Ryan Air job offer

[gd123]

I have been offered a job with Ryan Air on the Brookfield contract. Im due to start my rating on May 17th. Anyone who is on this contract and has some feedback would be greatly apprieciated.

[IrishJetdriver]

Whilst I can't offer information on the Brookfield contract, I can advise you that the company name is Ryanair not Ryan Air

[gd123]

Anyone else who could give me some info who is not bored on Ryan Air again would be great

[zerotohero]

Yup, he is right,,, its definitely called Ryanair!
at least thats what it says about a million times in all the books surrounding me in the flight deck

New BRK contract, well lets be fair, its better than McDonnalds but not by a great deal, I am on the older one, my friend is on the new one, and my god it sucks donkeys balls!

Just over 2 years in the airlines and 4 as a paid pilot and I can already see a significant trend in the reduction of wages and terms, that cant be good.

thinking about it logically I reckon by the time I make Captain ill probably be on the same money I am now, be it reduction in pay and inflation combined, so what I earn now is probably my top money here / lifestyle

as for your advise sir, you obviously want a job flying so your going to take it no matter what, just budget for 6months earning zero and lots going out in hotels, fuel, food, travel, and other general stuff you need,,, erm,, id, uniform, staff car park, regular car parks until your based, your going to need deep pockets to get money back the other way.

[EGCC4284]

Well done mate, I knew you could do it. Take the job, get the rating, get the hours and in 2 years time you will be in a better situation than if you had you not taken the job.

In 5 years time, you will look back and say it was the best thing you did. If you dont take it, you will still be looking for a job in 2 years time.

Try and keep the golf thing going, offer to get a manager in

And it's Ryanair, show a bit of respect

Love you x

[850CIT]

gd123 im also starting the 17th at EMA. PM me to get intouch

[ToMss]

Hi all,

could you please let me know how did you apply to RYN assessment ? I applied 1 year ago in CAE web site, still no news...

Thanks :)

[bleedair87]

Yeah, for me the same. Applied 6 months ago on the CAE webiste. No answer until now. What can be the reason for this? Has anyone a clue?

Many thanks!

[Skyhigh86]

Yeah, for me the same. Applied 6 months ago on the CAE webiste. No answer until now. What can be the reason for this? Has anyone a clue?

Maybe they dont want you?

Sorry to piss on your parade but it does get fairly tiresome how people expect to get a response from applying for a job!

[go around flaps15]

Correct. Thousands apply. A couple of hundred cadets taken. Around 300 this year I believe. If you get a call for interview you are in the minority. If you do the interview and get the job you are in an even smaller minority. Some people are under the illusion that it's their god given right to fly a jet for Ryanair once they have a frozen ATPL.

They are picky at the moment.


Why?


Because they can be.

[Skyhigh86]

Some people are under the elusion that it's their god given right to fly a jet for Ryanair once they have a frozen ATPL.

Yep the old "if BA decide not to headhunt me, theres always Ryanair" club are normally the type that are specifically not wanted in the airline:yuk:

Go around flaps15 is exactly right, they can decide to be exceptionally picky at the moment as they have hundreds if not thousands of newbies to pick from. In recent weeks ive only seen around a day of assessments booked into the sim each week at STC.

Which is most probably for the DEC's of which they are very much in need of......

[bleedair87]

Maybe they dont want you? Sorry to piss on your parade but it does get fairly tiresome how people expect to get a response from applying for a job!

Haha, no you didn't piss on my parade. (Thx, new expression learnt) ;) No but I was just wondering IF they've received my CV/application. I did not expect them to invite me, but just a little notice Yes or Not. Is this too much expectations you think?

[jersey145]

Such a shame some are so determined to get a job asap that they will buy themselves into this. If only the world was different. Make the most of the hours and gain as much experience as you possibly can, then bail out asap. They wont give a damn about you so treat them the same i wish you all the best of luck! Honestly! Keep those hand skills current. you will need them for the next sim assesment. It is all to easy to rely on the autos to the point where you loose those skills you spent lots of money gaining. Keep your heads up, and ignore all the company and work force political BS. you will realise in your on time when you have been screwed big time. Its an investment in the shoirt term. i hope for your sakes its a good one!

