C210 crash at Wlotzka Baken, Namibia [Archive]

Pro1966

1st Apr 2010, 17:48

This article is from a Namibian newspaper. Looks like just the pilot on board. Pilot's name confirmed and his next of kin informed.

"Sefofane Air this afternoon around two o'clock died when his Cessna 210 (registrasiemerke V5 BAT) approximately 20 km east of Wlotzkasbaken in the harsh Namib Desert between Swakopmund and Hentiesbaai cases."

RIP

dr27

1st Apr 2010, 20:57

any 210 left in Namibia ?

Flying Bean

2nd Apr 2010, 10:28

As next of kin have been informed, can we have the name of the pilot please?:sad:

Pro1966

2nd Apr 2010, 10:34

Republikein Tuisblad (http://www.republikein.com.na)

Csanad007

2nd Apr 2010, 10:35

Terrible news! RIP!

172driver

2nd Apr 2010, 13:36

Sad news, RIP. And kinda sobering picture :(

Any info how that happened ?

Dupre

3rd Apr 2010, 12:54

Sad, sad stuff. Condolences to all those affected.

It seems like C210's have had a bad time in Namibia.

Apparently it was Piet van der Walt. RIP.

172driver

6th Apr 2010, 10:43

Very sad and strange story. There is a longer article in today's Republikein (only understand parts of it, my Afrikaans isn't too great) and another one in the Namibian (in English) (http://www.namibian.com.na/news/full-story/archive/2010/april/article/pilot-killed-in-plane-crash/).

Both imply that the a/c suffered a mid-air breakup / structural failure. Pretty rare....

Voel

6th Apr 2010, 11:01

By reading all the relevant namibian newspapers this morning Republikein Tuisblad (http://www.republikein.com.na), the Namibian: Top Stories (http://www.namibian.com.na), Allgemeine Zeitung Namibia - Nachrichten mit Charakter (http://www.az.com.na) it is my humble opinion that the pilot did some aerobatics with that C210. I am not an aeronautical engineer, so I might be wrong.

Mysteriöser Absturz (http://www.az.com.na/lokales/mysteriser-absturz.104721.php)

172driver

6th Apr 2010, 11:13

Very strange indeed. In the pics it looks as if the wing spar was intact (I am, however, not an aircraft mechanic, I only fly the things), so at least going on what we see here it doesn't look like a spar failure. Also, a pilot flying just a few minutes behind the accident a/c mentions 'light winds' and nothing about severe turbulence. Without wanting to jump to conclusions, Voel may be on to something :(

Btw, Voel, how's the sandpit going?

Voel

6th Apr 2010, 11:18

Btw, Voel, how's the sandpit going?

Heiss :} Es wird Sommer. But nothing is as good as home:ok:

ACE247

6th Apr 2010, 14:24

I'm a Pilot myself round here, saw the wreck site, its quite bad.
Accident cause Seems like an Overstressed wing spar, it shows some compelling evidence of aerobatic flying. I have to agree with Voel, the pilot did something with his C210 that wasn't normal. He was very young (25 Years), dont know about his experience or if he took the normal path of obtaining his License. But that plane wasn't rated for 6G and was already rather old. The pilot married just a short while ago, sad story.:(

172driver

7th Apr 2010, 07:34

ACE, your comment re the spar is interesting. I haven't been there and can only go by the pics, and there there spar looks intact. Looks almost like the wing/roof assembly had been torn off. Loop with over-enthusiastic recovery?

DaFly

7th Apr 2010, 11:15

It has forever been fashionable amongst the younger guys to barrel-roll a C210 and other types...

BushCaptain

7th Apr 2010, 14:20

Firstly the story of baggage coming out of the plane and causing it to crash is bull**it!
The aircraft had no passengers on board!
In my humble opinion the pilot wanted to have a bit of fun (since he had just gone online) and probably tried some aerobatic maneuver
A C210 can do a barrel roll, if flown correctly at positive G, but an ordinary pilot with no aerobatic training is asking for trouble if he attempts such a maneuver :ugh:.
Anyway, all speculation. The investigation will hopefully find the cause of this tragedy!

PLovett

7th Apr 2010, 22:58

FFS aerobatics in a 210 is playing Russian roulette. They are a very capable aircraft for what they were designed to do but they also have a dark side to their handling.

They have a low Va speed (can't remember it off hand at present) in comparison to its normal cruise TAS. This should be the first indication that they can be fragile without struts. := They also have a laminar flow wing which does not like having sudden angle of attack changes imposed on it. I have had a friend killed flying one because he didn't respect that and he stalled it off a climbing turn. :uhoh:

If you haven't the self-discipline to fly one according to the book then you deserve everything that is going to happen. :mad:

AIWA

8th Apr 2010, 20:25

Mid air collision with an airliner? Maybe russians which would not report such an incident?

VarigMD11

9th Apr 2010, 08:40

Between 6000 and 12000 feet? I just don't think so. I'll go with in-flight breakup. Shame really.....

DHC6to8

9th Apr 2010, 13:16

I always hate hearing about such things... but it does remind me of way back when I was shore casting not far from Cape Cross and the German military transport (some Russian TU- if I remember correctly) and a US hercules collided...Sept `97... the beach strech was crawling in Orynx Helos looking for wrekage.... tragic.... but the rumor I later heard was that the US was sneaking a peak at the Germans and got a little too close!
6to8

Arabian Mustang

9th Apr 2010, 17:16

All sefofane Namibia airplanes are fitted with INDIGOSAT system that provides real time satellite tracking. Any sudden change in altitude or G forces should be recorded in the system, according to the the General Manager atleast.:rolleyes: Just the fact that someone watching should have kept the pilot from trying out anything stupid with the airplane.

