Airlink Pilot's Future

[Airplay]

RF and JVJ have saved and re generated Airlink. Avoiding an overflow of pilots on the market, well done. This has come @ a cost to the JS41 pilots. Some individuals were not given the choise of moving to other fleets. Some crew further down the so called seniority list were given the choice? The PICUS training have increased for the JS41 crew to 8 sim sessions and this cost is now bonded to the aspiring CPT. Bonded again on same aircraft for a left seat? How are they going to keep the skill in that company, whom in their right mind will sign another bond for same aircraft to move to the left seat ? To add insult to injury, the FO's are now not allowed to land at some(most) outstations, is this an indication of the skill level in Airlink! :eek:

[Kennytheking]

I think you trying to create a storm in a tea cup mate. Three weeks ago these chaps were looking the unemployment que. Another bond for a couple of years is the least of their problems. That que is also not going to get any shorter in the near future, so perhaps they need to bite the bullet and accept that life just sucks sometimes.

Also, co-pilots not being allowed to land at certain destinations is a standard industry practice. I have been flying for over 20 years and have over 10 000 hours and I am not allowed to land at certain destinations within our route network because I am in the right hand seat.

[Airplay]

Thanks for your input, just the facts stated as I got it, have fun with your 10 000 hrs in the right hand seat.:ok:

[Gyro Nut]

SAA said they would take some of the Airlink pilots slightly ahead of their proposed intake of pilots, in view of the fact that they might be jobless.

14 guys were given a simulator check ride recently, but only 2 passed! Hope this isn't an indication of the skills level there (apparently some of the applicants were captains as well).

[Alternative]

I was under the impression the 14 were all cadets....not so?

[Doodlebug]

Airplay, it is quite possible that Kenny has substantial jet PIC but has transferred to another company and is therefore in the R/H seat.

[Der absolute Hammer]

What simulator do SAA did SAA use for their checks?
If it is a jet then......
I think it is right to say that an experienced turbo prop pilot may have a much more difficult practical time of flying a jet and a simulator than will a newbie whose most flying have been on light and sensitive machines. On the other hand, one would expect a greater degree of the airmanship, such as throwing away an approach, from the more experienced pilot.
If it is a DC3, well, you cannot expect someone who tries to f ly a J41 to be able to land in a tail wheel.

[Gyro Nut]

The simulator check assumes no previous jet experience, but rather concentrates on basic, instrument attitude flying, and is a very fair assessment for the average pilot that comes off flying a non-jet aircraft.

[Der absolute Hammer]

In that case it should, with reasonably trained pilots, be possible, if not to demonstrate excellence, at least to be able to display competence.

[Airplay]

O well, the positive thing is that the management saved the Airline and secured the pilots a position. All we need is another airline going bust in South Africa.The question still remains, how are they going to keep the skill that they are building in the company, the FO's who can, will leave before their CPT position comes up with regards to this new bonding, that means the Cpt's will be stuck on the same pool without any hope of moving to another pool, hence they will also be looking outside.
Once again, Good show to the management at Airlink.

[DASHER 8]

You guys and gals need to stick together as a united pilot group and refuse to take the command position if it comes with a training bond.
Sure its tempting to take the command for all sorts of reasons.
Its fair for LINK to bond u guys for a type rating but not for a command.
The Airline cannot function without Captains so if u stick together and refuse the "command bond" you will get your commands in due course under better circumstances.
Good Luck!

[Der absolute Hammer]

Command training bonds are found in Europe.
They are an excuse to bond an FO to the LHS on upgrade in order to justify the simulator command training which is mandatory for most Europe airlines.
Is Airlink going to provide such expensive command simulator course which is a pass/fail situation?
There is no point in moving on once you have a command until you have a minimum of 500hrs in command on that type of aircraft. In Europe terms that is often described as two winteres worth of experience. So a two year command bond is not the end of the world for a young newbie captain. A fleet change command shift, at the request of the company should not attract another command bond within the same time period as a previous one. However a fleet shift from turbo to jet could give rise to a new command bond. Many pilots would go along with that?
The idea that pilots will stick together is not short of ridiculous. It has been shown everywhere that at the end of the band wagon, pilots will go with their individual needs-mostly financial and career oriented. Just accept a command bond as being the sharp practice and get on with it. Once you have the command you will forget about it soon enough. Make the consolation to yourself that you could always go fully procedural on the airline. That would cost them a bomb and if you want to band together as a gang of brothers, that would be a more definite threat of action and an easily implemented one as well which would be unlikely to cost jobs in the retaliation of manament.

[Avi8tor]

RF and JVJ have saved and re generated Airlink.I don't thing RF or JvJ deserve ANY praise. If I were them, I would be doing some very real soul searching right about now.

They have 'managed' the airline to the verge of bankruptcy. In their many achievements, a large number of incidents and 4 insurance claims in 6 months, of which 2 were total hull loses. Not to mention a body count. I know it shouldn't, but it amazes my they would like to continue screwing the crew.

Sadly the crew are as much to blame, from a strong union 10 years ago, that had the resources to force the company to court and won, to a bunch that take the view that its 'not their problem, I am not staying anyway'. Now the industry is in the toilet worldwide, and suddenly it is their problem.

My advise is: GROW SOME GONADS, STAND TOGETHER

[NOTOT]

Amen brother, anything works through unity, ask the govermund and abi wekkers!:ok::cool:

[Sir Osis of the river]

I'm with DAH on this one. It is becoming the norm for companies to have training bonds for Command courses. Especially if the training involves Sim work. In this day and age Sim's dont come cheap and the companies are only trying to protect their investment.

That said, a training bond should not be an issue if you are willing to take the upgrade and happy to stay with the company. Of course how much the bond is and for how long have to be realistic. (I have no idea what link is preposing)

Bottom line: Do you want the upgrade and are you going to stay, or just use the company and then do a "runner".

Sir O

[Der absolute Hammer]

The command training bond should not be a bribe for an upgrade. It should be viewed by both sides as almost an initial conversion only much harder in the sim. It should also be a pass'fail situation with a fail being for a specified period of time or training before a retake. Or the fail could be permanent. It is a weighty and very serious exercise delving into mind and pyschology as well as skill and knowledge. Properly constructed it reflects well upon a good training department. Whether Airlink has such a department is a question which events and Pprune scribblings have thrown in to some considerable doubt in certain quarters.

[Airplay]

Now this is what Pprune should be about, reading the above, a lot of views have been shared, a lot of food for thought and some good points mentioned. I must say this is one of the better discussions I have seen on Prune. Thanks for the positive feedback.
At the end of the day it all comes down to the pilot community world wide to stand together to avoid being raped.Nobody wants any company to close and see people loose their jobs, fair deals for company and pilots must be negotiated. Fair objective union representation goes a long way. The Airlink pilots will have to catch a wake up and get active.

[Springbok614]

yes, i agree, good thread so far!

i am just curious to know how these command upgrade bonds work in terms of still possibly being in a bond for initial training.

do they run concurrent then or does the last bit of the initial bond fall away? it could potentially be costly for the pilot if he/she has to get deductions off his salary for both bonds if concurrent.

just wondering.

[Der absolute Hammer]

On a bond which reduces where you have agreed to repay the company a certain amount for conversion training....
What I have seen before is where someone two thirds of the way through an initial conversion bond has had his bond topped up to the command cost bond and the period of two years started again.
A bond which does not reduce with time served is just plain unfair even though you may have no choice but to make the signature.