Saudi A320

[GoForIt]

Some questions about the A320 program.

1. How many hours a month are A320 skippers flying?
2. Are all A320 pilots dual rated with the A330, and flying both airplanes?
3. What percentage of A320 flying is international and what percentage is domestic?
4. I've got an interview in Paris. What should I expect? Is there a sim ride for this interview? Is it at the same time or is it a two phase interview process?

Thanks,
GoForit

[BadAndy]

1. Been averaging 40ish a month on reserve (but being told that will dramatically increase starting in about 3 weeks).

2. No, not dual qualled, and so far not being told of any plans to dual qual us (would be nice, though).

3. No idea on percentages, but on reserve in April, I never left the Kingdom, had a line in May, so had 2 Int'l trips scheduled, and back on reserve in June, so who knows. But, as a reserve, expect a lot of domestic trips. (I seem to be drawn to Abha multiple times a day...)

4. No idea about interviews now. Last year, they were 2 part interviews -- first part was one day in Cairo (written test in the AM, interview in the PM). Then a month later, back to JED for sim and medical. The written was almost word for word from Acing the Airline Technical Interview (or something like that). Again, not sure if that is still the format today, but it was a straight-forward, relaxed, non-confrontational process.

Good luck, hope that helps.

[GoForIt]

Thanks BadAndy. that was the info I was looking for.

In general, are you happy there? How is the quality of life in Saudi City?

Also, how long did it take from the time you started training to when you were released to the line?

[BadAndy]

In general, yes I am happy here. I will be happier in a few weeks when my family joins me... I have my complaints, but that will be true anywhere. There are good points and bad points, but once training is done, the good points seem to outweigh the bad points (training was approx 6 months to get released, and most of us were ready to quit and go home at some point during the training... However, the senior guys convinced us to stick it out -- and they were right, it has gotten a lot better post-training...) For the most part, they just leave me alone to fly (no hassles from management here like the other M.E. carriers are experiencing. The only bad points stem from a lack of organization in general, and our managers being swamped with work..., not from malicious attitudes). And, the F/Os here are the best I've ever flown with, so work (flying) is actually fun.

As for life on the compound -- it is what it is. It is living in a compound away from home. It isn't home. But, the housing is okay and the other families here make it bearable (a lot of bbq's and more families coming so even more "gatherings"...). Life in the Saudia compound is definitely better than other places I've worked and lived (Kuwait and West Africa). And, as more families come (with kids), it will keep getting better (we all hope).

But, to answer your questions, yes I am happy here. Four months ago, I couldn't wait to get out of here and never return. Now, I'm moving the wife and kids over here for at least the next few years. There is a lot to be said for the stability here. Go figure...

[chuckunu]

do NOT GO IF YOU ArE TOLD TO BUY YOU OWN AIRFARE AND " WE WILL REIMBURSE YOU" I hjave many pilot freinds who have not received the moneys back since oct. just get the typical saudi runnaround. if they supply then it can be ok but if you need your money forget it.

[chuckunu]

I cannot belive this.\.
I think My friend is sucking for pitty party.

Is it true Saudi does not pay the over time to Pilots until like six months later?

I was told by he that the overtime flying for JAN flying will be paid in July Inshalla??

I don't blieve him, how can Kings airline be this unorganized?

surly they mus be more organized?

[mutt]

surly they mus be more organized? Nope....... but ask your friend how much FLIGHT TIME he is doing before he gets paid overtime.

Mutt

[Samiadam]

chuckunu,


Its true what you are saying. They paid Dec's overtime two months ago. JANs overtime is still not paid. I dont know why they do that but thats how it is. Six months later , over time is paid. It wasnt like that few years ago.....

Sam

[Romasik]

Gentlemen, what are you talking about? I got my December overtime pay in February...:confused:

[metro301]

No one can tell for sure, they stopped giving out the paystubs in 2009.

They do pay what is owed, sometimes it just takes awhile to make it to you.

[mutt]

Metro301, pay stubs are still available, log on to the SAP system and print them out.

Mutt

[metro301]

Mutt, can u pm me the link please? there are about 50 different sites now and the links aren't working between them. I haven't seen a paystub since june of 2009.