PLovett

9th Apr 2010, 22:04

Arabian Mustang, not necessarily. :=

If a pilot was doing aileron rolls or barrel rolls the tracking system would still basically show the aircraft proceeding along its flight path while maintaining 1 G. There may be some slight variation in altitude but not enough to alert anyone watching the system. :uhoh:

However, in this case, it would show a gross divergence in both but by then it was academic. :mad:

BushCaptain

9th Apr 2010, 22:11

If the pilot was doing aileron rolls or barrel rolls the tracking system would still basically show the aircraft proceeding along its flight path while maintaing 1 G.

There may be some variation in altitude but not enough to alert anyone watching the system.

Sure, this would apply to anyone who knows how to do a proper barrel roll, but then they wouldn't have had an in-flight breakup!
Hopefully INDIGO will work like a Black Box and show what really happened with the aircrafts flight path...

Contract Dog

11th Apr 2010, 22:51

NL fired me 8 years back for rolling a 206. His arguement was that the stress on the airframe "could" kill the next guy that flew it. I paid to replace the wing bolts and left with my head hanging low, never to go over 60 deg bank angle ever again. Now, did this 210 go over on that day, or was it latent dammage from years of abbuse????

"IF" INDIGO is working (and thats a BIG if) it updates every 30sec to 4min, as per opperator specs (may be wrong, but thats the specs my A/C had) so ........... a LOT "can" happen in the inbetwene time. Just a thought

Dog

Spadhampton

12th Apr 2010, 00:06

Good Point CD.

Lets not forget possible overloading for God knows how many years.

An occasional symmetry check might be a good idea.

ragdragger

12th Apr 2010, 12:19

Maybe a dumb question, and I never saw the photo, but how does a wing spar that failed in flight look different from one that failed on impact?
IF the pilot did break up attempting an aileron roll my guess is that it wasn't from pulling too hard, but too little. Some combination of too high an entry speed, not high enough pitch on entry, or leaving the power in too long... resulting in exceeding Vne in the recovery. I have botched enough aileron rolls in Citabrias and Aerobats to know how fast they can pick up speed if you get things wrong and a C210 with gear retracted would get away from you a whole lot faster. I don't know how that would look on indigosat, but I guess no matter what happened at some point it would show an increase in speed and loss of altitude.
Maybe the poor guy was just unlucky, seems like there isn't enough information to know what happened for sure and there probably never will be.

DaFly

13th Apr 2010, 08:31

BAT had a fast airframe, unlike other C210s, that just don't want to pick up speed. It was a workhorse, with Sefofane for more than 10 years, but I don't think it had an overstressed frame, that would brake up while innocently flying along while everything is in the green...

Somebody else mentioned that the pictures looked like the engine could have come out of it's mountings in flight and hit the wing. Possibly a stone chip on the prop caused a piece of the tip to come of, causing an inbalance, that in turn made the engine rip out it's mountings?

SloppyJoe

13th Apr 2010, 09:36

Possibly it hit a bat that caused a piece of rubber to come off from round the windscreen which in turn caused the windscreen to come out and hit the fin causing the rudder to go full left and blah blah, seriously why not just wait and find out what the investigation reveals.

Spadhampton

13th Apr 2010, 11:13

Because we are professionals and never stop using our aviator brains concerning safety? We never stop rationalizing scenarios for the good of the pax….for the good of the profession….for the good of our own buttocks because we are generally the first at the scene of the accident?

Der absolute Hammer

13th Apr 2010, 11:47

Or::::
Are all pilots gamblers with the fortunes of their lives and speculation is nothing more than another spin of the wheel?

CONFOR

13th Apr 2010, 18:32

Well time has passed - and I noticed all the coments - no coment from me as I was not there - I lost an aleron trim tab on a twin not so long ago and did almost two barrel rolls before I could catch her - it was rough - had 20 knots to play with - boths sides as to slow or to fast the wings started to clap hands - inspected BAT myself - never saw anything like that - just hope and pray they get an answer there - but life goes on - safe flying chaps - take care

Spadhampton

13th Apr 2010, 22:00

Lost an aileron TIM TAB?!

GOOD GRIEF!

Well by logical extention, it would also be wise to have maintenance people that never stop rationalizing scenarios for the good of the pax….for the good of the profession......ect...

TWO ROLL OVERS?! HOLY MOLY!

TXaviator

4th May 2010, 03:08

FFS people. If you want to do aerobatics, GREAT, go use a proper plane and get proper training from someone who knows what theyre doing!!! as an AVID aerobatic pilot, and knowing the forces and what a botched maneuver can lead to, id be TERRIFIED to think to try maneuvers in a plane not built for them!!

it makes me cringe every time i see videos of people rolling planes with horrible technique and no clue what theyre doing. sad this kid found out the hard way.

GET PROPER TRAINING / USE A PROPER PLANE FOR AEROBATICS.

if i found out someone had been rolling a plane i had to fly next, id insist on them paying for a very thorough inspection first!!

note: im not accusing here, just saying if anyone gets a wild idea to do stuff like roll a plane thats not built for it... DONT DO IT.

Bob3213

5th May 2010, 12:32

The wreck arrived in Windhoek today. Cold chills will run down your neck when you see the wreck. Dont know how anyone would ever be able to identify the cause of the accident. There was no chance of survival. Shame man.