[White Knight]

Bl00dy well said:ok::ok::ok:

[Day_Dreamer]

What a load of cobblers some of you spout.
It's not the RYR,s of this worlds fault that T&C's have drooped it's the accountants who have pushed conditions down so that profits are higher and managers take home bigger bonuses.
The P2F guys and girls who spend the cash wherever it comes from on a type rating are only responding to the supply levels and economics of the current climate.
For even with borrowing at a very low level, and banks requiring infinitely more security there are many integrated and modular cadets out there with the money to move into the seat, regardless to type.
Bush flying, Air Taxi etc is a grounding but, by no means always what an airline is looking for, the old days of the self improver route, starting low and working up is sadly a thing of the past.
Money talks, the rest walk.

In other articles it has been mentioned that the selection for RYR is very demanding, and those of you who think that the money alone will get you in are very mistaken, more the green eyed monster than fact.
But let's not get in the way of a good bleat from the sour grape brigade.

A colleague has written a good article in last weeks flight about LoCo training standards.

For those who are starting the RYR course, Congratulations !!

You will always find people ready to run down those who have what they want or perceive that their T&C's are as a result of the LoCo's.
Just ignore them and get on with your career.

Good Luck.

[jetstreamrider]

Are you guys for real?!:confused: "It's not Ryan Air it's Ryanair!" Who gives a toss what the name of probably one of the worst employers in the airline industry is!? Ha...you lot really need to wake up and smell the coffee! The reason it is probably the best decision for you is that due to the fact you are all willing to pay to work for these cowboys...the chance of getting a job elsewhere without paying is impossible!

Are you so desperate that you will make yourself literally bankrupt in order to work for an airline? You will pay out so much for uniforms, id, sim rides, parking, hotels etc that by the time you do start getting paid to fly their 'fare paying pax' you will have created so much debt that you will be stuck in a vicious circle trying to pay it off. The only winners are Ryanair! Just think about it...what are you going to do on those long lonely nights away from home working for them when you have no cash to do anything...night off...can't go out, have no money...hungry, can't buy food, have no money...want to drive home for a couple of days off, can't, petrol costs too much! It will be a sad couple of years!

Do some decent flying on a caravan or something in Africa or instruct for a year or two...the hours will open up doors for you where you could potentially end up getting a gig flying a kingair or a corporate jet...it happens eventually I can assure you and you will experience some real fun working with great guys and gals instead of being another robot paying to fly the same old routes into the same old airports with minimum rest!!! :ugh:

Think about it instead of being so narrow minded in order to fill O'Leary's tight pockets!!

[Torque Tonight]

I'm not going to get sucked into this thread too deeply because, quite frankly, every thread with Ryanair in the title has always descended into exactly the same argument - do a search and you'll find the same debate a thousand times.

However, as the RYR-antis generally shout the loudest, by way of balance I will say this:

In my opinion, at this point in time, if you are an ab-initio pilot aiming for an airline career and you have a firm job offer from Ryanair you would be mad to turn it down.

You build up credible flying experience very rapidly. A good 800hrs per year into a hugely varied set of destinations. Working with crews with enormously varied professional and cultural backgrounds.
Excellent, brand new, well-maintained glass cockpit jets.
A secure job after your training. This isn't P2F where you get kicked out after you've done your course. You are being taken on as an FO in a company that ain't gonna go bust any time soon.
Respectable take home pay. You'll break even on your TR costs in year 1. After that it's in your pocket.
One of the best rosters in the industry.

There are downsides, of course.

The contractor status is a big negative in my opinion.
You don't get any love form the company (but hell, did you really expect that).
The value of the perqs, benefits and employment status that you are missing out on is significant.

The self-improver route simply does not exist in Europe in the way that it does elsewhere. There just isn't enough capacity for it to form a meaningful part of the career chain and it is already saturated (eg a double figure waiting list to be an unpaid glider tug pilot). Like it or not, a few thousand hours in an FR 738 will open career doors that simply wouldn't be there if you had you spent those years unemployed, flying Cessnas around Angola, or, dare I say it, being a regional turboprop FO. If you disagree, I refer you to recent BA job advertisments. It is a shame how the industry has changed, it's tough trying to weather a recession, but this is the reality of how it is now. You have two choices. Get on board or get left behind.