[CRJleb]

Hello everyone!
Does anyone have any information on the Saudi Arabian Airlines GACA FAA ATP exam?
Any helpful information would be appreciated.
Thanks

[vtwo]

Chuck it is true, No Payment for the Joining ticket I was told to buy it and I would get paid back. that was back in Feb. There is no system in place at SVA to track and follow up on things like that. if there is it is a SECRET.
I still have No idea what my travel benefits are. what is a 3-1? a 4-1 and a 1-1?
those are tickets but not sure which ones we get and how much they cost.

The ATP study, if you can get the Computerized Gleim study guide.
That is the test. It seems GACA has just ripped it off. The test I took was that study guides practice test . All they do is print out the sample test results and stamp it.

Hope it helps,
also, after reading the post from above, when is the pay for Perdiem and Overtime supposed to be paid? is there anything written about this? How long have Pilots been allowing this to go on?
thanks
V2

[metro301]

3-1 - space positive. 1 per year for you and your immediate family. 1st class for Captains, I think Economy or Business for FO's.

4-1 - space available, Economy. 1 per year for you and your family.

1-1 - no idea, probably for company business.

ACM - space positive Economy, 1 per month only for you.

ID 50 - space positive, unlimited. 50% of full fare in the cabin you choose.

ID 75 - space available, unlimited. 25% of full fare in the cabin you choose.

ZED Fare - space avail, unlimited on other Airlines.

After 10 years you get a term pass. That allows unlimited 1st class, space positive travel for a 3% fee.

[mutt]

vtwo,

Suggest you ask your management for the COCKPIT CREW ADMINISTRATIVE GUIDE.... it will answer a lot of your questions....

Metro301, 1-1 is for medical etc.

Cheers

[vtwo]

Metro, Mutt,
thanks for the explanations.
Mutt I did ask my boss, but got the Saudi Stare with a nice smile.

It looks like the collective minds here are a more valuable source of info.
Cheers

[mutt]

Your boss is a buddy of mine, but unfortunately they arent used to employing people..... so wander across the corridor to the office of the AGM Line and Administrative affairs and ask his admin staff......
Its an electronic document so easy to obtain.......... however, failing that, ask your neighbors, or failing that, review the documents given to you by HR, it should state, 1 3-1 positive ticket per year (Free but you pay taxes, same as ACM) 4-1 standby fare depends on destination plus taxes.... 1-1 medical, emergency etc...... ACM free for you not family and you pay the taxes.....

Good Luck.....

Mutt

[vtwo]

Mutt,
yes your are right they are very nice but not used to employing peeps.
I did not receive any thing from HR, I am getting sick of the run around Why is every thing a mystery and a secret? . I will just sit back and relax. If it happens it does, what a unorganized Cluster f^c( this place is. good thing they are not worried about profits, customer service, or employee moral. the BIG Ball keeps rolling.
They do know the difference between between Mist and Fog though. That being said, the Ip's Are very sharp, they put a lot of country's to shame. But really???? what is point? .

[jumbocpt]

Difference between Mist or Fog? i recall that from line training years ago in JED. all came down to the forecast vis.
Fog (FG) is observed or forecast only when the visibility is less than five-eigths of mile, otherwise mist (BR) is observed or forecast.
Airmans Information Manual

Good luck and enjoy the flights. I arrived in the late 70's and recently retired

[GoForIt]

Has anyone been reimbursed for tickets to the interview as they promise?

[vtwo]

I think the Silence is your answer?

[chuckunu]

WOW the things musted to be getting better.
I was told by friend that the 3 who showed to interview in Paris all were told to go to nest step, some time later in JED. Only 3 showed up and were paids moneys for own ticket on the spot. word it out at sv bout tickets and money not ben paid i bet.

good luck guy/gals
chuckunu

also was told my a Mngment pilot that 2 pilots and one instructor quit this wee because of no answers and organizations from bosses. true? or not?k

[alldaysushi]

Just throwing the 2 pennies in... Attended the Nov.09 screening. Initially told by Belal to contact SV Washington DC FOR FLIGHT ARRANGEMENT, too late for that program so payed own fare, with, Promises, and no reimbursement.

I really wanted to hope for the Saudia job as everyone I met while operating ACMI was great.

Still could be with some systemic organization,

Sushi

[vtwo]

Still no money for my ticket yet.

[Samiadam]

Hello,


Overtime for JAN and Feb has now been paid.


