Virgin and Turbulance

[Corsairoz]

OK, maybe I am just a cynic.I am also a regular long haul SLF and a private pilot.

I flew on VS043 yesterday to Las Vegas from Gatwick. It was a full flight.

Prior to take off we were 'warned' in an announcement that there would be mild turbulence 1/3 and 2/3 of the way through the flight.

Indeed after the meal, when the toilet queue was at its peak the SeatBelt light was put on for 30 minutes. All passengers strapped in. Cabin crew clears away with empty aisles.

But no turbulence......a few VERY light shudders, but really, nothing.

Then later in the flight....the same again.......SeatBelt light on clearing all passengers to their seats. Again Cabin Crew about their business.

But no turbulence......a repeat of the first time.

Now, maybe I am simply cynical, but it seems likely to me that the SeatBelts were put on to give the crew clear aisles and not for any safety reason. While I appreciate the work that Cabin Crew do, I do worry if the SeatBelt and Turbulence warnings become used not for safety reasons.

There are many reasons I am sure why 'crying wolf' is not a good idea in the aviation world. If I am right, is this a Virgin policy? It is more widespread?

Or am I just a cynic?

[Fernanjet]

You're a cynic.

And you can't spell turbulence.

[Dan Air 87]

I don't think so. You can never be too careful. Look at that commuter flight in the US this week when the a/c hit some turbulence and injured a member of the CC. I think they were being cautious and deservedly so.

[TightSlot]

You're quite right - It's a gigantic, global, airline conspiracy. I once had the signs illuminated all the way across the Atlantic because people kept getting up and getting in the way. The reverse is even more fun - Whenever the Captain reads the en-route weather and discovers turbulence is likely, we leave the signs OFF: What a laugh! Bouncing off the walls, they are!

[Global Warrior]

Ah come on guys........ everyone knows its the Gary Larson 1 Bravo procedure........ namely, the point due to automation, that the pilots switch the autopilot off and hand fly the plane......... better to be strapped in than not :D:D:D

[Jarvy]

Flew on Southwest last september and just before take off the cabin crew announced that the seat belt sign would stay on longer due to turbulence.
Then after that she said "and I hope the captain leaves it on the rest of the trip to stop you lot bugging us for service".

[G SXTY]

You are most definitely a cynic.

Predicting turbulence can be something of a black art, relying on experience, weather charts and radar, ride reports from other aircraft and even looking out of the window. It is not possible to predict it with 100% certainty, and you can rest assured that most of us prefer to err on the side of caution. Particularly when flying to a country where people will sue you for the price of a 747 if they are injured when turbulence could have been predicted and the seat belt signs were off.

Sometimes we’re dammed if we do and dammed if we don’t. Expecting a choppy ride, we leave the signs on and it’s smooth as silk. Passengers start asking to use the toilet, the signs go off, and as if by magic the turbulence starts. We don’t keep you belted in for a laugh, and certainly not to give the cabin crew an easier time.

[backseatjock]

Did you check out the bar area in J class? Reason I ask is that sometimes, if a few pax are being rowdy or drinking too much, too quickly, at the bar, the CSM asks the skipper to illuminate the seat belt sign for a while.

OK, this may be akin to crying wolf but it can settle a situation where other pax are complaining or there could be a risk of problems through others being drunk.

[Load Toad]

Frankly I think it would be a good idea to have a 'Sit the F' Down' light and announcement just prior to the meal service and certainly when it did get choppy but fellow passengers still wander around like lost and ignorant sheep.

[CornishFlyer]

On my flight to ANU last week, the CPT said prior to take off it'd be smooth all the way. The seatbelt signs came on 3 times due to unforseen turbulence. You never can predict how it will actually pan out in advance. Sometimes the opposite is true but it's always better to be safe than sorry so stop thinking it's a conspiracy

[UniFoxOs]

Predicting turbulence can be something of a black art, relying on experience,From my experience I can predict that turbulence will always appear when you have just opened your scalding hot tray of coq au vin and are trying to eat it.

Cheers
UFO

[Final 3 Greens]

Tightslot and others

I have heard, on more than one occasion, cabin crew call the flight deck on the interphone and ask for the belt sign to help them do a service task.

Never on VS though.

So before you scoff at the OP, it does happen and I suspect he has probably had the same experience as me if he flies a lot.

[Load Toad]

And it's so terribly inconvenient to be asked to sit down for a while innit?

Imagine a restaurant with 300 people and cramped conditions trying to get the scram out to the customers.

[Final 3 Greens]

You're missing the point. Load Toad.

The belt sign is a safety aid, not a convenience.

Use it as the latter and it brings problems later.

Not that it happens so often, in my experience, but it does happen.

[radeng]

My observations suggest that in the US, most pax treat the sign as 'advisory', not mandatory. FAs there rarely seem to bother - they probably find it a losing battle. On the other hand, I've seen Americans get quite nasty on BA when told to stay seated when the seat belt sign is on, if they want to go to the toilet.

A standing joke is that BA flight decks have a light that comes on when CC start serving tea and coffee: that tells them to illuminate the seat belt sign!

[Load Toad]

Matey, That's why I proposed a 'Sit the F' Down' light.


A 'plane - is a vehicle, a dining room, a bedroom, playroom, a lounge, a toilet, a cinema, a meeting room... and at has 300 odd people who think it is all of these things to them at the time they want it.
The expectation of what a flight should be has grown a disproportional amount not least because of the ways airlines advertise their product. And it's cheaper - so you now have people who bluntly speaking think once they've paid up they get to do what they want.

Imagine a restaurant trying to serve it's patrons if 50 start milling around, going for a slash, bringing the children in to play on the floor, getting up to hold mini-conferences near the door to the kitchens - but it just wouldn't happen. The mere fact of being in a restaurant would remind people 'it's quiet voice time Harold'. Not on a plane.

That's why I don't think it's wrong to 'suggest' prior to the cabin service starting that it's time to 'Put the crayons away, fold your arms and wait for your pie'.

[Corsairoz]

Note that in my post I was careful not to criticise the practice. Merely to question the existence of the 'convenience' Seat Belts On sign.

Personally I am a polite, well behaved, little SLF and always sit with my belt on, and I sympathise with the difficulty of the CC working through sometimes tens of passengers loitering around the A/C.

My question was really about if the CC can 'request' a Seat Belt On sign for service convenience. If its SOP then I have no issues, I just never experienced it before. Up until last week I thought the Seat Belts On was a safety only mechanism.