[Mikehotel152]

I can only second what Torque Tonight has said about Ryanair and the state of the commercial aviation industry in Western Europe. I have no doubt that people like justagigolo77 and jetstreamrider are decent people and good pilots who want the best for the industry, but I honestly do not think their negative perception of the motivation, training and abilities of the average Ryanair (or any low hour commercial) pilot is fair. We all have different backgrounds and stories. Many of us paid for our training ourselves through savings or by borrowing the money. Ryanair is not an option people should take without a lot of research and thought, but it is sometimes the only option if you wish to avoid the dole.

[Torque Tonight]

I appreciate the lack of **** slinging

Likewise. Unfortunately that is what mostly renders RYR threads unreadable.

sometimes some people just will not succeed
Very true, and that is the uncomfortable message that should be made clear to those thinking of embarking on training, but the flying schools won't because they want the course fees, and the airlines won't because an oversupply of pilots is favourable to them.

The golf analogy is valid to a certain extent. Paying for a standalone type rating, then paying for 300 hours on the line in some blacklisted Asian airline etc etc, is insane (as I earlier stated on another thread). The difference with Ryanair is that it is a firm job offer, and you will get a decent return on your upfront investment. You have become Tiger.

Thinking back to uni economics module days, you actually have a classic manifestation of the Prisoners' Dilemma (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prisoner's_dilemma)here. Wiki it if you're interested. You will never get the pilot workforce to hold out en-masse for improved Ts&Cs because it is always in the individual's best interests to accept rather than reject a moderate Ts&Cs job offer regardless of other people's actions.

[VJW]

justagigolo77 - I don't care to expand too much. In principle a lot of what you say it correct, but the manner in which you say it is what I had a problem with. For you to have a blanket opinion that all RYR pilots are suckling on 'mommies teet' and that we're all 'dip**** pilots willing to pay 50000 pounds for the priveledge to sit in the very front seat for 500hrs instead of the cabin' has me thinking you're both ignorant and arrogant. Perhaps you're the one still suckling, or missing a pat on the back for how noble you've been turning down all the jobs you mention.

Like you, I completed all training up to CPL/IR/MCC with zero debt, and decided to borrow £30000 from a bank for my type rating (to which I'm paying off without the help of mummies teet) - was for me an easy decision.

'If I wanted to be a professional golfer was decent at it but would never quite be good enough...would it make sense to continually push tens of thousands of euros or dollars into entering tournaments knowing you will never win or even make any money at all?'

This is crazy- you've never been to Florida I guess! Everyone who plays golf ploughs thousands of dollars into golf, only to drive the majority of the tee shots into the water/bunker. People do it to test themselves and enjoy the ride!

On a positive note- Go Tiger!

[captainsuperstorm]

but it s not flying. the 737 is old tech...what do you learn at ryan
/, move the gear lever, and flaps setting? what else? oh yes, read the check list...

do you fly the plane, how many X wind landing have you done manually there? probably none.

still better than nothing, but for me, a ryanair pilot worth less than nothing!

[Mikehotel152]

we could argue we worked harder to ensure we passed all the training we required, to avoid any further costs!

Absolutely. It certainly spurred me on. :) Moreover, although I obtained a personal loan to pay for my TR, my hugely reduced tax liability for the first year at Ryanair easily offset the loan repayments. When deciding whether to pay for a TR at Ryanair you must do your maths. Look at your net financial position after 5 years. Despite paying for a TR you will have taken home, before tax, around €300,000. You will also be a Captain and have about 3750 hours (incl. 800 PIC) on a modern B737-800.

Compare that reality with working your way up the aviation ladder. Torque Tonight has already rightly pointed out that this is almost impossible in the current industry. But assuming you buy yourself an instructor's rating and find a low-paid instructing job, then manage to find a Turbo-prop job after a couple of years, over the same time frame you'd be lucky to earn €75,000 and build 2500 hours on light aircraft.