Cheers

[chuckunu]

The lasted stories.............
Saudi air did Not pay cooking gas companys,, now SV city peoples has to buy own gases bottles for homes. and airbus pilots only get 4 days off in row now,?
i think my friends are lying to me to keep me from joining them? or they don't want to let me know where he will be going nexts.?
....

[BadAndy]

Chuck,

Not sure about the gas bottles. I just got two about a week ago and had no trouble. However, to be honest, it is becoming too much of a pain to go get them. It will be easier to just get my own near the compound (and cheaper then taking the taxi across town to get "free" bottles).

As for the lines, there was a change to the FOPM that says that all lines will be built to a MINIMUM of four days off consecutively, 9 days total (again, MINIMUM) off. For July, there were a few lines with four day blocks off and a few lines with 5 days off. How they will be in the future is anyone's guess. The 747 Classic F/O lines all had 6 days in a row off with an average of 12-15 days a month off. So, hopefully as the 'Bus gets staffed, the days off will increase. But again, I don't think anyone really knows what will happen...

As for your friend warning you off, if he's in the training cycle, that is understandable. It is the most frustrating experience in the world. Everyone hates it and wants to quit during training. But, take it with a grain of salt. Once you're out of training, it isn't so bad. They leave me alone, and I never work (standby every day, but I only fly about one day a week...). Sometimesthe chaos works in our favor... :8

[Romasik]

Someone for some reason wants things here to look really bad:bored:
Got my bottles today. Didn't know we have to buy them:confused:

[metro301]

The bottles cost 15 sar to refill. I haven't had SV pay for mine for over 2 years. Just not worth the hassle for the savings of $4USD every 2 months. That is just my opinion.

[mutt]

They used to have the gas store within the compound so it was extremely convenient, some kids decided that it would be a great idea to try to set the place on fire...... luckily they failed. The gas store was then closed!

*******
chuckunu, you will not like it here, don't come.

*******
Is the story true that an A320 guy decided to sell all of the excess furniture that he had provided with?

Mutt

[BadAndy]

Mutt,

I hadn't heard that one (about the guy selling the excess furniture). I know of two guys that sent the excess furniture back to housing to make room for their own stuff, but no idea about selling it off. Is he the same guy that just went home in the last couple of weeks?

Also, has anyone on here brought a dog into the Kingdom? I found the regulations, but it's going to be tight to get everything done in a 10 day window, without being able to get home to drive all over the east coast. Trying to figure out if there is an office here in Jedah where I can get the import license and get the Vet Certificate authenticated to avoid a trip to Washington... Thanks.

[mutt]

Talk to Jeddah Vet (Jeddah Veterinary Group (http://www.saudivets.com)) or a Classic FO called Rafi 2. . . . he brought in a dog about a year ago.

Good Luck.

Mutt

[BadAndy]

Thanks. I'll talk to the Vet this afternoon. If not, I'll call Rafe. Thanks again.

Andy

[jumbocpt]

Hi Mutt;
the new guys should look on the bright side. The uniforms are free of charge and so are the flight medicals. See how far that goes at Singapore Airlines.
when i was in JED, i got tired of the gas bottle situation and purchased an electric stove. You'll get your money back when you depart.

[jumbocpt]

Mutt
can i bother you for the proper address in Khalidia to Fedex a shipment to a pilot in Saudia City. I think it's better if it's held at the Fedex off next to Jollibee until he picks it up.
Thanks again

jumbocpt

[mutt]

Just send it to his house number and give his mobile number, they will call him to arrange delivery.

Mutt

[1Wingnut]

You asked about the GACA ATP exam. Since no one answered about that, I will take a shot. I took this exam about 18 months ago. The questions seemed to come from that Gleim exam test book, from about 2006. I had a lot of questions about NDB approaches and ETA/performance questions that needed a whiz wheel to solve. It was a computer based test, and unlike the computerized tests you might take in the USA, there was not a flight computer type program build into the software. If you don't bring a whiz wheel to the test, you will be doing a lot of guessing. Also, all those NDB approach questions didn't make a lot of sense to me considering there is not a single NDB approach in Saudi Arabia.

