Unite & BA

[NuName]

What do you all think of this, incredible damage being done to the airline at a time when its most vunerable. It is not inconceivable that BA could be made bankrupt through Unite's persistant activities. Imagine trying to get a flying job in that market, if its not bad enough already.

[flybypilot]

It is clearly a disgrace. During tough times most people pull their finger out, work harder and aim to protect themselves by protecting their companies. In this case they are refusing to carry out the extra service being asked of them, not exactly a big ask!

BA is easily as risk of going bankrupt and I believe the union is trying to use the ash cloud mixed with the strikes as a tool to try and break the BA management which I feel is just wrong when many of the cabin crew are better paid than many professionally qualified pilots in this industry.

Further to that, I have a few friends that are BA cabin crew (none fo which agree with the strike action at all) and the intrinsic bullying of staff to try and make them agree with strike action is a joke. The staff that returned on the temporary contracts are also getting a really hard time from the staff.

I really hope to see this get resolved but I fear the only way will be for BA to get rid of the high level cabin crew and develop the lower tiers on a new structure.

[uberwang]

Its an utter disgrace.. The Cabin staff are going to be without a job if they persist and then they will see what its like for the rest of us without jobs. Or even better, get jobs with low budget airlines and see what work is really like.. These people get ridiculous perks that are not in line with todays market and get paid well above the market price too.. I understand fully that people are not all in favour of the strikes but surely if they stood up and were counted saying they actually wanted to help then they would be protected.. It makes me sick to the stomach.

[Daifly]

Find it very strange that they think there is any public support for their cause now. An average salary of £35k not being enough is somewhat difficult to defend to people who don't earn anything like that (the majority of the country) and the Union need to take a good look at themselves for much the same reason - particularly when the people from BA offices who are providing the supplemental staffing are Unite members, but not related to BASSA.

I'm not sure what their end game is - do they honestly want to shut down the airline, because if they do the Government have to step in and legislate against actions like that. If BA were raping and pillaging their staff then I would maybe have a different opinion, but with unemployment nearing 3m I think they really need to think long and hard about what they are doing to their livelihoods and the livelihoods of thousands of others - the knock on effect on even the people working in the shops in T5 seems to be being forgotten - they are going without their commission because there are no people buying things.

It's all just very ****** up and I think the Union leaders have to realise that we're not in the 1970's any more and that Willie doesn't appear to be one for capitulation.

- And the last time I was on the train, in First, I had to endure a Unite union leader mouthing off about the backstabbing in the leadership of his union for 45 minutes. I wonder if his members realise that First is the class of travel for union reps now - I see even the Prime Minister travels Standard. Totally mad.

[NuName]

I see it a bit like the lawyer syndrome, they (the union) win, win or lose. If the company goes under, they move on to the next prey whilst the ex staff are left looking for employment in a seriously damaged market. And they will have paid for it through their "dues" I guess its a closed shop with all the intimadation we so often see. Bet they don't have a secret ballot.

[Crosswind Limits]

It's nothing more than socialism vs capitalism. A culture of envy and false equality driven by those that don't have (or more often than not, just begrudge those that have). A modern day class struggle!

UNITE couldn't care less about the wider ramifications of their reckless action - they just want to stick it to BA management and others of their ilk! :ugh:

[4HolerPoler]

Great banter guys but what has BA/ Unite got to do with BizAv?

4HP

[G-SPOTs Lost]

4HP

As somebody said above - not a lot right now but if BA went pop or ended up "downsizing" we'd all be at risk of "Nigels" (sweeping generalisation - sorry) wanting to enter our corner of the industry and being able to afford to do it on the back of a redundancy payment/early pension/Retained earnings for a whole lot less than I can....

Worthy of brief discussion here imho

[uberwang]

I agree, I think this is becoming an important topic for us. The industry in general could suffer if this sees a negative end. There is plenty of disgusting behaviour in our industry but this takes the biscuit.

[flybypilot]

Does anyone know of any corporate companies in Europe with union representation for pilots or cabin crew?

[Miles Magister]

If there are any owners watching this I am sure your team wil be advising you that experienced in a big jet does not mean you are an experienced pilot in all other areas of aviation. Operating in a big jet from large airports with a lot of back up is a very different skill set to even handling a smaller aircraft. There is a wide variety of skill sets out there and some very good pilots, but if you do wish to look at an experienced ailine pilot make sure he has the right training background for GA. This applies the other way around as well.

MM

[merlinxx]

Please ship this somewhere else, diddly squat to do with GA/BIZAV:ugh:. We don't have unions, we work for our keep:ok:

[4HolerPoler]

That's what I thought but this a member's forum and quite a few of them seem to want to discuss it so I'm going to leave it. If it bothers you don't read it.

4HP

[NuName]

Thanks for that 4HP, I was well aware that BA is not a consideration here but it soon would be if a couple of hundred well trained pilots hit the UK job market. And its also worth a thought for all the heavy metal pilots that freelance in biz jets, take away the heavy metal? Well that would be worth diddly squat:*

[northern boy]

There are around 3000 BA flight deck crew. Not a few hundred. That many pilots on the market would indeed make for interesting times.

Many would retire to their large villas and a lot would be off to the sand pit but such an outcome would have the management types in a frenzy of gibberish about going forward in the 5th quarter.

Unites case was not helped yesterday by the arrival of a contingent of brain dead SWP members barging into the meeting and screaming their usual 1970's slogans at the Unite negotiating team.

[potatowings]

This whole situation is the most ridiculous story I have heard for such a long time. The BA cabin crew earn significant amounts of money. Right now there is a recession and with the troubles in the Eurozone and the large swings in the markets, who knows which way the whole thing could go.... up is my hope of course!

They need to get real. BA is no longer a nationally owned company. They are not civil servants. They are working for a company that has to make a profit. They have to pay the bills and the tax payer should not have to worry about the potentially "too big to fail" scenario where we start bailing those greedy people out.

I think it is time for the rest of the industry to step in and silence these silly games. Work or leave.

When the airline is turning a £500 million profit, that's the time to start pulling out your negotiating tools.

Thank you for leaving this up. Of course the BA issue affects us in biz av. Even a small layoff by BA's standards could have massive impacts on us.

[thedeadseawasonlysick]

Unite was an ammalgamation of two smaller unions. This is why it has joint General Secretaries. There is an internal election coming up and then only one will be General Secretary. This is just posturing to show the troops that they are the one to head the union. Pure politics from both of them.