Ryanair's image may be relatively poor, but operational and training standards, not to mention safety standards, are very high. Evidence is easy to find: see ATC Level Bust and SID/STAR compliance, punctuality, bag loss, and accident statistics. Whatever the Company's failings, you can't reasonable complain that Ryanair

diminish this "profession" with substandard practises

As for the young pilots with

visions of grandeur [who] then complain when no one will hire them!

I do hear you. I also tend to agree. But then, I came to flying in my thirties, having worked damn hard to get a university education, postgraduate diplomas, and worked 5 years as a professional in another field. Personally, I don't think some of the lads in their early twenties are mature enough to be flying large jets. But Air Forces around the world having been employing similarly aged pilots for generations, so what do I know. :cool:

By the way, where can I find these 4 oiled-up Rio carnival girls

I'm more than happy to dust off my CV... :O

[BoeingDreamer]

Most people with low hours complaining about Ryanair, do it because of envy, either they have not been selected or they don't have the funds to pay for their TR.

I have personally never been a great fan of the airline, however to be honest, if given the chance I would take it would open arms, rather that then be a bitter hypocrite on these forums!

I believe most of you low hour guys, even being negative, if you had been selected or had the money you would have taken the job too!

For what your morales and ethics are worth, I would say who cares, in today's market a job is a job, and very unlikely you will get better start then with Ryanair!

I know of FIC's with close to 2000 hours, working full time, but stuck, because they don't have money to renew their IR!

For every pilot who preaches about their high morale standards, there is an equal opposite pilot looking to give young pilot's dreams and scam them of their hard earned cash, with promises of assessments, TR's and line training, which will lead to nothing else then massive debts.

At least Ryanair offers and option to avoid those vultures standing on every corner waiting for their prey.
Unfortunately some of you guys now sitting cosy in your LH or RH seat, after several years, have not been able to see what has happen with your companies.
Nearly nobody want to pay for your TR any-more, it is now widely expected that nearly everyone pays for their own TR, now even without a proper job contract/offer!

You can come with silly phrases about smelling the coffee, however I know of FO's at RYR taking home 3 times what an FI does! Not only that, after 3 - 4 years they either get command or go to much better companies, and do you know what? The major companies love to hire them, because they have received good training by Ryanair.
I know of 15 - 20 pilots just now recently going to Norwegian from RYR. Plenty gone to BA too, so what's the issue!

I could be bitter and say it all sucks, because I don't get an interview, I rather say good luck to you guys who got the chance, there is no better option around today for low hour pilots to get into the big league this fast, and that's all thanks to RYR.

BA did similar in the past, but they was just much more selective in the start, because they was paying for your training. However imagine at RYR, you can leave when you want, no long bonding times! They give you freedom to choose, if you choose other career like working in Tesco's instead of accepting working for RYR, you are the fool, not them!

[Torque Tonight]

I think everyone would agree that that sort of racket is a turd sandwich. I've said it already on this thread with reference to the Asian pay for hours then we sack you deals. No-one would argue with that. However, comparing Ryanair to these P2F scams is simply inaccurate.

Look outside your little box of EuropeFrom what I've heard, Canadian bush flying is a pretty closed shop, and a European abbo coming across looking for the self-improver route is unlikely to get results.

I looked at bush flying in Africa. That too is pretty saturated. MAF would have taken me but they wanted me for 4 years effectively unpaid.

I could go on but trust me, in Europe someone with an offer of a firm F/O position in Ryanair, or similar, would be mad to turn it down, even with the TR costs.

[BoeingDreamer]

justagigolo77

Well I am in a hurry due to my age, however I do agree if I was 21 I would not need to be in such a hurry.

But look down the food chain, I might have a chance to get an Air Taxi job, but if I want to be in the game I have to pay my own TR! Why?

Because if not others will be offered the job instead, who already have the TR! So I have no choice.

I can stick with my principles and say no, I will not pay, but what will that help me? Somebody else will take the job instead!

[coltrane]

Just out of interest lads, what's the captains hourly rate in your brookfield contracts? (It's written on the last page.) Is it still 138 something or is it down to 97 euro's/ hour?

[DMcC]

Hi, any chance you can elaborate on the job opportunities you are on about, ie where they are? Not aving a go at you just curious as I have been unsuccesfully searching.many thanks.