with it!

Alpha

[pilot790]

Ideally there was sponsorship but that has dwindled down due to the economic conditions which are dynamic !!

So most pilots from the boom years invested in themselves which is a good thing!! you succeed and your family enjoys the fruits of your labour !!

The question is to which extent you are willing to invest in your self

All I can say is that if you can afford it go for it !! All those who have done line training on the majority seem to be getting jobs so good luck

I am a neutral and wish everyone well and good fortune. To be a pilot you have to have natural inherent skills and one is optimism !!

Good luck and if any one wants to PM I am willing to fight my cause

[Pilot Positive]

As you can image this is an extremely contentious topic: There are a lot of people who have exploited the wannabee situation and others who have had their fingers burnt. Not to mention the issues of job merit, aviation safety and impact on T&Cs. See Below

http://www.pprune.org/interviews-jobs-sponsorship/412949-2011-recruitment.html

http://www.pprune.org/terms-endearment/410089-p2f-cancer-aviation-merged-petitions.html

http://www.pprune.org/airlines-airports-routes/408838-varsity-express-gone-bust-within-1-week-merged.html

Just cant believe people are still wanting to hand over cash to fly...even in this climate. :eek:

Contract or no contract you are extremely vulnerable and are helping to create an industry based on cash rather than merit with safety as the compromise. But then again you can take a horse to water.... :ugh:

[johns7022]

Paying up front for a job? No...but paying a prorated amount of training if I walked in the first year..not common but some operators have been burned by job hoppers...

[INNflight]

So........just to sum this up:

* You PAY for the TR

* You PAY for 50% of the line training (ooh how generous of the airline to pay the other half)

* You will be BONDED there for 6 ( !!!! ) years, even though the airline has not given you ANYTHING really?!?!

----

Sounds like an awfully good deal, jump aboard. :bored:

Edit: By the way... would you think a sales rep for an airline pays his way into a job?

Would you think a flight attendant would pay just to work?

Would you think the guy throwing bags into your hold would pay to do that?

Nope....only pilots are STUPID enough to do that!!! :suspect:

[INNflight]

...This is the auto-reply function of PPRuNe...

To respond to the above posting, please select one of the following answers:


a.) Yes, but the industry is in a bad state and this is the only way to get a job.

b.) You're right, but what other way is there into a very shiny jet cockpit?

c.) I wonder if I need to buy my uniform also...mmh... must start thread about it.

:ugh:

How 'bout you just sit it out and wait, maybe, in a year or two, that airline would be delighted to have pilots, pay for the TR and everything else. But noo, we all want it NOW NOW NOW.

Do some calculations and figure out how many hours of SE piston / ME piston you can fly to keep current / timebuild with the money you'd put towards a TR...