I got about a 76 on my test, which surprised me, since I got a 96 on my ATP written when I took it in the USA. I suspect that when the test was coded into the computer, it may be that who ever did the work marked some of the wrong answers as correct. This kind of mistake would not surprise me in Saudi Arabia. When my GACA license was approved, I filled out the paper of the data that would appear on my license, like my name. This paper went off to the guy who makes the license. It came back with my name totally spelled wrong, even tho the guy was just transcribing it off a piece of paper. No creative thought required. I sent it back, and it came back, again misspelled in a new way. I sent it back. It came back, and now I was offered a license with some other guys name on it. Back again, and finally I got one that was correct. If an official can't correctly copy my name off a form and put it in a license, it is not a big stretch to think that maybe when they were putting the test questions into the testing computer, they may have messed up on which answers were correct.

There is also another test, on the GACA FARs. For the most part the Saudis photocopied the FAA FARAIM and called them the Saudi regs. There are a few differences tho, like transition altitude, calling for an engine start clearance, ATC clearance procedures, etc. The test on the regs is open book, and the questions pretty much come in the same order that the info appears in the book of regs they give you. Most of the answers have been underlined in the book by previous people who took the test. If you can read English, there will be no problem and it will be easy. In spite of how easy this is, when I took the test, there was a Saudi Saudi Airlines DEC in the test room with me , and he asked to copy my test. We both had different versions of the test, so I was tempted to let him do it. :rolleyes:

There is an American former FAA guy working at GACA, Tommy Schmidt. He is a nice guy, and you could call him if you have any questions about anything GACA related. +966-505979877.

[cantbeafoolinlove]

There is an American former FAA guy working at GACA, Tommy Schmidt. He is a nice guy, and you could call him if you have any questions about anything GACA related. +966-505979877.

There is a good chance to get your happening thing screwed up if TS is involved.



Although there are few errors in the GACA written, but 96 becoming 76 chances are next to impossible. No personal attack intended.

[chuckunu]

Mutt,
yes you are correct. i am thinking that SVA is not for me.
I have just heard a capt's moneys for his childs schools was sent back by his bank for no money in the saudi account. have the paychecks been bad to?
I have not herd of late or bad salarys but i did hear about the bad check he was givin.

First I was thinking most of the stories are not true, but after hearing the same things over again from different peoples there, it must have some truth.
with the days off changes, no systems in place for the positive travel once a month to homes, Bad School moneys Checks, and all. I will pass. plus my friends said they don't want to get catched talking bad about this place, so they will not say from there mouths on this web, they just want to look for new jobs already.

Thanks for all the infos from every guys here . I am glad i did not waste my times and Saudis times.
good lucks to all there.
Chuckunu

[djeskine]

Chuckunu.

You certainly have been fed lots of crap about SV.
I usually don't post here, but as a 27yr veteran, I can tell you for certain NOT once has a paycheck been delayed. Cockpit expense and overtime do get delayed at times for various reasons but will ALWAYS EVENTUALLY BE PAID without exception.
I just received my child's education allowance, three weeks after filing.

As Mutt said, you won't be happy here, and I think you won't be happy anywhere else in the world. You live in your own utopian dream.

Dj.

[chuckunu]

yes you are correct.
Now that the perdiems were not paid on the new moon when will you get paid the moneys they owe you.
Do you just wait and sees? If my rents ere paid by me whens I fell like it after to many times I get get kicked out. why do you put up with the "CRAP" as you say?

[metro301]

They just turned on a new computer system that brings them into the new millennium. Of course they are having implementation problems

Why the "f" do you even care chukunu??

[Flingwing47]

Chukunu,

just an update on the cheque business. There was a problem last month with the cheque printer - the date was not completely on the cheque in the upper right - it overlapped onto the stub. So cheques (lots of them) were returned for correction.

Lots of staf had the same problem - only needed a signature with the date corrected and cheque was honoured

happy landings :cool:

[vtwo]

Still waiting for the check. Nothing but promises so far.
Anyone else have any luck recently?.
Also to any of the newer guys joining, did you get reimbursed yet?
I saw a sheet with about 35 guys that need to be taken care of.

[poina]

Save yourselves a big hassle on the gas bottles. Go buy electric stove and get an electrician for 50 riyals in the compound to wire it for you. Don't sweat the overtime as it has been like this for 30 years, ask Mutt. They will pay it but at their convenience.

[skytrek21]

Chuckunu....seriously needs to learn how to write properly. I am guessing he's not even level 4 and with that attitude won't be happy anywhere in the world. Sad excuse for a Pilot.